From: owner-sheryl-crew-digest@smoe.org (sheryl-crew-digest) To: sheryl-crew-digest@smoe.org Subject: sheryl-crew-digest V6 #15 Reply-To: sheryl-crew@smoe.org Sender: owner-sheryl-crew-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-sheryl-crew-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk sheryl-crew-digest Sunday, January 19 2003 Volume 06 : Number 015 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [sheryl-crew] Political entertainment [Oliver Schick ] Re: [sheryl-crew] C'Mon C'Mon questions [Oliver Schick Subject: [sheryl-crew] Political entertainment Hi Phyllis and John, Phyllis wrote: > I think a lot of the problem people have with it is that she's intentionally > trying to be so in your face about it. hm, it seems to me a lot of other people are trying to be far more 'in your face' about it and she's really just doing what those advocating war are doing. But perhaps there's an unease about people who are supposed to be entertainers voicing political views that are contrary to the 'official' line--I mean, everybody's always been happy with them entertaining troops, so as long as they're pro-war or at least have no opinion they're proper entertainers and no-one complains. Is refusing to do that dereliction of duty? > And now she's selling her "I don't > believe in your war Mr. Bush" shirts on the merchandise section of her > website...it just seems like she's profitting off of her opinion. I mean I > think she'd probably donate any proceeds to charity, but to the unfamiliar it > looks bad. I'm certain she wouldn't make money out of those sales, not only because she might fear it's bad PR. But I do think she's politically a bit naive--look at 'Subway Ride'. 'Hard to Make a Stand' really seems to me to show that Sheryl's most concerned with social, not political issues, i.e., she's most concerned with how different views can be accepted and lived on a much smaller scale than the political scale. Of course, that does not invalidate her opposition to the war, but as John says it does make people wonder whether she's anti-war or anti-Bush. (Hasn't she said quite clearly that she's the latter, as well?) > I think that's one of the things that brought her Cleveland concert down a > little...don't get me wrong, I had a great time, but she started up on the > anti war thing before safe & sound.(It was the night before the 9/11 > anniversary so maybe she just did it that night, I don't know). People paid > for a rock concert, not a political rant. Well, I guess Bob Dylan put politics into entertainment on the back of the Vietnam War--I don't know if that ever did much good, perhaps it did? At any rate, you've constantly got entertainers voicing their opinions on politics since. Personally, I don't like political entertainment very much, either, but global politics is truly in a parlous state if entertainers, of all people, feel they have to speak up ... you don't always get what you pay for, sometimes you get something extra ... > But in the end after it's all been said and done, it is her right to wear the > shirt...any attempts to say otherwise do the U.S. a great disservice. I agree completely. > And > remember the people on the forum are just a minority, just a bunch of angry > trolls. They'll go away eventually. I don't quite understand this trolling thing, the way it's developed--it seems it used to be just tongue-in-cheek, and mostly between people who know each other, but now people seem to do it for kicks? I'm sure it's because of the proliferation of forums, as opposed to mailing lists, where everybody knows each other. John wrote: > I noticed that her anti-war message appears to have been pulled from the web > site. Maybe it needed some editing. :-) Perhaps the record label decided on a different image for her? ;-^ > I respect her right to express her > opinion, but I get a distinct flavor of "I'm right, and anyone who disagrees > with me is wrong" flavor from some of the things that she has said. I haven't really been following that, but it seems to me that I get exactly that feeling from the opposition, too, and while it's not very helpful I'd say that's fair enough. > The > fact that she apparently supported intervention in the Balkans (at least, > she entertained the troops there) leads me to wonder if her opinions are > anti-war or primarily anti-Bush. I think the case with the Balkans was far more complicated than the Iraq case. I've had it explained to me at length by a friend who was an aid worker there and I still don't understand it fully. That war was also supported by more countries than just the US (and Britain). > I don't view her speaking out as particularly courageous, either. > Courageous would be an Iraqi citizen speaking out against the government. > Or one of the Kurdish kids from my daughter's high school returning to their > native country (well, that might just be foolhardy). Yes, both those things would be foolhardy. And I don't think it matters whether or not what she's doing is courageous or not. I just think there needs to be a diversity of opinion on this issue, and many other people wouldn't bother. I do think the way Hollywood stars (God forbid Sheryl ever turning into one, although she seems to be on her way) slug it out against each other come election time seems quite patronising. > That said, I'm not sure that I disagree with her. War is not a good > solution. Certainly those who see it as a "continuation of policy by other > means" (Clausewitz, IIRC) are morally wrong. There does need to be national > discussion on this issue. So I view it as a good thing when she makes her > position known. But she sounds a bit strident, and we need reason on this > point. I agree entirely, especially that war is morally wrong, and since I've only read about it I don't know how she sounds, strident or not. Oliver. - ---------------------------------------- oliver.schick@kcl.ac.uk ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 13:58:19 -0500 (EST) From: Oliver Schick Subject: [sheryl-crew] Birthday pony Hi Fee, > No clue about Abilene but I think what Sheryl says in 'Weather Channel' is a lazy 'birtday party' as opposed to pony. I can hear what you're hearing though. given that 'birthday pony' is printed in the lyrics booklet, I don't think so. It does seem to be some kind of oblique insider's reference, unless it's perhaps a semi-obscure set phrase. Oliver. - ---------------------------------------- oliver.schick@kcl.ac.uk ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 20:49:45 -0500 (EST) From: Oliver Schick Subject: Re: [sheryl-crew] C'Mon C'Mon questions Hi Phyllis, > Well Abilene is a city in Texas...however she's clearly using it as a > name...could have signifigance and maybe it's just something that she thought > would sound good in a song. I mean if you think about it, why did Sarah > Mclachlan choose the name Adia? no idea, I don't know the Sarah McLachlan song. I just suspected that perhaps Abilene was connected with some event in American history that Sheryl might be referring to. That's the only way I could think of the name having a significance. Of course, she could just be referring to a personal experience that took place in Abilene, assuming she's been there. > Not sure what's up with Birthday pony...I guess I need to pay attention to > the lyrics more. If that's what she's saying, maybe she's referring to some > kind of game like pin the tail on the donkey...although you probably can rent > ponies. That's more like what I'm thinking--'even though it's just a game'. It somehow seems to be related to the last lines of the song. To paraphrase: He doesn't want her (hanging round the birthday pony), even though it's just a game (not real?)--she claims that he knows they are the same, but doesn't admit it because he's a better faker. No idea if it really has much significance, but I thought I'd check. It did sound as if it might be just a set phrase. Oliver. - ---------------------------------------- oliver.schick@kcl.ac.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 15:47:20 -0600 From: "John D. Wilkinson, III" Subject: Re: [sheryl-crew] Birthday pony Hi, Oliver - As far as the phrase "birthday pony" is concerned, a pony is traditionally seen as the "pie-in-the-sky" birthday present that young girls ask for (this is a US thing, I think, I don't mean to sound patronising if the same is true in the UK). It would be a very special birthday gift. I can't think of any other interesting meaning for the phrase. John - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Oliver Schick" To: Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 12:58 PM Subject: [sheryl-crew] Birthday pony > > Hi Fee, > > > No clue about Abilene but I think what Sheryl says in 'Weather Channel' is a > lazy 'birtday party' as opposed to pony. I can hear what you're hearing though. > > given that 'birthday pony' is printed in the lyrics booklet, I don't think so. > It does seem to be some kind of oblique insider's reference, unless it's > perhaps a semi-obscure set phrase. > > Oliver. > ---------------------------------------- > oliver.schick@kcl.ac.uk ------------------------------ End of sheryl-crew-digest V6 #15 ********************************