From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V7 #30 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Wednesday, February 11 2004 Volume 07 : Number 030 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [support-system] extraordinary ["Mike Katsoulis" ] [support-system] Grammys, Billboard ["Derek McGough" ] [support-system] RE: No more flipping burgers, putting on that silly hat. ["Jeremy Rea" ] [support-system] Re: chiming in from sunny socal [Al Madrid ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 00:32:48 -0600 From: "Mike Katsoulis" Subject: [support-system] extraordinary when liz was on ryan seacrest a couple weeks ago, they showed clips of the black and white "extraordinary" video as they went to commercial breaks. I figure that is the same video they will send out to the major music networks. she performed an acoustic version of "why can't I?" however, and not extraordinary... how ill advised is that?! - -mike ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:01:48 +1000 From: "Derek McGough" Subject: [support-system] Grammys, Billboard Hi there, The Matrix failed to win their Grammy for production of Liz (amongst others). The Neptunes took this one home. "Extraordinary" is Number 20 (up from 23) on Billboard's Adult Top 40 chart, and is indicated with a bullet for increased airplay. "Why Can't I" is the second most played "recurrent" track on the format (these are slightly older tracks removed from the main chart) so it is likely that the continued airplay for the older single is holding "Extraordinary" back. However, it did take ages for "Why Can't I" to take off as well and it was several months before it was serviced to mainstream Top 40 stations so there is still hope yet. The abscence of a video at VH1 is concerning. Also, the lower end of the albums chart is very soft at the moment meaning that titles sell only a small amount to enter or re-enter the chart. But the airplay for "Extraordinary" has not encouraged enough album sales for this to happen as yet. I would estimate the No. 200 album on Billboard in February sells less than 3000 a week, so "Liz Phair" would be somewhere below that figure. Derek ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:18:38 -0500 From: Dan MacDonald Subject: [support-system] shuttin it emil wrote: Yes, "Extraordinary" was released (she performed it on The Tonight Show -- did you miss that, Dan?), but the video hasn't been re-shot or released well. um. fine. disregard my email bitching and demanding why extraordinary wasn't released. ooopsie. hahahaha but for the record - it sure as hell isn't getting ANY airplay in Detroit. not that i've heard anyway. now someone will probably email back and say "But dan...didn't you listen to the 24 hour Extraordinary-A-Thon yesterday??" :) ;) ah well.....i have yet to see the Maxim pics, but i hear they are true gems. can't wait! dan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:56:46 -0600 From: "Jeremy Rea" Subject: [support-system] RE: No more flipping burgers, putting on that silly hat. FYI, none of this is with the intention of sifting through the ashes of the the album's not bad/the album's rotten discussion; that house has burned. However, concerning Liz Phair and how much money she and her record label made, it should be safe to say, barring a world event that causes the nation to turn to "Hot White Cum" or "Favorite" for a sense of reassurance and perspective, the circus is packing up. As for claims that she is being mismanaged, maybe her career is being mismanaged, but this was never really about career or integrity; this was a desperate, desperate grab by a person who's own dichotomy concerning the whole thing made it that much more desperate. But, for all its pedestrianism, it was fairly ubiquitous, and "Why Can't I" was a modest hit. And at the peak of its popularity, it was sold, sold, sold. I heard it in a T.J. Maxx. It was in TV shows, a movie, other shit, shit that will continue to pay dividends, however humble, for years to come. Bill-paying dividends. But the album will never and could never be a hit. The audience that Phair aimed to tap into has moved on, moved on to more hard-core, street acts like Good Charlotte and Fefe Dobson. Phair is now stuck emulating people who aren't even cool anymore. So there was money made; the cross-marketing gambit has played itself out, probably profitably, but now those margins are thinning and it is time to pack it up and abandon ship. Soon will come a time where Phair may reassert herself as captain and go down with the ship, or row her little life raft into a California sunset. Always remember that the only difference between Phair and the thousands of other also-rans this year is that Phair has backstory for miles. That's it. jeremy _________________________________________________________________ Create your own personal Web page with the info you use most, at My MSN. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200364ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:13:45 -0500 From: "Jim" Subject: Re: [support-system] re: Buckets of money A girl's gotta make living! Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: NegSplitz@aol.com To: support-system@smoe.org Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2004 6:46 PM Subject: [support-system] re: Buckets of money Well, as much as we love - or loved - Liz, she is definitely riding the high road now money and career-wise. Her Matrix group is up for a Grammy with two of her recent songs and she has referred to the nomination in a syndicated column by Fred Shuster: "It's a very powerful marketing tool. It's all about marketing, getting out there and selling the product (my italics). If you can attach a Grammy award to it in any way, that turns into a very useful thing." So, along with the soundtracks, talk-shows, magazine features, and advertisements, Liz is seriously a commodity, something I would never have dreamed of a few years ago. I wish her well and hope that she writes and sings as she pleases. Nothing wrong with making dough, and I still can't wait for her next show on the 26th in LA! Cheers - Wes in Long Beach ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:36:42 -0800 (PST) From: Al Madrid Subject: [support-system] Re: chiming in from sunny socal Extraordinary is doing fine thus far and moving at an even pace with John Mayer's "Clarity" which has been on the charts almost exactly the same time. it is no. 18 on the charts and still rising. Why hasn't the video been released? That is what helped WCI reach the success it had. Check out the charts for today. See those top 10 singles? A lot of those have been out much longer than Extraordinary. MEthridge's song came out exactly the same week as Extraordinary I believe. It has 19 more stations playing it however. It's kind of all f'd up because WCI never took off, just kind of rolled along and was picked up by some stations well after it's release and Extraordinary has to compete with WCI and from what I know, a station doesn't play the same artist twice within a 2-3 hour period. I also believe that someone is fucking up at Capitol. No video release yet? All of those top 20 on this chart all have videos on VH1 except Extraordinary. http://www.mmr247.com/mmrweb/AllAccess/Charts.asp?format=a2R Emil, thanks for the mention. Kiss, Kiss...:) Al Madrid __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:48:35 +0000 From: "over pavema" Subject: [support-system] stalling sales >From: Dan MacDonald > Emil wrote: > > Anyone have a different take? Or any new dazzling > chart figures for that second single that was supposed > to REALLY send the album skyrocketing? It's been a > while since anyone has talked about it, and time just > keeps marching on. > >It's really frustrating to see a favorite singer being mis-managed. Okay >- - fine if the slant/style and audience she was going for was not my cup >of tea - but come on!! she has an album full of slick and glittery songs >generated by a hit-making production team - and whoever is in charge of >releasing her singles slacked off. >if they are gonna spend so much money on an album which is meant to "move >units" - why don't they do a little elbow work and start releasing >singles?? as predicted, capitol stopped pushing this clunker back at the end of the summer. the writing was on the wall already -- it's not going gold, and it's *definitely* not going platinum. they spent a small fortune making the goddam thing, and at a certain point you just have to stop pouring good money after bad. if the record was good, or the kind of thing that would grow on people, it would be different -- maybe. blue note (i think) let norah jones' album build slowly because they knew people would respond to it if they heard it. 'L/P' is soulless and all sheen and slick and glittery. but who's going to buy it? 300,000 copies (which may be a bit generous, but is probably close to accurate), that's basically all of her existing fans buying it, partly out of sympathy for the artist, and maybe another 100,000 'new' fans buying and trying. word of mouth wasn't very good -- even on this list the record only made like 75% of the top-10 lists -- and we're pre-disposed to hyping her work (and never mind that some % of those top-10s listed the EP only as the portion that was a 'favorite' of '03). her live performances haven't improved much (regressed, i think, but even if you love her shows in 2003, you'd be hard-pressed to say they were better than the buddy judge band shows). her 'imaging' is abominable and silly (not offensive or edgy). her interviews are tiresome anymore. i mean this seriously, i would not have been surprised at this point, if capitol had staged the super bowl stunt with liz, if they could've gotten her on the bill -- which they couldn't because nelly and justin and janet and kid rock are all way bigger acts. but, i really think they would've tried something like it, just to get some publicity. except... they've stopped pushing the record. is this bad for liz? maybe not. she's making publishing dollars from licensing the songs. but, remember, she's a co-writer on the popular songs, so she's sharing the $ with her co-writing friends. she's still playing the same venues, not moving to bigger halls or opening for bigger acts. she's basically a 37-year old woman trying to play the role of a rockstar and not quite cutting it. so, there's some money to be made in having your song on the queer eye soundtrack, or on the tad hamilton soundtrack, or on a 'friends' commercial. but people are tired of that song, they're not buying into 'extraordinary', and they're not clammoring for concert tix. she's coming to 930 in early april, i think, and for the first time ever, i'm not bothering to go. there are other performers i'd rather see and spend my cash on (unless we get reports from the early shows on the tour that she's spiced up the set list somehow, or maybe worked a wardrobe malfunction into the act). in the 2003 Pazz/Jop poll in the Voice, L/P is ranked #38. which may be about right, compared to the competition, but it's still her worst-ever performance in the poll (EIG = #1, WS = i think it was #4, WCSE = #17). (and before you think i set my course by critics' polls, this one ranks Zwan's cd at #106, which is dumb.) look, even in a world where hilary duff sells 10 times more copies of her cd in 3 months, than liz phair sells of her's in 8, people can still sometimes spot a phony. no one bought britney's album, either, because it just reached the point of desperation. and, in liz's case, even non-fans can see the label's fingerprints on "L/P" like they're in neon. liz said in one interview that she won't make a dime until april (which is when her tour ends). that was when she probably thought she could still go at least gold. so, at this point, it's a bit of a horse race as to whether capitol will drop her, or re-direct her when she goes back in the studio. i don't think we'll see "Liz Phair, Part II: Rock Me All Night Again Tonight", with a picture of her sitting ON the guitar (though if that happens, you're all my witnesses and i want 'cover concept' credit). capitol blew it, yeah. but they blew it when they sent her into the studio and told her how to dress, and put those dipshit photos on the official website, and tried to make her into another avril. they did NOT blow it when they simply recognized the inevitable: people are not responding to the album, and they're not going to pay money for it. so why keep pouring $ into promoting something people have aleady decided they don't want? they have new product that is selling or that might sell, which they'd rather promote. and who can blame them? how many chances does this record get? there was an old HBO series called, 'Dream On', and on that show one time the lead character was thinking about getting back together with his ex-wife. and his best friend says to him, referring to a comedian who was mysteriously popular back in the day, maybe like carrot top or something: 'i'm sorry, did a fucking safe fall on your head? that's like going to see Gallagher TWICE! what, did you think he'd be funnier the SECOND TIME?" it's kind of like that... o h, yeah: "Got to go to one of those red-hot L.A. parties Thursday night, courtesy of Nashville's own teen pop singer, Stacie Orrico. Stacie was honored with pop mom/sirenLiz Phair, milkshake-possessing Kelis, Shelby Lynne and others at Elle magazine's Women on the Verge party at the sniff-sniff Emporio Armani boutique in tony Beverly Hills. From what I could tell of the life-size pictures at the party, Liz Phair was a woman on the verge of coming out of her top. But I digress." - - from Brad Schmitt, the Tennessean.com website _________________________________________________________________ Find great local high-speed Internet access value at the MSN High-Speed Marketplace. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V7 #30 ***********************************