From: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org (shindell-list-digest) To: shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Subject: shindell-list-digest V2 #127 Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org Sender: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk shindell-list-digest Sunday, June 18 2000 Volume 02 : Number 127 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [RS] Once Again [RockinRonD@aol.com] [RS] My Closing Argument [RockinRonD@aol.com] [RS] way out there now [Sdgold60@aol.com] [RS] Newport Folk Festival ["Joy Munsey" ] [RS] Sunburned and cheery after Clearwater (the post that has nothing to do with Clearwater) [Katie Mahoney] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2000 08:39:55 EDT From: RockinRonD@aol.com Subject: [RS] Once Again In a message dated 6/18/2000 5:04:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Vanessa writes: << "Richard and Lucy are not on Dar's new record"--that's an interesting and valid tidbit for this list. "Something devious and bad must be up"--not so interesting, not so valid. >> I never once used terms such as "devious" or "bad." I simply heard some news I thought was interesting and passed it along to a group I thought would be as curious as I was. Further, I expressed my opinions on why. I never stated anything as fact. Ron ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2000 08:53:01 EDT From: RockinRonD@aol.com Subject: [RS] My Closing Argument In a message dated 6/18/2000 5:04:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time, RonG blitzkriegs: << We all know that AGF is trying to take a different approach with Dar's career, but I can't believe that after the incredible dedication and support that Dar, Richard and Lucy have shown each other over the last several years, that anyone could smell a rat over her selection (or non-selection) of harmony singers on her new CD. >> Dar's venues thus far have leaned more toward downtown-style rock & roll clubs. << Like Outpost in the Burbs and Passim and Iron Horse and the Bottom Line? A quick look at Musi-Cal shows festivals, state parks and colleges. Hardly "downtown-style rock and roll clubs." It's not like she's been playing the Bowery Ballroom or the Mercury Lounge. >> Given the talented songwriter Richard is, he certainly is not wanting for material. << Really? He's always been vocal about what an arduous process writing is for him, and his CDs have always been long-term labors of labor. It's well-known that he has no back-log of unrecorded songs except "Home Team" and "She's in Spain" . . . basically everything he writes gets on his CDs. "Reunion Hill" included three cover songs, and "Somewhere Near Paterson" included two . . . two and a half if you include "Summer Reel." Plus, "Merritt Parkway" was essentially "filler." And it's not like he bumped one of his *own* songs to include "Calling the Moon" . . . if it hadn't made the CD, the plan was to include "Shades of Black, Shades of Blue," which was also a cover. >> In my view, including a good friend's song on one of your own records is a definite homage of sorts. << I completely agree, but particularly this close to the "official" end of Cry3, there needs to reach a point where you let the connection die for a while. I'll repeat what I said before: putting their careers and tours on the back burner for as long as they did was about as much of an homage as could be expected. Not putting a good friend's voice on one of your own records is hardly an insult to that friend, nor indicative of behind-the-scenes monkey business worthy of Grassy Knoll conspiracy theories. >> And given how wonderful Richard harmonizes with Dar, to say nothing of Lucy in the mix, why wouldn't Dar include them? Will she find better people to harmonize with on the new record anywhere? Doubt it. <<<< Well, there's always the distinct possibility that maybe these particular songs don't call for their harmonies. Or that maybe after the C3 project, she simply wanted to work with other people. It's not like Richard and Lucy are the only singers in the business, ya know. Nor are they Dar's only musical pals. Heck, if she doesn't have the Nields -- who are older and dearer friends -- on her new CD, will that also be cause for suspicion? >> No, I think there was a conscious effort on someone's part to distance Dar from Richard and Lucy. << And what if the "someone" was Dar herself? I absolutely do not believe for one moment that if Dar wanted Richard and/or Lucy on her CD, that someone would have the authority to tell her no. If Dar's career has shown us anything -- and I'm sure Charlie can (and hopefully will) back us up on this - -- it's that she's anything BUT a marketing puppet, particularly when it comes to The Music Itself. Mr. Hunter . . . insight please. >> I smell marketing angst. << Smell what you will, but sometimes where's there's smoke, there's not always fire. Sheesh! All I did was pass along an interesting bit of news along with my personal opinion as to what might be up. For that I'm made out to be a Post Office letter-bomb wielding, Oswald-did-not-act-alone, paranoid conspiracy-theorist hell-bent on exposing Dar for being some backstabbing, ego-maniacal hussy? And that every single line I wrote had to be dissected and dissed? What are we in court? Fine. I'll keep all the inside info I get to myself. As it was, I didn't give up everything. There are some people very close to this situation who are hugely disappointed and a bit hurt by this turn of events. But I'll end it here. Ron Ron ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2000 07:10:39 EDT From: Sdgold60@aol.com Subject: [RS] way out there now hey ronG i am in full agreement about the records filler and dars control of her career - - i think that My Love will Follow you with dar and Lucy is great - i heard it as party of crycrycry and I adore the song that is filler too- meaning it was a prepared song- in the can ready to go - no pain Great gain i will also guess that Calling the Moon is a gift from a good friend if I wanted to sell my records, I would love a song penned by dar williams on it...its a trade off for one version of MAry Magdelene and also for NORA and now lets impeach someone to even the score again.. grassy knoll- it was a single shooter.. and Dr martin Luther - Castro why is that little boy still in a mansion with horses in washington?? who has the rights to the movie of the week - his dad or miami and just because I am a socialworker all week doesnt mean i analyse my friends...boy whatta song that would make... sharonG off to clearwater again ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2000 07:17:23 -0400 From: "Joy Munsey" Subject: [RS] Newport Folk Festival Hi I'm not sure if it's been posted yet, but Richard is playing with his band again at the Newport Folk Festival on August 6th. Joy ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2000 18:43:52 -0400 From: Katie Mahoney Subject: [RS] Sunburned and cheery after Clearwater (the post that has nothing to do with Clearwater) Oh dear god. I just caught up on 19 Richard-lists . . . do you have any idea what it was like to read the ENTIRE guitar discussion in a span of about fifteen minutes? Now I can't think about anything else! John Andrew Clary said: >I am really appreciating all of you -- >how this community conducts it's >friendly discussions and has made >me feel welcome. I was actually thinking about that just this morning . . . while I dearly love the Dar-list, I think this list is my favorite of the, um, six I'm on. (Oh no, I'm turning into RonG! {Heh, did I say "oh no"? Silly me, I meant, er, well, that is . . . } But I console myself with the fact that one of the lists only gets ten to fifteen posts a week, one of the lists I skim the subject lines and then delete, and one of the lists is on my other account. So that only leaves three, right? Right?) I mean, on what other list do you find people participating in a discussion who decide that their discussion has gone on for long enough, gently advise each other that out of courtesy to the other listers they should maybe take it off-list, and then considerately change the topic? It's almost ridiculous. sharong said: >how can you not use christopher >walken in a richard shindell song Ooh, he would be creepy as the "By Now" character. Although I've always had a soft spot for him ever since I saw "Sarah Plain and Tall." Dave, trying to revive his lame-o thread on yet another list (okay, so I kinda like it, and was looking forward to hearing peoples' responses) asked us for our favorite chords, and the actor who would portray the aforementioned chord. I have to say, before going any further, that I'm not particularly fond of D minor. I don't know why. I just think it's pretty wussy. I'll take a nice deep E minor any day over that whiny little four-string D minor. But that doesn't really answer his question. Let's see . . . favorite chord . . . favorite chord . . . There's one chord that I really like, which I learned from playing "Angel In Manhattan." I'll now proceed to set every musician's teeth on edge with my non-technical description of it. It's that C chord where you play D on the B string instead of C. Um, C9? I don't have the slightest idea. I like it much better than A-sus-something and E-whojamawhatzit, the other funny chords in that song (welcome to Katie's World of Guitar, where all chords are either real chords or funny chords). But I don't know who would play it. Someone young and fresh, a little naive and a little hesitant. Any ideas? (Okay, Dave, now can I get my ten dollars for playing along?) Pat said: >I'm not as fond of Dar's vocal on the CryCryCry >Cd as I am on the live cut of the song featured >on "Che Lives," a compilation CD put together by >Young / Hunter and Signature Sounds Records >a couple of years ago Me either. I taped that version off the radio when she was on WRSI the night before starting her End of the Summer tour. I find the Cry Cry Cry version a little darker and a little more dull. I'm very fond of the Che Lives version; I like it at least as much as Richard's. I'd love to hear Lucy's version sometime. And don't even get me started on Peter's version of "The Ocean" (or rather, his *alleged* version, which I have NEVER. EVER. heard . . . grr . . . ). Okay, I'm done. I had a glorious time at Clearwater yesterday . . . hi to sharong, and hi to Norman (who we called hi to, but I don't think you heard us, and we had to hurry to catch up with our friends . . . so "hi" for yesterday :-)). Ciao! Katie ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ End of shindell-list-digest V2 #127 ***********************************