From: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org (shindell-list-digest) To: shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Subject: shindell-list-digest V4 #253 Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org Sender: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk shindell-list-digest Saturday, August 31 2002 Volume 04 : Number 253 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [RS] Gordon Lightfoot and Protocol ["Norman A. Johnson" ] Re: [RS] Imagine life so boring [Joe Lanzalotto ] [RS] Re: Imagine life so boring [ptpower@juno.com] Re: [RS] Transit's meaning ["Sandra J. Smith" Subject: [RS] Gordon Lightfoot and Protocol I was listening to some Gordon Lightfoot last night and was blown away by one of his songs, "Protocol". It's on Summertime Dreams (same album as "The Wreck"). Doesn't this sound like something Richard would write? Norman Protocol-- Gordon Lightfoot (C) 1976. Who are these ones who would lead us now To the sound of a thousand guns Who'd storm the gates of hell itself To the tune of a single drum? Where are the girls of the neighborhood bars Whose loves were lost at sea In the hills of France and on German soil From Saigon to Wounded Knee Who come from long lines of soldiers Whose duty was fulfilled In the words of a warriors will And protocol? Where are the boys in their coats of blue Who flew when their eyes were blind? Was God in town for the Roman games? Was he there when the deals were signed? Who are the kings in their coats of mail Who road by the cross to die? Did they all go down into worthiness? Is it wrong for a king to cry? And who are these ones who would have us now Whose presence in concealed Whose nature is revealed In a time bomb? Last of all you old seadogs Who travel after whale You'd storm the gates of hell itself For the taste of a mermaid's tail Who come from long lines of skippers Whose duty was fulfilled In the words of a warrior's will And protocol. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 17:28:50 -0700 (PDT) From: adam plunkett Subject: [RS] Transit's meaning I do not know who wrote that they saw "Transit" to be religiously overbearing but thank you. It led to think about the song in ways I hadn't. That, I guess, is a sign at what a talented writer he is. I first heard the song at the 1999 Boston Folk Festival. The song was very new. The song blew me away. I am sure everyone here has had an experience at a concert with a song that they always will remember; that happened for me with "Transit". I never saw much religion in it. Yes, the main character is of a religious nature but I saw her as more of a symbol of foregiveness and the antithesis of the rage in the "real world". Also, I never see it to be as humorous as others do. Yes its very funny but that humor really hits hard when you het to the last few verses. Jesus, I love that song. :) And the use of slant ryhme is great.... *steps off the podium* - -Adam Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 21:51:57 -0400 From: Joe Lanzalotto Subject: Re: [RS] Imagine life so boring I LOVE the Beatles, but if any one of them had made their best solo LP as their first release as an unknown artist (never having been made famous by the BEATLES), would they have ever been allowed to make a second? Joe Bill Chmelir wrote: > "Imagine no possessions > It isn't hard to do > Nothing to kill or die for > And no religion too" > > - ---John Lennon > > Speaking of religion, this will probably be considered sacrilege by some on > the list. > > I've always liked Imagine and most of John Lennon's music. However, after > reading the lines above rather than listening to them, I've reappraised > Imagine. I can't help thinking what a boring world Lennon's imagined world > would be. Give me a break John. You were a great musician, and I know you > were a dreamer, but your lyrics in Imagine imply you were skipping around in > lala land in the early 1970s. > > I'm sure that many of the same people who thought that George H.W. Bush was > out of touch with America because he wasn't aware of bar code scanners at > the supermarket think that Lennon's lyrics in Imagine are absolutely > brilliant. Imagine could appropriately serve as an anthem for people > everywhere who are completely out of touch with reality. If Lennon believed > in the lyrics he wrote, he hardly believed "in that reality" or any reality. > > Personally, I like having things in life worth dying for. Imagine a life so > devoid of meaning you have nothing worth risking your life for. A life > devoid of true passion. What about the freedom for those you love to pursue > happiness? Aren't they worth risking our lives and possibly dying for? I > think so. > > Killing and religion, John? The 20th century saw secular regimes (USSR, > China, Cambodia, etc...) murder multiple times more people in the name of > the state (about 100 million) than have been killed in the name of religion > through all of time. If Lennon wished to indict the greatest evil of his > lifetime he should have changed that line to "and no communist states too". > I'm not a religious person, but I recognize that the world would be a darker > place for the vast majority of it's population without religion. Religion > is a very good thing in the lives of billions of people. > > I suppose it would be easier for me to understand John's espousing the > virtues of no need for possessions if I lived in a Brownstone on the upper > east side. Lennon had more talent on his left pinky toe at age 18 than I > have in my whole body at age 29 and so financial reality is an issue for me > but was not for him around the time he wrote Imagine. > > The thing I love most about Richard's songs is that they deal with real > people in real life situations. They involve real struggle, real fear, real > love, real beliefs. I guess I'm grounded in and enjoy reality. John Lennon > was a great musician. His death was very sad and horrible. But if I read > the above four line excerpt from Imagine and didn't know that he had written > it, I would think the author was either just being silly or that the author > was a child. Maybe a grown up who had been doing too much acid. Ahh... > Altered reality.... Maybe that's it. > > Peace > Bill - Somewhere Near the surface of Planet Earth > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.380 / Virus Database: 213 - Release Date: 7/24/2002 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 02:49:32 GMT From: ptpower@juno.com Subject: [RS] Re: Imagine life so boring Joe wrote: >>I LOVE the Beatles, but if any one of them had made their best solo LP as their first release as an unknown artist (never having been made famous by the BEATLES), would they have ever been allowed to make a second?<< Well, I've never been *that* much of a Beatles fan, and "All Things Must Pass" kept me coming back for more of George Harrison -- the *only* former Beatle whose music I bought. Pat . ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 22:44:45 -0700 From: "Sandra J. Smith" Subject: Re: [RS] Transit's meaning Adam wrote: >And the use of slant ryhme is great.... Ummmm, what's a slant rhyme? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 08:35:16 +0200 From: "Ronnie de Champs" Subject: Re: [RS] Imagine life so boring Bill wrote a lenghty peace denouncing Lennon's Imagine lyrics. I think what John meant to say with these 4 lines is that lots of people get killed because other people want to possess what they have or because other people think their religion is better and therefore merits killing the non-believers. If people would put less emphasis on possesions or religion the world could be more peachful. I do not think he wanted to abolish religion or possesions he just said to try and imagine what the world could be like if you didn't fight about these things Ronnie >From: "Bill Chmelir" >Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org >To: "Jesse Gormley" , >Subject: [RS] Imagine life so boring >Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 17:36:21 -0600 > >"Imagine no possessions >It isn't hard to do >Nothing to kill or die for >And no religion too" > >- ---John Lennon > >Speaking of religion, this will probably be considered sacrilege by some on >the list. > >I've always liked Imagine and most of John Lennon's music. However, after >reading the lines above rather than listening to them, I've reappraised >Imagine. I can't help thinking what a boring world Lennon's imagined world >would be. Give me a break John. You were a great musician, and I know you >were a dreamer, but your lyrics in Imagine imply you were skipping around >in >lala land in the early 1970s. > >I'm sure that many of the same people who thought that George H.W. Bush was >out of touch with America because he wasn't aware of bar code scanners at >the supermarket think that Lennon's lyrics in Imagine are absolutely >brilliant. Imagine could appropriately serve as an anthem for people >everywhere who are completely out of touch with reality. If Lennon >believed >in the lyrics he wrote, he hardly believed "in that reality" or any >reality. > >Personally, I like having things in life worth dying for. Imagine a life >so >devoid of meaning you have nothing worth risking your life for. A life >devoid of true passion. What about the freedom for those you love to >pursue >happiness? Aren't they worth risking our lives and possibly dying for? I >think so. > >Killing and religion, John? The 20th century saw secular regimes (USSR, >China, Cambodia, etc...) murder multiple times more people in the name of >the state (about 100 million) than have been killed in the name of religion >through all of time. If Lennon wished to indict the greatest evil of his >lifetime he should have changed that line to "and no communist states too". >I'm not a religious person, but I recognize that the world would be a >darker >place for the vast majority of it's population without religion. Religion >is a very good thing in the lives of billions of people. > >I suppose it would be easier for me to understand John's espousing the >virtues of no need for possessions if I lived in a Brownstone on the upper >east side. Lennon had more talent on his left pinky toe at age 18 than I >have in my whole body at age 29 and so financial reality is an issue for me >but was not for him around the time he wrote Imagine. > >The thing I love most about Richard's songs is that they deal with real >people in real life situations. They involve real struggle, real fear, >real >love, real beliefs. I guess I'm grounded in and enjoy reality. John >Lennon >was a great musician. His death was very sad and horrible. But if I read >the above four line excerpt from Imagine and didn't know that he had >written >it, I would think the author was either just being silly or that the author >was a child. Maybe a grown up who had been doing too much acid. Ahh... >Altered reality.... Maybe that's it. > >Peace >Bill - Somewhere Near the surface of Planet Earth > > > > > >--- >Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.380 / Virus Database: 213 - Release Date: 7/24/2002 _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ End of shindell-list-digest V4 #253 ***********************************