From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V7 #186 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Monday, December 13 2004 Volume 07 : Number 186 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [support-system] One Less Thing . . . ["Jim" ] Re: [support-system] Friendly Reminder [Tyler Coates ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 18:13:15 -0500 From: "Jim" Subject: Re: [support-system] One Less Thing . . . (Resent, because as usual, I initially used "Reply" instead of "Reply To All"...my bad.) James, A truly engaging story. I see why you're a writer. I can sum up my lack of participation in the list in just a few observations: I joined this list when I "rediscovered" Liz a year ago. I used to listen to her earlier stuff occasionally. Mostly with my then-girlfriend. I'm more of a speed-metal kinda guy. (Slayer, Slipknot, Hatebreed etc.) When I joined, I expected to get (and did) Liz news, anecdotes and the like. With that, I was pleased. What I tired of very quickly was defending her new album to those on the list who didn't like it. As far as I'm concerned, if they don't like it, don't fucking listen to it. I like it, and it's not my job to change their opinion. It's like asking someone what their favorite season is, then trying to change their mind. It's fruitless...and I'm tired of hearing them whine. Take the disc outside and perform some sort of yuppie-stylized burning ritual on it if you like. I don't care. And I mean that. And if Liz suggests that her old fans should just "move on", I'll bet that she doesn't care either. Peace, Jim - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 7:18 PM Subject: [support-system] One Less Thing . . . > When I was a sophomore in college I really wanted to be cool and hip and > went > to Tower Records and bought three albums, Lucinda Williams Car Wheels on a > Gravel Road, Erykah Badu's Live album and Liz Phair's Exile in Guyville. > Looking back on it now, Lucinda Williams seems an odd choice for a young > male in > Philadelphia wanting to be hip, but I digress. I think I was going by > some > list > of important female artists I saw on VH1 or something like that. I > remember > getting back to my dormroom and popping all three in my cd player and > pressing > random. My roommate and I sat around listening to them while we played > board > games and smoked pot and drank forties of beer. My roommate and I did > this a > lot. I wish I still could. > > Anyway, I don't remember thinking much about anything we were hearing. I > remember Liz Phair sounding really gross. I mean, I was from the suburbs > of > Rhode Island, what the fuck did I know? In fact, I think I actually tried > to turn > it off at one point, but my roommate said he liked it so we kept it on. > Strangely, I don't think I ever took it out of my CD player for the next > three > years. > > To say that Exile in Guyville was my life is an understatement. I didn't > know the names of the songs (for the longest time I thought Flower was > called > Strange Loop). I would listen to it constantly, before parties, before > class, on > trains, on subways. I would wait for my roommate to leave and then I > would > turn it up real loud and play air guitar and pretend I was singing along > with > Liz Phair. Oh ya, boys and girls, I was hip. > > Eventually I bought Whip-Smart and sometime later Whitechocolateeggspace. > I > made three mix tapes which collectively had every song from the major > albums > on it. I most have drove my friends crazy. Any chance I had I would > throw > this into their faces and say "listen to this." But none of them ever > really did. > Though the one and only time I dropped acid a bunch of us were in my room > and I put on Shatter and I remember everyone started to cry. I'll never > forget > that. I don't put much stock in drugs or the people that do them, but > that > was a moment I'll never forget. > > Eventually I joined this list and had many lively discussions and > arguments > with you all. Oh what fun we all had. I guess many would find something > like > arguing about rock 'n' roll frivolous or nerdy. But come on, you know you > love it. We're all a bunch of nerds deep down. > > I bought a lot of other CD's, too. I really got into The Pixies and Tori > Amos. The day I turned 21 I took a cab up to a part of Philadelphia I'd > never > been to before and saw a "secret" Breeders concert. It was in this really > shady > part of town and when I got inside I was eyed by almost everyone because I > looked really young. I sat at the bar and ordered a beer and listened to > the > soundcheck. There was only like twenty other people there and we all sat > around > speaking in hushed voices about music and The Breeders in particular. > This > was just before TitleTK came out and nobody knew what to expect. People > had > beachballs and were throwing them all over the place. I was standing > literally > right in front of Kim Deal. I couldn't believe it. She leaned down and I > lit > her cigarette. I lit Kim Deal's cigarette! I was so fucking cool. That > year I saw The Breeders 25 times. I followed them around. Kim and Kelley > started recognizing me. As did all of Imperial Teen (who opened for > them). In > Philadelphia, Kim pointed me out and she and Kelley sang "It's getting hot > in > here" b/c they knew their biggest fan (re:me) hated it. > > In New York City, a big mosh broke out during Saints and I got punched. I > made sure everyone noticed my bruise. In Las Vegas, my "new" roommate and > I got > stranded in a part of town where no cab would come. So after the concert > we > sat on a curb with some other fans and drank Schlitz beer and talked about > music until the sun came up. > > Don't get me wrong, I still loved Liz Phair more than anything . . . and > this > is about the time "Take a Look" surfaced on the list. I remember wanting > to > puke when I heard it. I mean, come on, I just spent a year following The > Breeders around with their new, totally stripped down album. I got > punched > for > christssake! "Take a Look" was the antithesis of what I was about. > > The summer I graduated from college, the new album came out. And even > though > we had heard most of it already, I was excited. I even got the signed > copy > that some nice person on this list alerted me to. > > I was totally torn about it. I sort of liked it. But not really. > Eventually I just stopped caring and started listening to a lot of Tori > Amos. I got > really depressed. Who wouldn't? I had no idea what to do with my life > and > was > living with my parents and Liz Phair had just released this shitty album > and > here I was in my room listening to "Silent All These Years" again and > again. > > I knew I wanted to be a writer. I had written a book of short stories > that > won some contest and they gave my $5,000 for it. I had nothing to do one > weekend so I packed up my stuff and moved to Chicago b/c that's where Liz > Phair was > from and Liz Phair changed my life even if she did write shitty music now > and > I was pissed off at her. Eventually I saw Liz Phair while I was living in > Chicago. I saw her all three nights at the Metro. This was before she > started > wearing a headset. The concerts were full of frat boys and little kids. > Liz > was okay. A little blah. I hated her band. But she does have this thing > where it always seems like she's looking at you. That was kind of cool. > > This list was very active at the time. And very angry. We were split b/w > those who loved the new album and those who despised it. It made my head > spin. > I eventually signed off the list. > > I forgot about Liz. When she came to the vic when chilly Chicago evening > I > vowed not to go see her. All day I walked around saying, I'm not going to > see > Liz Phair. I'm not going to see Liz Phair. > > I went to see Liz Phair. > > I paid $100 to a scalper and got right down in front (the only place to > be). > It had been months since I had given Liz any thought whatsoever and even > as I > stood their drinking my Guinness I don't really remember looking forward > to > the show. There was a young high school couple next to me and I was > chatting > with them for a while. I asked what they thought of the new album and > they > said "what new album?" They didn't know Liz Phair had released anything > else but > "Liz Phair." Oh well. The concert was okay. Not as good as when I saw > her in > New York when she played Explain it to me at random, but good nonetheless. > The headset didn't bother me. I still have the setlist from the show. > > But I really didn't care about Liz Phair anymore. I didn't even bring her > CD's with me when I moved. She just wasn't a part of me anymore. > > I lived in Chicago exactly a year. And you know what? Liz was right. I > liked Chicago but it's not a very nurturing place for artists. I > understand why > people like it there, but after a while you want to be around other > artists so > you move to New York or LA. I didn't move to either. I moved to New > Orleans. I visited New Orleans once and I liked it so I moved here. It's > okay. > It's no better or worse than any other place. I think you need to be in > love to > really love where you live. > > A couple weeks ago, for no apparent reason I went out and bought all four > Liz > albums and listened to them all in sequence. You know what's odd? I > don't > really "get" EIG anymore. Oh, I still think it's brilliant. Maybe the > best > album ever. I appreciate it. But I'm not angry anymore. And despite > what > you > say, EIG is an angry album. When I loved it, when it was a part of me I > was > very young (I'm still young, but I feel old) and very angry, I had a > variety of > lovers and I always thought they were trying to dick me over. Looking > back > on my relationships I was probably just being childish. But now when I > sing > along to "6'1''" I no longer feel it deep down inside of me. I'm no > longer > proud that I know exactly when to say "ya" because I figured that out > three > years > ago and nobody cared then and nobody cares now. It made me very sad, that > this piece of art didn't stay with me. And I thought, you know, this is > probably > how Liz Phair feels too. It's like, I know it's great and I know why > people > love it because at one time it was me, it was who I am. But it's not me > anymore. And I started to feel genuinely sorry for Liz Phair. That she's > kind of > stuck. Where does she go from here? > > She can't write this lo-fi stuff anymore. She didn't succeed as a pop > artist. > Does she have anything else to say? Does anyone care anymore? So I > signed > back on to the list to find out. And from the lack of discussion it looks > like maybe nobody does. Maybe that's not a bad thing. I read an > interview in > Spin where Liz Phair said maybe it's time her old fans move on. Maybe > that's > true. It is a little like losing a lover. And as time goes on you find > yourself laughing that you cared so much. But I did care. And Liz Phair > will > always be apart of my subconscious. And everyone once in a while I'll > listen to > the albums and remember the times I had. But that's it. > > Anyway, I bought the new Fleetwood Mac album the other day. Is it bad to > like Fleetwood Mac? Tell me if it is and I'll throw it away. But I kinda > like > it. I also bought the double album reissue of Sonic Youth's Dirty. I > used to > love that album. It's kinda loud. God, I'm getting old . . . > > I have no idea why I just told you all this. > > james > > "Now I'm lining up six or seven good jobs/my hair's looking great and my > friends are all snobs/but I don't have my man and I don't have my dog and > I > don't > have very much fun/and that's one less thing on my mind." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 01:32:28 -0500 From: Tyler Coates Subject: Re: [support-system] Friendly Reminder Katie wrote: > It's the end of the year folks! Start looking through > your CD collection and post what were your fave albums > of 2004! Here's my list, kind of in order: 1. Sufjan Stevens - Seven Swans 2. Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds - Abbatoir Blues / The Lyre of Orpheus 3. Wilco - A Ghost is Born 4. Mirah - C'Mon Miracle 5. Allison Moore - The Duel 6. Rilo Kiley - More Adventurous 7. Le Tigre - This Island 8. Loretta Lynn - Van Lear Rose 9. Kasey Chambers - Wayward Angel 10. Elliott Smith - From a basement on a hill 11. Tegan and Sara - So Jealous 12. Matt Pond PA - Emblems 13. Ted Leo and the Pharmacists - Shake the Sheets 14. The Killers - Hot Fuss 15. TV on the Radio - Desperate Youth, Blood Thirsty Babes Tyler. - -- John Tyler Coates James Madison University - -------------------------------------- "Harold, everyone has the right to make an ass out of themselves. You just can't let the world judge you too much." - --Harold and Maude ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V7 #186 ************************************