From: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org (shindell-list-digest) To: shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Subject: shindell-list-digest V3 #20 Reply-To: shindell-list@smoe.org Sender: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk shindell-list-digest Monday, January 22 2001 Volume 03 : Number 020 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [RS] Re: Live Album [Tom926@aol.com] [RS] Amen to Eliza [Deb Woodell ] [RS] Live RS and ticket prices ["Eley, Bill" ] RE: [RS] Calif Ticket Prices & Live Album ["Jane Perron" Subject: [RS] Amen to Eliza Tom wrote, >Am looking forward to Eliza Carthy's new cd. > "Red Rice" was amazing. Oooh, yeah! I knew who she was when I picked it up, had enough $$ for a double cd (a rarity) and was blown away! Deb Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. http://auctions.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:41:16 -0600 From: "Eley, Bill" Subject: [RS] Live RS and ticket prices How can I pass up an opportunity like this? My non-SNP picks would be: Sparrows Point Are You Happy Now Kenworth of My Dreams On a Sea of Fleur-de-Lis Nora By Now Summer Wind, Cotton Dress Fishing Mary Magdalene Cold Missouri Waters Shades of Gray The Things That I Have Seen Arrowhead Concerning ticket prices - we usually pay $12-15 to hear Richard here in Houston, which seems very reasonable (I think he probably gets the entire gate at the Mucky Duck, which would be about $1500). That's the same price for Ellis Paul, John Gorka, Lucy, etc. They'll charge as little as $8 for someone fairly unknown, and as much as $25 for Willis Alan Ramsey, Ray Wylie Hubbard, or Kinky Friedman (who rarely performs live). Bill ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:56:35 -0500 From: "Jane Perron" Subject: RE: [RS] Calif Ticket Prices & Live Album Smokey, Thanks for the info ..... inquiring minds want to know. I like this guy, he makes sense. Jane - -----Original Message----- From: owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org [mailto:owner-shindell-list-digest@smoe.org]On Behalf Of Young/Hunter Mgt. Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2001 10:30 AM To: shindell-list@smoe.org Subject: [RS] Calif Ticket Prices & Live Album > Wrote John: Wow! I just purchased my tix for May 10 at the Freight & > Salvage in > Berkeley. $16.50 for a Thursday night general admission!!! Sheesh. How > soon 'till he's playing arenas and the venues are charging $20 or more > for lawn seats? Dear Listers, Yes, Richard will be out in Calif for a date or two in May, as he will be attending a wedding in the Bay Area that weekend. So we booked the Freight in for the Thursday, and are now looking to fill the Tuesday and Wednesday (i.e. the 8th and 9th). Suggestions welcome. As to the price - as Richard's manager, y'all should know that I actively try to get Richard as much money as seems reasonably possible for shows, and personally, I think a Richard Shindell concert should cost about $17-20, and must say that I'm kind of surprised that this would be thought excessive. In fact, when I first read John's note, I thought he was commenting on how _reasonable_ the tickets were (as compared to things like "shed" shows!). It just shows how different people's perceptions are! Let's go over the math. These are the actual numbers.... Richard is to receive 65% of the gross, less $100 at the Freight. The capacity of the club is 238. Therefore, Richard's potential share, if all tickets sell out in advance, is $2,453. That does NOT seem excessive to me! Personally, I want to see Richard netting about $3-5000 per show; then I'll feel I've done my job well, and that the man can finally be making fair income for the years of work he's put in for comparatively little return. And remember, out of that $2,453 (and don't forget, that's only IF the show sells out), Richard has to pay us at YH, and Tim Drake, and his plane ticket, and car rental, and hotel and meals.... As for the Freight, they'll make $1475. That seems fair to me as well. Out of that they have to pay for their ads, newsletter, taxes, upkeep, paid staff...and Lord knows they've put on a lot of shows that are NOT full... I feel like it's the responsibility of the artists who now have a draw to help the artists who aren't yet known have a place to play. Would be interested in hearing other's feelings on this. Also... I'd love to hear people's thoughts on what songs from SpPt, BD and RH we should try to get on the live album (all performance variables being the same). The plan on the live album is to highlight songs from RS's "earlier" (i.e. pre-ownership of his masters) catalog -- that would mean the first three albums. Best, - - Charlie ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:37:23 EST From: SMOKEY596@aol.com Subject: RE: [RS] Calif Ticket Prices & Live Album Still, I know there's no WAY that Ellis is making that much money at his shows! And honestly, I think $20 is too high for Richard. I'd pay it, of course. :-) Did you read Ellis' board recently? He posted about recent set lists and doing new songs, etc. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:34:32 -0600 From: "Timothy Bruce" Subject: [RS] Ticket prices: Artist, venue, fans and newcomers Subject: [RS] ticket prices Sharon wrote: ....the emerlin shows... the ones where the live taping will occur are 23 dollars each...if you need to add the whitestone at $7.00 the thru way at 1.00 (one way).. gas ... food maybe.. and it adds up for those who travel to shows to...though i have never minded spending money or traveling distances for any artist.... Well I, too, am willing to travel for outstanding folk opportunities. (I put 350 miles on my car in one night last November to see Lucy in Duluth...) But, as for prices, one must really look at it organically. There is the artist, the venue, the fan, and the total newcomer. And, because of this organic dynamic, we really can't expect admission price to be standardized. Still, I was put over the edge last September when I bought four tickets to Dar's Green World tour for $110 (plus Ticketmaster fees). Because the tickets went on sale the day I left for FFRR and I didn't find out about it until after I was home, I didn't even get very good seats. Then I had to go try to "sell" three Dar newcomers on the "value" thing. The large, double balcony theatre did not sell out. On the other hand, last May I bought six tickets for Richard at the Gingko for $12 each and treated my entire party. I got five Richard newcomers in the door because the price WASN'T $25. We all know how fortunate we are to still occasionally be able to see many of our favorite performers in VERY intimate surroundings. And because each of these shows is part of an ongoing "series" with specifics printed on some flyer, the prices must be more-or-less in line with what the venue USUALLY charges for shows so as to: a) not shock or outrage the usual clientele and, b) maybe get some of them thru the door. The Gingko Coffeehouse in St. Paul cannot go charging $30 for a show no matter how highly they regard the artist. It won't work....even if they give away free scones! The non-profit Cedar Cultural Center in Minneapolis is similar...I was personally thrilled last December when it was standing room only (nearly 500 people!) for Lucy and Nina at $16 (or was it $18?) a pop with people actually turned away. That's still within reason for getting newcomers to check her out especially with my enthusiastic promotion. Today I'm struggling with $30 a pop for one of our annual private shows with the (New Orleans) Radiators playing all-acoustic on Feb 3rd. I must do a reality check because: a) I've seen them 50+ times, b) it's not just the price I must pay, it's the price I would have to ask "newcomer" friends to pay who aren't sure, and c) when these parties started, they were $20, then $25. Because Lucy and Richard and The Nields, and even Dave and Tracy are still not that well known in most parts, the management must be sensitive in setting the price, that is if you want to continue to attract newcomers to the shows. And we're all newcomers from time to time, acting on a word-of-mouth recommendation to go see someone new who's visiting our town, (Jess Klein, Louise Taylor, Chris Smither, etc.). If the price goes from $7-$12 to up over $20, I'd be less inclined to experiment. This is folk/coffeehouse reality. It's funny how, in pop music, most people routinely pay a higher price for a show in a larger room where they know they will be situated further from the artist. Guess that's the "star power" and the "big cheering throng" thing. Still, I very rarely bite when ONE TICKET for ONE SHOW costs roughly the equivalent of THREE DAYS and NIGHTS at Falcon Ridge, including camping! But go figure..... ETimothy ------------------------------ End of shindell-list-digest V3 #20 **********************************