From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V2 #186 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Friday, June 25 1999 Volume 02 : Number 186 Today's Subjects: ----------------- ben folds on chopsticks ["Ginz" ] danny's not here mrs. torrance... ["MrE" ] Look Sharp! ["Michael Carapella" ] TR1 and Parallel Lives ["Michael Carapella" ] No Liz in the UK, but... [Chipko Arnold ] Chicago Liz Phest ["Allison" ] Fwd: shane origin [Mike Connolly ] Covers of Liz songs [drpeak@juno.com] Re: #WCSE/irc and Missy Elliot Plug [Meredith Robbins ] BOYS,KURT,GOD... ["M.L.Magdalene" ] La la la London [mhuisman ] More Liz Lillith Dates! [steve ] Re: support-system-digest V2 #185 ["Pat Smalley" ] kurt/courtney 2 cents ["dana polachowski" ] Re: support-system-digest V2 #183 [Biggerd000@aol.com] more Beatle covers........ [mhuisman ] Re: support-system-digest V2 #185 [Seth ] On the side... ["bjrothe" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 01:12:48 -0400 From: "Ginz" Subject: ben folds on chopsticks so, i found a review of the Ben Folds Five show in Chicago, 6/18/99. The reviewer mentioned "Chopsticks", but didn't say "Liz Phair". Keep a look-out for a copy of this show....ok? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 00:24:11 -0700 From: "MrE" Subject: danny's not here mrs. torrance... >"Sally Mae" >Mr E/Momus I do not believe that Courtney's >behaviour had anything to do with Kurt's suicide. there are a great number of factors that contribute to the taking of one's own life, of which the most likely is the people we hold most dear, whither that would be in some neuro/psycho estimation of their worth or one based one 'real' value is of little consequence...perhaps you've not heard of evan dando...and disagree with me as you please (since it is insignificant in the whole scheme of things), but do try to not misquote or misinterpret what i have written...contributing to someone's depression is not to be misconstrued as killing them... >Momus I'm glad you appreciate Chickmail >and it's ventures as long as you also appreciate >the notion of feminism behind it *FEMINISM ROCKS* ...and you are absolutely correct, just don't choke me with the dogma lest i run over it with my karma...and yeah...i am the proud owner of a chickmail address... >Is MrE something that one can be turned into? >Is it like Baptism? I'm an atheist. Yes, I really >think so. I want the pope, to take a picture, of >his god, so i can look at the flipside... ...huh? >Mikey C >Being a fan is great, but don't you think his >importance to music increase disproportionally >on the morning his death was announced? ...only to those who 'believed' in 'one song', assorted come latelies, misguided media dogs and superficial followers of fashion >He died in 1994, that was 5 years ago! ...let's see...cobain...1994...eig...1993...but you are right...but you are wrong...you may be right...i might be crazy...but it just might be a lunatic you're looking for... Momus ~~ "...i wish i was special... you're so fuckin' special...but i'm a creep.." ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhSHIT ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 13:46:17 -0700 From: "Michael Carapella" Subject: Look Sharp! >. And Joe Jackson!!! I've loved Joe Jackson for years! Big World, anyone? I choreographed my final performance project for my modern dance class in college to Cha Cha Loco (Body & Soul)...< I'm with you! Me and my friend Randy played those two albums to death. I used to play "Sunday Papers" in a band in high school too... - -Michael ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 13:43:02 -0700 From: "Michael Carapella" Subject: TR1 and Parallel Lives >in the end, it was simply an overwhelming desperation clouded by drugs that were having a lessened effectiveness that brought down a wizard, a true star.< A Todd reference? >Michael Carapella -- hey! I'm from upstate NY too, 2 years older than Liz too, and work in uptight professional services too (CPA firm). Whip-Smart was my first exposure to Liz, then EIG, then WCSE, so I know what you mean by the "in through the out door" method of turning on to Liz. I'm curious: which 8 songs from WCSE did your friend choose to put on the tape for you? < Shew--parallel lives, huh? By the way, ever catch a band called 805 (formerly Heartbeat or something like that) when we were in our prime club-going years? The eight songs (from memory) were basically the first six or so and then "What Makes You Happy" and "Shitloads of Money". >I should put you in touch with my college friend from Chicago Sure, although I have no shortage of friends who didn't quite make it in the biz and a few who are still trying. It's tough because the vast majority of rockers break in before they turn 30. After that it's anything goes, but I think most people can only beat their heads against a wall for so long. It's really somewhat depressing, but I'm still routing for my buddies in The Uninvited. - -Michael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 01:56:28 PDT From: Chipko Arnold Subject: No Liz in the UK, but... ...I've spent the last 2 night seeing R.E.M. and they are awesome. Anyone who thinks they're past it and touring for the money THINK AGAIN. A great mix of oldies as well, i won't reveal names, but let's say that even you Chronic Town lovers will be happy. They did different oldies each night and apart from the opener and end songs the whole set was changed. I could write pages about how great they are, but i'll spare you. On the subject of Pavement, they played London about a month back and were pretty good. Ben Folds also played recently and were fantastic as usual and Built To Spill are playing tonight, supported by the Webb Brothers (hey Ruthie!). Next week it's the wonderful Hazeldine (Indigo Girls fans should check them out) and Willard Grant Conspiracy on the same bill. Got to go as i have work to do before i meet Scott & Ken!!! "and i wonder how i've come to know so much less than i knew before" ... Joseph Lee Henry. "i know the promise is so much better than the real thing" ... Grand Drive. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 06:37:26 -0500 From: "Allison" Subject: Chicago Liz Phest Okay, I'll step up as the organizer of the Chicago Liz Phest, July 9-10-11. I am a local and can do the neccesary research. Will anyone who is interested in attending please e-mail me? Suggestions on what you would like to see/do would be appreciated. In the meantime I will find out about accomodations, the address of the studio, open mike nights, etc. Due to the fact that there are only a few weeks until the proposed weekend, write me soon so I can get started! Thanks, Allison sahsie@earthlink.net ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 04:46:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Connolly Subject: Fwd: shane origin Got this in the mail this morning, so I thought I'd pass it along (as asked): - --- Melany_Helinski@prnewswire.com wrote: > From: Melany_Helinski@prnewswire.com > To: mikey3394@yahoo.com > Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 16:38:00 -0400 > Subject: shane origin > > i'm at work and don't have my support system address > to email directly to the > list, so you could post this or just take it in for > what it's worth: > > >> "Shane" always seemed to me to be about a boy > going > >> off to war...I actually did a class project where > we > >> brought in songs either written during or about > >> Vietnam, and I brought "Shane" in for the class. > >Shortly after WS's release, there was an article in > >Rolling Stone by a guy named Shane who swore he was > >the guy in the song. Anybody else have more info > on > >this? > > well ... i'm sure i'll be rebuked, but i could claim > to know the origin -- let's > see how convoluted THIS gets: my boyfriend's > ex-girlfriend who had a friend named > blue who went to oberlin claims the song is about > blue's boyfriend. i THINK i > have that right. i'll have to really check that out > b/c it almost sounds like > urban myth. > > i, on the other hand, have NO claim to fame and no > NO one that ANYONE has written > a song about. :-) > > --melany _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 19:59:35 -0700 From: drpeak@juno.com Subject: Covers of Liz songs So everyone's trying to come up with covers for Liz to do but Liz's real strength all along has been her strong-strong songwriting -- she doesn't need to cover anybody else!! So, okay, it's fun to speculate, imagine, play with the idea but what about, instead, other musicians\bands, etc. covering Liz's fabulous output? Who else out there could do real justice to a Liz original? Jonathan Richman doing "Fuck and Run"? Lucinda Williams and "Divorce Song"? Garbage with... well, hell I don't know which song they could do!! Anybody else got any ideas? Has anybody covered any Liz songs that anybody knows about? D.R.Peak ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 21:07:48 -0400 From: Meredith Robbins Subject: Re: #WCSE/irc and Missy Elliot Plug Dan wrote, among other things: > Quick question...i've been out of the irc loop for a bit, just wondering - is > #WCSE on DalNet or Effnet or Undernet? It's on EfNet--well, *sometimes* it's on EfNet. Sometimes we's there, sometimes we's not. I'd try late on a weekday evening (Eastern time). And then he wrote: > ps - I just bought the brand new MISSY ELLIOT album - I swear - this woman > knows what she's doing!! IF you didn't already fall in love with her first > album, pick this one up - with an open mind. I enthusiastically second this suggestion. I was blown away by Missy at last summer's Lilith Fair (she was, for me, the secondary highlight of the day and certainly the best showman there), so I picked up her album. It was fabulous, but this new one is even better. That girl is da shit, I'm telling you. Meredith - -- "In terms of appearance, I wanted a post-coital glow, and all I could get was a self-tanner mishap." --Jasmine Davila, alt.fashion ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 07:24:50 PDT From: tommyk7@excite.com Subject: Re: Covers of Liz songs On Wed, 23 Jun 1999 19:59:35 -0700, drpeak@juno.com wrote: "So everyone's trying to come up with covers for Liz to do but Liz's real strength all along has been her strong-strong songwriting -- she doesn't need to cover anybody else!!" I totally agree with this!!! Fuck covers! If I go see Liz perform, granted the encores are going to be either Fuck and Run, Perfect World, Stratford and/or Divorce Song, but those are better than any "cover." Before the encores, I'm also too interested to hear unreleased songs from GS or whatever to worry about covers. Rock stars perform, cover bands cover, and the twain should never meet (well, ok, there is plenty of grey area there). What also pisses me off is all these so-called rock stars re-recording others' works. Write your own fucking songs! OK, Weird Al doesn't count, and Hendrix's "All Along the Watchtower" is simply outstanding...but it's annoying to me that so many of them are successful because a lot of the songs are older and kids today don't know them. Remember the Lemonheads doing "Mrs. Robinson?" And Ugly Kid Joe with "Cat's in the Cradle?" Those renditions SUCK! Even Metallica, a very respected band and a favorite of mine, did a whole ALBUM of covers. I'll bet half the idiots who watch MTV at least 5 hours a day think that Lenny Kravitz's "American Woman" is original. It's like, get back in the "TRL" line to request your Backstreet Boys or whatever, you fucks. As for "Who else out there could do real justice to a Liz original?" Juliana Hatfield singing "Flower?" Ha! TMK NP: Jimi Hendrix, _Live at the Fillmore East,_ Disc 1 _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jun 1999 01:14:12 -0500 From: Priciliano Luna Subject: beatles and george info Well.. I think you do a great cover of its all too much or and your bird can sing. my fav era well its just to hard to say but I really like the 1960 through 1962 era. Just listen to the star club tapes they just rock..sorta proto-punk. and they did that when they were drunk...just imagine a sober show.its the kinda of recording that will drive your neighbors or dorm nuts late at night. Also biggggggg George Harrison news, he's working on a new album called "Portrait of a Leg End". some of the songs are Valentine, Brainwashed and another i cant recall but its about rivers? Juan Luna:) love peace and understanding to all pass it on. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 08:54:22 PDT From: "M.L.Magdalene" Subject: BOYS,KURT,GOD... Okay GUYS(literally i mean GUYS)i'm SO sorry about the comment i made about guys not understanding Liz. That was not only shallow but sexist of me and i can NOT belive that i posted something like that. You must try to understand that is not like me--you just have to see that Molly(don't ask me WHY i'm talking about myself in third person)should not post to the list when she's been drinking AND fighting with her boyfriend who..incidentally...destroyed on of her Liz CD's earlier that evening...That's my only excuse and i am really truely and deeply sorry as it is often the guys on this list who's comments and i enjoy the most...PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, don't think of me as a sexsist shallow little bitch everytime i begin to babble as nothing like that shall ever be posted by me again...nothing sexist like that..now OFFENSIVE..well..that's a different story... For who-ever said something about KURT not being an icon until after his death--yes it's sad isn't it? The man had to stick a gun in his mouth for people to see his beauty and depth? Granted i feel you were saying that he is only an icon because of his death but...i just think society as a whole should be swollowed for things like this... >I'm an >atheist. Yes, I really think so. I want the pope, to take a picture, >of >his god, so i can look at the flipside... This was just a brillaint comment and i just wanted to let who-ever wrote it know that... Okay anyways... All apologies, M _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 11:54:19 -0400 From: mhuisman Subject: La la la London To all SSystemers going abroad this summer...... I'm gonna be near London too this summer:-) For pretty much all of August. I really wanna visit all these Beatle landmarks in London. Someone is selling this book on ebay for $5.00 about all the Beatle landmarks in Lodnon, like the place where I am the Walrus was filmed etc. So, to all you travellers going abroad, e-mail me and maybe we can meet and do something:-) Marlie _______________________________________ one, two, three, four, five, six, seven all good children go to heaven -John Lennon 'You never give me your Money' ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 12:46:06 -0400 (EDT) From: steve Subject: More Liz Lillith Dates! Here are all the dates liz will be playing, according to the LIlith Fair WebPage. The july ones are new dates. i think that Hollywood and Vine Update was wrong about liz playing both detroit dates, the webage doesnt list that. July 9 George, WA 10 George, WA 11 Portland, OR August 14 Detroit, MI 17 Cleveland, OH 18 Indianapolis, IN there is also a little article about liz at the website http://www.lilithfair.com/artists/lizphair/index.html steve ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 11:10:48 +0100 From: "Pat Smalley" Subject: Re: support-system-digest V2 #185 Hellooooooooo, So here's my point, I think if people listened too and bought music that they actually liked, instead of music that is ''cool'' then artists like Liz would get a sack load more exposure. But people won't coz if they aren't into the latest tune then they will have the piss taken out of 'em no end and the shit kicked out of 'em too just for being slightly different than the majority of people. Also it kinda sucks that out of population of 28 million an artist only has to sell 100 thousand or so records to get to No 1. But in 2 or 3 years Britney Spears,Jewell,The Spice Girls and most of the other crappy teenyboppers will have been forgotten about and Liz will still kick ass. Marky. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 13:22:18 EDT From: MLevine171@aol.com Subject: Re: support-system-digest V2 #185 U know what would be kinda funny to try? We should find teenyboppers on AOL or the web, and IM them asking them if they've heard a liz song on the radio..like for example Hi Jessica, I saw the music u like in ur profile. Have u heard Liz Phair's "polyester bride" on the radio yet? and they'll say "no" and we can go on about how she's going to be very big soon, and how her album is great, and how she should get it, and tell all her friends to get it. Then maybe she'll go pick it up, and like it and tell her friends..hehe That would be kinda funny to try...Well..I probably sound like a complete idiot, so bye.. steve In a message dated 6/24/99 1:17:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Pat@smalleyp.freeserve.co.uk writes: > I think if people listened too and bought music that they actually liked, > instead of music that is ''cool'' then artists like Liz would get a sack > load more exposure. > But people won't coz if they aren't into the latest tune then they will have > the piss taken out of 'em no end and the shit kicked out of 'em too just for > being slightly different than the majority of people. > Also it kinda sucks that out of population of 28 million an artist only has > to sell 100 thousand or so records to get to No 1. > > But in 2 or 3 years Britney Spears,Jewell,The Spice Girls and most of the > other crappy teenyboppers will have been forgotten about and Liz will still > kick ass. > > Marky. > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 13:28:38 EDT From: TADude9999@aol.com Subject: Limited Offer Hi everyone,hope your summer is going well! I have 10 tapes I'd like to offer to the first 10 people to respond to me. The tape was made from an original CD boot. The tape is the "Glory" boot. Plus I've added a bonus; "Firewalker" and "Don't Apoligize" I'm not a tape trader so all I'm asking in return is the cost of the blank tape,the cardboard box I'll send it in and the postage. The total comes to $2.76 if you're in the Land of the Free. If you're not in the U.S. I'll check the cost for you. TAD NP "Dust Bunnies" by Bettie Servert ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 13:41:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Miz Phair Subject: cinco de mayo mania? Just wondering if anyone else goes to the post office specifically requesting Cinco de Mayo stamps, or if I'm alone in my overboard-ness. paige= _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 14:43:07 -0700 From: "dana polachowski" Subject: kurt/courtney 2 cents [since this is about the whole kurt/courtney thing, this will no doubt piss you off if you're sick of hearing about this, so please scroll way down....] the way MrE phrased his whole assessment of that scenario was perfect. he wasn't AT ALL saying that courtney directly had anything to do with kurt (?) killing himself (more on the question mark below). he made a really insightful observation. so, i'm sorry, but i totally agree with him--certain aspect's of courtney's behavior probably did *not* help kurt deal with not only his depression but probably also the sucky aspects of being famous/the music biz. courtney lives for the limelight--and it's not even like you have to dig for subtle clues. and at this point, this woman actually sincerely believes she's at the forefront of america's "cultural elite" (i wish you could hear me laughing.... i mean, first of all, who'd fuckin' *wanna* be?). so right there that shows you how "intelligent" she is. eeeek. please. so, yeah, i basically think she's full of shit. (no apologies.) ok, so anyway--and this kind of ties into the posthumous legend thing that people have been mentioning--i've heard, as i'm sure many others have as well--and i'm not saying i BELIEVE this, but it sure is intriguing--that maybe possibly it *wasn't* kurt who pulled the trigger. 'cause he had been talking about quitting to go and raise his daughter. i know this is very JFK/grassy knoll/x-files and i'm sorry if i'm making anyone mad by mentioning it, but... the only known thing is that's it's a fuckin' tragedy, but has there been a ruling on the case? it might still be open.... dp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 18:51:07 EDT From: Biggerd000@aol.com Subject: Re: support-system-digest V2 #183 wow today i came across a c.d. buy nirvana called outcesticide its a bootleg man am i ever on cloud nine a few months ago i was figurin out how to turn a computer on now i have liz phairs girly sound demos , fuck and run , this nirvana boot and i also have a smashing pumpkins boot that i acctually found at a used c.d. store in east lansing . i just love bootlegs so lets give it up for bootlegs and lets give it up for mp3's as well well i remember last year at lilith fair in milwuakee liz came out to sign autographs as per usual. i was so nervous when i finally got to her that i couldnt talk i was talkin but the words wouldnt come out my hands were shakin and words were soft mumbles and studders but liz smiled and nodded like a she knew what i was sayin which no body on earth could understand my words at that time but she was the only reason i was at lilith fair and i got to meet her i think it is real cool of her to come out to talk with fans. heres somethin that some one told me recentley that liz posed for a porno mag im just curious if this is true anyhoo some one email me biggerd000@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 18:52:07 -0400 From: mhuisman Subject: more Beatle covers........ Just had a thought: The ultimate Beatles song Liz should cover: I WANT YOU (She's so Heavy) off of Abbey Road Besides the she's so heavy bit, I could totally se Liz doing this. To me it seems like a really sexually charged song. Anywayz, thats all for now:-) Marlie ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 15:21:44 -0400 From: Seth Subject: Re: support-system-digest V2 #185 Since this digest was too big to quote the message I wanted, just to be a pain, to Dan who said Missy Elliot didn't redo Eighties songs and rap over them, I think you forgot to remember her song, "I can't Stand the Rain." Not I know Tina Turner originally sang this, in the Eighties, but I only heard the Elliot version once so I don't know if she raps over it or whatever, but you were wrong in that aspect of her. It is currently the second song I have heard of her but I do enjoy her much. Seth, who feels stupid being such a pain in the ass! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 23:44:29 -0500 From: "bjrothe" Subject: On the side... This a personal email to Ken Lee (I believe it is Ken Lee, the person who possesses the WCSE Demos) ... I know you are already swamped with requests for CDR's of those, but I would really love to get a hold of a set... Let me know... Sorry, had to take care of that personal bit there... Liz Phair and Tanya Donnelly (Belly) should stay off the radio and just keep doing their music. I would pay $40 a show to see them play (Cut out the Record companies... they suck money!) because they are still at the level where you don't have to see them in a big stadium... Unlike Barenakedladies... Bands are so much better when they are in a small venue... Anybody disagree? (Don't get me wrong, Liz deserves a 'shitload of money' for her music, I just don't want the real fans to suffer from 'Morrisettism'... ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V2 #186 ************************************