From: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org (precious-things-digest) To: precious-things-digest@smoe.org Subject: precious-things-digest V6 #32 Reply-To: precious-things@smoe.org Sender: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "precious-things-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. precious-things-digest Wednesday, February 21 2001 Volume 06 : Number 032 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Waitress lyrics [ToriLiscious@cs.com] marianne on boys for pele [ToriLiscious@cs.com] Re: decipher merman! [VioletLilith@aol.com] Re: precious-things-digest V6 #30 [FreakamI@aol.com] Re: Caught a Lite Sneeze [VioletLilith@aol.com] Marianne ["Wendi" ] Re: decipher merman! [JNe9027355@aol.com] Re: Merman lyrics.....it's all here!~ [JNe9027355@aol.com] Re: Caught a Lite Sneeze [Richard Handal ] Re: fave line- again! [UnderH20thing@aol.com] marianne speech [Talula514@aol.com] Re: more lyric deciphering ["Lynne Toussaint and Christina Sepp" ] Baltimore [nmielke@mindspring.com] Merman lyrics.....it's all here! [VioletLilith@aol.com] eBay ~ [Mysterilady2001@cs.com] The real girl behind Marianne [Richard Handal ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 13:33:30 EST From: ToriLiscious@cs.com Subject: Waitress lyrics << "there's too many stars...and not enough sky. >> i took it as, there are too many guys and not enough room in my life for all of them. micah ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 13:38:47 EST From: ToriLiscious@cs.com Subject: marianne on boys for pele << what's up with Marianne? >> i mean, putting the damage on is pretty f-ing depressing, but what is the symbolism of marianne being put on Boys for Pele? marianne doesn't have anything to do with a guy screwing her over. the song doesn't fit on the record. i love it, don't get me wrong, but it seems like a little earthquakes or maybe even a choirgirl. hmmm. micah ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 21:15:32 EST From: VioletLilith@aol.com Subject: Re: decipher merman! In a message dated 02/16/2001 10:46:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, JNe9027355@aol.com writes: << I LOOOOOOOOVE this song. but im wondering if it's an ode..... what's your take on it,everyone? -AJ >> she often sings it for matthew shepard! *jen* ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 12:51:50 EST From: FreakamI@aol.com Subject: Re: precious-things-digest V6 #30 Hiyas. I was watching this show Haunted History on the History Channel last night. And it was about Hawaii and it's history in terms of paranormal activity and what not and there was a segment on the Hawaiian volcano goddess Pele and how she would appear to people from time to time and she could appear in various forms, as a young woman, an old woman, a white dog, and so on. And according to stories, she's described as temptuous, powerful, beautiful and some other stuff I forgot. But I was wondering if the Pele in BFP refers to this Hawaiian goddess? *~[adjoa] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 21:26:39 EST From: VioletLilith@aol.com Subject: Re: Caught a Lite Sneeze In a message dated 02/18/2001 11:24:47 AM Eastern Standard Time, Talula514@aol.com writes: << << what's up with Marianne? >> >> she went to school with her, too....if i remember correctly.... and, the monkey was her imaginary friend as a child.... *jen* ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 12:53:51 -0000 From: "Wendi" Subject: Marianne I have always liked the song Marianne, and knew that it was about a friend's suicide, but never totally got it until a very dear friend of mine commited suicide in 1998. She was gay and pretty open about it and that just didn't go over well with certain people in our high school. She was a constant target. And when the school learned of her suicide the principal asked for a moment of silence over the intercom system and these certain people who constantly picked on her just happened to be in my class at that time. And during this moment of silence for my friend one of them actually said 'Fucking dyke, she's better off dead. Less we have to deal with.' I've never been so angry in my life. I had a REALLY hard time controlling my anger and had to be escorted out of class. And I went home that day and listened to Marianne over and over and it made total sense to me from that day on. The first (and unfortunately only) time that I saw Tori she played Marianne and this was only a few months after her death and I cried so hard. Before she played it she said that this song is about a friend who was beautiful and she thinks she comes to visit her sometimes, and that she feels her tonight. in the song Tori is kind of quiet when she sings "tuna rubber, little blubber in my igloo, yes and i knew you pig tails and all girls when they fall" then gets louder on "and they said marianne killed herself and i said not a chance not a chance" ---I've always kind of felt like when Tori says 'and I knew you pig tails and all' it was kind of like saying I knew you for more than just your beauty. and that was the way that I felt with my friend was like I knew you for more than just you being a lesbian and killing yourself, you were a beautiful person and friend. then on the part "She was so pretty, why, why, why, why did she crawl down in that deep ravine" the way that Tori keeps repeating "why" would always make me cry during that song because for months (and still to this day) I keep asking why. I'm going to stop now because I'm getting too emotional. I just thought that I would put my two cents in because Marianne holds a very very special place in my heart. Wendi ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 15:05:35 EST From: JNe9027355@aol.com Subject: Re: decipher merman! In a message dated 2/17/2001 4:54:54 PM Pacific Standard Time, Cindy2Love writes: << I like the line "you're my little goat" I know we had kind of a disagreement if this was actually "you're my little goat" or "you're my little girl" But isn't "goat" another word for "kid?" I love it.... Well that's my 2 cents... Love, ~*Cindy*~ >> i thought it was "you're my little girl..(then she silently says)....god" What is the actual line? - -AJ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 04:02:25 EST From: JNe9027355@aol.com Subject: Re: Merman lyrics.....it's all here!~ In a message dated 2/19/2001 6:30:52 PM Pacific Standard Time, Violet Lilith writes: << Sleep now You're my little girl >> i swear she whispers "god" after girl. that lyric is so endearing! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 18:34:59 -0500 (EST) From: Richard Handal Subject: Re: Caught a Lite Sneeze Reese said: > A friend of mine downloaded a live version of Marianne off of Napster > for me, and before Tori plays the song, she says a little speech about > how the guys at Atlantic felt about her producing her own album. The sound clip and transcript are both on The Dent at: http://thedent.com/boulder.html Now that Michael has the Google search engine on The Dent it's fast and easy to find all kinds of stuff like this. Pretty great. Be seeing you, Richard Handal, H.G. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 01:18:19 EST From: UnderH20thing@aol.com Subject: Re: fave line- again! my favorite line has to be.... "maybe i'm just the horizon you run to when she's left you." (at least that is what my fav. line is this month.) :^ Glitter Girl ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 14:58:02 EST From: Talula514@aol.com Subject: marianne speech Micah & fellow toriphiles, here's the little speech before Marianne I was mentioned before (Tori says it to the audience before playing Marianne) "When I started recording this record (Pele) it was very interesting because none of the record guys wanted to let a woman produce her own record, they were very very nervous about letting me do this, and they were much more nervous when they heard it. (laughter) What sort of happened was, I turned in the record, and I've never really had such a moment in my life. . . I mean, things were kinda better when I pooped in my pants. And I walked in, and, ya know, I sold millions of records for this company, and I walked in, I've had some pizza and a nice glass of wine and I was like, well I'll meet the new girls (the songs I think) and I know its a little dark but you know everybody needs a good bottle of wine and some depressing songs every once and a while. And so I walked in and this is what I met. (pause and some laughter) So, basically, what I said was, after this record went platinum, I said, so we didn't do it because of anything you all did. It was because of you guys (the audience) Record companies, radio, had absolutely fuck all to do with any of this. And that's the truth. But the one thing is . . . this is one song that demanded to come tonight because although she's not on this planet anymore, she was probably the main song that gave me strength to withstand when everybody said I've made a piece of shit" *faery dust* Reese ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 22:56:42 -0500 From: "Lynne Toussaint and Christina Sepp" Subject: Re: more lyric deciphering > << "need a big loan from a girl zone" >> To me, this line has always meant she needs strength from her womanhood, and her woman friends to overcome the loss she's felt from her breakup with Eric. Her main guy was gone, so to fill the void, she needed female energy, power, etc. peace christina ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 15:51:23 -0600 From: "Carmen Riojas" Subject: Re: Fwd: can everyone give me an opinion?! i always took it to mean that if she lost her mind/sense at armageddon she could always join the church (pope's rubber room)>From: ToriLiscious@cs.com >To: precious-things@smoe.org >Subject: Fwd: can everyone give me an opinion?! >Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 11:29:42 EST > > >Return-path: >From: ToRiGLosS@aol.com >Full-name: ToRiGLosS >Message-ID: <6.121cddb0.27bbf04e@aol.com> >Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 09:29:34 EST >Subject: Re: can everyone give me an opinion?! >To: ToriLiscious@cs.com, precious-things@smoe.org >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 117 > >In a message dated 2/13/2001 8:03:15 PM Central Standard Time, >ToriLiscious@cs.com writes: > ><< "and if I lose my cracker jacks at the tidal wave I've got a place in the > Pope's rubber robe" >> > >She's just watching the 'tidal wave' (what I interpret to be the whole mess >of the world - or maybe even doomsday or something), snacking on some >crackerjacks (maybe her sanity..?) she has a place in the pope's rubber robe >- I always assumed rubber in that it stretches to accommodate ANYTHING or >ANYONE... I guess it's not that hard to get into the robe! Hehehe - I always >took the line as a whole as her saying, maybe sarcastically, that if she ever >lost her way she always has a place in the church. I feel, though, that it's >more sarcastic, sounds like something a preacher (Dad!) would say to someone >they can tell isn't going to listen to them. It sounds like one of those >remarks made by the loser at the end of an argument.. at the point where they >KNOW they can't win.. I can just picture old Reverend Amos saying on the >phone to YKTR Tori, "Well Myra Ellen, if you ever change your mind there's >always a place here in God's house for you".. or something like that.. Maybe >she has the crackerjacks because she wants to be checking things out before >she dives in and she figures she could have a snack while she observes... >Anyone else? > >that's all off the top of my head, forgive me if you don't likey. > >SHaDYFeLiNE - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 18:08:11 -0000 From: "Danny.Weddup" Subject: Re: Too many stars... Hi everyone, "there's too many stars and not enough sky" another way i've heard of saying this is "too many chiefs and not enough Indians" - too many people who want to be at the top of the tree, and want to be the centre of attention. Bye, Danny * and i'm a black rainbow * and i'm an ape of god * i've got a face that's made for violence upon * and i'm a teen distortion * survived abortion * a rebel from the waist down Marilyn Manson * Disposable Teens * ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 01:56:01 -0500 From: nmielke@mindspring.com Subject: Baltimore Stephen asked: : Are there really only 10 in existence as it says in the Tori : collectibles book? The Collectibles book doesn't say that there are only ten in existence. It says that, at the time of the printing of the book, there were only ten copies known to be in the hands of fans. What's the difference? "Baltimore" is a private pressing. That is, Tori's dad shelled out the cash to have it made. When you do something like that, you literally cannot only get ten copies made. The biggest cost of pressing your own album is the cost of having the mold made. The cost of the vinyl itself is next to nothing. Usually, the places that will do vanity pressings such as "Baltimore" require a minimum of 250 to 500 made (and some of 'em would require 1000). That means that Rev Amos walked into the record pressing plant with a wad of cash, and walked out with at least 250 vinyl copies of the single "Baltimore". Then they started giving them away to anyone who would hold still. They sent 'em out to radio stations, record companies, gave them to friends and family, etc. And finally, twenty-some-odd years later, Tori became a star with fans like me who are collector freaks. At the time _Collectibles_ came out, about ten of us had copies of the single. When something like that is printed, the number of singles in the hands of fans increases almost overnight. The biggest reason for this is that someone who got a copy of it from Rev Amos all those years ago suddenly finds out that the old vinyl of the girl down the street is worth a few hundred, and they sell it off to someone who wants it. Right now, I'd -guess- that there are 25-30 copies of "Baltimore" in the hands of fans. So where are the other two hundred or more? Good question. There's probably still a good number of them languishing in attics. I'd be willing to bet that some got thrown away (along with the baseball cards that are also now worth some cash ;). As for the eBay auctions ... buyer beware on eBay. I'm not going to comment on the legitimacy of the auctions themselves, largely because I can't get to eBay right now. :) But if you're going to buy a big ticket item off of eBay, make sure that the seller is willing to either use an escrow service (eBay provides links to these), or is willing to ship the item COD. For an added measure of protection, use your credit card (not bank account!) via PayPal -- 'cause if the item doesn't show up, you can call your credit card company and have the charge removed from your account. If the seller is unwilling to use an escrow service or ship COD, then they're not worth your time. /nm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 21:30:52 EST From: VioletLilith@aol.com Subject: Merman lyrics.....it's all here! Go to bed, the priests are dead Now no one can call you bad Go to bed, the priests are dead Finally you're in Peppermint Land He's a merman He doesn't need your voice He's a merman Go to bed, dream instead And you will find him He's a merman eternally Doesn't need something you're not willing to give He's a merman Doesn't need your voice to cross his lands of ice Go to bed, the priests are dead Now no one can call you bad Go to bed, the priests are dead Finally you found him - lala la Who could ever say you're not simply wonderful? Who could ever harm you? Sleep now You're my little girl Go to bed, the priests are dead And go singin' low again Go to bed, past the apple orchard And you'll feel nice Two can play, I said, two can play ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 18:26:38 EST From: Mysterilady2001@cs.com Subject: eBay ~ Hi ya EWF ~ OK, well, to catch everyone up there was a Baltimore on eBay this past week. It, oddly, was a private auction and ended up with a final bid of 1,700.00 + dollars. The night before it ended a brand *NEW* seller put ANOTHER Baltimore on eBay using the EXACT image as the first and the same wording - literally the same ad. Since the first auction was private we have no way of knowing who was bidding. I wrote to the seller asking why it was a private auction. He sent some BS reply and I then replied back that MANY of us frequent Tori bidders were concerned. Then I openly accused him of having this kind of auction so he could bid on his own auction, or get a friend - or friends - to raise the bids. I told him Baltimore's typically go for $600.00 - 700.00. Frankly, I don't care if this was rude. Sometimes we NEED to be openly out there verbal to let the bad guys know we are on to them. I sent my emails to "Bad Seller" on Friday morning - one day before his private auction was to end. Late Friday night second BALT auction appeared. Interesting its not a private auction huh??? The two auctions are SOOOOO similar you'd have to be a MORON not to see it. And yet eBay is doing NOTHING. I'll say it here - eBay=MORON! A BUNCH of us wrote to eBay to complain and eBay wrote back that they could see no problem. BULLSH*T! Its clear as crystal. eBay just isn't going to DO anything because their take - $$$ - on this guys nearly 2,000.00 auction nets them a tidy fee. Same thing on the new auction - which is up to $510.00 with over a week to go. We can watch this auction as well, but it seems it does nothing. eBay is too locked into profit for themselves to do anything for their bidders. So, I propose we do something else. I say we start a group/webpage to help our fellow bidders identify sellers we've worked with in the past that ROCKED - like Harikari - and sellers to avoid - like the Balt seller. Also to help our fellow eBayer to identify shill bidding patterns - like the possible ones that appeared in the UNDER THE PINK FULL WHITE PROMO CD Item #1409523388 that ended today. I can smell these things like a ... oh I won't finish that phrase. Anyway, our fellow Toriphiles need to be aware of the underhanded tactics some sellers use. We need to make eBay a safe place to bid, in as much as we can anyway. We need eBay to be a safe place to get our goodies, not a den for those with less than admirable intentions to prey on our passion. Thank you to everyone who wrote eBay about this matter & to everyone who wrote to me personally. Not a single person didn't see the problem. I'm so relieved I was not alone (whew!). Please let me know, either by posting to PT (with the owners permission of course) OR personally via email whether you think having a website for identifying good sellers, bad sellers and scam selling practices would be of benefit to us eBay Tori bidders. I think it would. Anyway, that's that. My last suggestion is this: If you buy a big ticket item on eBay, Tori item or otherwise, INSIST the seller use eBays Escrow service. Escrow means you send the money to eBay and eBay holds the money while the seller send the item to you to be examined. Then after your OK eBay sends the money to the seller. There is a small fee but isn't it worth it? If the item isn't legit you get your money back. With eBays insurance you ONLY get 175.00 of your money back. In the case of a bad Baltimore you would be losing a LOT of $$$. Good luck eBayers! Safe Bidding Toodles ~ MysT *** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 16:28:25 -0500 (EST) From: Richard Handal Subject: The real girl behind Marianne Hello: I see folks here talking about the girl Maryanne who inspired the song Marianne. Those of you who have been on this list for a long time and have seen my prior posts about this can feel free to scroll past, as this is old stuff to you. As opposed to the impression Tori would often leave when she talked about her from the stage early on in '96, Maryanne did not commit suicide--at least, she didn't commit suicide on a conscious level. It always disturbed me to think that Tori was leaving the impression in the minds of a lot of people that Maryanne killed herself. Some of her family still lives around here. About three years ago her oldest brother was on the work crew when a friend of mine was having some renovation done on his house which is about a mile from Maryanne's old house. (This friend's sister was friends with both Tori and Maryanne in school and he knew the fellow.) I always imagine that if *I* had a sister who had died an early and tragic death and lots of people believed she had committed suicide that I would be pretty upset. Anyhow, Maryanne Curtis was a girl who Tori went to junior high school with who died of a drug overdose when she was 16. She'd been at a party and taken a dangerous combination of things. By all accounts (and I know a good half-dozen people who went to junior high with Maryanne and Tori-- that's not bragging; it has nothing to do with me, it's just a result of geography) she was an amazing, beautiful person. People who knew her back then strongly and fondly remember Maryanne to this day, even if they never heard of Tori's song about her. Here's what Tori said about Maryanne on the WHFS radio program "Just Passin' Thru" which originally aired on February 11, 1996. You really have to hear the depth of feeling in her voice to get the full impact of it, but here's a transcript of what Tori said about Maryanne in that radio interview: "Umm, Maryanne came to visit me--the spirit of Maryanne. Maryanne Curtis was a girl that I went to school with. And uh, some say she killed herself, some say she died over an O.D. I choose to believe that Maryanne just umm--to me she was kind of like a young Mary Magdalene. She . . . it just wasn't . . . the world couldn't *hold* her anymore, it couldn't, umm, understand her energy. "I think anybody that knew Maryanne, would tell you that she reflected the best parts of you back. So when you'd look into Maryanne's eyes, yes, of course she was beautiful, but *you* felt beautiful, because Maryanne never hated *any*thing--*any*body. And so when she died, you felt like this thing that reflected the best part of **you**, had died. So for Maryanne to come back again, was umm . . . it was uh . . . like the second coming for me, really." Here's something which was printed about Maryanne. It was in the fan magazine Upside Down, Issue #4, from 1994 in the QT section on page 22. The interviewer asked: "Who is Maryanne, mentioned in 'Sister Janet'?" Tori replied: "Maryanne Curtis is a girl I went to school with in junior high. She was the kind of person everyone adored, she was just magical. I had written a song about her years ago which I used to play in the bars sometimes. It never went any further than being performed, I didn't record it. Since then I have always wanted to have Maryanne in a song. She died from a drug overdose when she was 15. It is not known, but I don't believe it was a suicide. I think she took the wrong things together. She is very special to me, and comes to visit in my songs sometimes." (Tori was mistaken there about Maryanne's age when she died.) Maryanne's death served as a major wake-up call to a lot of girls who knew her and who were, like Maryanne, doing a lot of drugs. Maybe it still can. I recently watched a bunch of episodes of My So-Called Life, and the episode where Rayanne almost died of an O.D. is extremely resonant to the Maryanne story. When they cut to Angela's mom in the car crying her eyes out over her friend who'd O.D.ed many years earlier it was easy to share the ongoing sense of loss that left-behind friends can feel well into their adult lives, which is what led to the song Marianne showing up in the first place. And that 'Rayanne' is only one letter shy of being 'Maryanne' is a bit creepy to me, too. (The transcript of that episode can be found at: .) To quote from the end of that episode, "We move from terror and loss to unexpected good fortune. And out of darkness, hope is born." Anyway, Tori's song is a wonderful memorial to Maryanne. People who never knew her now feel warmly toward her, and people who have lost someone dear to them have found in the song an avenue for their grief. I know I have. Tori did that--and I have a lot of respect and love for her because she did it. Take care, Richard Handal, H.G. ------------------------------ End of precious-things-digest V6 #32 ************************************