From: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org (shindell-list-digest) To: shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Subject: shindell-list-digest V4 #251 Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org Sender: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk shindell-list-digest Friday, August 30 2002 Volume 04 : Number 251 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [RS] Re: spirituality in music [Elizabeth ] [RS] Other Worlds [RockinRonD@aol.com] [RS] spirit in the sky, er, spirituality from the folkies [Jimcolbert@aol] [RS] Re: . . . spirituality from the folkies [Rongrittz@aol.com] [RS] Re: Religion in RS music [ffrink@lm.NOSPAM.com] Re: [RS] Re: Lennon lyrics (no RS) ["Ronnie de Champs" ] [RS] Just one more ["Shelley DePaul" ] Re: [RS] Re: . . . spirituality from the folkies [Deb Woodell Subject: [RS] Re: spirituality in music Roxylee wrote: > Just trying to be sensitive to the people here > who mentioned they are > uncomfortable and could be offended hearing so > much christian content. I think there's a big difference between uncomfortable and offended, at least to me. They come from entirely different places. As someone who's not a Christian (or anything else in particular, religiously) I can sometimes feel uncomfortable with explicitly Christian content in media, whether that's music or TV or whatever. I feel uncomfortable because Christianity is such a dominant part of our culture, and so being reminded of that can create a feeling of differentness, of being outside of something, that is not very pleasant. However, I would not be offended by any religious content unless I felt it was being used in a destructive way, which is certainly not what Richard's music does. It has always seemed to me that Richard uses the religious and spiritual themes in his songs to express his own doubts and beliefs and whatnot. I'm offended by something because I think it's wrong and probably harmful. I'm uncomfortable about something because it touches on something inside of me in an unpleasant way. For what it's worth, I'm made more uncomfortable on occasion by the Richard songs that are country-music-ish than I am by the Christian-themed ones. I really don't like country music! LOL Elizabeth, delurking momentarily ===== Elizabeth ~~~ "Our existence deforms the universe. *That's* responsibility."--Neil Gaiman Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 08:40:01 EDT From: RockinRonD@aol.com Subject: [RS] Other Worlds In a message dated 8/29/2002 10:45:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Elaine is dead on the money with: >>> Isn't it wonderful that there's an artist, in our midst, that provides us > with such food for thought? We can let our imaginations soar, we can lift > ourselves spiritually, and we can even be literal if we choose to. What a > boring world it would be if there was room for only one interpretation. > Thanks Richard.<< Imagine trying to apply any of the above to MOST "ARTISTS" on the VMA Awards show last night. How ridiculous would that be? So much for the so-called musical establishment. Glad I don't subscribe to it in any way, shape or form. Bah! RockinRonD ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 08:50:19 EDT From: Jimcolbert@aol.com Subject: [RS] spirit in the sky, er, spirituality from the folkies In a message dated 8/30/02 4:56:46 AM Eastern Daylight Time, owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org writes: > By the way, I hear "Next Best Western" as being about doubt, and lack of > faith, whether temporary or not. "I wish I could believe" is the > defining line. I also think that as a human being, whether or not > Christian, you can understand where the narrator is coming from. > From my listening point of view, Roxy nailed that one. To me, it's that plea, the longing for understanding and faith that defines the protagonist. He's searching for truth and enlightenment...maybe figuring there is more, but not ready for a leap of faith yet. He might just be dipping his toes over the edge...or just thinking that maybe he should... What would new listeners think if Richard did a more "politically correct" set designed to be mostly unoffensive to everyone's point of view? I think the spirituality is part and parcel of who he is and how he writes, and to remove that is to gentrify his writing. I mean, you can almost always find someone who can be offended by something in these times ("TV light? TV's what's wrong with our society today!" (: ) but it's part of who he is musically. Beginning writers are usually taught you write what you know...or write what you feel... obviously Richard has been a man of deep faith at times in his life, wherever his is now, and it's part of what he knows and feels- and I think that's why it can be so honest and moving. Now out of curiosity, what other folkies seem to write with a similar sense of spirituality without actually writing songs of worship? I always got the same kind of underlying feeling in some of Jesse Winchester's work; Leonard Cohen is an obvious one, ditto Bob Franke (although he also does songs of praise); Carrie Newcomer used to have a lot of this feeling to her work... others? jim colbert bellefonte pa ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 09:04:24 -0400 From: Rongrittz@aol.com Subject: [RS] Re: . . . spirituality from the folkies >> Now out of curiosity, what other folkies seem to write with a similar sense of spirituality without actually writing songs of worship? << More than anyone, David Wilcox comes to mind. RG ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 09:50:57 -0400 (EDT) From: ffrink@lm.NOSPAM.com Subject: [RS] Re: Religion in RS music Quoting Janet Cinelli > Subject: Re: [RS] Imagine > > I meant to say, he didn't say imagine no God, he said > imagine no religion. I stand corrected! > Janet > > > > > Actually all Lennon said was Imagine there's no > > religion. Again, a separate > > matter. > > > > Norman I think John Lennon had a song on the Plastic Ono Band record that had lyrics something like 'I dont' belive in Jesus, I don't beleive in Buddha, etc, etc" Maybe the title was 'God'? It's been a while. Anyway, I know he recorded that record while engaged in Arthur Janov's Primal Scream therapy. Always home, Mike ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 16:15:28 +0200 From: "Ronnie de Champs" Subject: Re: [RS] Re: Lennon lyrics (no RS) Mike wrote: >I think John Lennon had a song on the Plastic Ono Band record that had >lyrics >something like >'I dont' belive in Jesus, I don't beleive in >Buddha, etc, etc" Maybe the title was 'God'? It's been a while. Anyway, >I know he recorded that >record while engaged in Arthur Janov's Primal >Scream therapy. You're right Mike, title of that song is 'God'. Not that well known as 'Imagine' offcourse. In the song he mentions a lot of concepts / peopel he does not believe in: I don't believe in magic I don't believe in I-ching I don't believe in Bible I don't believe in Tarot I don't believe in Hitler I don't believe in Jesus I don't believe in Kennedy I don't believe in Buddha I don't believe in Mantra I don't believe in Gita I don't believe in Yoga I don't believe in Kings I don't believe in Elvis I don't believe in Zimmerman I don't believe in Beatles I just believe in me...and that reality Ronnie _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 11:07:34 -0400 From: "Shelley DePaul" Subject: Re: [RS] Re: . . . spirituality from the folkies > >> Now out of curiosity, what other folkies seem to write with a similar sense of spirituality without actually writing songs of worship? << > > More than anyone, David Wilcox comes to mind. > > RG Michelle Bloom is a really interesting new artist of this type. I think Wilcox has been promoting her a bit. Anyone heard her? Most spiritual guy I can come up with is Tom Waits, ("Chocolate Jesus", and others) ; ) David Massengill (Jesus the Fugitive Prince ; the Noah song, etc) Love Patty Larkin's "Mary Magdalene" Ricky Lee Jones "Horses" and others Townes has some pretty sublime songs Greg Brown "Billy From the Hills" ; "Maria"...too many to mention Absolutely love Gabriel Yacoub (Richard's friend, I think, - recorded "You Stay Here")the entire album, "Bel", is amazing esp. "L'eau" (Water) (brush up on your French) Dave Carter (Bless his soul) O. K. I give up. I'll be here all day on this one. Shelley Let's see... Leonard Cohen Randy Newman........... - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, August 30, 2002 9:04 AM Subject: [RS] Re: . . . spirituality from the folkies > >> Now out of curiosity, what other folkies seem to write with a similar sense of spirituality without actually writing songs of worship? << > > More than anyone, David Wilcox comes to mind. > > RG ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 10:12:06 -0500 From: TRoman Subject: [RS] W32.Klez.E removal tools W32.Klez.E is a dangerous virus that spread through email. Kaspersky give you the W32.Klez.E removal tools For more information,please visit http://www.Kaspersky.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 11:35:25 -0400 From: "Shelley DePaul" Subject: [RS] Just one more Oh, and Geoff Bartley! Sorry, but I couldn't leave out dear Geoff. Put him near the top somewhere. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 09:57:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Deb Woodell Subject: Re: [RS] Re: . . . spirituality from the folkies > Now out of curiosity, what other folkies seem to > write with a similar sense of spirituality without > actually writing songs of worship? << Two quick ones that come to mind....Deb: Indigo Girls ("Closer to Fine," especially) Rosanne Cash (some songs on her "The Wheel" cd) ===== You can take the rock band away from the girl and think you've tamed her. But, she'll just pick up an acoustic, give you that innocent little girl grin, quietly laugh and say? "Nevah!" Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of shindell-list-digest V4 #251 ***********************************