From: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org (precious-things-digest) To: precious-things-digest@smoe.org Subject: precious-things-digest V7 #93 Reply-To: precious-things@smoe.org Sender: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "precious-things-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. precious-things-digest Friday, May 3 2002 Volume 07 : Number 093 Today's Subjects: ----------------- How Songs change... [ToriphileMaria@aol.com] Pele (was: Re: least fav Tori songs???) [Brian K Tanaka ] Re: songs that had to grow on me ["Tom xxxxx" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 2 May 2002 01:41:35 EDT From: ToriphileMaria@aol.com Subject: How Songs change... In a message dated 05/02/2002 12:21:13 AM Central Daylight Time, owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org writes: > think of all Tori's songs Sugar is the one thats the best example of how > her style and issues have changed over the years as she's tweaked it as she > goes along. Like how she's changed the original "if they found me out" to > "WHEN they find YOU out", so it's gone from the LE themed "please someone > hear my voice" to the more recent "oi! I'm telling you *this* boy!" kinda > tori - the song used to be ashamed of the fact that this boy was taking > advantage of it and taking it for granted, but now it's just angry and going > to let him know it... > Wow, that is really interesting you bring this up, b/c I have been thinking alot lately about how tori changes the song slightly over the years and it brings it a whole new meaning... the greatest emotional connection I have to evolving lyrics is from Doughnut Song-- I think prior to this tour, she would always sing : "you can tell me its over and its over" -- but this last tour, she started singing it "you can tell me its over, and *MAYBE THEN* its over..." Which I think makes a huge difference, like she's saying.. its not over until I say it is... its not over yet, regardless of what you say. I LOVE THAT!! She also sometimes add "you're wasting all my time, this time" where before it was "and if I'm wasting all your time" which again shows new empowerment. I really loved the song in 1996 when I first heard Pele, it had been one of my favs because I really connected w/ it at the point... it faded into background eventually... then on this last tour, when I heard here new way of singning and I fell in love all over... the same thing w/ crucify--- the new whurly version owns me now. So I was wondering, are there any other songs that you guys have now liked more because of certain changes in the lyrics-- however small? Also, does anyone know exactly when she started changing the Doughnut song lyrics?? Ive been meaning to compare songs from '99 from my huge boot collection, but I have been really busy w/ grad school..... maybe I can find time now that I only have one paper left... =) ~~Maria Trading Website: http://www.auburn.edu/~aguirmg ******************************************************** "The unexamined life is not worth living." - -Socrates ******************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 May 2002 00:55:07 -0700 From: Brian K Tanaka Subject: Pele (was: Re: least fav Tori songs???) Richard Handal typed the following words: > And, as I've said here before, it helps to think "courses of a meal" or > "acts of a play" for the four sections in between the separator songs. I'm new to the list so I hadn't heard your "courses of a meal" metaphor before. Now I'm looking at the back of the album and I'm astounded at my ability to miss the division into four sections. You'd think the indentation and the pattern of (separator) song lengths would've tipped me off long ago. Oh well; sometimes I'm slow. But, that's very interesting and I'll have to carry this new notion through my next listenings and see what happens. On a related but less fully developed note: I don't know if others have made the same observation as this but when I was first exploring Pele it occurred to me that you could look at the album as a little galaxy of thoughts and emotions, but with the first four songs as an outer shell (to mix my metaphor) that's challenging to traverse at least the first few listenings. This shell, especially Professional Widow, makes it plain that, no, this will not be background music, and, yes, you will want to approach the rest of this galaxy with an open and attentive mind and, more importantly, an open and attentive heart. Hopefully that makes a little sense... I've never tried to describe that notion before. Also, thanks for making the WHFS mp3 available. It's great to hear someone speak so eloquently about non-linear, highly metaphoric, "get out of your head" writing--a subject that by it's nature is hard to describe. > Something else to realize about the lyric-writing process with her is how > much she's a product of the Cherokee culture as her mother's father, Poppa > Copeland, introduced it to her, and which also embodies many of the themes > she encountered again when, in her teens, she first began to read about > mythologies of other cultures. As a sidebar, this reference to Poppa Copeland ties this thread to the "learned to love..." thread for me in that Frog on My Toe took on new dimensions and depth when I heard Tori's introduction to it from the Nashville 10/3/2001 show. I had always liked the song, but for some reason I had never made the connections before, and this version with this dedication converted the "like" to a "love". (If you have the TOMB version of this show, the intro I'm refering to is actually at the end of the preceding track.) - -- - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.well.com/~btanaka/tori - Gxis la kokino, oreloj kun futoj... - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 May 2002 06:19:47 EDT From: JNe9027355@aol.com Subject: Re: precious-things-digest V7 #76 In a message dated 4/7/02 10:21:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time, owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org writes: > Subject: Me And You mp3 > > I was wondering if anyone knows where I can find a good copy of Me And > You from the Hand Of Fate soundtrack? I downloaded the one from > hereinmyhead.com/sounds but I can barely hear Tori. Any help is greatly > appreciated. she recorded this song for a soundtrack? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 May 2002 16:42:22 -0400 From: Cyndi S Crawford Subject: Re: Pele (was: Re: least fav Tori songs???) >Now I'm looking at the back of the album and I'm astounded at my ability to miss the division into four sections.< I can tell you.. and I'm very new to this too.. where I think a section happens.. and that would be--for me at least.. correct me if I'm wrong.. after Muhammed My Friend and before Hey Jupiter.. something about that.. just seems to be like a.. split-off sort of a moment in the album.. or maybe before Muhammed at least.. somewhere involving THAT song to me is a separate section. Sincerely, Cyndi S. Crawford (Keyyooo on ICQ and IRC, Keyyooo1 on AIM) http://learntothink0.tripod.com/learntothinkagain/ -- http://www.geocities.com/keyyooo/ -- http://www.platinumcomplication.com/cyndi/ Tori Amos' response when asked to describe herself in five words: "I. Do. Not. Describe. Myself." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 May 2002 23:14:14 +0000 From: "Tom xxxxx" Subject: Re: songs that had to grow on me This is another interesting thread. LE: Mother. I just didn't get it at first. I'm not even sure when I got it but I'm so glad I did. She's one of my favorite girls now. Truthfully though, most of this album had to grow on me. On the first few listens only Crucify and Winter did anything for me. UtP: Past the Mission. I had to see the video and have a long talk about this song with a good friend before I saw how awesome it is. BfP: Twinkle. Thought this song was a non-understandable mishmash. Then I put it at the end of a tape of LE I made for the car (it was just about the only song that fit in the space). So, after the end of LE, this gentle, hopeful song came on and I finally noticed. FtCGH: iieee. Same as Twinkle, sort of. I thought it was nonsensical drivel at first. Seeing her play it on Storytellers brought me around. TVAB: none. My opinions of these songs have really not changed too much since I my first few listens. I guess I like 1,000 Oceans less than I did and Lust more. SLG: Time. I found it boring at first and was predisposed to dislike it as I'm not a Tom Waits fan. Now, I think it's pretty profound. Others: Never Seen Blue. It bored me originally. toodles, Tom "All the carnage of my journeys makes it harder to be livin' He said, 'It's a long road to be forgiven." Amy Ray, "Chickenman" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 May 2002 23:14:14 +0000 From: "Tom xxxxx" Subject: Re: songs that had to grow on me This is another interesting thread. LE: Mother. I just didn't get it at first. I'm not even sure when I got it but I'm so glad I did. She's one of my favorite girls now. Truthfully though, most of this album had to grow on me. On the first few listens only Crucify and Winter did anything for me. UtP: Past the Mission. I had to see the video and have a long talk about this song with a good friend before I saw how awesome it is. BfP: Twinkle. Thought this song was a non-understandable mishmash. Then I put it at the end of a tape of LE I made for the car (it was just about the only song that fit in the space). So, after the end of LE, this gentle, hopeful song came on and I finally noticed. FtCGH: iieee. Same as Twinkle, sort of. I thought it was nonsensical drivel at first. Seeing her play it on Storytellers brought me around. TVAB: none. My opinions of these songs have really not changed too much since I my first few listens. I guess I like 1,000 Oceans less than I did and Lust more. SLG: Time. I found it boring at first and was predisposed to dislike it as I'm not a Tom Waits fan. Now, I think it's pretty profound. Others: Never Seen Blue. It bored me originally. toodles, Tom "All the carnage of my journeys makes it harder to be livin' He said, 'It's a long road to be forgiven." Amy Ray, "Chickenman" ------------------------------ End of precious-things-digest V7 #93 ************************************