From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V2 #159 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Tuesday, June 1 1999 Volume 02 : Number 159 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Wish You Were Here ["M.L. Magdalene" ] asking god ["DarkSide oftheMoon" ] AM honest? PLEASE! [Mike Connolly ] dp, manson, piano, 4-trk ? ["Paul Erickson" ] Helium Live ["keelyfish" ] Re: Julia Roberts, 6'1" on 6/1 [AngelLieb@aol.com] liz phair, a rant;hole on lillith ["Dana Protano" ] Neutral Milk Hotel ["Chipko Arnold" ] girlysounds ["scott smith" ] Bounced message [Jason Long ] Bounced message [Jason Long ] Bounced message [Jason Long ] Bounced message [Jason Long ] Bounced message [Jason Long ] Re: support-system-digest V2 #158 [Oh4sythia@aol.com] more things ["Nicole W." ] PhFest Website [Meredith Robbins ] les choses ["Nicole W." ] chicago??? [MangoHula@aol.com] Want a tshirt ??? Okay... ["Jaime" ] free liz phair sticker [John Kim ] Re: Wish You Were Here ["April Haitsuka" ] Re: Liz Phair, A Rant [Jason Long ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 23:33:04 PDT From: "M.L. Magdalene" Subject: Wish You Were Here Okay this isn't Liz related but somebody was talking about Julia Roberts and how Liz made a refrence to her in "Chopsticks". Now this has nothing to do with that, but i was reading "People"(don't ask me why)and there was this little thing in there about how Julia didn't shaver her armpits and how the British or English or something community was just all upset and appaled by it. I just thought that was ammusing. Don't know why. Just something to do. And since we're still talking about songs that we think it would be cool for Liz to cover--what about "Wish You Were Here" by Pink Floyd or "Paint it Black" by The Rolling Stones(don't know about that one compltely though)or even "Like a Virgin" by Madonna(or would that be demeaning Liz?). I have to have all 4 of my wisdom teeth cut out tomorrow!!!--also not Liz related..but weighing heavily on my mind-- Looking for and Explanation, M _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 04:25:55 PDT From: "DarkSide oftheMoon" Subject: asking god I must agree with some other posters on Sheryl Crow. I saw her a couple of months ago and she was very good in concert. Strong vocals, the band was tight (Wendy & Lisa were quite a excellent addition).She has developed so much as a songwriter and performer. And to be compared to Tom Petty is certainly no insult in my book. And actually I like Jewel too. She may not be anywhere near the caliber of Liz but she is listenable and easy on the eyes too. Which brings me to the whole idea of looks. Who cares if an artist is pretty to look at or not? Hell in their day, Frank Zappa, Alice Cooper, Sex Pistols were not considered poster boys for 12 y/o girls. It's about the music not just the looks, unless they are going for a show type effect like Kiss or Alice Cooper or Bowie were doing in their time, then of course its done for shock value/entertainment/etc. I'm not gonna touch the whole Built to Spill thing...although I think I will check some of their music out. Seems like some folks were trashing Phish not too long ago, so I guess this month its BTS. Did I miss this somewhere or how about some more details on the DC Liz Phest? Some songs I'd like to see Liz cover: "Don't Worry Baby" Beach Boys "When the Levee Breaks" Led Zep "No Rain" Blind Melon "I'm Only Sleeping" Beatles Has anyone else heard the new radio ad for the Ford ZX2 or whatever the hell new truck it is? The song they play for the ad sounds so much like Courtney/Hole its not funny...."it makes me feeeeeeeel.." True Story - There's a church I drive by everyday on the way home. They have a portable sign that they put messages out on, you know, religious stuff. Yesterday it said - Need Directions ? Ask God Well someone this morning rearranged the letters so it read - Erections? Ask God Hmmmm......... Special thanks to Ginz and Rlew for the Girlysound copies! _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 05:51:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Connolly Subject: AM honest? PLEASE! Nic'Ole Dirty Bastard. Your conversation with your brother reminds my of when my sister and I were those ages, all those years ago. We are 10 months apart in age. We never talked to each other civilly until after I had started going to college, then left home completely. But now, twenty years later, all is well. We're actually like brpther and sister. From: MLevine171@aol.com > I don't agree at all with what u said about Alanis. > Alanis iS NOTHING like the backstreet boys. The BSB's > r in it for fame and money, and Alanis is > against fame and money. I'm really gonna have to disagree with you on this one. Take a look at her first two albums, the ones she never talks about nor covers songs from in her concerts. She switched from disco diva wanna-be to Angry Young Woman for her third, _Jagged Little Pill_, and sold over 20 million copies. The next album songs, alledgedly, were all written in one day (must be hyperbole - let's just say she wrote them really quickly), and she made it know how her trip to Asia and Africa affected her outlook on things spiritually, which was a very trendy position to espouse. ...and he continues > Go by songs like "Baba" and "Perfect" and "most of > her songs. Well, I have seen her on the latest tour and have heard all four albums worth of her songs. (Have you?) She has been a pop queen for her entire career, both before and after the change in direction. From where I'm listening, Alanis really does have more in common with the likes of manufactured pop bands like BSBs and Shania Twain, than Liz Phair and Tori Amos. Okay, enough of that. My fingers hurt. NP: Nothing, because I left my music at home. === Mikey C Va Beach "It's time to face what you most fear Right Guard will not help you here Brace yourself, my dear..." - - Jello Biafra "Holiday In Cambodia" _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 07:30:30 PDT From: "Paul Erickson" Subject: dp, manson, piano, 4-trk ? <> <<>> I saw a couple people properly explain what I was refering to when I mentioned the seedy meaning of dp. They did a good job of saying it pretty clearly without actually having to say it out right. Hopefully everyone now knows and we can leave that discussion behind us. Sorry about the nature of the discusssion. I just thought the various dp's on the list should know. <> Butch Vig may be holding the reins to some extent but he wouldn't be anywhere without Shirley as the front person. Sorry everyone, but a lot of it goes back to looks and image. I'm not saying that that's all Ms. Manson has to offer but it is definitely an element to that bands success. I believe she wrote most of the lyrics for the second album which I have and didn't think was that great. I don't think Jewel sucks but it is definitely possible to play an instrument since childhood and still suck. I've been playing piano since a kid, and twenty years later I'm still not all that great. The difference is 4 tracks (8-4=4). On one machine you can record 4 unique tracks of audio. On the other you can record 8 distinct tracks of audio. As with most things, more is better. _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 11:11:12 -0500 From: "keelyfish" Subject: Helium Live Keely: >As a sidenote, some of the best bands in music right now are notoriously >sucky live. Take Helium for example. Helium sucks live????? I *never* heard that one before. I saw them nearly ten times live and not once did I hear anyone boo-ing them and not shouting for an encore. Really I'm not flaming you but I'm curious to hear about your concert experience with Helium. What happened? Well, I've seen them several times and they were just really lackluster. It wasn't like they were missing notes all that much (some, but not a lot), but it wasn't like they were playing very well, either. By notoriously I meant that I have heard from many many people that they sucked live when they saw them, too. I was under the understanding that it's just a thing. I mean, I love Helium, and they could get up and play with toy guitars and mary could sing through a vocoder for all I care, I was just saying that I have heard from so many people that they had heard from so many people, too, that they were just stinky live. No big thing. No flame on Helium. Just an observation. Keely ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 12:35:07 EDT From: AngelLieb@aol.com Subject: Re: Julia Roberts, 6'1" on 6/1 Tim asked about Julia Roberts and if Liz actually did know her. I read in some article that Liz met Julia at summer camp and they tried to keep in touch, but Julia kept making collect phone calls. I'm sure you can find an article where Liz said this at Ken's Mesmerizing site. Today is June first. Nothing exciting, but this got me to thinking about how this list originally was, 6'1" Mailing List. Sooo...gives me a great question to ask, which era did everyone begin their Liz following? EIG? WS? or WCSE? Craig used to have profiles of everyone on his page, Phair Territory, where this was mentioned, but it's not there anymore. Of course, I'm new to Liz ("new?" Hmmm...) and got into her shortly before WCSE but bought EIG after seeing her mentioned in so many Lilith Fair articles. Hey! Hey! Hey! I posted during the day! KL ():D ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 09:49:38 PDT From: "Dana Protano" Subject: liz phair, a rant;hole on lillith hello all danas,- (y'know there is a band the donnas-they're awesome, my sister is donna and maybe dana p and i can start the danas and then the donnas and the danas can tour together and we can get the two jaimees from the list and do a big tour, the danas, donnas and jaimees!) i had done another post late last nite and it didn;'t make the digest, is there a time cut-off? maybe it got lost in cyber space. i wanted to comment on the liz phair pseudo-bio. I haven't gotten that far, maybe cos i was a BIT turned off by the way it started. I just got it two weeks ago for my bday and haven't had that much free time, but what i read was kind of lame. i would think that most of you listers would be turned off, too. It starts off by saying how the author doesn't know shit about liz, doesn't give a shit, has pretty much never heard or seen her, etc. well the publisher doesn't care- this is what really gets me-"just make some shit up we'll put some pics in between" "no one really reads this stuff", and "we have to cash in on her before she completely falls out of the public eye and there is no interest". I guess camden is being dangerously haonest. and i will once again say , i have not gotten too far, but this REALLY BOTHERS me. I feel like some stupid kid who just got duped even though i didn;t buy the book, just the principle of it all-taking advantage of us ravenous liz fans! please feel free to reassure me that the book loses some of its ambivalence soon! >I just remembered this funny thing i saw, it was on this list of why it's >good to be female(a short list!, just kidding) so it said: women can be groupies, guys are just stalkers! pretty funny right all you liz stalkers! (kidding) god, you have to be soooo careful on this list now , even when you make jokes! like that playboy comment i made saying those of you who'd be sad liz wasn't nude were perverts-- A JOKE!!!! Do we remember what those are? >Someone said Hole IS playing lillith, is this definite? If so, do you know >if they are playing in the NY area? and will they be doing any of the same >dates liz will be doing? I wonder if those two would get along? That's all for now-Remember: If you kiss your honey when your nose is runny You may think it;s funny But itsnot! DLEP NP: The KElley DEaL 6000- go to the sugar altar _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 10:10:28 -0700 From: "Stephanie Morris" Subject: My 50 cents... Not much to say, just a lot to comment on. I have been catching up on the last week or so of digests. Lot's of interesting stuff... From: TADude9999@aol.com Subject: (no subject) Dana Protano,on May 27th wrote: " Mick Jagger plays the guitar,piano and has been considered in the music biz, as one of the foremost harmonica players in the biz for most of his career." We can't forget Mick's degree from London School of Econ. When will looks not be the main focus? Ugh. Also, the song that people want Liz to cover, the "I might like you better if we slept together" is a Romeo Void song (someone did point that out) Deborah Iyall (the singer) is still around SF. She will be doing some Jewish music thing soon. She's cool. "And on a related note, why does everyone consider Garbage to be a chick band? It's Butch Ving's project, and always has been from the start." For a lot of people, a female singer equates a "chick band" RIDICULOUS! Garbage is cool, but Shirley is the lead singer because she's hot and has red hair. See above comments about Mick Jagger's lack of "good looks". It's that same thing. Would Garbage be as popular if they had a mediocre female lead or just some guy? No. "Are you kidding? Listen to the lyrics of "Baby Got Going" on WCSE! - - - --John" I never thought about that! It makes sense. Now if she would just cover She Bop, she would be done. She could do a masturbation trilogy. Hey.... "Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 13:25:44 -0500 From: jeremy Subject: Re: Tori, Liz, and Alanis tori amos and ani difranco suck. that's all. jeremy fallout@purdue.edu" Very intellectual! I am impressed with your open-mindedness and your ability to make such a deep statement! Wow! We love people like you on this list, or rather we eat your for breakfast. "> > If I were you guys, I wouldn't go by the initials dp as it can have some > meanings in some circles you may not want associated with yourselves :) > > i know about "displaced person" and "dumb polack" (which is frightfully close to my own hideous surname), both of which sort of....fit. so, what am i missing out on? how else am i disgracing myself? please tell.... dp" Also, why would anyone, like Dana Polowchowski, who sounds like he/she has a brain, want to associate his/herself with anyone who used a term like "dp"? That's all for now. No Liz content, no nothing except rants. Sorry. - -Stephanie NP- Husker Du: Flip your wig ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 10:33:28 PDT From: "Chipko Arnold" Subject: Neutral Milk Hotel As there seem to be a few fans of NMH on this list i thought i'd pass on some gossip/rumours. The word is that they are now signed to Rykodisc and their two albums will be reissued soon and a new one will be recorded when Jeff is better (he's been ill lately, but should be up and about soon). NMH may play at the Terrastock festival in the UK at the end of August, but it's still up in the air. Anyone in the UK, or due to visit in August should check out the Dreamy records site (www.dreamyrecords.demon.co.uk) for details on the festival, which will be INDOORS!!!! (anyone who'e witnessed an August Bank Holiday in the UK will no how attractive that is) and in the centre of London. Might see you there. "and i wonder how i've come to know so much less than i knew before" ... Joseph Lee Henry. "i know the promise is so much better than the real thing" ... Grand Drive. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 13:52:44 -0400 From: "scott smith" Subject: girlysounds I've enjoyed listening to liz (still do,-always will) yet I have not be able to find a copy of girlysounds-I need help! If anyone can help solve my dilemma it would be more than appreciated. thanks, ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 14:25:53 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: dave Subject: rare liz Hello there, i don't get to write very often, but i'm making a little compulation and i need to get my hands on rare liz songs... what i am looking for in particular... Carnivore (Raw) Don't Have Time (I own this on tape... but would like it in a different format) Rocket Boy (release from stealing beauty) and any live/bootlegs you might have... basically, i would like these in mp3, or HIGH QUALITY wav or another audio format... if you want t ohelp, i'll make it very worth your while :) david ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 14:29:57 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: Danaldj@aol.com Subject: danas, liz, alanis Alright-now I know what dp stands for thanks for educating me- This is the other dana p, i have ceased using my hotmail acct as it is too small to handle the large, large manliness of the support-system mailing list! And dana polichowski- us dana's have to stick together! (so Sad about Dana Plato, I loved her on different strokes, and i think one of the reasons was cos of her name!) Anyway, I wanted to say that I agreed with some of the things Steve said about Alanis. And I think that MLevine, I was at that show-Philly Core States , right? I walked in as liz was playing "explain it to me"(I was so upset she started early and i missed part of the set) Well anyway, I went to that show JUST TO SEE LIZ, I didn;t even buy the ticket, someone else bought it and gave it to me-it was the only way they knew i 'd go see alanis.;BUT I MUST SAY, even though I wasn't really into her after all her music was played to death on commercial radio(I realize that's not really her fault). She is a really energetic, and good performer. I am still not a fan, but after seeing her, i think i gained a respect for her and you can't put Alanis and tori or maybe even Drewel in the same category as BSB, PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!! Alanis is talented. even if she;s not my taste, as is tori- lets stop the bashing of the femmes out there who don't completely suck-let them be, at least none of them are brittany spears or whatever else cheesy kid rock teenybopper music is being spoonfed to america today! alright , enuf talk i am going to relax now, p.s.- I heard the Irving plaza sleater kinney show was quite good, so upset i couldn't go, i heard helium's mary timony was not too good at all, but i love helium anyway and saa dougher from the crabs and cadallaca played solo(has a solo album coming out), no cadallaca songs done w/sara and corin though. oh i wish i went, i heard they were selling the hot rock on vinyl for $8!!! It is sooo worth it!!!! hopefully they will come back although i know they are not! listers enjoy the show tomorrow!! I'm soooo jealous!!! Dana L.E.P. (what's gross about that now?) N.P.:Clouds, "thunderhead" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 14:30:23 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: Danaldj@aol.com Subject: liz in playboy first- i hate this screen name- i did NOT pick it so I am apologizing to myself i think, but in case anyone is wondering since it maybe gender confusing i will tell you what dad was thinking- danaldj-dana L-for lady and DJ for Dj danaladydj, hence-danaldj i felt this needed to be explained. alright-my bfriend cut out for me the liz thing, but literally just her part cos he knows how i feel about it. Exact words for those keeping track at home who do not want to buy the mag just for the pic or quote: Title says The Phairest One of All LIZ PHAIR describes herself as "an upper-middle class cute girl with smart parents, singing dirty words." We'll buy that. You buy Whitechocolatespaceegg. The pic does not have a year on it but was taken by Paul Natkin and is a live pic, very old looking from her hair and all, she looks different, she's playing guitar and is standing , and the funny thing is i just noticed on the back there is this REALLY GROSS pic of a blonde girl with THEEE biggest and ugliest boobs and a pair of tacky sunglasses on, it's a small pic and as i said i only have the part of the page withthe liz thing so i don;t really know what the deal is with ms.ultra big boobs with tacky sunlgasses but she's lsqueezing them together and they are drooping it's really weird! jsut thought i'd share that! i still don't know what issue this was from , if anyone is interested i will find out.jsut say the word. that's all for now dana lady dj (dp) oh i don't care, i'll take two , after all two is better than one! NP:BUILT TO SPILL, KEEP IT LIKE A SECRET!!!! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 14:31:41 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: siobha5@ibm.net Subject: REM covers for Liz >>4) "Fall On Me" -REM >> (The lyrics "buy the sky..sell the sky.." damn! I get >> pure chills just thinking of how AMAZING Liz would sound >> singing this song...DAMMIT! WHy Can't she do it!?) >I don't know. The success of REM comes from the synergy of the entire band. >The lyrics are cool, but the lush instrumentation behind them is also an >integral part of the song. The performance and the songwriting process are >so tight that it makes a successful, somewhat original turn for an REM cover >almost impossible. >April actually "Fall on Me" has already been covered by a group called Cry Cry Cry which is made up of Dar Williams, Lucy Coplansky, and Richard Shindell, (i don't know if those last names are spelled correctly). IMHO their version of "Fall on Me" is absolutely beautiful. I think Liz could definately do a great job of covering that song. Siobhan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 14:32:45 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Bounced message From: "Pat Smalley" Subject: Vote for Liz Hey you out there in Phairland, Well there I was scolling down the worlds most stunning woman poll.Well guess who I came across way down near the the bottom...... Yep Liz herself with only 2 crappy votes.2!! So you all have to get there and vote for her now, It's at http://www.freevote.com/booth/pen1 So get there and put right this horrible lack of support for Liz. Thanx, Marky. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 15:09:52 EDT From: Oh4sythia@aol.com Subject: Re: support-system-digest V2 #158 Tim said: >I was wondering if she really did know Julia >Roberts at age twelve or if that was just artistic license. I hope I'm not the fortieth person to answer this, but yeah, Liz did meet Julia R. at camp; she's mentioned it in interviews. Something along the lines of Julia being the bossy type and how she was okay with that until after camp, when the two girls talked by phone a lot. This is because Julia would call collect, or expect Liz to call her back, or something that pissed Liz off because, according to her, Julia's parents were no less rich than Dr. & Mrs. Phair. Katie Spaceegg wrote: > Livin' la femme nikita! <------ hey! > Goes with that annoying Ricky Martin song! Am I the only person on this list of lovers of all tunes esoteric who will *admit* to being a sucker for this badly written, overplayed, unoriginal pop song? Because I am. A sucker, I mean. Leslie """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" "She never drinks the water; Makes you want to drink champagne, & once you let her take you there, You'll never be the same..." --Ricky Martin """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 17:15:34 -0400 (EDT) From: "Nicole W." Subject: more things About Explain It To Me or Don't Have Time or whatever being Liz's fave song, she's also said (to me and others) that May Queen is her fave. So she's either a pathological liar, or has a few favorite songs. :) Umm... thi s is kind of an old thing, but I've been listening to "Erectinga Movie Star" lately, and even though Shudder to Think have sang abou8t Broom Blond Hair in other songs or whatever, I really think it's Blue-blond in "Erecting".. read that somewhere. Okay something fucked up just happend to this e-mail so if htere is weird shit at the end of htis, blame it on the U of Michigan. Later, Nicole P.S. I think I had more to say. Oh well. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Jun 99 05:19:24 -0400 From: Meredith Robbins Subject: PhFest Website Hi, I just finished putting up a little website to house the pictures taken at the fabulous DC Liz PhFest that took place lo these two weekends ago... I know it's probably rife with errors, and the formatting is terrible, but please, don't tell me about it. I put the page up just as quick as I could, and it's still taken me literally 12 hours. Thumbnail-ifying with Adobe Photodeluxe is a *drag*. When I put asterices around "drag," it makes it look like a double entendre--what for, I don't know. But I just want to let you know that it is not a double entendre. Thumbnail-ifying really is a drag. Anyways, it's at http://www.exileinnetville.com/phfest/ if you're interested. Love, Meredith NP: My new CD-R copy of the Lounge Ax show with special bonus surprises! Only they're not surprises, because I already knew what extras I was going to get. Anyways, thanks again, Ken! +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ "On rocky islands, gulls woke." --Esther Forbes, "Johnny Tremain" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 16:39:31 -0400 (EDT) From: "Nicole W." Subject: les choses A few things: Spaceeggy: An eight track is a recording device which has eight different "tracks" thqat you can record on, meaning htat you can record eight different parts. Like you can layer eight times. Like seperatley record four vocal tracks, a drum track, a guitar track, a bass track, and ... a horn track. A four track only has four of those tracks. Okay this is n't exactly accurate, but this is the basic idea, I think. I've never owned or used either one, so that's why I can't be 100% sure, but I'm fairlycertain that I'm close to the true definiteion. About Jewel... even if she DOES sing about PC topics and stuff, that doesn't mean her lyrics are GOOD, and it especially doesn't mean her music is good. I could sing about how racism sucks, but what if my lyrics were like "Fight racism, cuz it sucks, and you're dumb if you're racist, so don't be racist, cuz you're a big dumb stupid dork!" That would be really lame (but also the best I could do as far as lyrics,cuz I ain't no type of prolific poet). So message shmessage; when you suck, you suck. About the giveaways... RAY! I feel your pain! The few times I could have stayed up for a digest but opted to go to bed, there were awesme givewaways. Ugh. I guess I'm not meant to get anything,b ut that's okay. I guess. Maybe. Not really. ;) I heard Elvis' "Suspicious Minds" today, and I'm trying to decide if that would be a good songfor ms. Liz to cover. Of course it would be good for liz to cover some kind of elvis, cuz she sings about elvis a bit, you know? I think Supsicious Minds would be good, yeah. I decided. Okay. Maybe "You Never Give Me Your Money" by the beatles. IS that the name of the song? I think i8t is. And "Green Grow th4e Rushes" by r.e.m. Okay I'm going now... Gosh. this post isn't funny at all... its' like a Serious Nicole Post. How sad, eh? Later, Nicole np: Liz Phair at the Lounge Ax (1999) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 18:47:36 EDT From: MangoHula@aol.com Subject: chicago??? so, is ANYONE still planning on going to CHICAGO???? can the "planner" please email me w/ any current information you may have............dates, things to do, places of interest, who is going??? that would be MUCH appreciated!!!!!!!!!!!! it is fast approaching. *oh, and stay tuned for that site all about the DC Liz Phfest.............meredith is putting it together and it should be up and running soooonnnnnnn..........(pssst, meredith? you working on it??? ~~~~~~~~LyNda~~~~~~~~~ *that don't impress me much* (i promise i'm NOT a shania fan but i heard don and mike (syndicated radio show that rocks) on the radio making fun of this song and it just won't leave my head) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 19:30:40 -0400 From: "Jaime" Subject: Want a tshirt ??? Okay... >>My inner-child laughed it's ass off at that comment..just thought I would >>let you know you're appreciated. >>M >>......I do have AOL >>IM so I put you on my list and hope to see you around soon so we can bitch >>about the world together.....oh, and Drewel, too. >>Jackie Thanks M & Jackie... So sweet to be acknowledged! AWWW!!!! *smile* >>ack! so i didn't stay up. what are the chances it would happen two days >>in a row? pretty good, I guess. >>...ray Hey ray... How about this--- you email me and you can be the proud owner of one of my original, homemade, kick-ass Liz t-shirts... Just because you're you! _________________ ______________________________________________________ *Also-- if anyone else wants a t-shirt, I will be happy to send you one-- email me for details. I had originally only wanted to make ten, but I decided that isn't fair... because it's not like I have a limited amount. So email me and I'll send you the details. ______________________________________________________ __________________ This list makes me feel so generous... ~Jaime* *the t-shirt girl who openly hates drewel* - -<<>>-<<>>-<<>>-<<>>-<<>>-<<>>- "I only get high about twice a day, It helps to keep my blues away..." --Bran Van 3000 -<<>>- "Downer Surrealism." - --Frank Zappa, on Steely Dan - -<<>>-<<>>-<<>>-<<>>-<<>>-<<>>- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 19:40:04 -0400 (EDT) From: John Kim Subject: free liz phair sticker i got two liz phair stickers. the first person who emails me back about this will get one. if i reply to your message that means you get it, if i don't email you back, then you were too late, and i won't email you back. the sticker has these yellow ovals on it and says "liz phair" on it like the cover of the new album. big hug. john kim email: jjk50@columbia.edu aol IM: puppechase ____________________________________________ "two inches or a yard, rock harder if you're sagging. i ain't too proud to beg, nah!" --lisa left-eye lopez tlc ____________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 17:17:59 -0700 From: "April Haitsuka" Subject: Re: Wish You Were Here re: Liz covers >even "Like a Virgin" by Madonna(or would that be demeaning Liz?). I like the thought of a Liz cover of "Like A Virgin" with snarling guitars -- and a few lyric revisions (a la "Wild Thing"). Madonna's lyrics were kind of shallow back then, and I think Liz could improve upon them with her own keen wit. April ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 21:26:11 -0400 From: Jason Long Subject: Re: Liz Phair, A Rant DLEP wrote: >i wanted to comment on the liz phair pseudo-bio. I haven't gotten that far, >maybe cos i was a BIT turned off by the way it started. I just got it two >weeks ago for my bday and haven't had that much free time, but what i read >was kind of lame. i would think that most of you listers would be turned >off, too. It starts off by saying how the author doesn't know shit about >liz, doesn't give a shit, has pretty much never heard or seen her, etc. >well the publisher doesn't care- this is what really gets me-"just make some >shit up we'll put some pics in between" "no one really reads this stuff", >and "we have to cash in on her before she completely falls out of the public >eye and there is no interest". >I guess camden is being dangerously haonest. >and i will once again say , i have not gotten too far, but this REALLY >BOTHERS me. >I feel like some stupid kid who just got duped even though i didn;t buy the >book, just the principle of it all-taking advantage of us ravenous liz fans! >please feel free to reassure me that the book loses some of its ambivalence >soon! Well, the book isn't supposed to be an actual biography of Liz by any means, and Camden Joy, in reality, is a huge fan of Liz's work. It'd be hard for me to explain exactly what the book is supposed to be and do a good job of it, so instead, here's an article about it that appeared in the September 1998 issue of Detour (which also featured an article on Liz that I believe can be found on Ken's Mesmerizing site; if not, I can type it up for the list when I get a chance). The Joy Of Camden Camden Joy rants and raves with punkish glee, and deconstructs Liz Phair and the broken promise of pop culture in his dazzling debut novel, The Last Rock Star Book. by Steven Jenkins "I was eating a really delicious orange the other day," whip-smart writer and agitprop pop-culture theorist Camden Joy recalls via phone from Boston, while his puppy, Ella, yaps in the background. "Suddenly I closed my eyes, and it was an amazing sensation to just focus on the incredible taste. I had my headphones on at the same time, and it struck me that the taste of the orange was the perfect analogy for the music I was listening to." Which musical artist inspired Joy's joyful citrus epiphany? Was it pudgy pixie Frank Black, whose _Teenager of the Year_ Joy has championed as "The Greatest Record Album Ever Told"? Or was it Al Green, whom Joy considers "The Greatest Record Album Singer That Ever Was"? Perhaps it was lo-fi retro popsters the Apples in Stereo, or is that comparing apples to oranges? Guess all you want, because Joy won't tell. Let's assume, then, for the sake of a tidy editorial transition, that the sweet and juicy singer who provoked Joy's taste buds and imagination was the one and only Liz Phair, who just so happens to be the (ostensible) subject of _The Last Rock Star Book_ (Verse Chorus Press), a savvy hybrid of fictional autobiography and pop-music critique. Subtitled _Liz Phair, a Rant_, this "last" book just so happens to be Joy's first published novel. _The Last Rock Star Book_ traces the downward spiral of a morally suspect slacker, also named Camden Joy. Following an unwanted break-up with his girlfriend, the lovably dizzy Shaleese (who believes her father was Rolling Stones bad-boy Brian Jones), Camden is hired by schlock publisher Gabriel Snell to write a quickie "where is she now?" bio of Phair, long absent following the release of two acclaimed albums (but now back in the spotlight; see page 74 of this issue). Daunted both by the assignment and his going-nowhere life in Iowa -- vividly portrayed in hilarious yet poignant flashback scenes of teenage sex, drugs, rock and roll, and petty crime -- Camden grows increasingly obsessed with Phair's music. Acting out of desperate bravado, Camden steals his landlady's car and journeys to Chicago to confront Phair and his own personal demons. In a heady yet freewheeling style that recalls Lester Bangs, Greil Marcus, and Phair herself, Camden -- the character and author -- relates this extraordinary ode to squandered youth and perfect pop songs in a helter-skelter flurry of words and ideas. His casually complex musings on identity, fame, and art are fueled by the visceral kick and emotional wallop of great rock music. Joy's formative introduction to rock and roll occured in the fourth grade, while growing up in Ventura County, just outside of Los Angeles. "I heard Paul McCartney's _Band on the Run_ in 1974," he remembers, "and by fifth grade I owned every Beatles album. Then I got into Dylan." Punk hit L.A. a few years later, and Joy jumped into the mosh put with X and the Circle Jerks. "Music was so different then, before MTV," he reminisces. "Bands was completely committed to playing good music for people who were into it. It wasn't about packaging songs to be played as background music at the mall." Joy hung out in Los Angeles throughout the '80s ("They're back now ... what a sad joke"), writing songs and playing in bands. "It was frustrating because I felt duty-bound to follow an established rock vernacular, yet I wanted to write complicated narratives about complex issues. Rock songs were too limiting. Around the same time my life was disintegrating. My girlfriend married another guy, and I thought I could win her back if I gave up the kind of wild rock-and-roll lifestyle I was leading. So I started writing books." Although his girlfriend wasn't impressed by this sudden shift from punk provocateur to ink-stained wretch, Joy discovered that he enjoyed the freedom of working alone and telling stories. Upon moving to New York City in the mid-'90s, Joy wage-slaved by day and prowled the streets of Manhattan by night, posting obsessively scrawled manifestos celebrating the cultural significance of favorite bands such as Yo La Tengo, Son Volt, and the Mekons. "I remember drinking a whole lot one night and lying in bed with the room spinning," Joy recalls, "and the idea hit me that I should post a series of rants that connect to form an underlying narrative of one person's particular psychosis. It was fun for a while, but the weather got really bad, and the cops would fine me, and I'd come home freezing and covered in glue. It was all pretty desperate, and I don't think anyone really took the time to piece them all together as I'd hoped." Nonetheless, the mainfestos that survived this 1995 experiment exemplify Joy's deeply heartfelt, maniacally inventive brand of fandom, as this ode to indie heroes Pavement attests: "I hereby suggest the American President of the United States and all them U.S. trade reps to haul Pavement to the trade talks. They are our grandest export, our finest product, infusible in hot weather, our best materials. Pavement should be carried on our shoulders and emblazoned on our backs and ushered unto waiting planes at the last minute and with an almost effete, deliberate importances, their bellies bloated with our very best meats." Pavement remains in Joy's pantheon, but in 1994 his absolutely positively favorite record was -- what else? -- Liz Phair's almost impossibly brilliant debut, _Exile in Guyville_. "I was writing a stuffy Victorian novel and I was sick of it," Joy remembers, "so I started on another book and _Guyville_ crept into it. I decided to reply to the record just like Phair replied to the Stones' _Exile on Main Street_. I loved how she gave herself permission to fuck around with lies and conflicts surrounding her politics and her personal tastes. So the book became about Liz Phair, who I still think is phenomenal. I never thought she'd become so famous, and if I'd written the novel a year later it would have been completely different. Maybe it would have been about Courtney Love." Thankfully ignoring the Last Rock Star Crook in favor of Phair, Joy's fictional alter ego, Camden, researches the "rising punk starlet" for his bogus bio, which sleazy publisher Snell predicts will be an easy sell to Gen-Xers: "I been seeing in the trades about these baby-buster kids, and that's who this'll grab. Age group 18-29. Attributes: parents divorced, intelligent, sarcastic, mistrustful of mainstream advertising, big _Speed Racer_ fans, overeducated, underemployed, big TV watchers of the '70s, make references instead of conversation." Camden fits this demographic, and with Joy's help he actually develops a striking analysis of his subject's unique vocal style: "Liz Phair sings with teeth gritted, vomit riding high in her gullet, like she's standing before us not as a preachy rock star but beside us as a disappointed friend, looking askance at us over her shoulder. And the truth is, she does not sing her songs so much as seethe them -- she seethes better than any other vocalist I've heard, male or female." It is precisely this attention to detail -- to the manner in which a singer chooses to sing her songs, and to the consequences those choices have for listeners -- that distinguishes Joy's orange-juice observations. His characters are losers in the grand tradition of dead-end American road novels, yet they care passionately about how and why Iggy Pop's version of "China Girl" is superior to David Bowie's, and they're bewildered by the sheer glut of good and bad music churned out by bands like Superchunk, Supergrass, Supersuckers, Superstar, Supernova, Superthis, Superthat. At one typically sharp point in the novel, the fictional Camden concludes that "Rock and roll seemed just as futile and stupid as anything. To say merely that we felt a little let down by rock and roll would be about like saying the Japanese felt a little let down when they lost World War Two." I don't believe for a moment that the real Camden would agree, not as long as Van Morrison and Elvis Costello and Pavement and Liz Phair are making graceful, fearless, noisy, wicked records. "There's an amazing moment in "And Your Bird Can Sing," Joy enthuses as he discusses the Beatles' _Revolver_, "after George's incredible guitar part, when John Lennon sings the line, 'When your bird has broken.'" Joy does his best Lennon impression, spewing melodic bile. "There's so much rage in it, you could write a novel about revolution just from those few seconds of music." Do it, Camden. Call it _The Last Rock Star Book, Part Two_. ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V2 #159 ************************************