From: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org (support-system-digest) To: support-system-digest@smoe.org Subject: support-system-digest V2 #58 Reply-To: support-system@smoe.org Sender: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-support-system-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk support-system-digest Saturday, February 27 1999 Volume 02 : Number 058 Today's Subjects: ----------------- liz in magazine, good sigs, etc. [Oh4sythia@aol.com] Alanis alert ["Chipko Arnold" ] Liz Phair Touring Australia? Maybe! ["Chris Whitfield" ] Something else about KEN'S CDs ["Nicole W." ] [none] ["Katy Foudree" ] i can't believe... [george2@sas.upenn.edu (matt george)] Re: support-system-digest V2 #57 ["M.L. Magdalene" ] Liz on the World Cafe 2/26/99 [TADude9999@aol.com] Blondie [Craig King ] wcse sessions [Josh Webb ] Liz on WXPN(yeah...again) [King of All ] easy ["Stacey Wirt" ] mp3~matador~canada~al capone [MrE ] Johnny Feelgood and abject desire ["Cynthia Nagle" ] Johnny Feelgood and abject desire ["Cynthia Nagle" ] oh shit ["Cynthia Nagle" ] Ken Lee ROCKS!!! [MrE ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 02:18:57 EST From: Oh4sythia@aol.com Subject: liz in magazine, good sigs, etc. Wow, I was last to post yesterday. New experience for me. The last poster's name next to the end of support-system digest # **************************** always depresses me - no more to read after that. So I depressed myself. Liz was barely mentioned in MoxieGirl, this combined catalog/magazine. The editors charmingly (ha) call it a catazine or a magalog, they can't make up their minds. It's aimed at girl-power-type teenagers who can simultaneously support skateboarding better than the boys, discuss proper eyebrow tweezing technique, and drool over Leonardo DiCaprio. Ah, the contradictions of being an adolescent female these days. Anyway, there is one cool features-editor, SuperClea, who is obsessed with mix tapes and has a fresh one for every issue. So I saw my younger sister's copy of MoxieGirl for all of 15 seconds, and it seems that Clea made a tape with themed sides. Side A is something crush- dependent - probably either infatuation or I-got-dumped-depression. Side B is the I'm-so-over-him side, and she put in a Liz track. The thing is, it's Polyester Bride, and I think there are better over-him tracks than that, right? Whip-smart and Guyville were both supposed to end with getting over a guy? Like, May Queen, Stratford-on-Guy, Strange Loop? So maybe she just stuck PB in to buy cred, like Alanis… Who knows. So since I've been tripping on Meredith's sigs, <"The capital is still reeling from shock today after it was revealed that <><><>< <*+*the bitch is back and she's ready to party*+* Right on - talk about sometimes a dream (is what makes you a slave…) ><><><> Subject: Alanis alert Anyone in London might be interested to know that Alanis is playing at the Shepherds Bush Empire on March 1st. This is a pretty small venue for her as when she tours in the summer she's playing Wembley. It was meant to be a secret thing but word got out. Now the embarrassing bit, i might be going!!!! yeah, i know, but hey, i've never seen her live and, well, i might be able to get free tix! i'm not proud. Trouble is Mercury Rev AND Jason Falkner (ex-jellyfish) are also playing that night. Three gigs to choose from! What's a boy to do? Time to get the dice. "and i wonder how i've come to know so much less than i knew before" ... Joseph Lee Henry. "i know the promise is so much better than the real thing" ... Grand Drive. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 21:42:13 +1100 From: "Chris Whitfield" Subject: Liz Phair Touring Australia? Maybe! Well I subscribed from my home account just so I wouldn't have to wait until Monday to mail this from work... anyway a friend was wearing his Liz Phair tshirt (the 'sprite' one - don't know if its official) in Greville Records in Melbourne today... and one of the guys who works there said that the day before he had gotten a call from a promotor friend who was asking if it was worth bringing Liz Phair out to tour Australia... and the guy said 'hell yes'! This is the first definite info I've heard about tour interest. not that it should really surprise me.. she seems to be getting a _lot_ of airplay outside mainstream radio. Whitechocolatespaceegg is apparently the feature album of the week on JJJ - which guarantees two songs each 3 hour 'shift' for non specialty shows. And she's getting a lot of support on RRR as well.... i heard a three songs together from WCSE on one show (Talk Is Cheap) and another show (Tigerbeat) played Shitloads Of Money! On the downside the album distribution is a bit haphazard, not as many stores have local copies yet - and the locally produced stuff isn't up to scratch on the printing. more tour news as it hits.... Chris NP: Mix Master Mike - Anti-Theft Device ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 09:09:07 -0500 From: "Matson, Lisa" Subject: oh very funny darrin wrote: I think the screwed up people of this world (racists, homophobes, paedophiles, physical abusers both male and female, lawyers, etc.) oh ha ha, How cleverly you threw that last one in there. Very nice. It's only funny till you need to sue someone. (but don't even think about calling me.) ( and then again, i do corporate work and you're not part of our judicial system anyway-- being a northie) Actually, I am consulting my attorneys regarding a defamation claim right now so be nice. in other news: LIZ on WORLD CAFE TAKE NOTE: i heard that after a time they put the world cafe on cd and sell it either at borders books or (for philly people only i guess) at that used cd store in manayunk. can anyone confirm this?? Lisa - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----- And it seems like I've got something to prove But in some ways its just something to do. LIZ PHAIR - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ------ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 12:13:07 -0500 (EST) From: "Nicole W." Subject: Something else about KEN'S CDs People... $2.00 seemed really cheap to pay for Ken's CDs. That's because it was a little *too* cheap when you factor in postage and the cost of the CDs and the two- CD jewel box and Ken's time and all this stuff. Hence, if you only paid $2, it would be nice if you'd donate him some more money. True, I haven't done so yet, but that's because I need to break my $20 and I never spend money so I haven't had a chance to use it yet. But when I do, youc an bet I"ll be paying ken-o. Anyway... once I was talking to ken and he did a little calculation of what the actual CDs cost after all was done, but I dont' remember the figure. I think it might have been like... $7? I'll ask him and then post the figure or something. Anyway, I just think it would be nice, even if youcan't afford $7, to give him a couple of extra bucks. Keep in mind, $7 is still SUPER SUPER SUPER cheap for what you're getting! Two CDs, kids (and adults)! A two CD bootleg essentially. So... his address is: Kenneth Lee (I can call him Ken-o, though) P.O. Box 1972 Union City, CA 94587 C'est tout. For this post, at least. It needs to be expressely about thsi issue so maybe since it will be short, people will read it. KEN KEN KEN KEN KEN. If i put ken's name in here, people might forget it's my post and actually read this. But a few people actually read my posts. Thanks pholks! ;) You are phaboo! Phreebird!!! Nah... this isn't just a philler. Later, Nicole (not Nebula or Neptune or Nincompoop or Necropheliac or Niche or Nads or... WHAT UP #wcse??!) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 10:33:11 PST From: "Katy Foudree" Subject: [none] Hey all... I'm new to the list and if anyone knows anyplace I could get any live Liz stuff I'd love it... also I would like to find sum of her Gurly Sounds stuff as well... please email me and let me know... I love Liz Phair and have since I was lik 14. She's a great artist and I wish she would get more publicity than those like Alanis Morisette (who is overrated) but I tried to get tickets to the Indianapolis show where Liz opens, and can't... oh well. Later Katy/ Twnklgrrl1 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 13:53:02 -0500 (EST) From: george2@sas.upenn.edu (matt george) Subject: i can't believe... ...that i worked for a year over at kids corner on wxpn, every day going upstairs, seeing david dye doing world cafe, just HOPING that one day he'd have liz as a guest, and NOW, 2 years later, is when he finally books her...grrr ! :) but enough of me being bitter. i just wanted to mention for those of you in the philadelphia area and who are stuck at work or something while liz was on the show on friday (like i am, even though i'm like 4 blocks away from the studio...grrr ! no wait, didn't i say i was gonna stop being bitter ?), they're gonna rebroadcast her apprearance on saturday at 12 noon (88.5 on the dial), so you can catch it and tape it then. man, i wish i had kept better connections over there...maybe i could have sat in on the show or something...argh. anyways have a great day guys... matt http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~george2/music/liz (it'll be updated someday, i promise...) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 11:17:13 PST From: "M.L. Magdalene" Subject: Re: support-system-digest V2 #57 >Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 00:29:13 -0600 >From: "Jenny Sayler" >Subject: sometimes a dream... > >>p.s. does anyone remember the hand motions to this ditty when played with >>only 2 people? I swear there is a hand-clapping sequence that goes with >it, >but none of my friends can recall one. > > >When I was little we did this: > >Bubblegum bubblegum in a dish >How many pieces do you wish >my mother told me to pick the very best one and you are not it > >So we didnt do a hand clappy thing, but a you're not it thing instead I thought that was a jump roping thing....atleast that's what we did when i was little. As for my Liz Content...it's not much really--i converted a freind...well.....forced her to listen to Liz so much that it became some sort of an addiction and she had to go buy one of her CD's(WCSE) to avoid withdrawl. But all the same--we need more Liz fans....she deserves it!!! And then there is the Grammy's-for those of you who watched--which i figure was most of you--i personally found the show so highly annoying that i wanted to burn out my eyes--as if it wasn't bad enough that most all the CRAPPY awards has CRAPPY nominees and then even the crapies out of all of them won--my personaly favorite was when Ani DiFranco'(who of course wasn't even there)lost to Alanis.....puke.... and then there was Shania Twain...and that awful outfit...or maybe it was the camera angel...or both....and Celine Dion who either needs to eat something or put a back over her head. But there was a plus side..i figured out my Alanis issue. I can listen to her music all the same as music i can tolerate but don't like if i don't have to look at her...it's when i have to watch her sing that i get disturbed...she's always doing that thing with her head..and her hands...and surely someone else knows what i'm talking about.... Anyways Back to the babble of our subculture, M ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:48:01 -0500 From: King of All Subject: Liz on WXPN >i heard that after a time they put the world cafe on cd and sell it either >at borders books or (for philly people only i guess) at that used cd store >in manayunk. can anyone confirm this?? > >Lisa Well, I can't confirm this, but if someone can find out if it's true, I live two minutes away froma Borders and know exactly what CD store you're talking about and I'd be happy to pick up any number of copies for anyone. By the way, for anyone who contacted me about getting a tape copy of the show - it's now 2:46 and I'm sitting here with my finger on the record button. Send me those requests! Later. KOA. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 16:05:01 EST From: TADude9999@aol.com Subject: Liz on the World Cafe 2/26/99 I taped the approximately 25 minute show,if anyone would like a copy please e-mail me privately at TADude9999@aol.com and I'll make you a copy.Please include your name and mailing address. Thanks TAD NP Liz at the World Cafe ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 13:35:59 -0800 (PST) From: Craig King Subject: Blondie Sorry, non Liz content alert. Just curious, did any of the Blondie fans on this list get the new album "No Exit"? I think it's great! It sounds just like classic Blondie. Sounds they never missed a beat Just wondering if anyone else has heard it yet? Craig "The KingAdRock" _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:09:42 -0800 (PST) From: Josh Webb Subject: wcse sessions Hello all, I haven't posted in a while, but with new music by way of Ken, I feel inspired again. First my five Phavorite Phairities: 1.Blood Keeper 2.Beginning To See the Light 3.Waiting For the Bird 4.Freak of Nature 5.Sometimes a Dream(Is What Makes You a Slave) I'm right with everybody else on Blood Keeper. How that didn't make the album, I have no idea. I find What Makes You Happy interesting on the recordings too. That was my favorite song from wcse and I like the shelved versions of it better than the album version. Where I always thought WMYH was a great song, I found it to be a little overproduced, which to me is proved on the wcse sessions. Also, kind of interesting that Liz still mumbles the lines coming out of the bridge in Headache. I remember her saying that she had done that when she forgot the lines and it was just so her that she left it in. I guess she left it in quite a few times. Any traders out there interested in putting together a swap. I have an extensive Liz collection, as well as other artists. The URL for my tape trading page is on the bottom of my signature file. Late, I'm out, Josh == "The world is full of ugly things that you can't change. Pretend it's not that way. It's my idea of faith."--Ben Folds Five "If you've got a one in a million girl, don't let her get away, 'cuz the next one in a million girl is a million girls away."--Liz Phair If you're interested in trading live tapes with me, visit: http://www.angelfire.com/fl/layeroffilm/tapelist.html _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 17:13:14 -0500 From: King of All Subject: Liz on WXPN(yeah...again) By the way, during the show, they mentioned that CDs of the shows can be bought online. I don't know all the details or how much of each show is available, but here's the address for anyone who's curious: http://www.xpn.org/sections/worldcafe/ KOA. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 17:26:12 -0500 (EST) From: "Stacey Wirt" Subject: easy Ok, there's been some posts about "easy".... Here's what I always thought.... it's about someone dead who's come back to haunt liz... I always thought that it was about liz's dead grandfather. I'm almost positive that I read this somewhere.... an article, someone's page...I don't know. Does anybody know what I'm talking about?? Has anyone read this same article?? And about the world cafe show liz is doing, will someone please post the songs that she plays? ... and speaking of the world cafe, WCSE is number 11 on a viewer pole for best albums of 1998.....EIG is number 32 for best of 1993... YAY!!!! go liz!!!!!!! - -Stacey ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 15:11:48 -0800 From: MrE Subject: mp3~matador~canada~al capone >>Also, today Matador announces the launch of its new mp3 >>site, at http://www.matador.recs.com/mp3/ as if you didn't already know... - -- "I don't even know what street Canada is on." ~~ Al Capone~~ (take that you foreign types!) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:27:47 -0500 From: "Cynthia Nagle" Subject: Johnny Feelgood and abject desire Hello Digesters, MANY thanks to Suzanne Walsh for posting the excerpt of the article on women and violence in song! I pulled up the entire article immediately, and found it to be one of the most thought-provoking items I've yet come across courtesy of the digest. (If you haven't done so, I urge every thinking person to check out the entire article -- go to http://www.pioneerplanet.com/ and enter "liz phair" in the search engine). It puts into words what I've been trying to articulate for myself since buying WCSE: why I'm so crazy about "Johnny Feelgood" (the song, and the person -- yes, I have a Johnny Feelgood in my life). The issue is so loaded, and so fascinating: pleasure and pain being only a breath apart from each other; "the feminist bottom line in the 70s... that sex and music had to be gentle and women couldn't be transgressive sexually or musically;" "living periodically in the danger zone while maintaining a basic grasp of oneself... and that tension is part of falling in love." Right away, I realize that declaring my fondness for the theme of "Johnny Feelgood" may put me on the PC hit list (or, conversely, the hit list of those who insist that Liz is not a feminist). So be it. I'm not telling you what Liz's motives are, or saying that anyone has to agree with me -- I'm simply offering up what one of her songs means to me, put in a context of other songs dealing with the same theme. If there is such a term as "post-feminist," this topic surely qualifies. "Johnny Feelgood" and the other artists' songs mentioned in the article express my (and many women's) conflicted feelings about power in some areas of life in the 90s. The article points out that today's women enjoy -- take for granted, even -- the freedoms that their mothers' generation fought so hard for. But that very fact opens up a Pandora's box of other feelings that need to be dealt with. I found especially interesting the observation of how in "Hit So Hard," Courtney Love deals with "mutual vulnerability and the potential for mutual destruction in the most explosive relationships." Makes me think of pairings in history that sparked fireworks, because the 2 people involved were either both creative or both very strong... Kurt & Courtney, of course, Sid & Nancy, Hepburn & Tracy, Carville & Matalin, Auguste Rodin & Camille Claudel... there are dozens of others. I think back on conversations with a female friend of mine... she's my mother's age, and married, but otherwise we have a lot in common: a professional job with some autonomy & power, income equal to or exceeding that of the man in the house, opinionated, doing what we want when we want. We share similar viewpoints on lots of things, including sex and power. We've discussed the phenomenon that the Pioneer Planet article terms "emotional slumming" (what a great term!) and also "the rape fantasy" (which is NOT a desire to be raped, it's a desire to be "overpowered" during consensual sex). The article scores a bulls-eye in identifying "a taste for danger-boys and for butting up against tough men intellectually, emotionally and/or sexually... just as some powerful men enjoy sexual submission, women may feel the same." The whole issue is especially interesting to me, since I've just been cast as the lead in The Heidi Chronicles -- which deals with one woman's journey from the mid-60s traditional female role, through the sexual revolution of the late 60s and 70s, to the uneasy ground of the late 80s -- and all the while, she's trying to discover what SHE really wants (not what her female friends want, not what her boyfriends want, not what society wants). To me, Liz Phair's music in general (and Johnny Feelgood in particular) picks up where all that leaves off. The new frontier, perhaps? ***** And on a different track altogether: Leslie -- I know the 2-person hand-clapping motions to "bubblegum, bubblegum in a dish." Hurricane Cindy "Well look at me, I'm frightening my friends" is a humongous understatement. NP: U2, "Shadows and Tall Trees" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:40:25 -0500 From: "Cynthia Nagle" Subject: Johnny Feelgood and abject desire Hello Digesters, MANY thanks to Suzanne Walsh for posting the excerpt of the article on women and violence in song! I pulled up the entire article immediately, and found it to be one of the most thought-provoking items I've yet come across courtesy of the digest. (If you haven't done so, I urge every thinking person to check out the entire article -- go to http://www.pioneerplanet.com/ and enter "liz phair" in the search engine). It puts into words what I've been trying to articulate for myself since buying WCSE: why I'm so crazy about "Johnny Feelgood" (the song, and the person -- yes, I have a Johnny Feelgood in my life, but the theme is enacted more in fantasy than real action). The issue is so loaded, and so fascinating: pleasure and pain being only a breath apart from each other; "the feminist bottom line in the 70s... that sex and music had to be gentle and women couldn't be transgressive sexually or musically;" "living periodically in the danger zone while maintaining a basic grasp of oneself... and that tension is part of falling in love." Right away, I realize that declaring my fondness for the theme of "Johnny Feelgood" may put me on the PC hit list (or, conversely, the hit list of those who insist that Liz is not a feminist). So be it. I'm not telling you what Liz's motives are, or saying that anyone has to agree with me -- I'm simply offering up what one of her songs means to me, put in a context of other songs dealing with the same theme. If there is such a term as "post-feminist," this topic surely qualifies. "Johnny Feelgood" and the other artists' songs mentioned in the article express my (and many women's) conflicted feelings about power in some areas of life in the 90s. The article points out that today's women enjoy -- take for granted, even -- the freedoms that their mothers' generation fought so hard for. But that very fact opens up a Pandora's box of other feelings that need to be dealt with. I found especially interesting the observation of how in "Hit So Hard," Courtney Love deals with "mutual vulnerability and the potential for mutual destruction in the most explosive relationships." Makes me think of pairings in history that sparked fireworks, because the 2 people involved were either both creative or both very strong... Kurt & Courtney, of course, Sid & Nancy, Hepburn & Tracy, Carville & Matalin, Auguste Rodin & Camille Claudel... there are dozens of others. I think back on conversations with a female friend of mine... she's my mother's age, and married, but otherwise we have a lot in common: a professional job with some autonomy & power, income equal to or exceeding that of the man in the house, opinionated, doing what we want when we want. We share similar viewpoints on lots of things, including sex and power. We've discussed the phenomenon that the Pioneer Planet article terms "emotional slumming" (what a great term!) and also "the rape fantasy" (which is NOT a desire to be raped, it's a desire to be "overpowered" during consensual sex). The article scores a bulls-eye in identifying "a taste for danger-boys and for butting up against tough men intellectually, emotionally and/or sexually... just as some powerful men enjoy sexual submission, women may feel the same." The whole issue is especially interesting to me, since I've just been cast as the lead in The Heidi Chronicles -- which deals with one woman's journey from the mid-60s traditional female role, through the sexual revolution of the late 60s and 70s, to the uneasy ground of the late 80s -- and all the while, she's trying to discover what SHE really wants (not what her female friends want, not what her boyfriends want, not what society wants). To me, Liz Phair's music in general (and Johnny Feelgood in particular) picks up where all that leaves off. The new frontier, perhaps? ***** And on a different track altogether: Leslie -- I know the 2-person hand-clapping motions to "bubblegum, bubblegum in a dish." Hurricane Cindy "Well look at me, I'm frightening my friends" is a humongous understatement. NP: U2, "Shadows and Tall Trees" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:57:18 -0500 From: "Cynthia Nagle" Subject: oh shit Sorry, I think my long message went through 2x... Cindy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 21:55:19 -0800 From: MrE Subject: Ken Lee ROCKS!!! and to my hero, Ken Lee ~~ You da...no that would be considered rascist, but i guess maybe 'cracker' is a term of endearment? so, You're the Man...no, that would be considered sexist, see above for usage of 'dick'. so, You're...no, that would likely be construed as selfist, although few heros remain with which to compare. so, how about 'Job well done", no, that would alienate those having not done a job so well. phucit...To Whom This Concerns, GREAT PHUCN DISCS!!! which brings me to this: How come you damn (and i mean that in a good way) Canadians and eastern seaBORED types get bratmobile with S-K? and liz with Mahatma Morissette? john candy was right... leave it to beaver MrE - -- "You don't know a woman until you've met her in court" ~`~ Norman Mailer ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ End of support-system-digest V2 #58 ***********************************