From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V6 #226 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Saturday, August 23 2003 Volume 06 : Number 226 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [support-system] test [Catherine Molanphy Subject: [support-system] test test (again) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 03:10:52 -0400 From: Catherine Molanphy Subject: [support-system] a relic Maybe this is an indication of how bored and blue I am, but tonight I was browsing the supportsystem archives, and I saw in late-1998 a reference that Jase made to me regarding songs in which Liz "borrows" or references other songs. I once made a list of all the instances in which Liz ripped off a melody or a lyric from another song, in the hopes that as people discovered new ones, I'd add that to the list. Anyway, after I had tuned out from the list, people were talking about this subject and Jason mentioned my list. So, anyway, tonight I did a search of my old-backed up harddrive CD (from before it crashed big time), and NO, I haven't yet found that list, but I found something else that made me smile. It's just a list of Liz lyric quotes, which in and of itself wouldn't be *too* interesting, except that for whatever reason (I don't remember now), I put a "submitted by" after each quote, for the listmember who "submitted" the quote. I thought some of you might get a kick out of seeing this list from five years ago, and maybe some of you diehards who are still subscribed will see your names. Enjoy... ________________________________ "The things I have to do would make a slut blush blue But I can't get out what I'm into." - - Can't Get Out of What I'm Into, from the Girlysound demos submitted by Robbie * * * "Looks like shit and it feels like America." - - Money, from GirlySounds submitted by Catherine Molanphy * * * "But if you'd known how that would sound to me, You would have taken it back And boxed it up and buried it in the ground..." - - Divorce Song, from Exile In Guyville submitted by Jaime * * * "You had a dream in which I was I was a spider While I was dreaming that you were in love with me." - - Tell Me You Like Me, from Shelved Demos '96 submitted by Catherine Molanphy * * * "If you've got a one-in-a-million girl, don't let her get away, 'cause the next one-in-a-million girl is a million girls away." - - Freak of Nature, from Shelved Demos '96 submitted by Jaime * * * "We hear Terry say That Trish is O.K., But she oughta learn to shave Her bikini line better..." - - Girls' Room, from Shelved Demos & Studio Recordings; & whitechocolatespaceegg submitted by Catherine Molanphy * * * "Fame and fortune took its toll, He's not the king of rock 'n roll anymore, He's just a junkie redneck." - - Elvis Be True, from the Girlysound demos submitted by Dan * * * "Sometimes a dream is what makes you a slave." - - Sometimes A Dream (Is What Makes You A Slave), from the Girlysound demos submitted by Mariam Hamou * * * "Don't remember feeling older any worse than feeling wooden and alone..." - - Don't Have Time, from the motion picture soundtrack to "Higher Learning" submitted by Steve * * * "All the cars on the road are driving away from here, but I'm still looking under my nose, to see who I am." "If I ever pay you back, if my money and wallet's intact, I'll probably be in a box lying down - loosely suited in black." "But anyway, you know, by and large anywhere I go I won't find anyone who loves me enough to make you look bad" - - If I Ever Pay You Back, from the Girlysound demos submitted by Dan * * * "i just want to borrow time and to give my body piece of mind" - - Wasted, from various live performances submitted by Megan Brown * * * "Because free love Is a whole lot of bullshit." - - Hello Sailor, from Girlysounds submitted by Catherine Molanphy * * * "Where have I been? Got any WHAT? Who have I seen? I spy a May queen." - - May Queen, from Whip Smart submitted by Emily Simmons * * * "I want a boyfriend I want all that stupid old shit, like letters and sodas" - - Fuck and Run, from Exile in Guyville submitted by Andrea Steiner * * * "And oh, all the tears in four tiny years, well look at me I'm frightening my friends" - - Crater Lake, from Whip Smart submitted by Andrea Steiner * * * "Some pot of gold, it's just a carpeting store on opening day..." - - Alice Springs, from Whip Smart submitted by Emily * * * "Now we need inhalation noises, would you like to help me?" - - Wasted, a spoken comment towards the end of the song on a radio show submitted by Dan * * * "And the licence said you had to stick around until I was dead but if you're tired of looking at my face I guess I already am." - - Divorce Song, from Exile in Guyville submitted by MARIAM * * * "I bet you've long since passed understanding what it takes to be satisfied. You're like a vine that keeps climbing higher, but all the money in the world is not enough. And all the bridges blown away keep floating up..." - 6'1", from Exile in Guyville submitted by Michael Irish * * * "With all of the time In the world to spend it Wild and unwise I wanna be mesmerizing too" - - Mesmerizing, from Exile in Guyville submitted by JudyLee1 * * * "Don't I look like Alice in Wonderland meets an Adidas commercial?" - - between-song patter from the "Fuck & Run" bootleg CD submitted by SkipyTripz * * * "i'm gonna tell my son to keep his money in his mattress and his watch on any hand between his thighs..." - - Whip-Smart, from Whip-Smart submitted by Zooey33 * * * "I won't crack the door too far for anyone who's pushed it too hard on me." - Nashville, from Whip-Smart submitted by PhishenGal * * * "You've been around enough to know that if you think you're it, you'd better check with me." - Girls! Girls! Girls!, from Exile in Guyville submitted by PhishenGal * * * "Got any what? Disease? Hashish? A mind?" - - May Queen, from Whip-Smart submitted by PhishenGal * * * "You gotta have fear in your heart" - - Shane, from the Girlysound demos & Whip-Smart submitted by "J. R." * * * "But I can't imagine it in any better terms, then naked, half-awake, about to shave and go to work" - - Nashville, from Whip-Smart submitted by Dominic * * * "Daylight catches me by surprise Almost every night And kicks my way another hole to sleep..." - - Carnivore, from the "Carnivore" 7" single submitted by Dan * * * "It was 4 am and the light was gray, like it always is in paperbacks." - Chopsticks, from Whip-Smart submitted by KevinDH * * * "I've got to tear my life apart and go west, young man." Go West, from the Girlysound demos & Whip-Smart submitted by Andrea Steiner * * * "The fire you like so much in me Is the mark of someone adamantly free. But you can't stop yourself from wanting worse Because nothing feeds a hunger like a thirst." - Strange Loop, from Exile in Guyville submitted by Jason * * * "All the stars up in heaven were rushed by an angel, to see the light of your face better" - - Beginning To See the Light, from various live performances submitted by Ascending to the Stars * * * "Kicking snakes up from dusty rocks" - Dogs of L.A., from Whip-Smart submitted by Jason Long * * * "I wanna be cool, tall, vulnerable, and luscious." - Perfect World, from Shelved Demos & Studio Recordings; & whitechocolatespaceegg submitted by PhairDanes & Athena M. Waligore * * * "How can you say something witty when there's dead air?" submitted by Robbie * * * "The earth looked like it was lit from within like a poorly assembled electrical ball" - Stratford-On-Guy, from the Girlysound demos and Exile in Guyville submitted by jacqueline stetler * * * "Imagine me.... behind your eyes." - Jealousy, from Whip-Smart & Juvenilia submitted by pat * * * "He's just a hero, In a long line of heroes, Looking for something attractive to save. They say he rode in On the back of a pick-up. And he won't leave town 'til you remember his name." - Soap Star Joe, from the Girlysound Demos & Exile in Guyville submitted by Beau * * * ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2003 23:08:50 -0400 From: Catherine Molanphy Subject: [support-system] Need an approximate date... Does anyone remember approximately when the WCSEsessions (1997) boot began to circulate? I wanted to browse the archive and see what all y'all's initial reactions to it were... I'm assuming it was *after* WCSE proper was released... because I remember that I unsubscribed after that record. I guess I'll take a look through 1999 and see what I find... - --Catherine ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 17:54:41 +1000 (EST) From: Brett Subject: Re: [support-system] Need an approximate date... Do you mean Ken's WCSE Sessions Double CD ? If so, this is one of the earlier references to it Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1998 23:47:32 -0600 (CST) From: kenmlee@ix.netcom.com (Kenneth Lee) Subject: what's this about those darn tapes...? *shrug* / Brett On Thu, 21 Aug 2003, Catherine Molanphy wrote: > Does anyone remember approximately when the WCSEsessions (1997) boot began > to circulate? I wanted to browse the archive and see what all y'all's > initial reactions to it were... I'm assuming it was *after* WCSE proper was > released... because I remember that I unsubscribed after that record. > > I guess I'll take a look through 1999 and see what I find... > > --Catherine ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 04:41:24 -0400 From: "Michael Honaker" Subject: [support-system] i only post because i'm a real cunt in school Erin called me a cunt and spelled: >Are you dense? Evidently I am! And thank you for calling me a cunt! I was never part of the in-crowd in high school because all the really cool pretty people we're way too cool for me... and post really brilliantly thought out messages to mailing lists because they're...well...just so fucking cool! But now that I've been called a cunt, I've arrived! Love you too, sugar. I figured it was a fake e-mail, but didn't quite know for sure...I didn't recognize your e-mail address in the post. I kind of skipped out on reading the list for a while because of too much bullshit ridden conversations cluttering it up (and people posting 8 thousand reviews at once...you know, sometimes a link works better). So, yeah... Good. Glad it was fake. I should hope no one really joins the list without learning to spell, of course, you never know... Avril might join the list eventually when she gets tired of pretending to be a musician. Everyone keep an eye out for an e-mail address that looks like CMPLK8TDSK8RGRRL @ AOL.COM and we'll know when to either jump ship or laugh her off the list. The OMG post *was* hysterically funny, by the way. I thought the "BFF" was a nice touch. I just wish the whole list was that much fun to read, but alas, we're all irate cunts apparently. I was just irritated already that day when I responded. Sorry. It's all in fun though. Stephanie said: >Maybe CUNT is accepted on this list because Liz >has used it in a few of her songs. Does that mean we can use "Faggot" and "Queer" on the list in every day conversation since Liz used them? You know, "cunt" is an insult too...not to me, but it may be to someone else. It's all in the way one uses the word. Erin called me a cunt, and let me tell you I liked it more and more... mmm...I feel dirty. Now that I know the word is approved, I shall use it constantly! Knock yoursleves out though... I only wanted to state my opinion. An insult is an insult. If someone had said "don't patronize me, faggot" then they would have been put in their place, or at least I would hope they would be. There are other ways to get your point across and take a stab at someone without being a sexist moron. I say this because it was obvious that he wasn't joking when he said "cunt". If he had been, I wouldn't be typing. I'm all for insulting people, but shit, at least when you're insulting someone's intelligence, make sure you know what you're talking about. There's too much whining about the birthday thing anyway... Big deal, she didn't do it. Hell, she can't even remember how to play Carnivore, right? Oh well. Liz is Liz. Hate her if you must, I'm not going to defend her, but I'm not going to insult her because I don't know her personally, and beyond the whole birthday thing, whether you want to admit it or not, she's a talented musician and that's why most of us are here... not because she's approachable and does us favors. In response to the other trash that has been said by the same birthday guy: why would anyone, including Liz, respect you? Re-read what you posted and what you said to Catherine. Then get a life or a job or some shit to occupy your time, because you're wasting it by bitching about something that can't be explained or apologized for by anyone but Liz. I think I'll send this e-mail now and go beg all of my celebrity friends to mention my name whenever their interviewed and on tv so I can be famous too, or at least mention my boyfriend's name so I can hold that over his head that I'm responsible for him being partly famous. But damnit, if they deny me, I'll post a hateful message and damn them all to hell and back just to make myself look like a badass. YEAH! MEET ME BY THE LOCKRZ AT 3 SO I CAN KICK YOUR ASS, LIZ! AND I'M TAKING UR TWINKIES AT LUNCH TOO, CUNT! Pardon me if I've been a/an [insert degrading word of your choice here]. Please feel free to send me hate mail! - -Michael ==== SUPERNOVA has moved... http://www.fan-sites.org/liz-phair/ The SUPERNOVA Discussion Board... Where all the faggots, queers and cunts go to be cool... http://supernova.board.dk3.com ==== ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 12:01:00 -0700 From: "dana p." Subject: [support-system] it's too late, baby you're assuming "professionalism" refers to slick stage presence and, i dunno, choreography and the like. that's not exactly what i'm talking about. i'm using it in the sense that when you're out there, you're doing pretty much whatever it takes to make the experience enjoyable and entertaining for the audience--and (gasp!) yourself. [tori amos, for example, is very professional. she's puts on a fantastic show and it's not about being smarmy and slick.] it's not about trying to cover up for lack of talent or whatever--it's just something extra. i'm referring to a professional "spirit"; it's something in your demeanor and performance that says, "i like being in the same room with you and let's all enjoy some music i'm about to play..." and, yes, sure, there *is* an underlying reason for it: you're trying to sell records, after all. can we all agree that she took this step with the new CD to build a huge audience and reap the financial benefits? ok, so then building audience rapport and being "open" and fun at shows is a really good way to do that. [does that satisfy your "logic" jones?] AND you're trying to get people to come back to see you again. (see discussion below.) many have a lot of respect for performers who go the extra mile, or, in this case, the extra inch. whatever. just a little something extra. some people on this list are acting like, if she did the shout-out, oh my god, it would open the floodgates and the grasping masses would be demanding that she pay off their credit cards or fuckin' donate a lung or something---the demands would never end!!! good grief.... how many people does she ever have in line to sign autographs and--oh yikes--she's got ONE GUY with a really interesting story asking for one little shout-out. one person. that's IT. christ, i've seen some musicians stand in line for *an hour*, after performing a kick-ass show for 90 minutes, patiently signing autographs and posing with fans for pictures. *** sorry i keep citing the "business" aspect, but if you knew how the musi! c busine ss works, you'd know that artists make money only on touring. unless their CD goes platinum. then they look forward to raking it in from endorsements. that means at shows, you gotta work it, because that's the key part of the cycle. sorry, sweetie, but that's just how it is; i am not making this up. bone up on how it all works, maybe. if you sign a contract, that implies a business arrangement, right? like i just said, trying to get people to come see your show again is a really good strategy to earn income as a musician. in fact, it's pretty much your only recourse. that, and producing. and scoring films. musicians make almost nothing on CD sales--that money is used to pay back fees incurred to produce the record. *** i'm presenting an opinion based on observation of behavior and what i consider to be a problem--because it goes beyond brian's thing: i'm on several different lists and the reports i'm hearing of shows.... not good. and it pains me, it really does. it's too bad to see someone so talented fuck it up for herself, simply because she feels she did everything she could (write some songs the way she was told and then pose for pictures in label-approved outfits) and now we're all supposed to be falling all over ourselves in devotion--financial and otherwise. seriously, if she indeed wants to be "the people's princess," she really truly is gonna have to get down from those "six-inch heels anymore" and do all that stuff that the people like. no matter how boring or pedestrian or just plain stupid she thinks it is. sorry. she made a very calculated choice, didn't she? and then she's got *one guy* asking for a shout-out. it takes less than 10 seconds to do it, and, there you go, people think you're cool and they're happy to be there and all the rest of it.... that's all it takes, it's done. *** if she really wanted to shut that bitch up from the NY Times, she'd be trying much harder to own her shows, no matter if she's opening for jason mraz or, ha ha, gary coleman. like i've said many times before,! if she' s so concerned with trying to emulate sheryl's success [and you *know* it's because she wants to be livin' large the way sheryl does], she should note that sheryl built a very loyal following through kick-ass live performances. she MADE them like--and respect--her, because she performed like a trouper, show after show after show. an endorsement from keith richards didn't hurt, but this point is, she was handed an opportunity and she ran with it, she made it work. keep in mind, too, that she was a *very* hated person for awhile there, people in LA really loathed her, but she rose above it. liz has been given a *huge* chance to launch her career to the next level--something many artists don't get EVER--and what is she doing? she's standing up there in her high-concept, vogue-magazine-inspired outfits--it's all about "look at me"--and just going through the motions onstage. not good. capitol spent a *shitload* on this record and she *does* owe them--in this case, in the sense that she should be putting on great shows. which would benefit her the most in the long run. she's being damn dumb; face it. ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V6 #226 ************************************