From: owner-seven-seas-digest@smoe.org (seven-seas-digest) To: seven-seas-digest@smoe.org Subject: seven-seas-digest V7 #245 Reply-To: seven-seas@smoe.org Sender: owner-seven-seas-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-seven-seas-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk seven-seas-digest Wednesday, June 12 2002 Volume 07 : Number 245 Ye Olde Seven-Seas Digest and Gazzette seven-seas list wars: the long-range perspective ["Kristin F. Smith" ] RE: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? ["Zap" ] seven-seas <*`*`* Contest! *`*`*> ["Zap" ] To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with the command: unsubscribe seven-seas-digest [Unsubscribe seven-seas by itself won't work b/c you are subbed to the digest, which is a separate list known as seven-seas-digest] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 10:42:48 -0600 From: "Kristin F. Smith" Subject: seven-seas list wars: the long-range perspective Back in the days of Dante Alighieri, the young poets of Florence, all devotees of the god Love, wrote sonnets to him and to their various ladies. These poems they circulated among their friends and fellow poets for commentary - a sort of no-tech e-list. As we might expect, frequent discord erupted; slighting comments were made, offense taken, ladies insulted.. Scurrilous sonnets would fly back and forth. Occasionally, things rose to the level of fisticuffs, even swordplay. In assessing the condition of this list, perhaps we should consider the 13th Century Florentines. Kristin :) ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 19:11:52 +0100 From: "jon@ikoo" Subject: Re: seven-seas list wars: the long-range perspective > Occasionally, things rose to the level of fisticuffs, even swordplay. > In assessing the condition of this list, perhaps we should consider > the 13th Century Florentines. > > Kristin :) Are you suggesting we take cudgels and knuckle-dusters to each other? ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 09:08:29 -0700 From: Charles Pham Subject: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? just my quick two cents: I think Zap's decision to implement basic (i stress *basic* here) rules don't seem too unreasonable. Most everyone on this list is cool and abide by them already anyways...some just use the emailing list as if it was a messageboard sometimes. So these rules just clear things up a bit. No biggy. I was one of a few that unsub'd a few months ago because the list was basically unreadable...and I sub'd onto the moderated list. That list was great in theory, but then again why have a separate list for Bunnymen related content when the main list itself is supposed to be Bunnymen related to begin with. This is no attack on anyone by any means. Let's just get back on track. If there's no news and nothing to talk about, there's nothing to talk about. Simple, I think. Feel the urge to chat or just talk with one or two people directly? Use private email or Ivan's messageboards at bunnymen.com is a good place to go for that. Lastly, I don't think Zap is trying to act like God or anything. He's just cleaning things up a bit and making the list more readable. Ok, those are my thoughts. No color lines. ;) Charles ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 16:44:11 -0400 From: "Chris Adams" Subject: Re: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? Charles put it perfectly, I think. - --Chris A. Charles Pham Sent by: owner-seven-seas@smoe.org 11-Jun-2002 12:08 PM Please respond to seven-seas To: "'seven-seas@smoe.org'" cc: Subject: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? just my quick two cents: I think Zap's decision to implement basic (i stress *basic* here) rules don't seem too unreasonable. Most everyone on this list is cool and abide by them already anyways...some just use the emailing list as if it was a messageboard sometimes. So these rules just clear things up a bit. No biggy. I was one of a few that unsub'd a few months ago because the list was basically unreadable...and I sub'd onto the moderated list. That list was great in theory, but then again why have a separate list for Bunnymen related content when the main list itself is supposed to be Bunnymen related to begin with. This is no attack on anyone by any means. Let's just get back on track. If there's no news and nothing to talk about, there's nothing to talk about. Simple, I think. Feel the urge to chat or just talk with one or two people directly? Use private email or Ivan's messageboards at bunnymen.com is a good place to go for that. Lastly, I don't think Zap is trying to act like God or anything. He's just cleaning things up a bit and making the list more readable. Ok, those are my thoughts. No color lines. ;) Charles ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 23:12:28 +0100 From: "Shaz" Subject: Re: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? This has been bugging me for a few days now, cause I like the list......I've been wanting to express an opinion but Charles has indeed put it perfectly IMO. Except that I do not think messages should be changed at all by admin, although I think maybe Zap had his tongue in his cheek when he changed one of the messages, and although this may have been a bit of a wind up (?), I still do not think it is right. Now can we cut the crap and get back to 'normal' within rules? I am missing some of the chit-chat but understand that rules are made for the benefit of all and I'd rather have a list with basic rules than lots of fragmented lists....... The list is dead, long live the list ;-) let's 'Start Again'..... Shaz > Charles Pham > just my quick two cents: > > I think Zap's decision to implement basic (i stress *basic* here) rules > don't seem too unreasonable. Most everyone on this list is cool and > abide by them already anyways...some just use the emailing list as if it > was a messageboard sometimes. So these rules just clear things up a > bit. No biggy. > > I was one of a few that unsub'd a few months ago because the list was > basically unreadable...and I sub'd onto the moderated list. That list > was great in theory, but then again why have a separate list for > Bunnymen related content when the main list itself is supposed to be > Bunnymen related to begin with. This is no attack on anyone by any > means. Let's just get back on track. If there's no news and nothing to > talk about, there's nothing to talk about. Simple, I think. Feel the > urge to chat or just talk with one or two people directly? Use private > email or Ivan's messageboards at bunnymen.com is a good place to go for > that. > > Lastly, I don't think Zap is trying to act like God or anything. He's > just cleaning things up a bit and making the list more readable. > > Ok, those are my thoughts. > > No color lines. ;) > Charles ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 23:36:42 +0100 From: "MaryBellows" Subject: Re: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? Several points that seem to be missing here. There were/are two lists 1) Moderated 2) Unmoderated Zap not only changed mails he completely censored others. So why censor an unmoderated list? He bans people because they disagree with him or 'bad mouth' him. Sticks & stones sticks & stones. He is merely a caretaker let us nor him forget that. ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 22:51:23 -0400 From: "Zap" Subject: RE: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? I moderated a few individuals, who would not heed my warnings. I very politely asked them to take it off-list, and then I very Rudely told them to do it or else... It's not a matter of good vs bad, it's a matter of what NEEDS to happen To restore this list to it's mission. I asked people for help in doing so... I got told, I was the "asshole" admin. In truth it's a job nobody wants, and I take the mission of the list as More important than what some may think of me. I realize that my methods may seem tyrant like to some... And some realize that this approach was the only way it was ever going to Happen. Regardless of whether you call the list "ours" or I call it "mine" I am here to make things run smoothly and keep them on track. The moderated list was my attempt at making everyone happy... So the chatters could chat, and the fans who wanted on topic, And newsworthy bunnymen/related content could get that, effortlessly... (on their part at least, with great effort on mine) The vocal crowd on here, the very ones I was trying to please.... Took every opportunity to berate, and belittle this, when in all Truth it had ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, to do with them. I've never "banned" anyone. And by the new list rules, nobody gets bad mouthed... It's not acceptable or called for. It doesn't matter what title you throw at me: Admin, caretaker, listowner, whatnot. The mission is the mission, and THAT is what we are here for. Basically the rules were always there, I just had to put them in writing for some. What *IS* not appropriate now, *WAS* not appropriate then. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-seven-seas@smoe.org [mailto:owner-seven-seas@smoe.org] On Behalf Of MaryBellows Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2002 6:37 PM To: seven-seas@smoe.org Subject: Re: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? Several points that seem to be missing here. There were/are two lists 1) Moderated 2) Unmoderated Zap not only changed mails he completely censored others. So why censor an unmoderated list? He bans people because they disagree with him or 'bad mouth' him. Sticks & stones sticks & stones. He is merely a caretaker let us nor him forget that. ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 22:58:22 -0400 From: "Zap" Subject: RE: seven-seas New Rules: Good or bad? Thanks guys, I truly believe that a lot of people who are vocal to me Off-list, would appreciate you speaking up for them. I can certainly understand their unwillingness to jump in the fire! - -----Original Message----- On Behalf Of Chris Adams Charles put it perfectly, I think. - --Chris A. Charles Pham just my quick two cents: I think Zap's decision to implement basic (i stress *basic* here) rules don't seem too unreasonable. Most everyone on this list is cool and abide by them already anyways...some just use the emailing list as if it was a messageboard sometimes. So these rules just clear things up a bit. No biggy. I was one of a few that unsub'd a few months ago because the list was basically unreadable...and I sub'd onto the moderated list. That list was great in theory, but then again why have a separate list for Bunnymen related content when the main list itself is supposed to be Bunnymen related to begin with. This is no attack on anyone by any means. Let's just get back on track. If there's no news and nothing to talk about, there's nothing to talk about. Simple, I think. Feel the urge to chat or just talk with one or two people directly? Use private email or Ivan's messageboards at bunnymen.com is a good place to go for that. Lastly, I don't think Zap is trying to act like God or anything. He's just cleaning things up a bit and making the list more readable. Ok, those are my thoughts. No color lines. ;) Charles ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 23:32:58 -0400 From: "Zap" Subject: seven-seas <*`*`* Contest! *`*`*> Okay, in order to get things back on track and bring back the spirit of friendship.... Answer these questions (on-list): Why did you join seven-seas? When? Then tell us your favorite story involving the list or listmembers. Doesn't have to be long, a short paragraph will do. Deadline: Saturday 12noon EST I'll put up another poll, and we'll all vote for a couple favorites... The winners will get: 2 rare bunnymen cdr's each (I have several to choose from) The contest must have at least 4 entries in order to be valid (50/50 shot at the prize) ====================================== Choices! mailto:majordomo@smoe.org Subscribe/unsubscribe Seven-seas Seven-seas-moderated Both available in digest form. ====================================== ------------------------------ End of seven-seas-digest V7 #245 ******************************** ======================================================================== Please send any questions or comments about the list to seven-seas-owner@smoe.org