From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V3 #112 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Friday, April 28 2000 Volume 03 : Number 112 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Looks of Liz ["Michael Worrell" ] PJ Harvey, again. [Dan ] Heathers, Liz, Aimee Mann! [JJewelbaby@aol.com] Courtney Love ["Emma L. Demastrie" ] Re: off topic - pj/freeway 2 ["crack head" ] my mistake ["Dana Polachowski" ] Courtney Love Rears Her Ugly Head ["Molly Magdalene" ] Re: support-system-digest V3 #111 [Emerald314@aol.com] Re: Courtney Love Rears Her Ugly Head [HOLEPARTS@aol.com] courtney discussion [Gerardo ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 01:35:13 -0400 From: "Michael Worrell" Subject: Re: Looks of Liz Hrrm. A lot of people have said a lot of valid things about the looks of ECP etc., but one thing came to mind as I was drifting through the Internet earlier tonight... If Elizabeth Clark Phair looked like Roseanne Barr, her popularity (such as it is) would plummet. Hell, if that was the case, songs like 'Fuck and Run', 'Chopsticks', and other songs that involve a certain act of copulatory bliss would take on a whole different connotation. If was up to me, a Roseanne Phair would entail a 'Fuck the Fuck part; just _run_!' You certainly couldn't fuck and watch TV...you'd be watching her, like a widescreen fat roll or something. I don't know. Perhaps I've just caused nightmares for a lot of people. Anyways, ECP is an MIF. ;P Michael NP: "It's a Motherfucker", Eels "The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." - --Hunter S. Thompson ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 02:01:41 -0400 From: Dan Subject: PJ Harvey, again. steve wrote: >i find it interesting that >you dont say "Yuck..anorexic" about liz (who, when i saw her in july, looked a great deal thinner than the average woman, as PJ does -- not that that means they're anorexic...they're bodies could totally just be that way. but back to my point) So what, you dont say "Ewww" to liz because you >think she's pretty? it's ok for a "pretty girl" to be thin and please >everyone's eyes, but girls who are "homely as hell" and thin it's "Oh god, >not another yucky anorexic"?? You read a bit too much into it dude. I am not knocking anyone with anorexia at ALL. I was merely pointing out that Polly Jean HARVEY is excessively thin and her head looks EXCESSIVELY large in comparison. I made it a point - to show that I respect, adore, admire and LOVE this amazing artist and hold her to the highest regard. Proof that looks mean didley. As far as looking anorexic..i don't recall liz looking unhealthy. Liz has some muscle to her arms, if I remember back in April when I got the chance to shake her hand. I would never peg someone like Liz as even close to anorexic. As for Polly Jean - I really honestly think she needs to gain some weight. Hell - as long as she is healthy...but, her posture, her gauntness at times..i dunno...sometimes I wonder how those stick arms can rock out so hard on a guitar, but I guess she is doing it - so she must have some kind of inner strength that is not apparent to the naked eye. She rocks, regardless. You did however prove my point. It is true that looks play that much of an important part. SKinny pretty girl is hot..skinny ugly girl - is not. I don't see it this way, I myself do see PJ as a sexy bird...however, I am not sure if I would see her as sexy if she weren't such a BLOODY GENIUS!! The woman is grotesquely talented, and her looks (FACE IT - she wouldn't win a beauty pageant, not with society's fucked up standards) do not affect her appeal whatsoever. This is something to be rejoiced, I think!! Proof that sexiness has NOTHING to do with wieght or physical attractivness. SEXY is all a state of mind - and no one proves it better than PJ. I'm not calling her ugly or knocking people who do not look like beauty gods...God knows I'm not on the cover of Cosmo - but all in all - if she were just your bestfriend, in a pair of joggers and a sports bra, I dont know if TOO many people would be turning their heads to get another look..and I am talking about MEN and WOMEN here - because it is not JUST men who stare gals up and down...I know - I hang out with some of the most fierce queens known to humankind. Drag Queens too - and they're EVEN WORSE! But hell - we're all human right? It's all fun and games at the end of the day anyway. We all know deep down, "all that matters is what makes you happy." Dan. Dan. %&%&%&%&%%%%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&%&% "I don't have a case, that's why I have a hammer." -Farrah Fawcett, "Extremities." *******************************^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 07:08:11 EDT From: JJewelbaby@aol.com Subject: Heathers, Liz, Aimee Mann! Ok, I agree with the first part of this, because _Heathers_ is a brillant film which should not have a sequel. BUT, I must object to the _Girl, Interrupted_ slam. Winona put a lot of time in perfecting the script to try and equal the power of the novel. And let me say that the end result was incredible! The movie was a lot like the novel, although not entirely. But still brilliant all the same. So about Liz, has there been any word on a possible tour this summer? Any news about Aimee Mann touring in Europe, umm, NOW? I wish, since I am here in France, and lacking in lots of good music. . . But, I still have my Liz, my _Magnolia_ soundtrack, and my discman so it's all good! :) Julie <> ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:41:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Emma L. Demastrie" Subject: Courtney Love Mary, I'm so torn about what to think of Courtney, because I do love her. She's a truly unique individual, and I find her to be an immensely strong person. I definitely draw strength from her as a woman who survived a lot of shit and got herself back on track. She deserves to be commended for that, and she has had a shitty life. Read "Courtney Love: The Hole Story" if you get a chance. Ultimately, though, I do agree with most of what you've said about her. I mean, she is definitely an opportunist. She doesn't have the songwriting skills that many of her contemporaries have. And she enjoys associating herself with talented people who make her look good. That being said, however, it is not a crime to be like this. Lots of people are opportunists, and if anyone deserves to cash in on fame and recognition it's Courtney after the life she has had. I disagree with your comment about her acting. Courtney IS a good actress, just watch "The People Vs. Larry Flynt" if you're doubtful. There's a difference between craft and instinct, but when it comes to acting you don't necessarily have to have craft to be good. I can't wait to see her in that new Jack Kerouac flick with Keifer Sutherland. She would have made a GREAT Nancy Spungen in "Sid and Nancy". When all is said and done, I guess I respect Courtney more for what she has survived than what she has accomplished musically or otherwise. I also respect the fact that she speaks her mind and doesn't care who judges her. We need more brutal honesty in this world, I think. And of course I bow at the feet of "Live Through This." I still don't think Courtney's an "artist" in the strictest sense of the word, but she's influenced a lot of people and I'm glad she's in the world. - -Emma ***************************************************************************** "It's all smiles and business these days and I'm indifferent to the loss." -Ben Folds Emma Demastrie President Phi Sigma Pi National Honor Fraternity Beta Mu Chapter edemast@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:13:42 EDT From: "crack head" Subject: Re: off topic - pj/freeway 2 >From: Riot Poof >To: support-system@smoe.org >Subject: off topic - pj/freeway 2 >when i see "some chick" who's >really thin, i dont think "GROSS ANOREXIC" ok i'm gonna have to agree with this... i just wanna say something on this topic. i am rather thin, and i work in a department store... and people are always saying to me, "you're so thin." but not in a nice-complimentary sort of way, but in an accusing way with the subtle question "are you anorexic?" underneath it. and it really bothers me because, hell, i eat ALL the time (and i don't puke it up either). in fact 2 of my favorite things to do are eat and sleep!!!!!!!!! call me a slob. i call mySELF a slob. :) i know this particular train of thought isn't really appropriate to this list, but i guess it's just cuz i get this everyday and i can't yell back at my customers -yet. :P anyway... maybe if you see someone really thin, it's just because they have a high metabolism... don't always assume someone is anorexic -whether they're attractive or not. >As for Freeway 2, it has to be one of the worst movies ever! "Let's not >drink this bad dog water anymore, white girl!" haha WHY did they make >that movie??? WHAT WAS WITH ALL THE PUKING?? it really really scared >me. as for puking in movies... anybody seen DROP DEAD GORGEOUS??? that has got to be my all-time favorite mass puking scene EVER!!!! hehehehehehe. see that movie if you haven't... it's great, but even if you don't like it, the puking scene is the BEST!! :) 'course, i also like the puking scene in THE BIG HIT. the one where marky mark shoves the pillow in front of christina applegate's dad's face. i love that. ok. i'm done for now. enough with all the useless bullshit. erin ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:19:22 -0700 From: "Dana Polachowski" Subject: my mistake so i was glad to hear a guy (hey steve, kudos to YOU) talk about thin women like, "hey, they might just BE that way. whatever." 'cause a lot of times i hear guys say: "when i see a skinny woman i think: 'HEADCASE!!'" which bums me out, 'cause i am thin and--guess what?--i can't help it. grrrrrr. that's what i mean. there's only so much you can do about your physical "expression." it's a bummer for a lot of people, even those who are considered "attractive." being in a body is a drag, at least it is for me. if i could be a brain in a jar, i'd be so happy.... i think so, anyway. i dunno, sending out thought-forms or whatever. "...abby, abby something...." hahahahahhaaaa.... hey, so what do you guys think of this "my mistake" song being about "i'm married." HOO-boy!!!! DOC-taaah!!!! dp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:37:48 CDT From: "Molly Magdalene" Subject: Courtney Love Rears Her Ugly Head >PJ Harvey singing about how her life will be completely ruined and she > >might as well just die if some dumbass who left her won't come back to > >her is like fred durst singing "i didn't really do it all for the > >nookie, i valued the deep emotional connections we had too." on his >next >album. I'm sorry cause i know this was completely not your point, but this was just such a funny statement i had to comment. >As for Freeway 2, Okay the first one was okay..i suppose..if you ignore Reese Witherspoon as a whole..but why'd the go on and make another?! >i like trent reznor...i dont care if he's a whiney bitch, he makes >awesome >music and he's one hot motherfucker Yeah, but you know, he's just like..not whiney enough anymore. He's like..i'm still kinda sad, cause that's what my music is all about, but i've got Paxil now so i'll be okay.... >you MUST admit that courtney is a great actress Okay,i will totally reneg on what i previously said about her acting so you people will quit throwing shit at me, she was actually really good in The People Vs. Larry Flynt. >where the fuck do you expect her to be? You know, when you give birth to Kurt Cobains child you should expect for people to wonder. I mean the last time i can recall seeing Frances is like 2 days after Kurt died. I don't expect her to parade the child around, even though i'm surprised she doesn't since she is, after all, such an attention hungry BITCH, but can't she do a quaint little fucking photo shoot for Better Homes And Heroin Junkies who recover and think thier better than everyone, and let us see the fucking kid? I know it's not my kid, but it's not your fucking kid either so quit acting like Courtney is fucking mother of the year cause she keeps her child "out of the public eye", with her in it so much it kind of makes you wonder how often she sees that fucking kid. >that was just a stupid question Well think you i find most everything you say to be pretty fucking stupid too. >and how can anyone deny that courtney is a rocker? I'm not denying that she is "a rocker" i'm fucking disputing that she's "The Rocker" are you high? >id put her way above and beyond tori and pj anyday, as would most. I somehow doubt that. >live through this was written by hole, plain and simple Really, fascinating, because a lot of people seem to think it was written by Kurt. Now i'm not saying i agree entirely or anything, but it is an intersting theory. Some of it you know is hers, because i mean there's things in Celebrity skin(phrases)that have a certain familiarity to them, so you know, i figure those are hers, but some of it... M "You've never been so nuts about a guy You wanna laugh you wanna cry You cross your heart and hope to die 'Til it's over and then..." ((Bjork)) ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:47:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Easter Subject: Unexplained..... Boy, I certainly do like the discussion about looks and all. I have no idea what say, except for one prime example I went thru. When I first bought Paula Cole's This Fire album three years ago, you couldn't see her face. Soo...I'm listening to this "faceless" artist for about two or three months before I saw her in concert. During that time frame, I pretty much pictured Paula as a beautiful woman from the words she was singing. In my situation, I'd much rather not know what some artists look like until I've listened to their stuff. (gee...did I make any sense?) While the discussion of looks continues, that is if it does, I thought of another thread that was brought up from a chat with a coworker a few days ago. She talked about how she doesn't have that much respect for female singers cuz she views them as "whiners" (in her own words, she listens to Korn and NIN). Then it got me to thinking, what is it about female singers' voices that attracts me to their music? I know I cannot explain why my collection is largely of female singers, while I have about less than ten male groups or singers. Hmmm... Katie ();) ===== ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ "Twenty thousand faceless names, this is your show." - Chantal Kreviazuk __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 15:46:39 EDT From: Emerald314@aol.com Subject: Re: support-system-digest V3 #111 <> Madonna makes her daughter pay her bills? Huh? I think Madonna is the one making the money....I don't see Lourdes bringing in a whole lot of income there. I'm not trying to start any more discussion on this, because I don't really have an opinion on this whole Courtney thing. I like Hole. I like Madonna. I like Liz. They're all living their own lives, I don't think we have to compare them to each other so viciously because they're all doing their thing. That's all. ~Emily ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:33:54 EDT From: HOLEPARTS@aol.com Subject: Re: Courtney Love Rears Her Ugly Head i dont understand why you are so mad at me. we are just having a discussion about courtney, no need to get so angry, really. i just happen to like her a lot and i think/know that what you are saying about her is wrong (in my opinion i guess). ther is no need for courtney to ever do any photo shoots with frances bean- frances' life is already screwed up enough as it is. just be thankful that courtney is being a great mother, and not provoking her daughter's life to become even more twisted. and how could you doubt that i would rank courtney up higher than tori or pj? u have no right to say that, because she is way up higher than the both of them on my list. i would even go as far as saying she is higher than liz on my list. i dont understand why some people can get so angry and hate other people (famous) so easily. as if you know liz, or courtney, or pj, or tori. as fucking if. the only thing that i can think og is jealousy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:31:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Gerardo Subject: courtney discussion Big deal. Gerardo * ______________________________________________ FREE Personalized Email at Mail.com Sign up at http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V3 #112 ************************************