From: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org (precious-things-digest) To: precious-things-digest@smoe.org Subject: precious-things-digest V12 #36 Reply-To: precious-things@smoe.org Sender: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "precious-things-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. precious-things-digest Thursday, May 17 2007 Volume 12 : Number 036 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [pt] Tori Meets The PS22 Chorus, and some thoughts on ADP, etc. ["K.A] [pt] a little clarification ["Cyndi S Crawford" ] Re: [pt] Tori Meets The PS22 Chorus, and some thoughts on ADP, [handal@r2] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 22:29:20 -0700 From: "K.A. Fischer" Subject: Re: [pt] Tori Meets The PS22 Chorus, and some thoughts on ADP, etc. It's been interesting to read different people's comments on the new album and on the Caton issue, and I thought I'd also throw my 2 cents in. I think the new album is an amazing piece of work, it's huge in terms of the number of songs and all the different musical styles.... However, I would not say that this is my favorite album. I don't like to choose favorites when it comes to the albums, I do like some more than others, but I love different things about each of them, but I wouldn't say I think ADP is her best. There are just some of Tori's albums that to me are perfect, there is not one single thing or song I would change on them. For some reason, I hit "skip" every time I reach Secret Spell and Roosterspur Bridge, I just don't care for those songs - - yet. Some songs take years to really get to me, and then I fall madly in love with them, and I already feel that way about sooo many of the songs on this new album, just not those 2. Of course, that hasn't stopped me from buying the album 3 times already (iTunes, CD, LP) ;) Who knows, one day I may find I love each song on ADP, but for now it's 21/23 (and I still bow down to Tori for making so many amazing amazing songs on one album - lately I'm constantly singing different ADP songs in my head all day long and I'll think "Wow, that's from the same album?!") As for Caton, I miss him, I really do. I remember listening to the SLG album and thinking "I wish Caton could have played on this" because I think he just somehow would have made it even better. I think his guitar work complimented Tori's vocals and piano better than any other guitarist I have heard work with her since. He just added that special something to the songs, his sound was unique and really fit the beauty of Tori's works. I don't really mind the guitar work on this latest album, some parts of it I really love, but it is a little stiff and it just feels like it doesn't flow with the level of skill that Tori's musicians usually have. I don't think it lowers the quality of Tori's work, but I don't feel it takes it to the next level, and whenever Caton played with Tori, even when it was just the 2 of them on stage, I felt like he really did. I wish he and Tori would work together again, but I'm not holding my breath. I just miss what he brought to the table with Tori a lot, and I think his shoes are really hard to fill. I'm sorry I'm not the most eloquent writer, and I rarely find the words to accurately express myself (it seems to take me 3 times as many words as it does for others), but in response to the comments about Caton's ego I wanted to share one more thing. I first met Caton when he was leaving after a show on the Plugged Preview Tour in '98, and he was very gracious about taking pictures and chatting with my friends and I. Anyway, he and I exchanged letters a few times over the next couple of years, and he was really quite depressed when a tour ended, he said that it was really hard to return to "normal" life after being surrounded by this huge family of band members, crew members, fans, etc. He had a lot of love for Tori's fans and I think he really believed in the power of Tori's music. Who doesn't have days when their ego gets carried away? He's an amazing guitar player, and if once in a while he got a little caught up in that on stage I don't think that means he was trying to steal the spotlight. I hope others will continue to share their views on these issues, it's really fun to hear what people have to say and to see things from a different angle :) ~~alex ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2007 15:20:50 GMT From: "Cyndi S Crawford" Subject: [pt] a little clarification regarding my comments about Caton's playing and his ego (etc).. lemme just say this much: just because I think he's an egotistical player doesn't necessarily mean that I think he must have been a jerk--it IS possible to be a very nice person, very gracious and friendly to the fans and still be the kind of person who walks onstage and plays like they're the only person that belongs there. (I also COULD be wrong in my assumptions, etc, and if I am, go ahead and tell me why, because I'm not going to dig my feet in and refuse to change my opinion if I'm shown the facts) I'm sure it sounds contradictory, given how most people with an ego act, but it isn't always the case, so I can easily believe that Caton was a very friendly-to-the-fans kind of guy, regardless of how he played while onstage. oh, and Richard: whichever show it was that they opened with Black Dove is the one I'm talking about. :) - -- Cyndi S. Crawford ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2007 12:40:05 -0400 (EDT) From: handal@r2d2.reverse.net (Richard Handal) Subject: Re: [pt] Tori Meets The PS22 Chorus, and some thoughts on ADP, Hi, I checked the July 25 1998 Toronto setlist and Black-Dove wasn't on it, so Cyndi must be referring to the performance from the Club Tour that April. > well for me, Black Dove. the Toronto 1998 performance, specifically, > is where I first began to notice it. I felt like his guitar playing > was a bit much after Tori started singing. before that, though, it was > great. perfect, even. but when she started in on "black dove, black > dove.." nuh uh. Well, I just listened to it three times, and it doesn't sound to me as if it's anything unusual. We need to factor in the fact that this is an audience recording and there didn't seem to be a whole lot of bass in it, the recordist may have been situated close to the speakers that the guitar was coming out of, etc. I expect the version you have, Cyndi, is the one from the pirate CD pressing called Phoenix, and that we are thus dealing with the same recording. It's great to be able to talk about the same recorded version of a particular song. That takes the generalizations out of the equation. Good deal. I would suggest for reasons of overall musical quality that folks go for a concert from later in the tour. Tori made no bones about this first two weeks of North American club concerts being a public rehearsal tour, planned to be in smaller venues than the later concerts of the year so that fewer people would hear them before they were at their best. Also, her voice was toast during at least the middle week of it, due, seemingly, to allergy. Usually when people complain about the live band sound they say the bass guitar is much too loud. I know the sound varies widely in a lot of the halls depending where one is in it, so that surely explains some of why people complain. I usually found the mix to be somewhere between decent to excellent--that is, when I wasn't at the back of the lawn in an outdoor amphitheater or something. And if you ever happened to be near Mark for a concert and were seeing him work, you would know that Mark constantly adjusts levels, EQ, effects--the lot--and he's the arbiter of all the sounds coming off the stage. I can't say Caton's playing his guitar live for Black-Dove in a way that's much different from the studio recording of it. So if you still feel as you described about this, we're going to have to agree to disagree. I want to pile on top of what the wonderfully expressive Alex said. He just added that special something to the songs, his sound was unique and really fit the beauty of Tori's works. I don't really mind the guitar work on this latest album, some parts of it I really love, but it is a little stiff and it just feels like it doesn't flow with the level of skill that Tori's musicians usually have. I don't think it lowers the quality of Tori's work, but I don't feel it takes it to the next level, and whenever Caton played with Tori, even when it was just the 2 of them on stage, I felt like he really did. Wish *I'd* said that. I'll also echo what Alex said about Caton always seeming to be a humble person, which he was whenever *I* talked with him. He once came over to me near the parking lot in Akron in 1998 when he was riding his bike around, and I complimented him on his playing over the previous several concerts being above even his usual high standard, and he argued with me, saying he wasn't playing any better than he had been. If I tell someone they're doing their job even better than their usually high standard and they argue about it, I have to say it's difficult for me to think of that person as having a big ego. If he ever did, he certainly hid it well. Be seeing you, Richard Handal, H.G. ------------------------------ End of precious-things-digest V12 #36 *************************************