From: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org (shindell-list-digest) To: shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Subject: shindell-list-digest V7 #165 Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org Sender: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk shindell-list-digest Friday, July 8 2005 Volume 07 : Number 165 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [RS] the great american songwriter [sharon G ] [RS] Obviously One Believer [RockinRonD@aol.com] [RS] There is no sin ["Sally Green Heaven" ] [RS] More Annoying Thoughts [Tom Neff ] [RS] She Belongs to Me (Bob Dylan... covered by Richard Shindell) [OzWoma] [RS] booking shows [Patience9@aol.com] Re: [RS] There is no sin [lisa@sharinglaw.net] [RS] Paul Simon, John Prine, Richard Shindell ["Norman Johnson" Subject: [RS] the great american songwriter I am going to temporarily interrupt this Dave Carter- Richard Shindell love fest to add that I think there are two men who can be placed in the same category as RS and DC. Both write story songs, love songs, use their humor And are skilled at their craft.. Paul Simon and John Prine I think Prine is closer to Shindell than Paul Simon.. His catalogue is vast and covers a variety of similar content as Shindell. That's my 2 cents... Glad to see sally back around sharonG ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 09:20:44 EDT From: RockinRonD@aol.com Subject: [RS] Obviously One Believer Bart suggested an interesting thread--our input on what Dylan songs we'd like to hear Richard cover. Not too long ago at one of his shows, Richard did "She Belongs To Me" and I thought it was sensational. Funny, I used to play this song all the time back in my college days but haven't in years. Often, when I hear Richard do a cover, it makes me go to that song and try to learn it myself. His covers invariably inspire me and provide new interest in a cover song I never before considered. I suppose this is one of those definitions of a true fan. And just to add my .02, I think "Vuelta" is an important and pivotal work for Richard because, if nothing else, it clearly demonstrates his growth and expansion as a writer and musician. Recording the record with an Argentine ensemble was risky, despite the band's inarguable talents, and he pulled it off masterfully. To say nothing of composing a truly beautiful ode in another language altogether. RockinRonD ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 10:34:38 -0400 From: "Sally Green Heaven" Subject: [RS] There is no sin Lisa wrote: >run in the past-- some are uncomfortable, I am sometimes uncomfortable, >with the Christian vocabulary, imagery, and general shorthand, if only >because it's a language not all of us can follow and therefore can be >excluding. To Richard, it may be shorthand because he thinks everybody Well, who knows what is in Richard's head. I tend to think that Christian vocabulary, imagery, etc. is prominent in many of his songs because that's been his experience - going to seminary, leaving seminary, and who knows what other experiences or thoughts, struggles, positive experiences or whatever that he's had with Christianity. I think that his personal experience probably adds much to the richness of what he's able to say in these particular songs. I don't imagine that he meant to exclude anyone, just that he's writing what he has known. Although I do see that people who haven't had the same particular life experiences may not understand or be able to relate as much to the songs. But to wind up where I've begun, who knows what's in Richard's head with regard to intentions. I've also been reading with interest the many reaons people have for why they think Richard is a great songwriter and performer. So why do I think he's so great? Let's see, specifics. A lot of it is the rich and wonderful tapestry that his songs create in my head - the lyrics and his ability to tell a story while revealing it in pieces with conflict, drama, rising action, and denouement. And to do it in such a relatively short, confined space as a 4-minute song. And part of it is definitely the music - I'm not real technical with the guitar, so I can't attest to him having six fingers or anything, but I do notice that he makes the guitar sound so, I don't know, COOL. I didn't know an instrument with just six strings and some number of frets could make the incredibly complex sounds and chords and melodies that his guitar does (when he plays it - if I played his guitar I'm sure it would not sound the same, haha). And finally, part of it is definitely his singing voice. This is the most intangible thing to describe, although I suppose it suffices to say that I like the way his singing voice sounds. But that doesn't capture it - I feel like when he sings, and hits the high notes, the low notes, the drawn-out notes, whatever, that his voice makes my violin strings on my heart and soul trill out an answering note of something profound. It's thrilling. - --Sally ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 10:33:07 -0400 From: Tom Neff Subject: [RS] More Annoying Thoughts * I couldn't help noticing that the fellow who found it "interesting that very few of the Listers speak of Richard's spirituality" then proceeded to write about Dylan, bluegrass, production values, economic divides etc - but not about Richard's spirituality. Maybe it's harder than it looks! Or maybe it's his business and not ours and most Listers instinctively recognize that. :) * Dave Carter was a very good songwriter of a certain type and range, and if he had lived another 10 or 20 years he would have been one of the true greats. Instead he died too young, days before what would have been a breakout performance at his favorite festival, leaving behind a grieving partner & a promising & busily wordy body of work. (There are a lot of songs in the trunk too.) But respectfully - he is not Bob Dylan, he is not Dave Van Ronk, he is not even Richard Shindell for my money. He was a much beloved guy, very influential on a big regional group of intelligent, sensitive folk peers who revere his memory. For a while everyone was covering him because they loved him. I can think of maybe three examples that actually worked. The rest you just sat through. Over time I think three or four Dave Carter songs will stay in the repertory for some kinds of folk performers - and that's nothing to sneeze at. But with time will come perspective. I would personally put Dave on the level of Nick Drake. That's about right. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 11:30:44 EDT From: OzWoman321@aol.com Subject: [RS] She Belongs to Me (Bob Dylan... covered by Richard Shindell) Hello, All - RockinRonD posted: << Bart suggested an interesting thread--our input on what Dylan songs we'd like to hear Richard cover. Not too long ago at one of his shows, Richard did "She Belongs To Me" and I thought it was sensational. >> The recorded version can be found at the link below (scroll about halfway down to The Times They Are A-Changin' - A Tribute to Bob Dylan - Volume 2... http://dylancoveralbums.com/various2.htm Susan http://www.heartsdesireconcerts.com http://www.horseofadifferentcolorbooking.com "If you're lucky, you find something that reflects you helps you feel your life, protects you cradles you and connects you to everything..." ~ Dar Williams ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 11:45:43 EDT From: Patience9@aol.com Subject: [RS] booking shows Scott, it would be nice if the new web site had phone numbers to book shows at. I have been unable to find anything for Wilton, CT including the chamber of commerce. Lindy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 16:01:09 -0400 (EDT) From: lisa@sharinglaw.net Subject: Re: [RS] There is no sin > Well, who knows what is in Richard's head. I would generally agree, except that i heard him put forth the "shorthand" approach in an interview. Anyway, please don't construe my remarks as negative. OF COURSE he doesn't want to exclude anybody! lisa who should be at work ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 17:56:49 -0400 From: "Norman Johnson" Subject: [RS] Paul Simon, John Prine, Richard Shindell Sharon wrote: >> Paul Simon and John Prine I think Prine is closer to Shindell than Paul Simon.. His catalogue is vast and covers a variety of similar content as Shindell. << I've been a Paul Simon fan for over 25 years. I got hooked listening to the Simon and Garfunkel hits the radio would play when I was growing up. In college (in the 80s), I discovered Paul Simon's solo work from the 70s, and was blown away by songs like Duncan and American Tune. I remember buying the Graceland album as soon as it came out. Richard mentioned in a recent show I saw of his how every time he comes back to the US, he feels that the country he knew has changed. To ground himself, he likes to play old tapes and one of the songs he plays is Paul Simon's America. His version is wonderful, and I hope it is recorded some day. I know that he's also performed Bleeker Street and American Tune. BTW, I love the version of Bleecker Street done by Jonatha Brooke on the Bleecker Street album (this is the same compilation where Cry 3 does Tom Paxton's Last thing on my mind) I know some John Prine, but not as well as I know Simon. I can't think of any Prine songs that Richard has done, but I do know that Prine played at Sal's the night before it burned down. Norman ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 22:42:29 -0400 From: Jamie Younghans / John McDonnell Subject: [RS] RE: songwriting miscellany Hi all, I promise to shorten my posts. I was in a writing mode at work, and I think it just spilled over. Lisa wrote: >>I am sometimes uncomfortable, with the Christian vocabulary, imagery, and general shorthand, if only because it's a language not all of us can follow and therefore can be excluding.<<< I can see that, but one of aspect of his work I found intriguing was that he used that imagery and vocabulary in a way that I thought was more accessible, but maybe that's because I am familiar with it. I am very uncomfortable with art that is overtly religious (having grown up in Ireland with a religious education, "apostasy" doesn't even begin to describe my stand on religion), but I found the songs, even with the imagery, as speaking to something about the human condition in general, e.g., "it's in the nature of the beast, to wonder if there's something missing." That kind of observation, to my mind, opens up the song beyond the religious, with the redemption/deliverance really just being about getting to a place to sleep. And a song that is almost nothing but religious--"Mary Magdalene"--has the funniest line I've heard yet: "It was his career or mine." Like you, though, I'm not sure what "spirituality" means except perhaps anything beyond self-preservation? Is that too reductive? I also thought you were more likely to get a joke about lawyers and spirituality than any semantic rejoinders. Also, on your remark that >>There's plenty to aspire to without god<< Have you seen the New Yorker cartoon which shows "The last secular humanist being driven from his home?" Hilarious. Dylan covers by RS? I'm thinking early stuff, because that's what I'm most familiar with. My picks, in no particular order: anything from "Bringing It All Back Home;" likewise, anything off "Blood on the Tracks;" "Romance in Durango" (he can work on his Spanish!); "Motorpsycho Nightmare; "I Dreamed I Saw St. Augustine" (sorry Lisa!); "I Pity the Poor Immigrant;" "Senor;" "Highway 61 Revisited;" "Just like Tom Thumb's Blues" Bart wrote: >>I once worked with a guy who had six fingers on each hand<<. OK, but could he play "Wisteria"? Many of you have mentioned Dave Carter--what's a good CD for intro to his work? Is he an acquired taste, or could a Shin-head handle the hardcore stuff? Rockin Ron--how do you think RS' growth and expansion as a writer and musician is exhibited in Vuelta beyond working with an Argentine ensemble? From a big picture perspective I see it, and I've always respected artists who are willing to try something different (even when I think the project is awful--like Elvis Costello doing Burt Bacharach). But as a guy who has a much bigger picture view of his work than I do, do you find the work as a whole an "upgrade" in quality over earlier albums? Real short post, huh ;) John McD. ------------------------------ End of shindell-list-digest V7 #165 ***********************************