From: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org (shindell-list-digest) To: shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Subject: shindell-list-digest V3 #445 Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org Sender: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk shindell-list-digest Saturday, December 8 2001 Volume 03 : Number 445 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [RS] Bill Collecting [RockinRonD@aol.com] Re: [RS] Sonora [SMOKEY596@aol.com] Re: [RS] Courier Stuff [Bill Eley ] Re: [RS] Bill Collecting [Bill Eley ] [RS] Misc. Courier thoughts . . . [Rongrittz@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 08:59:19 EST From: RockinRonD@aol.com Subject: [RS] Bill Collecting In a message dated 12/7/2001 7:22:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, Bill Eley queried in my direction: >>> I'm curious about why you think "Out There" is so flawed compared to > "Courier". Are you talking production, song selection, venue, performance, > or what? << In some ways, all of the above. But overall, I think the most glaring fault is that the performances of the songs just aren't up to snuff on Dar's Live CD. I've been to more than a few Dar shows and she definitely has nights when she's ON and nights when she's, well, not so ON. There's too much of the latter on this CD, IMO. >>Although I think "Courier" is excellent, I think Richard's voice is a little nasally on some of the songs<< I think this would be a fair criticism of the record if one were to be somewhat picayune about things, but I actually like Richard's nasaly singing voice; in many ways it distinguishes him. Besides, he sings with such passion and urgency on this record that I'm more than a little "Willin'" to overlook this minor flaw, if that's what it is. >>If you didn't dislike Ellis Paul so much, we could throw that live cd into the comparison :-)<< I think you've got me confused with the "other" Ron (does this mean you don't respect my opionions?) :-) I actually LOVE Ellis Paul's live CD. It got a ton of play in my car stereo and in my portable on the LIRR on the way to NYC. As for the wrath of God...My advice to you is to stick around, don't take any long trips. There are Shindell Listers everywhere. Maybe even Afghanistan. RappinRonD the "Other" Ron ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 11:37:44 EST From: SMOKEY596@aol.com Subject: Re: [RS] Sonora Man, I would love to buy more copies of the Sonora Sessions. I can't believe these were left off the "real" CD. I know someone posted that you could buy it on another site, but I checked that out and it was actually "buy Courier and Sonora for this price". Crud. Any chance...any chance at all that we could buy more of these??? Hmmmm?? SMOKEY Atlantic Canada's Artists and Artisans www.gathering-of-artists.ca Subj: [RS] Er, Courier one more time Date: 12/8/01 12:34:58 AM US Eastern Standard Time From: lndavis@cnmnetwork.com (Lisa Davis & family) Sender: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Reply-to: shindell-list@smoe.org To: shindell-list@smoe.org I would like to concur with the vote in favor of "Sonora Sessions." THAT is a no-skip. Courier, while beautifully recorded and I can't say "overproduced"!:) isn't because naturally it includes Arrowhead which is personally one of my least favorites, Kenworth which while fun is a song that doesn't deserve to be on more than one CD, really, Willin' is ok, sure, but just another cover, Richard-lite, ...... SO, I would like to thank the folks for Sonora Sessions because we're lucky to have it! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 11:16:27 -0600 From: Bill Eley Subject: Re: [RS] Courier Stuff I wonder how Richard avoided having *that* included? Though I would guess that some would argue that AYHN is the Shindell equivalent (and remains one of my favorites). > From: SMOKEY596@aol.com > Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org > Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2001 23:17:19 EST > To: shindell-list@smoe.org > Subject: Re: [RS] Courier Stuff > >>>> . I adore "Sonora Sessions". Hopefully this minor critique > won't bring the wrath of God or Khan or anyone else on me.<<< > > Bill, I love this one too...why are all my favorites on the "bonus" CD? :-) > Hey, at least "3,000 Miles" isn't on either one of them. > > SMOKEY > Atlantic Canada's Artists and > Artisans > www.gathering-of-artists.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 11:29:13 -0600 From: Bill Eley Subject: Re: [RS] Bill Collecting While I have been know to mix up my "Ron's", I could've sworn it was you that didn't like Ellis. But you should know :-) > From: RockinRonD@aol.com > Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org > Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 08:59:19 EST > To: shindell-list@smoe.org > Subject: [RS] Bill Collecting > > In a message dated 12/7/2001 7:22:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, Bill Eley > queried in my direction: > >>>> I'm curious about why you think "Out There" is so flawed compared to >> "Courier". Are you talking production, song selection, venue, performance, >> or what? << > > In some ways, all of the above. But overall, I think the most glaring > fault is that the performances of the songs just aren't up to snuff on Dar's > Live CD. I've been to more than a few Dar shows and she definitely has nights > when she's ON and nights when she's, well, not so ON. There's too much of > the latter on this CD, IMO. > >>> Although I think "Courier" is excellent, I think Richard's voice is a little > nasally on some of the songs<< > > I think this would be a fair criticism of the record if one were to be > somewhat picayune about things, but I actually like Richard's nasaly singing > voice; in many ways it distinguishes him. Besides, he sings with such > passion and urgency on this record that I'm more than a little "Willin'" to > overlook this minor flaw, if that's what it is. > >>> If you didn't dislike Ellis Paul so much, we could throw that live cd into > the comparison :-)<< > > I think you've got me confused with the "other" Ron (does this mean you > don't respect my opionions?) :-) I actually LOVE Ellis Paul's live CD. It > got a ton of play in my car stereo and in my portable on the LIRR on the way > to NYC. > As for the wrath of God...My advice to you is to stick around, don't take > any long trips. There are Shindell Listers everywhere. Maybe even > Afghanistan. > > RappinRonD the "Other" Ron ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 13:22:27 EST From: Rongrittz@aol.com Subject: [RS] Misc. Courier thoughts . . . << it includes Arrowhead which is personally one of my least favorites, Kenworth which while fun is a song that doesn't deserve to be on more than one CD >> Well, here's my take on it, if for no other reason than to underscore the fact that they make vanilla AND chocolate for a reason. For me, "Arrowhead" is absolutely the highlight of the CD. The zippy arrangement on "Blue Divide" never did much for me, but this one . . . oh my gosh . . . it's Denny McDermott's shining moment. Although, the drums seem to be mixed a little subdued for my taste . . . his drumming seems even more powerful on the Emelin boot tape I have, for chrissakes. And "Kenworth" should be a godsend for anyone who thought that the pedal steel guitar made it sound too "country" on "Sparrows Point." In fact, "Kenworth" contains my single favorite note (how's THAT for detailed?) on the CD . . . Lucy's harmony note on the word "those" at the 2:43 mark in the song. See, when she usually sings harmony on that song, she stays on the E note. But here, she jumps up to a G, which I absolutely adore. Of course, just so show that nothin' ain't perfect, can someone tell me why the acoustic guitar is completely buried in the mix on "Kenworth?" Other things, while I'm on a roll . . . after giving it some thought, I really think that including "Sandy" instead of "Sonora's Death Row" was a lousy idea. Don't get me wrong, "Sandy" provided a wonderfully spontaneous moment at the Saturday Emelin show . . . with Richard having teased us about it earlier in the evening, and then coming back AFTER the final encore (when the house lights were already up and people were already leaving) to nail the song. But it doesn't work nearly as well on the CD as it did that night. And to me, with "Sonora" being a pretty regular inclusion in Richard's sets . . . as well as being a more "Shindellian" song . . . I think it should have made the main CD, with "Sandy" relegated to the EP. I guess I can understand, though, from a marketing standpoint, how having a Bruce Springsteen song on the disc might be a good thing. And boy, I wish there was a way for "Wisteria" to have made the main disc, too. There are already SIX songs from "Sparrows Point" on the disc (more than half the disc), so I certainly would have preferred "Wisteria" to, say, "Memory of You." Now for my last minor gripe . . . what's with the inclusion of a studio recording of "Reunion Hill?" The liner notes make it clear that it's not from any of the live shows, and it clearly has a different sounding feel from the rest of the disc . . . it jumps out in a very strange way. Richard NAILED the song at the Emelin, so was this done just so there'd be a way to get Larry Campbell onto the CD? Hey, I'm happy that we now have a recording that's more intimate than the Royal Canadian Fife & Drum Marching Band Halftime Show arrangement on the "RH" disc, but this seems a little bit like cheating. Still and all, there's no doubt that this is one of my top five CDs of the year. (Not RG's #1, you say? Well, I just can't make a disc of what's essentially old music my top choice . . . and besides, Dave & Tracy, Lori McKenna and Kris Delmhorst already occupy my top three spots). RG ------------------------------ End of shindell-list-digest V3 #445 ***********************************