From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V2 #262 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Friday, September 3 1999 Volume 02 : Number 262 Today's Subjects: ----------------- playboy [Athena.M.Waligore@Dartmouth.EDU (Athena M. Waligore)] Bounced message [Jason Long ] Bounced message [Jason Long ] Bounced message [Jason Long ] Bounced message [Jason Long ] ugly pains ["Jaime" ] happy as a dead pig in the sunshine [brian d irby ] What sort of man reads Playboy? ["John A. Johnson" ] Re: Liz in Playboy [dbickin@ibm.net] playboy subscribers & liz ["Morrise, Jason" ] Embarrassing Flower moments? [Katie Lynne ] free shit, take two. ["Dennis J. Kim" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 02 Sep 1999 01:33:29 EDT From: Athena.M.Waligore@Dartmouth.EDU (Athena M. Waligore) Subject: playboy i thought liz had an interview in playboy-or an article or some shit like that and that's why this rumor was started.. i don't think there's actual reason to believe liz is considering posing-- but please, someone contradict me if i'm incorrect.. athena ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 03:19:20 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: "D. Kim" Subject: Free shit. Not literally. Hey kids, Dennis is feeling generous today. The counter-guy at my local indie record store hooked me up with some Liz Phair postcards. The postcards have the vamp-woman, bun-raku eyeshadow, arm band, black sleeveless top, and very low cut black pants with no visible means of staying on her body picture of Elizabeth Phair with "liz phair" and "whitechocolatespaceegg" written on it with the yellow eggs. The postcards are postage pre paid (and i'll send them virgin, so you can actually use them) with the four (****) star rolling stone review on the back. I'm going to give them away to the first 3 support-system members who respond to this message and the 10th, 11th, and 12th respondents (for those of you who get digest or get screwed otherwise on these giveaways). One lucky respondent at random will get a little Liz Phair whitechocolatespaceegg sticker, too. If you respond to the list instead of the reply-to address, you will get actual shit from the animal of my choice. Remember to include your mailing address. NOTICE: Dennis is an equal-opportunity giver, so even if you are Alanis Morissette/Dave Matthews Band fans or gave away the ending to "The Blair Witch Project" or are a dendrophiliac, you'll still get one. dennis. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 03:22:25 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: "Kim P" Subject: Help!! I need "Girly Sound Demo" I was wondering if any of you Phair fans can tell me how i can get her "Girly Sound Demo" If you can help me out e-mail me a seattle_9@hotmail.com thanks. Kim http://www.angelfire.com/ak2/sandiego523 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 03:23:05 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: "Ginz" Subject: Morrissey on Tour Watch out. Morrissey is back on tour. 4 dates in the southwest have been announced. Supposedly 2 more US dates might follow. As for the sad state of country music, as someone was saying..... I never listen to county. But I saw Kelly Willis open for Beth Orton....and now I really like Kelly Willis. There is hope for country. Ginz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 03:21:44 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: Cynthia Weaver Subject: Liz and Tori Hey Shelly! I'm new to the list, and saw that we have the same favorite Liz song, and that we both seem to love Tori. How does everyone else feel about Tori on the list? I really hope that this doesn't turn into a huge bashing session, because I love Tori and would be crushed, but I can't help asking. It just seems like Liz fans would enjoy Tori, too. Any favorite Tori songs? What are everyone else's favorite Liz songs? "Pretty is never beautiful," Tori Amos Cynthia ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 10:03:09 -0400 From: "Jaime" Subject: ugly pains you know, MrE... "me love cookies too" -- Rosie O'Donnell cute... she even did it in the cookie monster voice. Speaking of fat jokes/sly comments... MrE someday (soon hopefully... damn post office) I will be able to send you a picture of myself. The girl behind the curtain will step out. I must know what you look like. I never think about it, and I've never even tried to imagine you...(well, once, but I saw you from the back) So this will be fun. Will we be shocked??? Paralyzed in agonizing ugly pains ? I hope so... it'd be soo fun! But i'm sure your foxy, maybe even more-so than my youthful-foxiness... did i mention i only have 3 teeth...? Stay tuned... ~jaime* - -- -- -- -- - " I can grow, despite all you know, you might not recognize me tomorrow..." ~Liz Phair, 'firewalker' - -- -- -- -- - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 09:48:29 -0500 From: brian d irby Subject: happy as a dead pig in the sunshine Jason, Naw, I didn't take any offense at it. I make fun of rednecks here too. i guess (maybe I should say "reckon") I have a little redneck in me, too, so I guess it's hypocritical of me (would a redneck use that word?). Anyway, no, I didn't see that one about the three guys who killed those boys in West Memphis, but I hear it was really interesting. I don't have HBO, so I have to rely on my friends to tape stuff for me. Anyway, back to southerners, variety is the spice of life, huh? I live in a rural area north of Little Rock, so I see lots of "variety." Anyway... Brian ps. no, I don't spit tobacco on the gunrack, that's what the empty Mountain Dew cans on the floorboard of my monster truck are for... hehehe ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 11:30:01 -0400 From: "John A. Johnson" Subject: What sort of man reads Playboy? On Wed, 01 Sep 1999 04:53:10 PDT tommyk7@excite.com wrote: >On Wed, 01 Sep 1999 03:46:09 -0700, Sally Mae wrote: > >"I really hope Liz doesn't pose in Playboy because I think it is really >degrading to pose naked in a national, possibly international magazine just >so males (and some females too I suppose) can perve at her. That's really >bad that posing naked gets women somewhere today, men don't have to pose >naked to get anywhere, bloody sexism. I agree that it is really unfair that women can get somewhere by posing naked, but men can't. Bloody sexism. ;-) > Anyway, I would kinda lose respect for her if she did pose in Playboy..." I don't think you have to worry about it. Liz once said in an interview that she was approached about posing, thought about it, and decided she did not want to. Of course, she could always change her mind. Personally, I don't care one way or the other about it. It's her life and I'm not going to tell her how to live it. I'm curious why some women get angry about other women posing in the nude. They usually say something like it degrades all women. But there's no evidence for this claim; it is just an assertion. Or, they say that men looking at some women naked makes men think sexually about all women. As if they wouldn't anyway. Thank goodness there are enough sane feminists like Camille Paglia, Katie Roiphe, and Christina Hoff Sommers to counteract the anti-sex zealots. tommyk7: >Hmmm...can't say I disagree with you...you ARE inciting a flame war with >this you realize...it's probably just a rumor...Playboy is notorious for >hounding beautiful women incessantly to pose...they also have been...known >(ahem) to let stars of extraordinary status pose semi-nude or just in >lingerie. Any subscribers out there? Let me rephrase: Anyone out there >with the BALLS to admit they're a subscriber? My wife bought me a subscription to Playboy in 1978, and we have renewed the subscription every year since then. We both read it pretty much cover to cover. We've both used it as a source of information for college courses we teach. What sort of man reads Playboy? I'll let you in on a secret. It's not just men. And it's not just perverts. - ----------------------------------- John A. Johnson j5j@psu.edu Professor of Psychology http://cac.psu.edu/~j5j/ Pennsylvania State University Penn State is not responsible for my behavior. Nor am I for the university's. "A ruthless, doctrinaire avoidance of degeneracy is a degeneracy of another sort. Getting drunk and picking up bar-ladies and writing metaphysics is a part of life." - from _Lila_ by R. Pirsig ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Sep 99 11:46:10 -0400 From: dbickin@ibm.net Subject: Re: Liz in Playboy >From: tommyk7@excite.com >Subject: Re: Liz in Playboy >Hmmm...can't say I disagree with you...you ARE inciting a flame war with >this you realize...it's probably just a rumor...Playboy is notorious for >hounding beautiful women incessantly to pose...they also have >been...known (ahem) to let stars of extraordinary status pose semi-nude >or just in lingerie. Any subscribers out there? Let me rephrase: >Anyone out there with the BALLS to admit they're a subscriber? I used to be a subscriber, does that count? I still have a good opinion of the magazine. A half-remembered positive review of Liz's music is what made me order EIG. (I was rejoining Columbia House, and had to fill out the twelve free CD's, and recalling Liz's name from months earlier in Playboy made me give her a try. Funny thing is those albums that I had wanted when I joined were almost all disappointments. Those I chose at almost random, like EIG, turned out to be my favorites.) I recall that Liz had one time before talked about Playboy saying she would have posed but only if she could take the pictures herself and do them in some subversive way. She said that no idea she came up with hadn't already been done before. I don't think her posing now would be a good idea. It WOULD give her some instant publicity, but I really don't see that publicity drawing in people who would in turn buy her music. But I think she might actually think better of it now. It seems that she is now singing Flower more seriously. From older boots I have heard, she sort of rattled it off, like she was still proud of it, but wanted to move on. Last year, she seemed to perform it with more emotion, even acting/dancing in a more enticing way. She seems to be embracing its sexuality. And the slide show last year had the nude shot. David ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 11:56:12 -0500 From: "Morrise, Jason" Subject: playboy subscribers & liz >Hmmm...can't say I disagree with you...you ARE inciting a flame war >with this you realize...it's probably just a rumor...Playboy is notorious >for hounding beautiful women incessantly to pose...they also have >been...known (ahem) to let stars of extraordinary status pose semi-nude >or just in lingerie. Any subscribers out there? Let me rephrase: >Anyone out there with the BALLS to admit they're a subscriber? hmm, does it really take balls to admit it? I was a subscriber for five years, but recently canceled. I don't think there is any shame in getting the magazine. if all a person wants is pictures of naked women, there are countless other choices out there. I don't mean to be one of those "I read it for the articles" people, but I certainly did read the articles. it was the articles that kept me renewing each year. and it was my tiring of the articles that resulted in canceling my subscription. I've read plenty of wonderful fiction, kept up on government censorship, drug law abuses, etc., gotten a few good sex tips care of the advisor, and so much more. but yeah, I looked at the pictures, too. I mean, what is wrong is not that guys like looking at pictures of naked women. it's that there are no good magazines for women to look at pictures of naked men. playgirl is like, hmm, let's put him in cowboy boots because that is sexy. someone must realize that what women enjoy and find sexy is not the same as what men enjoy. I doubt many girls have fantasies of a guy wearing a catholic school uniform. but I'm also a guy, I'm only able to speak on the female point of view from my discussions I've had with female friends. I don't think this has to turn into a flame war, but I know a lot of people must have their own opinions on this. if liz did pose in playboy, I don't know how I would feel. I've become jaded towards the magazine in some ways, but once in a while, they do have some sensual beautiful photography (i.e. the charlize theron feature). if liz were to have her own photographer do it (like cindy and herb ritts), then I think the result could turn out positive, but at the same time, if she were to want to do the nude photos as an art-related thing, wouldn't they be better suited to an art gallery? I just have this terrible picture in my head of liz posing like a "rock star" in some corny spread if playboy had their own way with it. but in the end, I'd rather just wonder what she would look like rather than have it totally revealed to me, because the attraction lies in the mystery. like they actually said in playboy, the best part of the striptease is before any clothing is removed. and now I will await the response to this, and just so everyone knows, I will not have access to e-mail for the next four days, so if you get this in digest form and send me private e-mail, it may take some time to get a response. or am I maybe a little big-headed to think that I will get a huge response? well, better to be safe. jason ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 19:53:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Katie Lynne Subject: Embarrassing Flower moments? Ohk...I cannot hold myself any longer with this subject! Why? Well...for starters..it's my b-day and it's the topic we're chatting about in the chat room I often start every nite at AOL. Next possible thread: Tell the story of your embarrassing moment of singing Flower in public. I'm sure some have stories to share! I know a new list member does. (Hi Paul!) Well, my story is basically singing Flower on a dog walk on the back trail. With my eyes closed. Open them up and see an old man in front of me talking on his portable phone and I had just finished the "cramming, ramming, slamming in me..." part. That's not it though...I'm always singing Flower and it's gotten to be a bad habit of mine for sure. Sing it at work, sing it in my car. Oh well...it would me nice to know I'm not the only dare devil here. The chat I mentioned earlier. Well...whenever I'm in the mood for it, I usually start an AOL chat and call it LizPhairRulez in the member chats. Anyone is more than welcomed to join! Katie ();) NP: EIG === ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* "I believe you believe in the myth of yourself." -Luscious Jackson ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 00:20:43 -0400 (EDT) From: "Dennis J. Kim" Subject: free shit, take two. Not literally. Hey kids, Dennis was feeling generous a couple of days ago, but i messed up and sent the message from a different account and it probably bounced and pissed off jase. i'm trying again. The counter-guy at my local indie record store (well, it's sort of a chain in the southeast, the record exchange) hooked me up with some Liz Phair postcards. These are practically worthless (well, 22 cents prepaid postcard postage) but you know how fans get sentimental. I'm going to give them away to the first 3 support-system members who respond to this message. The 10th, 11th, and 12th respondents will also get one (for those who get the digest). Respond to: djkimtwo@hotmail.com. I can't modify the reply-to: field of my school account, so remember to change the address. The postcards have the picture of Liz wearing a black sleeveless top; shiny,tight black pants that elicit the question "how are they staying on her body?"; and a black armband. She's in a vampy pose wearing bun-raku eyeshadow and disheveled hair. The words "liz phair" and "whitechocolatespaceegg" appear next to her along with some yellow spaceeggs. The four star rolling stone review is on the back. I guess you all know what i'm talking about now. If you win one, I'll even send it virgin so's you can evangelize with it. One lucky respondent will get a little liz phair WCSE sticker, too. If you bother the list members by responding to the list instead of djkimtwo@hotmail.com, you might be the recipient of actual shit from the animal of my choosing. Remember to include your address. NOTICE: Dennis is an equal-opportunity giver, so even if you are Alanis Morissette/Dave Matthews Band fans or gave away the ending to "The Blair Witch Project" or are a dendrophiliac, you'll still get one. Hurricane Dennis. Well, tropical storm anyway. - --- "A'nta baka?" -Asuka d. www4.ncsu.edu/~djkim2 ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V2 #262 ************************************