From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V5 #188 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Monday, September 23 2002 Volume 05 : Number 188 Today's Subjects: ----------------- liz on happy days ["sandra" ] we have a winner.... ["dp" ] Re: support-system-digest V5 #187 [Johnnycass631@aol.com] Re: Re: Liz in EW ["Stacey Wirt" ] Re: we have a winner.... [AWeiss4338@aol.com] Re: support-system-digest V5 #187 [Jase ] liz in EW [Dan MacDonald ] The Matrix [Kenneth Lee ] Coney Island Clip [Catherine Roper ] all tastes the same [Stephen Griffes ] "i need the infooo...." ["dp" ] Re: "i need the infooo...." [AWeiss4338@aol.com] [none] ["Drew Schultz" ] Re: [Jase ] BRETT ["Mark Schulte" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 19:19:17 -0500 From: "sandra" Subject: liz on happy days > I think Liz has pretty much officially jumped the shark now. > GUFFAW! sandra ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2002 22:34:13 -0700 From: "dp" Subject: we have a winner.... >>Brett wrote: >>avril lavigne (april levine, i just know it).>>Brett >HHAHAHAHH I bet you're right >t you are! i forgot who said it, but i read a quote in some mag where some musician said, "hey, i knew her when she was april levine..." crack-up!!! and GO JASE!!! that whole post was great. i love it when you're in bad mood (i'm guessing here); you're posts are totally funny. hey, who are "avril's people" anyway?? we're all doomed... at least courtney can name-check the right bands, fer chrissakes! geez.... here's a random question: has anyone ever heard of the music producer mark trombino? like, what has he worked on?? you're all gonna die, but we're kinda sorta "related." his uncle was my aunt's hubby. how crazy is that? my aunt keeps talking about mark this, mark that, mark got nominated for best producer in "rolling stone" (this was a coupla years ago already) and i'm all "well, what does he work on??" "well, i don't know...." grrrrrr. so if anyone knows anthing, thanks in advance. love,dp ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 01:44:35 EDT From: Johnnycass631@aol.com Subject: Re: support-system-digest V5 #187 Im sorry, but i just have to respond to this. It was written, that you wished Liz would just be herself musically. Are you her? No. You're a fan, just like any one of us on this list. I don't even want to mention the Avril-whatever-her-name-is name on this, but hey--so Liz is working with people who WORKED on her album--that doesnt mean Liz is gonna end up sounding like her. Great musicians make great albums. And she will come through like she always has. P.S. I wish Courtney would work with Avril Lavine--that way more people would hate her too-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 01:38:40 -0400 From: "Stacey Wirt" Subject: Re: Re: Liz in EW amen, Jase. I don't post very often (or.....at all) anymore, but I must say that this is fucking ridiculous. If liz is trying to become the next pink/avril levine/jennifer love hewitt I will lose all respect for her. And who even knows when the album will come out? By that point, the pop world will be interested in something else entirely, and Liz will be over. sounds harsh but that's what it's come to. disappointed, Stacey ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 02:26:37 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: we have a winner.... In a message dated 9/22/2002 1:34:47 AM Eastern Standard Time, daisywheel@mindspring.com writes: > here's > a random question: has anyone ever heard of the music producer mark > trombino? like, what has he worked on?? you're all gonna die, but we're > kinda sorta "related." his uncle was my aunt's hubby. how crazy is that? > my aunt keeps talking about mark this, mark that, mark got nominated for > best producer in "rolling stone" (this was a coupla years ago already) > and i'm all "well, what does he work on??" "well, i don't know...." > grrrrrr. so if anyone knows anthing, thanks in advance. love,dp > The only band I know of that he's worked with is Jimmy Eat World, the emo band that had a top ten hit with The Middle. It's a good band, worth checking out. As for Liz, I'm reserving judgment until I hear the album, or at least whatever is the single on the radio. But I do know what Jase means, Dar Williams made three great albums, and then on the forth one she worked with some of the people who worked with Shawn Colven, and The Green World stank of sell out. No offense meant to the Dar and Shawn fans on the list. I still like Dar, and Shawn is cool, just wasn't the right chemistry in this case. Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 03:26:23 -0400 From: Jase Subject: Re: support-system-digest V5 #187 Johnnycass631@aol.com wrote: >Im sorry, but i just have to respond to this. >It was written, that you wished Liz would just be herself musically. Are you >her? >No. You're a fan, just like any one of us on this list. I don't even want >to mention the Avril-whatever-her-name-is name on this, but hey--so Liz is >working with people who WORKED on her album--that doesnt mean Liz is gonna >end up sounding like her. Great musicians make great albums. And she will >come through like she always has. Great musicians make great albums -- except when they're very consciously trying to produce hits. To quote Aimee Mann, "There's a fine line between singles and jingles." I'm sorry, but I see this move as nothing more than a conscious attempt to be the next big thing by working with a currently hot producer. She seems to be aiming for style over substance. And quite frankly, the more accessible Liz's music becomes, the less inspiring it is, which is likely why _whitechocolatespaceegg_ is my least favorite of her three albums (even though it's still better than 95% of anything else out there). Do we not remember what happened when Joni Mitchell tried to work with Thomas Dolby in 1985? What happened was _Dog Eat Dog_, the worst album she's ever released. When the producer's signature is all over the work, more so than that of the artist themselves, you know there's a problem. And that's what I see happening with Liz's new album. And she's hardly being herself musically when she keeps jumping from producer to producer for this album and is writing with a "hit doctor," that Gary Clark guy. >P.S. I wish Courtney would work with Avril Lavine--that way more people >would hate her too-- OK, let me guess, you're another obsessed Nirvana fan who gets their kicks by slamming Courtney Love at every opportunity? Isn't that so 1994? It's been done to death. Get a new shtick already. Your ilk can all shut up already. You're getting your goddamn box set. Nirvana, in my opinion, are extremely overrated anyway. The Pixies were _far_ better. Sorry to be so snide, but I read enough of this shit whenever I log onto Courtney's message board. Jase NP: Big Star, _#1 Record/Radio City_ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 11:24:36 -0400 From: Dan MacDonald Subject: liz in EW >don't know if anyone saw it, but liz is currently >working with the people who did 'complicated' by avril >lavigne (april levine, i just know it). hey - was there any other news about the album or the making of it in this blurb? wish i saw it... as far as liz working w/ the people who did avril levigne's (or whatever) complicated...shit..i don't know.. liz has done some VERY shady things in the past... i can remember when i found out she was naming her album "Whitechocolatespaceegg" - i thought it was the dumbest thing i had ever heard of - i thought it was typical, stupid, a stereotypical example of a banal idea of who can make the album with the most 'different' and 'unique' and 'intriguing' name....then i heard it and i loved it and couldn't imagine it with any other name...and there was the whole "country tinged" scandal..remember that? and the whole opening up for alanis... liz has always done things that have kind of made me frown a little - but they always turn out to be okay...if anyone can pull it off - it's her i guess. and let's not forget the song "Down". if that was any hint of what we'll be getting w/ this new album, i can't see it being all that bad at all. still haven't heard the Julie Johnston songs... is there a "t" in that name? i've heard they were fantastic and amazing...i don't know..liz has yet to disappoint me musically and she hasn't even come close in the past...i'm gonna keep my faith regardless of who she is working with and just keep my fingers crossed...i just can't see it being that bad. (although i couldn't see garbage releasing an album like "beautiful garbage" either...so i guess anything can happen..) for now - i'm anxiously awaiting new albums by: Sinead O'Connor The Bangles (w/ Brad Wood producing - this is gonna be amazing) Tori Amos Massive Attack Courtney Love Portishead Matthew Sweet Veruca Salt and the new Bjork box set!!! at any rate - i'm out, dan ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 10:00:20 -0700 From: Kenneth Lee Subject: The Matrix Getting myself out from under those Liz clippings... Here's what I found out about The Matrix: The Los Angeles-based songwriting/production team of The Matrix consists of writer/producers Scott Spock, Lauren Christy, and Graham Edwards. They've been working together for over three years now, and during that time have gained a great deal of success, with five songs and all of the singles on Avril Lavigne's Let Go album (including "Complicated" and "Sk8ter Boi"), three tracks on Liz Phair's upcoming album, a couple of tracks on Ricky Martin's upcoming release, Christina Aguilera's "This Year" from the My Kind of Xmas album, and many other recent hits. Additional clients include the Backstreet Boys, Nick Carter, the band Lillix, and Ben Jelen. Well, at least it's only three tracks, but with that resume, yikes. - -Ken kenmlee@ix.netcom.com MeSmErIzInG - AnOtHeR LiZ PhAiR WeBsItE http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Club/2471/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 14:36:56 -0400 From: Catherine Roper Subject: Coney Island Clip >>Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2002 16:19:07 -0400 >>From: "Jennifer Sayler" >>Subject: new video clip >>Another clip from Doug! >>This one is of Tabitha Soren interviewing Liz at Coney Island. >>Its really great. >>http://www.liz-phair.com/video.htm >>Jenny I need help with Quick Time! Everytime I try to watch the clips on this website, a message comes up that says I need to download "Streaming Authoring". So I click yes to download and it gets all the way to end and then brings up an error message which reads "The dowload has been corrupted, would you like to try again." But if I click yes it will just do the same thing over and over. I even tried going to the Quick Time website and downloading it seperately from there...again, no success. Anybody out there know anything about Quick Time? Thanks! Katie - -- Roper, Catherine E roperce@jmu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 14:48:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Stephen Griffes Subject: all tastes the same > sleater-kinney on conan o'brian on october 30th?? that's almost as isn't that odd? but cool :) the world needs to be exposed. > working with the people who did 'complicated' by avril weird. i dunno who "the people" are but i hope that isnt the bandwagon she's jumping on. not trying to be ageist (how do you spell that?) but she's a tad bit old to be in the april/michelle/vanesa group. i seriously cannot tell the difference between those three...if liz's voice starts having that "this isn't a computer, it's my real voice!" quality to it then i give up. i know liz has good pop sensibility...which is fun, but if that gets into the wrong hands it can be manipulated to sound just like all that other shit. hahaha it's so amusing how we've grown to imagine the worst here. if she becomes one of those poptarts i'll get over it. theres tons of other great artists putting out fantastic music right now. but think positive :) stever np - spinner radio! check this shit out!!! heaven. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 12:24:15 -0700 From: "dp" Subject: "i need the infooo...." here's a random question: has anyone ever heard of the music producer mark trombino? like, what has he worked on?? you're all gonna die, but we're kinda sorta "related." his uncle was my aunt's hubby. how crazy is that? my aunt keeps talking about mark this, mark that, mark got nominated for best producer in "rolling stone" (this was a coupla years ago already) and i'm all "well, what does he work on??" "well, i don't know...." grrrrrr. so if anyone knows anthing, thanks in advance. love,dp The only band I know of that he's worked with is Jimmy Eat World, the emo band that had a top ten hit with The Middle. It's a good band, worth checking out. As for Liz, I'm reserving judgment until I hear the album, or at least whatever is the single on the radio. But I do know what Jase means, Dar Williams made three great albums, and then on the forth one she worked with some of the people who worked with Shawn Colven, and The Green World stank of sell out. No offense meant to the Dar and Shawn fans on the list. I still like Dar, and Shawn is cool, just wasn't the right chemistry in this case. Andrea ************************************************************************************************ hey andrea! how's it goin'? how's yer book doin'? i hope all is well. thanks for the info; i was just really surprised that here he was, all nominated in RS and i had never heard of him. well, professionally anyways. yeah, as far as i can tell, jimmy eat world is a cool group. well, now at least i know one band. i kept asking "who's he working with??" and all the trombinos are like, "well, it's alternative..." and i'm like, "yeah, great, i know stuff like that. OK, so who??" and every one of 'em's goin' "we have no idea. people." even his parents don't know. i talked to them a few years ago. the dad will never forget me because, hey, what's thanksgiving without a masturbation joke? yeah, that me.... and, you know, maybe our girl will pull through--who knows? i just though jase's post was hilarious. excellent display of humor and incisiveness, which is always good. and frankly i was sorta shocked that plans to work with *anyone at all* were even on the table. wow. and, yeah, what DID happen to michael penn? i wonder if he bailed. hey, i know: i'm gonna go see grant-lee phillips et al. in a coupla weeks; i'll ask him. alright... back to work for me... dp ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 19:14:43 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: "i need the infooo...." In a message dated 9/22/02 3:25:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time, daisywheel@mindspring.com writes: > hey > andrea! how's it goin'? how's yer book doin'? i hope all is well. thanks > for the info; i was just really surprised that here he was, all nominated > in RS and i had never heard of him. well, professionally anyways. yeah, > as far as i can tell, jimmy eat world is a cool group. well, now at least > i know one band. i kept asking "who's he working with??" and all the > trombinos are like, "well, it's alternative..." and i'm like, "yeah, > great, i know stuff like that. OK, so who??" and every one of 'em's goin' > "we have no idea. people." even his parents don't know. i talked to them > a few years ago. the dad will never forget me because, hey, what's > thanksgiving without a masturbation joke? yeah, that me.... and, you > know, maybe our girl will pull through--who knows? i just though jase's > post was hilarious. excellent display of humor and incisiveness, which is > always good. and frankly i was sorta shocked that plans to work with > *anyone at all* were even on the table. wow. and, yeah, what DID happen > to michael penn? i wonder if he bailed. hey, i know: i'm gonna go see > grant-lee phillips et al. in a coupla weeks; i'll ask him. alright... > back to work for me... dp > Pretty good thanks. Book is doing well, just found a publicist for it, and I'll take it to the next level. I'd never heard of Trombino before Jimmy Eat World, glad to see he's doing so well. Cool your related to him. I love Jimmy Eat World. I agree with you about Jase's post, I haven't made up my mind about Liz's new producers, that's how surprised I was. So here is a question for everyone, if her new album turns out to be like EIG or WS, just more commercial, but not like Michele Branch and so on, and she had a big hit with it, what would you think, especially if you liked the song. Michael Penn is starting his next album, but I have a feeling he finished with Liz before he did so.Ask grant, maybe he knows. Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 19:49:13 -0500 From: "Drew Schultz" Subject: [none] >don't know if anyone saw it, but liz is currently >working with the people who did 'complicated' by avril >lavigne (april levine, i just know it). Jesus, and people thought it was bad enough when she was working with Pete Yorn. That didn't really bother me as much, but this pretty much seals the deal that this album is going to blow. What's the first single going to be, "Fuck and Run (With My Fans' Money)?" I know it's your opinion, but I disagree. There is nothing wrong with Avril Lavigne. She is an amazingly gifted 17 year old. I like her, because in a way she's like a young Liz Phair. She performs for herself. With an opinion like that it shows that you don't support the muscian for who they are. Liz may be doing what she feels is in her best interst to get the new record out. I'm willing to wait as long as it takes for it to be out as long as Liz feels it is worth having her name on it. People should stop ripping on her for taking so long to get it completed. She has had things in her personal life that she has had to take time out to deal with. _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 22:16:52 -0400 From: Jase Subject: Re: Drew Schultz wrote: >I know it's your opinion, but I disagree. There is nothing wrong with >Avril Lavigne. She is an amazingly gifted 17 year old. I like her, because >in a way she's like a young Liz Phair. She performs for herself. With an >opinion like that it shows that you don't support the muscian for who they >are. Liz may be doing what she feels is in her best interst to get the new >record out. I'm willing to wait as long as it takes for it to be out as >long as Liz feels it is worth having her name on it. People should stop >ripping on her for taking so long to get it completed. She has had things >in her personal life that she has had to take time out to deal with. OK, in my post, did I bitch about the record taking so long? Yeah, I may have covered that in the past, but this post was expressing my distaste in regards to who Liz is working with. And I'm sorry, but look at the resume of that production team. This may seem indie snob of me, but I have to be truthful -- everything they've produced is, quite frankly, a piece of shit. That "Complicated" song, for me, wins the award for most annoying single of the year. And I don't happen to think Avril Lavigne is all that "amazingly gifted." Her music is about as mediocre as everything else on the radio right now and just as generic. In that case, is Britney Spears gifted as well (no jokes from the peanut gallery about her breasts)? And she's nowhere near being in the same league as Liz Phair as a songwriter. I doubt she could ever aspire to that. Would you rather I be dishonest and be a total sycophant and like everything Liz does, simply because it's her that's doing it, but meanwhile, if it was anyone else, I'd honestly loathe it? Would that make me a true fan then? The music Liz seems intent on making is not the kind that made us fans of her work in the first place. Why should we have to pretend to like something when we really don't? And I have a feeling that's exactly what some people are doing. But man, it sucks when you have to talk yourself into liking a record. And again, I wasn't ripping on Liz for taking so long with the record. I was ripping on her choice of producers. Jase NP: Sonic Youth, _Goo_ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 23:31:54 -0500 From: "Mark Schulte" Subject: BRETT ...sorry...I don't know this guy's e-mail address. But...yeah...Brett...I got the CD's like...a billion years ago...and I just now realized that I hadn't even contacted you about them. Sorry about that. Anyway...yeah...they totally rocked my world...? Thanks! I don't know. Sorry it didn't work the first time, but...yeah...they were worth waiting for...? And...new Liz Phair is depressing me more and more. It all seems so...Globe Sessions. But at least it'll be catchy, well-written Globe Sessions...? - -Mark _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V5 #188 ************************************