From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V2 #177 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Friday, June 18 1999 Volume 02 : Number 177 Today's Subjects: ----------------- dirty-minded pilgrims [raymond lew ] More Liz "Exposure" ["Michael Carapella" ] Special thanks to Stacey [Talula9695@aol.com] Beatles, and concerts, oh my [Mike Connolly ] Ani Live ["M.L.Magdalene" ] Hmmmmmmmmmm.... [AngelLieb@aol.com] mis use of whip smart ["Jaime" ] Re: the name game [Dennis Junkoo Kim ] ATTN: Janet (public apology) [jeF kearns ] Re: support-system-digest V2 #176 [Seth ] theres a whole generation with a new explanation......people in motion [m] Misc Liz Stuff ["Wendy Alkins" ] liz's popularity, ugly pilgrim's, milli, and SS SS... oh and the bank-dp! [Danaldj@aol.c] go-go's tribute, and new thread? and "head on" [Danaldj@aol.com] She was a working girl... ["Nicole W." ] Re: question [palik@ix.netcom.com] RE: mis use of whip smart ["chemhalo" ] stephen malkmus on liz [Valerie Barry ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 04:06:38 -0700 (PDT) From: raymond lew Subject: dirty-minded pilgrims i know this is really horrible, but wasn't there one or two pilgrims that were exiled for beastiality? i think they went on to found rhode island or something. so i guess the ugly pilgrim thing could be this guy...uhmm...and this sheep...and, uhhh... ugh. this is not something i should be writing about while i'm eating breakfast ...ray **************************************************************************** "I'm a wreck, I'm obsessed, I'm insane. Isn't that what you want me to say?" --Liz Phair the writings on the wall - http://www-scf.usc.edu/~rlew/ beginning to see the light - http://www-scf.usc.edu/~rlew/liz_phair/ **************************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 05:11:04 -0700 From: "Michael Carapella" Subject: More Liz "Exposure" >The thing is I see Liz as getting tons of exposure over past year. >She's appeared in pretty much every major magazine, done advertising on >MTV (influences), done a Calvin Klein campaign, a PBS special (sessions >at...), print campaign for rollingstone.com, tons of radio interviews >and in-studio performance, received high marks from just about every >music mag, toured relentlessly, done all the major talk shows, and took >time out of recording her follow up to WCSE to play a benefit show last >week. Capitol put a strong promotional push on Liz right from the get >go generating strong word of mouth months before WCSE was even >released. Toured relentlessly? I just started following her career but I have not seen any evidence that she toured relentlessly to support WCSE, or any of her CDs for that matter. But you are correct in terms of her actual exposure--she is out there. My point was that her overall... I guess "popularity" might be a better word... is not nearly consistent with her talent and product. >I am happy and content with Liz's current success level. A lot of >people view success with the mega stardom mult-platinum stature which >just isn't the norm for most bands. This often inevitably leads to a >backlash from the public and the fans. Liz does very well and I >suspect she will remain steady for a long time to come. If she does >have a breakout hit one day, good for her, and I will still support >her. I see your point. In interviews Liz has mentioned in one form or another that she would like to be part of what's happening on the radio, which makes sense since that was her primary source of musical entertainment while she was growing up. I think that my having just discovered her and my ingrained Western sense of success just makes me think, "She should be HUGE and ALL OVER THE RADIO--and certainly not opening for anybody!" I suppose once I get over that I will just be grateful that she's successful enough to continue releasing CDs on a major label. >Let Liz make a comfy living, enjoy her craft, put out an album once in awhile and >tour for her fans (Florida Liz, Florida..) and we're all happy. Sure, OK. I think I'm starting to feel a little better about this (although this subject was not originally my post). - -Michael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 09:19:02 EDT From: Talula9695@aol.com Subject: Special thanks to Stacey Hey guys, just thought I'd drop a line to let all of you know just how cool fellow liz phan Stacey is: A while back I posted a message practically begging (okay, I'll admit it - I was begging) for a copy of Girlysounds because evidently I'm the only person alive who doesn't have it. Anyway, Stacey was the first to reply (even before Jason!!!) and so I figured that was a pretty good sign that she should be the one to make a copy for me. Stacey told me she had Girlysounds as well as some live stuff, so I sent her 2 tapes and return postage, promising to make her copies of some Tori stuff because I've got a huge collection. I just got this e mail from her today saying she made me 6 tapes, 4 of them paid for out of her own pocket!!!! How cool is that??? So I think I'm definitley obligated to let all of you know just how awesome this chick really is (but please don't beg her for tapes like I did - she'd be sooooo busy then and probably hate me for it!!!). And thanks to everyone else on this list because all of you (minus the jerks who leave threatening messages and shit), even though I don't know you guys personally, seem to really kick ass!!!! Thanks again Stacey!!!!!!! Jackie (please pardon the long message, but I'm mildly retarded and sometimes don't know when to stop) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 08:48:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Connolly Subject: Beatles, and concerts, oh my > From: "Michael Carapella" > okay, she's on Capital now, right? A perk of being > on a somewhat major > record label is usually better - or PROPER - > promotion, isn't it? Nope. Not sure how it is on Capital, but over at Universal they have a handful of favorites, and everyone else has to scramble for promotional funding. Friends of mine, on their second album (first one sold roughly 500,000 copies, maybe more {SoundScan wasn't too accurate then}, so it's not like they're hopeless) the company paid for only three radio appearances, no tour support, and isn't pressuring radio stations at all to play their songs. Very disheartening. So I wouldn't expect any other big record company to be cooperative. But over at Sony/550, those guys are cool, and very supportive. Spend money like they've inherited it from Daddy. > - -Nicole > NP: it's still the beatles (no, that's not the name > of hte album. I'm just still listening ot the > beatles.) But the name of "The White Album" is "The Beatles," right? Or have you change albums? Okay, contributing to the threads: First concert was Electric Light Orchestra on their _Out Of The Blue_ tour at Pittsburgh Civic Arena. That show was between the cities of Boston and Washington DC, and they didn't bring their big ole spaceship stage with them. I was 15 or 16 at the time. High school soundtrack: _Animal House_ soundtrack Oingo Boingo _Only A Lad_ The Anti-Nowhere League _We Are The League_ Dead Kennedys anything Black Flag anything Kansas everything Journey _Escape_ The Clash everything REM _Murmur_, _Chronic Town_ The GoGos _Beauty and The Beat_ Joe Jackson everything Pretenders everything Elvis Costello everything Iron City Houserockers everything Donnie Iris _Back On The Streets_ Silencers "Sidewalk Romeo" Lynyrd Skynyrd's live album The Who _Quadrophenia_ Beatles everything Pink Floyd _Animals_ Velvet Underground _Loaded_ These are pretty much the highlights. Anything that would fit near those listed about we would listen to. Quite a strange and exciting time for music, 1979 through 1981 was. (Recommend giving it a try if it ever rolls around again.) > In response to the "ugly pilgrim thing," I think > that it may just be a pun: > The Pilgrims arrived on the Mayflower > April showers bring may flowers I concur, Mr. Scott. It's probably something that just sounds nice, and fit at the time she was writing it. But it could be a secret code, transmitted worldwide, signaling invaders, terrorists, lawyers and other troublemakers to enter the country. NP: Miles Davis _Kind Of Blue__ === Mikey C Va Beach "When money talks, I try not to listen But lately it's been screaming in my ear." - -Ben Folds Five, "Emaline" _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 09:34:33 PDT From: "M.L.Magdalene" Subject: Ani Live >Imagine if someone caught the Queen masterbating? That would be pretty >harsh. Best Not Think Too Deeply on that one..... >well i just wanted to write and tell everyone about my monday >night.......i had front row center tix for ani!!!!!!! it was >amazing...SHE is amazing. The first time i saw Ani it was almost as though i was seeing GOD or something! The atmosphere at her concerts is just so.....i can't even think of a word for it--white-light-ish--or am i just obsessed? M _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 13:08:56 EDT From: AngelLieb@aol.com Subject: Hmmmmmmmmmm.... It would have been really cool if Liz's cover of I'm a Believer appeared on the Austin Powers 2 movie soundtrack. They played this song during the movie, a big highlight for me cuz it reminded me of Liz's cover. Katie ();) NP: The Best of the Doors (disc two) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 13:34:55 -0400 From: "Jaime" Subject: mis use of whip smart Its so funny, because I'll admit, I smoke my fair share of dope... the one drawback to smoking so much is whenever I eat (and I havent smoked in a day or so) I feel sick... Ah... it sucks. But the dry spell is near over. But anyway I had pertinent topics to post about... I read somewhere (here???) that she set-up Whip Smart, it was to be the stages of a typical (perhaps personal) relationship... Chopsticks-- they meet... she drives him home, she's secretly timid... Supernova-- she realizes she's infatuated... Support System-- they party together... friends meddle in... "what the hell is a lover supposed to do?" X-ray Man-- she realizes things are getting heavy "you have secret plans for me" Shane-- "you gotta have fear in your heart"... enuff said Nashville-- she is liberated here... she seems to question herself... 3rd person, until she decides "I wont decorate my love" Go West-- she's running away... did they break up? every relationship has at least one breakup... Cinco de Mayo-- party time, shes free... "it wasnt fun this time letting you go"... cinco-de-mayo! Dogs of LA-- I dont really have a fucking clue what this song means... maybe fantasy...it sorta has a wishy- washy-lonely tone to it... Whip Smart-- she mentions children... fantasizes about her son (funny how she had a boy too) Jealousy-- no explanation needed Crater Lake-- she's getting drunk... perhaps in the stage where you act out, you cant believe its over... Alice Springs-- "so many opals, nobody here knows what to believe, theyve got me under ground" she seems a little disillusioned... May Queen-- She is over it, and I love the ways she says "Where have I been? Got any what?-- Typical questions from a boyfriend... and it sounds like shes happy not answering... I love whip smart and I love liz. I think I'll post again tonight when I get high (why not?) because my words arent flowing well right now. Later list-- by the way--- Nicole -- I loved the vagina dream! but has anyone a clue to whose brown eye that is on WCSE ? ugh...anyway... ~jaime* ~~~ "...poetry is not an expression of emotion, but an escape from emotion..." ~T.S. Eliot ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 13:56:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Dennis Junkoo Kim Subject: Re: the name game Well, instead of SS, why not EssEss? (at least in print) and then we can use SuppoSys otherwise, to be interchangeable with SupporSyste. Or, we can condition ourselves to pronounce "SS" like "sss, sss" or maybe "the digest" or "that email thingy" or "you know, the one with all the bounced messages?" I move that we refer to Liz as Elizabeth Clark. I live with a girl named liz and she abuses me, calls me "rice-eater" and other epithets. She has a VW cabrio parked in front of our house, that should be abuse enough alone in itself notwithstanding heretofore otherwise mentioned abuses of nevertheless herebeforesaid person or persons in composition of previously preceding letter. - --- "Your manuscript is both good and original, but the part that is good is not original and the part that is original is not good." -Samuel Johnson "A'nta baka?" -Asuka d. www4.ncsu.edu/~djkim2 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 11:37:42 PDT From: jeF kearns Subject: ATTN: Janet (public apology) This is a public apology. I am sorry for posting my comments to you for the whole list to read. Sincerely, jeF. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:19:24 -0400 From: Seth Subject: Re: support-system-digest V2 #176 Hey people, This has little Liz content, but anyway... I have put on some Mendhi/Henna and I wrote "Liz Phair" then a box around it. Below it reads "Polyester Bride," since I couldn't fit whitechocolatspaceegg and I wanted to do some thing about wcse I guess. On the other hand is some weird design thing. Anyway, I'm wearing it to thins picnic that everyone in my class is going to since we're graduating from middle school. OOOh! I feel so young with all you other people. Anyway small class, but maybe I'll write if anybody says anything interesting about it. Seth ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 16:41:21 -0400 From: mhuisman Subject: theres a whole generation with a new explanation......people in motion Hey all, Not really a post about Liz..but I just wanted to say that Nicole is one awesome girl!! Everyone of her subject lines or np comments is a beatles song or lyric..... The beatles rock...as I'm sure everybody has heard me say before. Check out my beatles trading page....not much beatles stuff yet, but cool pictures http://www.geocities.com:80/SunsetStrip/Alley/4522/beatles/intro.html Sometimes I wish I was born in the '60s....everyone seemed to be sooo happy and have no worries:-) and of course the thought of being high and /or drunk all day would be a bit of a bonus:-) Marlie NP: Forrest Gump Soundtrack - Scott Mackenzie, San Fransisco(Be sure to wear some flowers in your hair) - -- "When I cannot sing my heart....I can only speak my mind" - John Lennon 'Julia' ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 18:30:30 -0400 From: "Wendy Alkins" Subject: Misc Liz Stuff Hi! First concert was Go-Go's/Police in early 80's (I was in high school). Am proud to say that I don't regret that being my first! Most recent show was Liz at Lupo's in Providence in may. She rocked...Hard to believe she Ever suffered from stage fright. It was an awesome show including Mesmerizing , Supernova, PB, ....Tons of stuff from EIG and WCSE plus a few new songs that were great. She mentioned that she has a company in RI (tax purposes). Anyone with info? Anyone with a tape of that Lupo's show? I'd gladly trade or send a tape. Anyone seen CIV in concert? They're awesome yet they don't tour as far as I know. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 21:31:21 EDT From: Danaldj@aol.com Subject: liz's popularity, ugly pilgrim's, milli, and SS SS... oh and the bank-dp! DP wrote...<>> dp, that was a fucking hilarious post, hey mr. canadian, maybe they wouldn't recognize you in drag!!!! ..... or would they?! (j/k) I have to say i agree Taryn (i think) artists do tend to get mediocre/waterdown when they become popular and start catering to an audience or try to have such mass appeal. Perhaps liz did it herself on WCSE, there were less bad words and strong sexual conotations, is that cause of capitol or is it liz getting older and being a mom or is it bcos the rec. execs made her put out a polished , commercial album? Someone said they knew someone who heard "Uncle Alvarez" on the radio, must 've been non- commercial , esp. since there was only one single. I remember at the Roseland show they had these WCSE posters there with "Polyester Bride" written on it and "What makes you happy". I asked Donnvan Finn, the Matador College radio rep if that was the new single (this was in october) and he said"no, it will be 'johnny feelgood' " and then i never heard received or saw anything single-wise from liz- as someone else mentioned there are a number of other GREAT songs on the album that could have been single and "what makes u happy" has a lot of appeal, commercially and is very radio friendly, lots of people played ot to death at our station. i think matador is just really bad at promoting sometimes, and i know they didn';t do much for WCSE cos it was co released w/ capitol and they didn't even send us the album at the station. All they sent was the PB single on cd w/two versions of it that sound exactly the same and are like 2 seconds different time wise! I was wondering too<<<"What(who?) the heck are the big L.K.'s?" i think if i really stopped to think about it, it would hurt my head too much........does anyone know so i can give him a decent answer???>> what are the big LK's is it a gang? or maybe a chicago thing? <> That's what i thougt too, it's word association and that's what i think it was for liz , too, but i always wondered if there was some type of "ugly pilgrim thing" like a massacre or revolt.. hey wasn't there...? the boston (valentine's day ) massacre? seriously, entertainers bring mayflowers, ...ugly pilgrim thing"....just a thought. OK, now onto the serious stuff........ Paul wrote that he didn;t like SS and like some of the others, I have to comment on this cos when you have lots of thoughts in your head that you need to get out and can't type fast enough, SS is convenient and everyone knows what you're talking about, susy is a pain in the ass, and i will continue to write SS and Paul, just get your mind out of such strangeness.... i never thought of nazis, when i read people writing SS, sorry. Also, another thing, paul, FYI- Milli Vanilli DIDN'T win a Grammy, because they had to give it back when they were"discovered" for being Frauds!!!!!! You'd think when they won the Grammy so unfairlty they would have some kind of conscience about the whole thing and fess up! And I'm sure since you are really a closet Milli fan, that you aware of Rob Pilatus' (half of the talentless duo) OD last year. I actually caught some of the special as i was flipping around and i thought it was sad, even though they were cheesy , it's sad the guy was all depressed and couldn't get his shit together........(survival of the fittest...hmmm...) this is turning into a very long post , so that's is all for now oh yeah, The new pavement album is really good- i agree w/the rest of you guys, just kept meaning to pipe in, and i wish i was going to the ny shows, i couldn't believe how quickly they sold out! Damn!!! I am in love w/the song"The HEXX" it is awesome!!!!!! I am disappointed in the Donnas album though, I expected more. alright i am shutting up now dp in nj ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 21:39:10 EDT From: Danaldj@aol.com Subject: go-go's tribute, and new thread? and "head on" Forgot to mention this... there is a tribute album to the Go Go's out on a label out of Chicago called 4 Alarm Records..I think it is called "Unsealed..tribute to the GoGo's" This awesome band the Pinehurst Kids are on it and also the FRogs and some others(can't remember who) we're waiting to get the album but I just thoughti would let y'all know. "Head on" by J & MC is also covered by The Pixies on Trompe Le Monde- you might remember it as it got some MTV airplay, it's a good cover- straight forward rock form an awesome band. And yes, Ginz The album "Automatic" is awesome.. I really like it a lot, i bought it when it came out, unfortunately i did not have a cd player then so i cant play it on air, cos it's on cassette, but i can listen to it in the car and i love "between planets" and "Drop" but the whole thing rocks! Hows about a new thread? This might be a tough one though, I know it is for me.. so mayhaps(daisyfool, i stole your lingo!) it will not be a go... I dont know if i can answer it, maybe you've done it b4, but it would be interesting to know................................ .......... WHAT IS YOUR ALLTIME FAVORITE LIZ SONG? dp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 22:04:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Nicole W." Subject: She was a working girl... North of England Way... Anywho... Just cleaned up a shitload of piles of junk in my room... it's time for a break. I was listening to alot of beatles, but then I turned on wcse but left hte room. I came back to find my sister singing along with Whit Chocolate Space Egg. That was odd... she's pretty heavily into Mariah Carey, Brandi, Monica, Jay Z, BSB, Puffy, etc. Okay I always forget to ask this... Anyone notice... it might be elsewhere, but I notice it in the Glory boot... how similar "Jealousy" and "Supernova" are... interms of the guitar part? I always think Liz is about to play Jealousy but she plays Supernova, or the other way around. Anyone else? Okay I have to go... there are four people in here and one of htem is my guest... who just arrived. Bye. Later, Nicole ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 21:26:07 -0500 From: palik@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: question L.K.s = Latin Kings, a pretty large Hispanic street gang ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Jun 99 22:54:45 From: "chemhalo" Subject: RE: mis use of whip smart I like Jaime's theory on whip-smart...the only problem is that a couple of songs, notable "Shane" and "Dogs of LA" interfere with it, because of the specific subject matter. "Shane" always seemed to me to be about a boy going off to war...I actually did a class project where we brought in songs either written during or about Vietnam, and I brought "Shane" in for the class. I think that "Dogs of LA" is somewhat related to the film Reservoir Dogs. JC ________________________________________________ If you really want to see me Check your papers and your TV Look who's telling who what to do Kiss my ass ________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 00:11:27 -0400 From: Valerie Barry Subject: stephen malkmus on liz hello all (especially my heavy metal buddies!)...i have much on which i'd like to comment from previous digests, but i'm sleepy and the whole cutting-and-pasting quotations thing has very little appeal. also, i seem to have misplaced exile...damn damn damn! i haven't seen it in about a week. but...creative loafing, an atlanta newsweekly (its in other cities, too) had stephen malkmus of pavement (who is just dreamy, i think!), an enigmatic songwriter indeed, give his thoughts on varius lyrical exerpts. our gal liz was reviewed as follows: >Liz Phair, "Flower": "Every time I see your face/I get all wet between my legs/Every time you pass me by/I heave a sigh of pain/Every time I see your face/I think of things unpure, unchaste/I want to fuck you like a dog/I'll take you home and make you like it." > >She's painful and she's wet. She wants to fuck you like a dog. She'll take you home and make you like it. That's really cool. She must like this, taken like this out of her songs. [Laughs] I think it's pretty funny -- not funny -- but sort of shocking in its own way. But I never noticed it being that shocking when I listen to her. I guess I did hear her say, "I wanna be your blow job queen." I thought that was pretty cool. And I think that album's actually a pretty great record, Exile In Guyville. For me, if I did this it would have to be totally ironic. I mean, I don't know what she was thinking when she did it. Maybe she was really into it. Cause I know these are sentiments that some women really feel. [Laughs] There's obviously girls who related to it. And then there were, of course, all the writer nerds, critic guys, that really got turned on by it. for the whole article, go here: http://www.clnetwork.net/ np: david letterman on the idiot box - ben lee is about to come on, i'll have to check him out as many of you have opinions on him. actually, its that mitsubishi comercial that uses the pixies song..grrrr. we're a market segment, dammit. ******************************************************** Valerie Barry valerieb@mindspring.com ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V2 #177 ************************************