From: owner-stillpt-digest@smoe.org (stillpt-digest) To: stillpt-digest@smoe.org Subject: stillpt-digest V2 #8 Reply-To: stillpt@smoe.org Sender: owner-stillpt-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-stillpt-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk stillpt-digest Thursday, January 13 2000 Volume 02 : Number 008 Today's Subjects: ----------------- b/Willow ... ["David S. Bratman" ] Re: b/Willow ... [Todd Huff ] Re: b/Willow ... [meredith ] Re: b/Willow ... [allenw ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 12:03:18 -0500 (EST) From: "David S. Bratman" Subject: b/Willow ... We read it here first: the world is beginning to pick up on something first mentioned in this topic sometime. (Gayle, was it you?) www.salon.com/ent/log/2000/01/12/willow/index.html Donna Minkowitz pleads to Joss Whedon: "Make Willow gay. You heard me. You must know that millions of your lesbian- and gay-adoring fans (some of whom are straight) held their breaths the other week when Willow held hands with that cute Wicca girl so they could make really, really strong magic together! ... You suppose you're radical because you made [VW] a lesbian ... Well, my Laura Mulvey-reading friend, that's just not good enough!" More, much more, including a comment on whether Buffy's outsider status makes her a symbolic lesbian. (Not good enough either, says Minkowitz.) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 17:40:32 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Huff Subject: Re: b/Willow ... That's a great find, David. Spoiler below for the episode on the 25th: Ethan Rayne returns! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 20:45:00 -0500 From: meredith Subject: Re: b/Willow ... Hi! David pointed out: >We read it here first: the world is beginning to pick up on something >first mentioned in this topic sometime. (Gayle, was it you?) > >www.salon.com/ent/log/2000/01/12/willow/index.html Great article. I couldn't have said it better myself. Though I must admit that when I read this bit: >Do you have any idea how galling it is that the >smartest, most feminist show that has ever been still makes me read myself >into the characters and construct elaborate fantasy love-lives for them >=behind= the official versions? ... I had to re-read it three times before I realized that she hadn't suddenly switched gears and started talking about Xena. :) +==========================================================================+ | Meredith Tarr meth@smoe.org | | New Haven, CT USA http://www.smoe.org/~meth | +==========================================================================+ | "things are more beautiful when they're obscure" -- veda hille | | *** TRAJECTORY, the Veda Hille mailing list: *** | | *** http://www.smoe.org/meth/trajectory.html *** | +==========================================================================+ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 15:31:07 -0600 (EST) From: allenw Subject: Re: b/Willow ... David, I believe it was me, actually, but I can't take too much credit; it was hardly subtle. And many, many other people have commented at length on the subject on USENET (I'm not sure if Salon counts as "the world" more than USENET does). I find it interesting how many people on alt.fan.buffy are not only disapproving of Willow being possibly bi, but deny that there was anything in "Hush" that might so indicate. That being said, I'm not too fond of Donna Minkowitz' Salon article, for two reasons: 1: Asking/telling Joss to "make Willow gay" or bi seems wrong. She is, or she isn't, or she might become so, but if it comes off as Joss changing the character arbitrarily, that's bad. 2: It also seems like an attempt to pre-emptively take credit for a possible plotline that Joss already seems to be heading towards. - --Allen Wilkins On Wed, 12 Jan 2000, David S. Bratman wrote: > We read it here first: the world is beginning to pick up on something > first mentioned in this topic sometime. (Gayle, was it you?) > > www.salon.com/ent/log/2000/01/12/willow/index.html > > Donna Minkowitz pleads to Joss Whedon: > > "Make Willow gay. You heard me. You must know that millions of your > lesbian- and gay-adoring fans (some of whom are straight) held their > breaths the other week when Willow held hands with that cute Wicca girl > so they could make really, really strong magic together! ... You suppose > you're radical because you made [VW] a lesbian ... Well, my Laura > Mulvey-reading friend, that's just not good enough!" > > More, much more, including a comment on whether Buffy's outsider status > makes her a symbolic lesbian. (Not good enough either, says Minkowitz.) > ------------------------------ End of stillpt-digest V2 #8 ***************************