From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V3 #126 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Thursday, May 11 2000 Volume 03 : Number 126 Today's Subjects: ----------------- NLC: Something Funny ["Michael Worrell" ] [none] [Vasant Ramamurthy ] Re: ["Jason Long" ] Re: support-system-digest V3 #125 [Fiercecalmlvr@aol.com] Re: When Last We Left Our Hero... [AWeiss4338@aol.com] *sigh* + a new thread??? (scroll to the end) ["Chris Camboni" ] agressiveness [Craig King ] Veruca/juliana and a pony. [Dan ] Voting is closed, read the mail and find the outcome [Nelsewhere@aol.com] Woodstock remake revisited [Gabriel Peterson ] Please Do Not Breed ["Molly Magdalene" ] Muses? [JRHanan@aol.com] the joys of skipping school...(offtopic) [Sexililgurl@aol.com] [none] [Craig King ] RE: Please Do Not Breed [Gerardo ] i went to your concert and i didn't feel anything! [Riot Poof ] juliana's pony (no liz) [Melissa Leigh ] Re: Please Do Not Breed [HOLEPARTS@aol.com] The Battle of Vercua Salt [AWeiss4338@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 01:15:39 -0400 From: "Michael Worrell" Subject: NLC: Something Funny http://www.brknews.com/backstreet.html Read it while the "Hallelujah Chorus" or the "Ode to Joy" is playing. Heh. Heh. Heh. Huh huh huh...cool. Michael NV: "The Black Hole" on DVD "The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." - --Hunter S. Thompson ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 00:33:39 -0500 From: Vasant Ramamurthy Subject: [none] i think everybody on this list needs to take a chill pill & go listen to hanson's "where's the love?" that should set things right. vasant ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 01:48:43 EDT From: "Jason Long" Subject: Re: >i think everybody on this list needs to take a chill pill & go listen to >hanson's "where's the love?" that should set things right. Actually, I think having to listen to Hanson would only make me angrier. ;) Posting in lieu of doing actual work, Jase ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 01:50:19 EDT From: Fiercecalmlvr@aol.com Subject: Re: support-system-digest V3 #125 In a message dated 5/10/2000 12:20:25 AM Central Daylight Time, owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org writes: > oh, im sorry i joined a list for kindergartners! i can see why it would be > offensive now...... seriously tho, its not like we are all 10 years old or > something. i think that we are old enough to be able to take some offensive > language. oh well, if its a rule its a rule. its not the only stupid rule > ive > heard of As someone who personally works with kindergartners and first-graders on a daily basis, I can tell you that there are some principles that we go by in the classroom. We do not say things that will hurt other people's feelings. And when we are in someone else's domain, be it a mailing list, a classroom, or the home of our grandparents, we abide by those rules. Those who have to be reminded of these very elementary principles are the ones acting like "kindergartners", not those who try to remind them to treat other people with decency and respect. xo katie ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 02:33:50 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: When Last We Left Our Hero... Aimee's not going to do a video for Bachelor #2, she says it's too expensive. I don't know about singels though and no one asked at the chat she did at barnesandnoble.com last night. If I remember correctly she did say EIG was one of her favorite albums. Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:54:53 EDT From: "Chris Camboni" Subject: *sigh* + a new thread??? (scroll to the end) Children, children, children. Can we all take a step back and look at how ridiculous this list has become? Or at least our antics... Someone brought up the point that we can't always dwell on Liz, which is cool, but must we be children in our interactions with others? Don't get me wrong here- I'm the most immature, irresponsible jerk (ask my gf- she thinks I'm an asshole for the most part (j/k- sorta)) I admit that I'm disgruntled when people rant about NIN sucking (done more for music than most bands) and the whole (lol) argument on Hole (lol) got me agitated. Who cares what Courtney did or didn't do? At least she didn't blow her head off. I loved Kurt, but what can you say about a father who abandoned his child? And honestly, I was disappointed to find out HOLEPARTS is a dude. Kind of a buzzkill. My theory that women can be assholes will have to wait. Anyway, I'm off by soapbox. Sorry to be preachy. *QUESTION* Why does the majority of (people posting on) the list dislike WCSE? See, I went all bassackwards into it, and after spinning EIG 300 times the past month, I think I know why everyone considers it Liz's best. EIG is DIFFERENT from WCSE- is that why everybody loves it so? Did people expect another EIG and that's why they were disappointed in Liz's next two ventures? I don't have Juvenelia or Girlysounds (sadly) so I can't really comment on what those are/were- but why such animosity towards WCSE? Maybe people could post or email me privately about why they like one album in particular. My theory is it's all in how you purchase the record. Although I like EIG better now, in the two years I had only WCSE, it helped me through some rough times. Anyway, if you made any sense out of this email congratulations. Remember: you're only as good as the music you listen to Chris NP "Five to One" ~The Doors ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:55:01 -0400 From: Meredith Robbins Subject: The Long Goodbye You know, it used to be that when the digest got long enough to be broken into two parts, I'd be happy and excited -- whoo, extra Liz goodness! Yeah! But man, this time... It was like, well, fuck. More to skim through, what a drag. This is not how it should be, my little friends, and it is not how it always was. I've been a member of one Liz list or another for a pretty long time; I think I joined the late, lamented Guyville list in early 1996 or so, and I joined this list (well, the Liz Phair Digest List, later renamed 6'1", later rerenamed support-system) whenever the hell it came into existence (I remember the drama, but not the date -- sorry, Jason, I'm a bad list historian). Life in Lizland was good. I liked being a part of the list communities -- particularly the nascent Liz Phair Digest List/6'1", which was seriously hardcore kick-ass. Now I'm just, like, embarassed. I know there are intelligent, thoughtful people with respect for other people and great things to say still on this list. But for the most part, they've either decided that posting isn't worth the trouble of dealing with people's dipshit responses or that they just aren't interested enough in the list today to even read it carefully, much less respond to it. Not everyone who posts is an idiot or a troublemaker, of course; but the idiots and the troublemakers usually post loud enough and often enough to drown out the interesting, intelligent conversations that do come up. So when a thought-provoking, non-hostile, even -- dare I say it? -- on-topic thread gets started, it too often dies a premature death, crushed beneath the weight of inane flame wars that go on FREAKIN' FOREVER. I know I'm going to get the predictable responses to this post: if you know what's good for the list, why don't *you* write thought-provoking, non-hostile, on-topic posts? Simply put, I don't care enough. Putting up with months and months of childish sniping and asinine chatter has effectively destroyed any emotional connection to the list that I may once have had. It sounds a little silly to refer to an "emotional connection" to an e-mail list, but it does happen -- a sense of community tends to lead to a sense of responsibility and of attachment, and vice versa. But the expansion of the list into a faceless horde (I'm sorry, Jase, I know it sucks to complain about the list being too large for its own good, but I really think this is a factor here) has lessened our sense of community, and the constant self-absorbed infighting has lessened our sense of individual attachment and responsibility to the group at large. Each loss has increased the other in turn -- a vicious circle of mailing list decline. The second reason is that (and I will admit that this is probably self-defeating, but oh, well) I don't think anything I could do would do any good. I'm writing this because I'm tired of feeling stifled, not because I think anyone on the list is going to go, "Dear God, she's right! We must do something to save our precious list before it is too late!" I know this list and the regular posters to it far too well to delude myself like that. There would have to be a major sea-change in the way certain of our more vocal list members think of themselves and of the mailing list in order for any kind of improvement to be effected -- and I truly don't think any of these particular list members would be mature enough to let that happen. The best I can hope for is that *all* the list members will join together in their dislike of me -- because, hey, at least that's unity. But with our current crop of contrarians, who knows if that'll even happen. Anyways, you can respond to this if you want, but please be aware that I probably won't be around to read it. I'm staying subscribed long enough to make sure this post makes it to the list OK (hey, would you spend this long pouring out your heart only to have it vanish into the ether?), and then I'm out of here. I was reading (well, skimming, as per usual) the digest the other night, making my usual anguished noises of list irritation, and my boyfriend said to me, "Jesus, Meredith, if you hate reading it that much, why do you put yourself through it?" And I thought to myself, well, hey, why *do* I put myself through it? I mean, if I want Liz news and discussion, I've made enough friends through my years on the list to take care of that. And it's not like I'm getting all that much Liz news and discussion here, anyways. There's really no need to torture myself by sticking around. So, yeah, if you really want to discuss this with me, call me a bitch, whatever, feel free to e-mail me directly at mar90@columbia.edu. Otherwise, as of this coming digest, I bid you all farewell. Love, Meredith - -- http://www.eclectricity.org http://www.exileinnetville.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 07:09:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Craig King Subject: agressiveness As far as the aggressive music being a factor in the whole Woodstock debacle, I really don't think that plays much of a factor. I've been to Ozzfest the last 3 years as well as countless other metal concerts. Ozzfest is the premire metal festival of the year. You want to talk about aggressive music, Ozzfest has it. Slayer, Megadeth, Tool, and of course Ozzy Osbourne have all played, among others. Of all the years I've been going to it, I have never once seen or heard about a crowd getting out of hand. In fact the crowds have actually been fairly polite. I think the main factor causing the Woodstock debacle was the environment. I mean they were charging $4 for one bottle of water, outrageous prices for food, the port-o-potties were overflowing, people were bunched up in tents like sardines at night. Plus the fact that there were 400,000 people there over 3 days or whatever it was. Factor all that in and it makes for alot of unhappy people. When people are unhappy, they tend to do something about it. This is what I think led to the inmates running the asylum, not the bands. On a side note, I was only half kidding about Liz calling the album "My New Album". However, now that some people have pointed out that they like that title, well, I kinda like it too now! ;) Craig NP: Stone Temple Pilots - Unplugged and More __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 10:46:40 -0400 From: Dan Subject: Veruca/juliana and a pony. Hi Just wondering if anyone knows any background about Juliana Hatfield's new band Juliana's Pony...who are the memebers? Is it just a side "solo" project like an experimental thing??? Sounds really really cool, and I can't wait to grab it next week - but just wondering if anyone knows..um...exactly 'what' it is.... Also Veruca Salt was on the Mike bullard show last night (thanks STEVE!!!!) I know this is late, so there really isn't even a point to me writing this right now (kinda like saying "HA! You missed it!") but it was really neat..Louise sounded great..the played "Born Entertainer". Also - they showed a really fast clip of the video...it kinda made me wonder when it was shot...i know it was only a fast clip..but Louise looks really REALLY thin in the video...I've come to the conclusion that I think I like her better on the heavier side...she looks adorable!! As for the "pony" part of the email - (bad intro) - I do find that QUITE a few gay guys are really into girl rockers. It's that age old stereotype that ISN'T a stereotype. For some reason gay guys like seeing powerful women blah blah blah..and I hate admitting to it - but it's probably true. Every single gay guy I know either WORSHIP all those gals we love to listen to like Liz, Hole, Veruca Salt, PJ Harvey - or they adore the "other side" of the spectrum - (ahem - Madonna, Janet Jackson). Some of them, even swing both ways. *gasp*. I really do hate stereotypes - but this one is just too obvious to miss.. it has to be true. ANyway, I don't wanna start a big 'gay theme' thread...(even though the list wouldn't need any help from me at the moment) but it's kinda cool in a way. Also - HOLEPARTS - your anonymity with yer name really did throw me for a loop! I don't wanna center you out - but for some reason - I always thought you were a girl too! WIthout QUEstioN!! Sorry! It's a good thing! maybe you just write in a very sexually ambiguious voice.. The best quote ever was Liz Phair saying: "I'm so in touch with my masculine side, I could date myself." I love that. My version is - "I'm so in touch with my feminine side, if I were straight,I could date myself." oh ya!! Dan 2000. um..just kidding. good night. %&%&%&%&%%%%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&% "I don't have a case, that's why I have a hammer." -Farrah Fawcett, "Extremities." *******************************^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:40:32 EDT From: Nelsewhere@aol.com Subject: Voting is closed, read the mail and find the outcome Anyone who wants to help me get permission and assemble the boxed set can email me at NiKKiHaSSMaNLVR@aol.com-if we do get permission and all the people that said no want a copy, thats no problem-we'll let you know the outcome. Nick ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:47:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Gabriel Peterson Subject: Woodstock remake revisited Please tell me if I'm wrong, but the only time I've heard of these rapes in the crowd was at Woodstock. The way people are talking about it, you'd think these bands are going around on rape tours. I couldn't imagine this happenning at a Liz Phair concert but I also can't imagine it happenning at a Kid Rock concert either. I just think that there were many unfortunate factors that led to this. One of the biggest was that this Woodstock was a joke. Coca Cola and MTV cannot recreate what occurred the first time around. I don't know what anybody you shelled out that much money was hoping for but it looked like an awful idea to begin with. Here is my take on the factors: 1) A huge diverse crowd can show great unity (i.e. Fourth of July, demonstration, etc) as long as they agree on why they are there. I don't think everybody was at Woodstock for the same reasons. 2) High prices cause people to have less respect for what they are given and for them to 'get their money's worth'. 3) Huge crowd from people all over the country is a bad mix of mob-rule + anonymity. 4) The mystique of Woodstock's free love and naked women placed in such a different setting turned into lust. 5) There was a case in NYC about a murder in the middle of the city which nobody responded with help to that spawned tons of psych tests which all show that a large crowd is less likely to come to somebody's aid than an individual would. 6) I also don't think that everybody in the crowd knew what they were getting themselves into. As an example, if you go to a Sepultura or Pantera concert, you know that the mosh pit is going to be rougher than your average concert. At Woodstock, there were probably a lot of people not knowing what to expect from such an odd mix of people. There are a few more but I've realized how far I've carried on. In any event, I believe that the bands had an effect on the rapes but so did many other factors. I'm open to debate on this, Gabe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 10:49:50 CDT From: "Molly Magdalene" Subject: Please Do Not Breed >i think that we are old enough to be able to take some offensive >language. oh well, if its a rule its a rule. its not the only stupid >rule >ive heard of You know what. It's not that people CAN'T take the offensive language. It's that people shouldn't have to. You think it's a stupid rule you're more than welcome to leave. Maybe you don't understand why some people are upset about this, but what i don't understand is why you're so pissed off cause you can't use this word?! Do you think it's cute and funny to use this word or what? You know maybe since i'm not homosexual myself i don't have a fucking right to go off on you right about now, but i'm going to do it anyway because i have a lot of gay friends. A LOT, and it's not the same is hearing it myself and having it mean the same thing but it's not really fucking fun having friends living in a red neck close-minded town and watching them get torn down and treated as though thier presence isn't tolerable with that one word because of something so personaly and nobody elses business as their sexual preference! If you wanna say the word cause you think it's so fucking cool go ahead and say it till you're fucking blue in the face, but why don't you lock yourself in a closet and do it, nobody else wants to fucking hear it. >just so that you all know, im a guy, not a girl Oh my god..that explains so fucking much..and yet..makes so much make less sense.... Don't you miss nap time fucking around on this list HoleParts? M "If you want to challenge the system, don't go to bed with it" ~Ani DiFranco'~ ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 12:46:49 EDT From: JRHanan@aol.com Subject: Muses? Can someone please fill me in on this Throwing Muses rumor? I just went to Pollstart, but Throwing Muses came up, and there were no shows listed. It's there for a reason, though, right? Can someone in the know impart their wisdom of this situation to me. Thanks so much. Cheers, Jason ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 13:12:47 EDT From: Sexililgurl@aol.com Subject: the joys of skipping school...(offtopic) so i just saw the "starsuckers inc" video. i couldn't keep my self from giggling the whole time. first of all... star suckers... just totally killed it for me. but this video. .. was so damn hilarous i had to say something about it. I love hole. . very much. Courtney is awsome. But the way that fat guy was dressed up like her. I hit the floor. Though i think trent went to far with billy. I still think i get the point. Their are way to many fake ppl in music today. ok i know this has already been a topic on this list most likely, but i'm slow. Forgive me. ;) and for the liz content! someone said something about people liking exile more then WCSE. i personally think just the opposite. I mean don't get me wrong i love exile. But i personally relate more to WCSE. and i think musically it just sounds.. better. just my two cents. ~^~taryn "when i'm really hot, i can walk in a room, and if a man doesn't look at me he's probably gay" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:42:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Craig King Subject: [none] >>during the recent discussion of the word, i noticed that a lot of the guys on this list are gay, and i thought it was funny cause i realized that the only guys i know interested in kick-ass rocker chicks, like liz and ani and tori, are gay guys and i think thats kind of funny-<< Man, that's one big generalizaton if I ever saw one. I love alot of "kick-ass rocker chicks", and I am not gay. I hate it when people generalize that. To quote the great Seinfeld: "Not that there's anything wrong with that". ;) Craig NP: Alice In Chains - Jar of Flies The rollercoaster ride's a loney one I'd pay a ransom note to stop her from stealing - Stone Temple Pilots __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 17:07:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Gerardo Subject: RE: Please Do Not Breed The subject reminded me The Breeders, what about them? i friend told me he read they're getting back together to make great new album, who knows anything about them? any fan? what's with Kelley? thank you. Gerardo * ______________________________________________ FREE Personalized Email at Mail.com Sign up at http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 17:07:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Riot Poof Subject: i went to your concert and i didn't feel anything! OK, i just want to apologize if i made anyone uncomfortable with my last post...i didn't mean to randomly spew things and they weren't meant for anyone on the list in particular...i just felt the need to rant about that genre, since i feel so strongly about it. I stand by everything i said, and believe that white privilege, male privilege, and hetero privilege is alive and well in the music industry. i didnt mean to hurt the feelings of any straight white guys on the list, i was just looking at rap/rock from a social perspective. i don't have the time to get into huge discussions about it (so i'm sorry to all the people who sent me the RUDE private emails), so i just want to apologize if i made anyone feel like i was pinpointing them, because that wasn't my intention. (though i keep thinking back to that bikini kill song that goes "i'm so sorry if i'm alienating some of you...your whole fucking culture alienates me!") ha. um, jason said >>I'm glad there are still comments that make beer shoot out my nose >>(ow!). Thanks Steve. mighty welcome, anytime. stay away from hawaiian punch though, that burns like you wouldnt even believe when spewed out of the nose! ;) >And Jeff, boy am I jealous about you seeing the Muses reunion with Bob >Mould opening. I doubt if they're coming to Texas. i am still in utter disbelief. i would kill to see that. or stick cookies up my ass--either or. Tanya Donelly....sigh!!! im glad she's back to performing...can't wait for her next album! well, i didnt get to see the muses...BUT im seeing kristen hersh w/ vic chesnutt next monday! i know, it isn't the same, but it'll do. i can't wait to hear kristen. steve np - le tigre ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 17:58:27 -0400 From: Mike Marlatt Subject: on that note... And I really take offense to people using the term "frat-boy"! People throw the word "fag" around knowing that they're probably offending someone (I know I do!!! :), but nobody ever worries about all the wealthly, semi-charmed, well-rounded, cute (giggle) frat boys of the world. Everybody acts like we had it so easy. Easy!? We once had a guy in our house who had to pay his own tuition! He could barely afford to insure his Lexus. I find it so degrading when people refer to a bunch of drunk frat boys as a bunch "drunken frat boys". How judgemental can those people be? Just cause your drunk and in a frat doesn't make you some "dunken frat boy". These terms get thrown around so loosely and it's as if it's OK to pick one group but not OK to pick on another. Frat boys by far get the worse of it. You just wait, once they decode that genome thing they'll discover that frat-boys have certain genetic details and homosexuality is just a lifestyle. You'll see. One day you'll see. but then again, it's just a word being typed by someone I've never met....so why the hell would I care? Being gay is just like anything else. I should know being straight and all. sitting on the fence Mike Marlatt Investment Advisor NESBITT BURNS Tel: 443-1622 Fax:443-1524 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 20:04:51 -0400 From: Melissa Leigh Subject: juliana's pony (no liz) It's a side project with various other artists and the album is going to be released simultaneously with Juliana's new album. for more info ('cause I'm too lazy to type) http://www.rounder.com/rounder/catalog/bylabel/zoe/1013/1013.html Psych stuff - The thing that umm someone had mentioned about a murder happening in NYC with everyone watching - I think it's called the bystander effect. The larger the group around the awful thing happening the less likely that someone will help because people feel that responsibility is diffused among the whole group and each individual has less responsibility to intervene. They also believe that others are more qualified to intervene. The particular event was in 1964 in Kew Gardens, Queens (crappy area no matter what anyone says) when a young woman, kitty genovese, was coming home late at night and was attacked. People in the area watched from their apartment balconies and didn't do anything to prevent it. The attacker left and returned I think more than 3 times over hours and still no one did anything even though they knew it was happening. In interviews with these neighbors afterwards they said things like they thought the police had been called by someone else or that they heard her screaming but just brushed it off as a drunk from the nearby bars. For next class please read chapters 2 and 3 and I'll post grades from test 4 on the bulletin board outside. - ---melissa ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 23:01:07 EDT From: HOLEPARTS@aol.com Subject: Re: Please Do Not Breed In a message dated 5/10/00 10:53:25 AM Central Daylight Time, m_l_magdalene@hotmail.com writes: << red neck close-minded town and watching them get torn down and treated as though thier presence isn't tolerable with that one word because of something so personaly and nobody elses business as their sexual preference! >> i really feel bad that you live where you do. where i live it is nothing like that. we really have nothing against homosexuals. people here hate homophobes more that homosexuals. <> i really dont understand why you are THIS mad at me. if this is still about the Hole thing than im sorry, but i really dont know what else to say. i like hole, and i think that their music is better than anyhting else ive heard. <> i really never knew that sex had THAT much to do with everything. call me naive, but i have never been anywhere that has been this sexist before in my life. it is really sad that people judge gays from straights by the music they listen to. it is really shallow too. i dont know if it is the place that i live or what, but guys listen to whatever music they want, as do girls. there are so many guys here that listen to rocker girls. i guess we find it a turn-on. im turned on by a confident woman that isnt too shy or embarrassed to say what is on her mind. there are many gays, and they arent treated bad. the people that hate the gays are the ones that are treated bad. maybe i didnt understand the whole "fag" thing because i havent experienced living in such a homophobic area... i also really cant comprehend how you could have so much hate for me over an e-mail. i know you never really liked me from the start, but i mean, i would never write an e-mail to you the way you did to me. i dont know you well enough to hate you in that sort of way, plus, i would feel way too horrible to ever write anything like that. it may be an age difference or something of that sort, or it may be because of sex. either way, i really dont understand it. all i know is that i could never hate anyone, or yell at them in that tone of voice over the internet. there is too much i dont know... <> like i said, i just dont understand how you could write something that is so hate-driven. i have gotten myself into this mess by telling people my opinions, and what i believe. i guess that is a big no-no here. it has never been an issue on any of my other lists. oh well, different music, different crowd, i guess. i dont feel sorry for what ive said. im a result of the environment ive grown up in and the music i listen too. i will never feel bad about my opinions. im only proud of them. ~Mike a straight white male (i personally think its sad that people judge other people by their sex, but if that is the way it is, there ya go.) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 00:03:04 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: The Battle of Vercua Salt My local modern rock station has a feature where two new songs are played and you have to choose which one you like more. Tonight is was Vercua Salt's new single, not Born Entertainer but something else, nice rocker, and Nina's new single. Nina has gone pop, and it does sound like Sarah Mclachlan, don't remember the title of that one either. Both songs are excelent, and I like Nina's new direction. Unfortunately both got trashed by the audience and two new songs will be on tomorrow. They'll play them anyway, Nina's song sounds like a hit, so does Louise. Gossip time, suppoetly Nina left because both her and Louise had a crush on the same guy, rumored to be Dave Grohl. I'd heard something even wilder, the Nina had a fling with VS's drummer, Louise cheated with Nina's boyfriend and Nina caught them in bed. Make of all this what you will. Andrea ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V3 #126 ************************************