From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V3 #299 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Monday, November 6 2000 Volume 03 : Number 299 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Bounced message [Jason Long ] Re: I can't listen to the radio... [Jason Long ] Re: I can't listen to the radio... [Jason Long ] liz news ["Jennifer Sayler" ] Re: 100 artists of hard rock [Jason Long ] Re: hard rocking Liz, Cursed, recommended records [Emil Breton ] Kansas ["Molly Magdalene" ] "title of post" ["Dana Polachowski" ] Re: support-system-digest V3 #298 [steve the dyke-tyke Subject: Bounced message From: Nick Nelson Subject: Re: support-system-digest V3 #297 >Ok, i don`t think anyone ever answered me... Did liz >move to la? I thought she had a house in chicago. Erin I think she's just staying here when she works on the new LP. She seems pretty grounded in Chicago, although if she does move permanently, I think (hope) she pick L.A. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 05:56:15 -0500 From: Jason Long Subject: Re: I can't listen to the radio... Jeff wrote: >Anyway, my musical tastes seem deeply rooted in 1995, and every radio >station where I live and work (in and around Boston) has become a clone of >itself. My once fav ("college radio" 'FNX) has become as mainstream as the >corporate rocker (BCN). I am almost at the point now of leaving the car >radio on where my 7 year old left it (Bubblegum radio) and find myself >singing along to Brittany, Christina and Mandy (another aside--girls simply >did NOT look like that when I was 20!!). > >So, I need a little help from the list to enhance my CD rotation away from >Liz, Juliana, Throwing Muses, LTC, Mazzy Star, Spinnanes, Tracy Bonham >etc--I need some suggestions of current music I might like that doesn't get >played on the radio, but fits my musical faves better than the angry rock of >Limp, Korn, Stained and Godsmack (who I must say is really good allthesame). I can relate to this all too well, since I've found myself in the same situation over the past couple of years. More than ever, I've been relying on recommendations made on this mailing list and others I'm on to discover new music. There are also a few online publications with fairly decent reviewers -- much better than those who write for, say, Rolling Stone -- that I've come to trust to some extent. This is also part of why I thought the tape swap idea would be good to try -- while we do often discuss other artists on this list and make recommendations, this would be a way of allowing others to actually hear what we're talking about. I'm not sure how many are interested in doing another swap, but I think I will try to organize another one in a month or so. If you'd like to, feel free to join in on it. As for some suggestions of albums or artists to check out: * Sleater-Kinney: If you haven't already given them a listen, they're a must. They are a little bit harder than some of the artists you mentioned liking (Juliana, Mazzy Star), but just as rewarding. It's really hard to put into words, but their music is like the ultimate balancing act, yet they never waver. They write great riffs and their songs are undeniably catchy, but they're also more complex than they may initially seem; they have a better sense of dynamics than just about any band I can think of; and they write incredible lyrics -- sometimes analytical, sometimes emotional, always fiercely intelligent. Taken together, their lyrics and music are intense and cathartic, and the resulting songs are "anthemic" in the best sense of the word. I just wish I could convey the rush I get when I listen to them -- every album had raised the stakes even higher but they've never failed to floor me. Start with this year's _All Hands on the Bad One_, which in part, seems to be a reaction to the current state of rock (all those angry bands you mentioned, the rapes at Woodstock, etc.) -- they're conveying a lot of things that need to be said. Thank God. With all the "dumbed-down" rock bands out there, we need bands like this more than ever. * Aimee Mann: Normally I'd recommend Aimee's new album, _Bachelor No. 2_, to anyone who might be interested in checking her out, but based on your list of artists you like, it seems to me that _I'm With Stupid_ might be a better place to start. In a lot of ways, I have to wonder if the album would have done better if it had been released a year or two earlier. I think it would have fit in better in the musical climate of 1994 or 1995, but due to record label politics, the album sat unreleased through the period where it would have stood a better chance. "Long Shot" and "Choice in the Matter" would have sounded great on modern rock radio along with the other female artists getting played at the time (Breeders, Elastica, Liz, PJ Harvey). Aimee might not have sounded as aggressive as those artists, but the overall vibe, intelligence and her dark humor would have been a nice fit. _I'm With Stupid_ is probably also Aimee's most varied album: in addition to those rockier songs, there are also some acoustic and slower songs which she's just as adept at. * Jen Trynin: It's hard to find and by now a few years old, but if you missed out on it the first time around, you *need* _Gun Shy Trigger Happy_. The only album that has had more of an impact on me is _Exile in Guyville_, which is saying a lot. Musically, it's about evenly split between rockers and slower songs, much like _Guyville_, and almost as expertly sequenced. The lyrics are music are both excellent, but what really seals it for me is Jen's remarkable guitar playing (she plays all of the guitar on the album, both rhythm and leads, and is an inventive, proficient player) and her vocals, which are passionate without ever sounding over-the-top and are full of conviction -- you believe every word (again, much like _Guyville_). Check the used bins, the cut-out bins, see if your local music stores still have any stock on hand, do whatever it takes to find this album, as it is getting harder to get. Of course, if you want to make it easy on yourself, amazon.com still has it on CD, although none of the other online retailers do. And if you like this one, try checking out _Cockamamie_, her earlier, still-excellent-but-more-straightforward-rock album (again, also hard to find). * Elastica: If you liked their first album, make sure you check out the new one. If you didn't, check it out anyway. Sonically, _The Menace_ doesn't bear much relation to _Elastica_, although spiritually it's in the same ballpark. The uptempo songs are a little more raucous than those on the first album; at the same time, they're a little more 'arty,' yet still catchy (although not so much as "Stutter," "Line Up" and "Connection" off the debut). The slower songs (about half the album) are where the band become almost recognizable at times -- they are far more layered and there is more of a reliance on keyboards/programming, although the guitars are still prominent. There's a lot of growth here, particularly in songs like "Image Change," "Human" and "My Sex," which they never would have been able to pull off before. The album does have a sound of its own and feels a little schizophrenic initially, but after a few listens, everything falls into place. Challenging, but if you're willing to make the effort, you'll be amply rewarded. Hope this helps... Cheers, Jase ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 07:36:35 -0500 From: Jason Long Subject: Re: I can't listen to the radio... I wrote, about Elastica: >The slower songs (about half the album) are where the band >become almost recognizable at times -- which should read "almost unrecognizable." Why haven't I went to bed yet? I'm too tired to make any kind of sense... Sleeplessly, Jase ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 09:01:43 -0500 From: "Jennifer Sayler" Subject: liz news I dont know if this has been posted already or not, but I thought everyone would want to know. According to my friend Jill, Liz is giving a lecture at the University of Texas for a women in music class and a small show for the press. Jill is going to the lecture, but has not been able to get tickets to the show. I dont know when any of this is actually happening, but I think it is soon. So thats my Liz news, back to lurking.... Jenny *^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ I gave her my heart and she gave me a pen. - -John Cusack (Say Anything) ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* Cool, Tall, Vulnerable and Luscious - http://www.liz-phair.com Vampyr - http://www.saylerfamily.com/jas/vampyr.htm *^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 09:00:04 -0500 From: Jason Long Subject: Re: 100 artists of hard rock Craig wrote about the VH1 'greatest artists of hard rock' list: >I can't wait to see what Liz has to say! It would take >forever to point out all the problems with that list, >so I will quietly go away. Yeah, looking over the list, I thought to myself, "They've got to be joking" more than a few times. I won't go too far into it, but what's with all the bad hair bands from the '80s who made the cut? And why do a great number of the artists/bands who made it on seem to be, well, rather derivative? Do you know who voted for this thing? I have to wonder if a few voters weren't being a little ironic, and VH1 being VH1 didn't pick up on it. I guess I can't totally complain, though -- Hole made the cut, when normally all anyone does is slag Courtney Love off. She deserves some recognition for her talent. Seeing The Clash, Sex Pistols and Ramones all in the Top 20 warms my heart too. I don't quite understand Sonic Youth being on there. I've never really thought of them being all that particularly "hard rock," but even less so than some of the other curious choices on there. Still, it's good to see them recognized anywhere. Why are the Stones in the bottom half of the list? And how the heck did Pat Benatar even place? >NP: PJ Harvey - "Stories From The City, Stories From The Sea" Although I'm a big fan of PJ Harvey, quite often it takes me several listens to really "grow" into her albums. This one I loved from the first listen. Some of the songs remind me quite a bit of Patti Smith and the mix is a lot cleaner than on some of her other records. I never really got into _Is This Desire?_ or _Dance Hall at Louse Point_, so maybe I have slightly lowered expectations, but I really think that this album is a return to form -- the best she's done since _To Bring You My Love_. I know it's a long shot, but I hope this album finally finds PJ a wider audience. I'm glad that "Good Fortune" was the song they chose for the first single; it seems like it has the greatest chance of catching on. Still awake (ugh), Jase ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 08:03:26 -0800 (PST) From: Emil Breton Subject: Re: hard rocking Liz, Cursed, recommended records To the dude in Boston who's searching for artists outside femme rock 1995 and radio rage 2000 to listen to: Guided by Voices (start with Bee Thousand) Badly Drawn Boy (highly, highly recommended) Elliott Smith (start with Either/Or -- absolutely as essential as Ms. Phair) Jen Trynin (Boston native, in fact; both LPs are outstanding and HARD-rocking) Yo La Tengo (start with I Can Hear the Heart...) re: Cursed (not Charmed) theme song -- Liz's vocals are getting too perfect, and after all the anticipation, I wish it lasted longer than 20 seconds. I do agree the show from the outset seems brutally unfunny. I do kind of dig the lyrics, but I was actually hoping for a Laverne & Shirley-type theme song (of equal length) that I'd want to have on tape or something... and let me just say HELL YEAH to Liz's well-deserved inclusion in VH1's Top 100 Hard Rockers or whatever it's called. Gotta love VH1. And thank god Liz is being recognized as a hard rocker, period, and not a "woman in rock", a category in which many non-rocking women have been lumped lately. I'm all about separation. Thanks very much for the news. - -E __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one Place. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 08:42:37 -0800 (PST) From: Emil Breton Subject: oh, fuck I guess I misunderstood. Liz is NOT included on the list of hard rockers, but will be featured in segments talking ABOUT hard rockers? Thanks, Craig, for the list. Still good to hear that Liz will be on TV yet again, but FIE on the listmakers for picking Courtney Hole over her. Lenny Kravitz, too. Damnation! - -E __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one Place. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 10:42:58 CST From: "Molly Magdalene" Subject: Kansas >I'm 29 and lived in Boston all my life. (Though I just moved to >Kansas.) I'm always alarmed to hear that other people live in Kansas. I mean..i know they do...i can see that..but...blah... M "Maybe i didn't like to hear but i still can't belive that Speed Racer is dead so then i thought i'd make some plans but fire thought she'd really rather be water instead" ((Tori Amos)) _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 09:12:11 -0800 From: "Dana Polachowski" Subject: "title of post" > > I can't wait to see what Liz has to say! It would take > forever to point out all the problems with that list, > so I will quietly go away. > dude, i cannot believe you typed all that... i'm in awe. let us know what liz has to say.... i'm curious. those VH1 shows--they suck you in!! i can't believe it! one minute i'm sitting there flipping through channels, next thing you know i'm a full 45 minutes into "the tony orlando story." yikes. it's sick. it's weird. i don't understand it. i'm too shocked to bitch and moan about BFF. god, what a bummer. c'est la vie, though, i guess. they did some great things. (like sign my bra...) jeff g: like you, i've become quite disgusted with our "alternative" saviour-radio station out here. well, it comes and goes, the disgust. it's the same 5 songs (blink182, green day, beastie boys, green day, blink182). i like sandra's idea, the alt-country. there's tons of stuff to check out. happy trails! dp PS: astrology says gore's gonna win, but we might not know for a few days or even weeks if they have to go to the absentee ballots. so let's see! VOTE VOTE VOTE!!! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 13:46:40 -0500 (EST) From: steve the dyke-tyke Subject: Re: support-system-digest V3 #298 Whoa. am i the only one who is frightened that pat benatar and korn are on the same top 100 list???? creepy... eep. as for nina simone, i think she is doing a 10 city tour or something. check out pollstar. she was AMAZING. she is the kind of role model that should be out there right now. she came out with a sexy sleeveless dress, and just belted out the tunes. and she is an amazing pianist!!!! i was so impressed. she played for an hour and a half (I hope i'm that energetic when i'm 77!!!) and she kept interacting with the crowd the whole time. not only was the music wonderful, but she was just the coolest. she was so political. she kept bush-bashing, and incorporating anti-bush lyrics into her songs. oh, and one song she did she was like "this song is for all the Black maids out there...we've been in this work for 100 years...and this shit has got to stop." it was just great. very inspiring. the university presented her with a special award at the end of the evening. it was wonderful. she is my hero:) steve IM: ThrownMuse21 BikiniKillBoy ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 14:57:13 EST From: AMCFLND1@aol.com Subject: Re: support-system-digest V3 #297 In a message dated 11/4/00 1:32:40 AM Eastern Standard Time, owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org writes: << Also, I'd be interested to hear someone's review of the Borders Poe n' Bro Tour, since the one I'll see is the last date in Austin on November 13. >> I saw her at Housing Works in NYC Friday night....She sang 5 new songs: Control, Spanish Doll, 5 and 1/2 Minute Hallway, If YOu Were Here, and Hey Pretty (not in that order)....her brother read from his book, and they both shared stories....You should really enjoy the show.... Sara. ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V3 #299 ************************************