From: owner-sheryl-crew-digest@smoe.org (sheryl-crew-digest) To: sheryl-crew-digest@smoe.org Subject: sheryl-crew-digest V6 #49 Reply-To: sheryl-crew@smoe.org Sender: owner-sheryl-crew-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-sheryl-crew-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk sheryl-crew-digest Sunday, March 23 2003 Volume 06 : Number 049 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [sheryl-crew] To Laurence & other French peeps ["Thomas Avallone" ] [sheryl-crew] Official Fan Forum ["Gregg Dempsey" Subject: [sheryl-crew] To Laurence & other French peeps Laurence, I would not call your post 'pointless'....You know how much I respect the people of France and their country, and MANY Americans feel the same way - you just don't HEAR about those people. I do think any American who wants to boycott France should sit back and think about the culture they have created for us. You see it in New Orleans, you see it in the arts, and most importantly, you see "HER" standing on Liberty Island in the New York Harbor. Tom "I've heard there's joy untold Lays open like a road In front of me" ~ PJ Harvey http://www.tav2367.20m.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 10:59:36 +0100 From: "Laurence Cazes" Subject: Re: Re: [sheryl-crew] My opinion - Hi Phyllis & Crew, First off, I want to say sorry to those on this list who do not want to hear about politics & war here. I'm partly guilty and responsible for this after going to one of those "anti-French" sites from a news site (not sure if the drudge report was a news site). I'm not aware of the previous discussions that have taken place on this list for the previous month or so - as I haven't read the messages yet, except for the very last ones. No flaming, please ;) > Isn't that the problem though? What isn't biased...if the American broadcasts > are biased in the one direction, aren't the European broadcasts biased in the > other? Where is the common ground? You say that the war is illegitimate...the > U.N. disagrees. The argument of the resolution was the time table. France & > Germany wanted to wait till God knows when (Saddam has proven he's very > capable of hiding whatever weapons he has from the U.N. inspectors). I also > don't think it's been proven that France & Russia aren't opposed because of > their oil contracts. It's something that needs to be considered. I agree with you on the fact that no one is unbiased on this subject. There has been a lot of rubbish stuff going on when I turn my TV on - about the USA - and I certainly believe you had the same kind of stuff that may have made "some" people in the USA dislike (or hate) my country just like some people in my country started to point at the USA without trying to understand the grounds of your government regarding this particular war. I think that the boycott of products from a country because they do not agree with yours is a total crap. It won't solve anything. And it just looks like you're saying "hey, they don't agree - let's show them what we can do" and in my opinion it's like the Cold War - an escalation of anti-somecountry feelings. I'm not a politician - so don't blame me for not understand things you think you understand (you may be as wrong as I am). I don't know how long the government in my country wanted to wait until a strike. The oil contracts may be one of the reasons why the government of my country do not want to support this war - I won't deny it, it may be one of their reasons. But what I can tell you, is that my government was ready to help the USA to strike Iraq a few months ago - although I do not remember this being mentioned anywhere. What happened is that President Bush looked so determined to do this war and eventually looked like one of the religious extremists (sorry - that's how most people felt in my country. We try not to mix politics and religion, and when you keep hearing speeches that look like religious speeches, it's kinda freaking you here. I, for myself, do not believe in any God - until you can prove me his existence) who have raised terrorism in the world. Please - don't flame me or anything - that's just how most people felt here in my country, including me. Maybe I am biased. But maybe you are also being misled by your government. I don't think *any* of us can answer that. Let me go back to the point I started. France would have agreed to strike Iraq, but Mr Bush's "behaviour" (not sure if this is the appropriate word) made France reconsider its postition about war. I believe my government had long talks about it, and not only did they envisage the impact a veto at a U.N. vote would have one of the relationship between France and the USA, but I also believe they envisage what might happen AFTER this war. See - Turkey is now invading North Iraq. I've just seen it on the news - there are journalists saying that it was in agreement with the US government, while other journalists are saying that the US had strictly forbidden Turkey to send their troops to Iraq. We'll see what's true later I guess. But what I mean is that this war will awake people from the surrounding countries - and actually any country where there are Muslims in the world - because Iraq and other countries are calling for a Jihad war against what they call "American terrorists". In 1991, I was 9 years old. I was too young to undertand what was going on. I still don't know what really happened at that time. I'm just gathering info about it, but it's pretty complicated :-[ That's why I am seeing the current war as a "new" thing. That could mislead me in some ways - I know, I won't deny it. << If that's what you mean, it seems like you're advocating appeasement as opposed to rooting out the problem at it's core. >> That's the problem. If we consider that there'll be more terrorism because of this war - should we have thought about it before and not do it right away without the agreement of all nations? Or should we just strike right away like the USA wanted to do? Right now, I feel concerned about security in the US. I love your country, I've always loved it - and although I am French, I have always wanted to go and live there till I die. You can imagine how sad I am when I see the relationship between those two countries I love crumbling! I do/did even intend to spend my summer vacation there - but I feel afraid of staying there and I don't know if I'll eventually come. I wish there won't be another 9/11, but if it does happen, I'd feel sorry for those whose family life would be broken. I so wish nothing like that won't ever happen again - but in a way, the US would have provoked it :-( I also wouldn't be surprised to hear about terrorist attacks in the UK as well :-( My parents wanted to go to London this summer - they are now reconsidering their trip for security reasons... As for me - yeah I'm selfish lol, like everybody - I'd like to know whether you think I would be safe if I go to the US on July. I sooo want to go, my parents don't want me to go, and I'm afraid to go. Please email me off list for this last question - and for any remark you want to make regarding what I am saying in this mail. Laurence ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 15:34:15 -0800 From: "Gregg Dempsey" Subject: [sheryl-crew] Official Fan Forum As you know, we decided to take the fan forum on Sheryl's official site offline last Wednesday because of the flamers and the hatred they were spewing. There was also a fair amount of pro-war crap, anti-war crap, and some anti-American stuff thrown in as well. Hopefully, this break will give everyone time to cool off. When the forum does go back on line - you'll find things a little different. The last three days of the forum have been deleted (all threads, except a few I specifically saved), and the last three days of new usernames have been blocked. So that means that anyone who was causing trouble is probably blocked and a few users who were causing trouble were also blocked. I'm waiting for word right now on how they want me to handle war-related topics in general. My own sense is not to allow them, but I will wait and see. Sheryl was going to put a statement out about the board being closed, but it appears they've talked her out of it. I have new moderator powers and I can now take the forum off line anytime there is a need. By the way, we'll be looking at how the war goes, but we'll probably come up around 6 pm Pacific on Monday if things stay about the same as they are now. If you have any questions, please write to me. Gregg. ------------------------------ End of sheryl-crew-digest V6 #49 ********************************