From: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org (precious-things-digest) To: precious-things-digest@smoe.org Subject: precious-things-digest V2 #322 Reply-To: precious-things@smoe.org Sender: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "precious-things-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. precious-things-digest Saturday, November 15 1997 Volume 02 : Number 322 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: take to the sky [rain ] Re: take to the sky [Lady Eorann ] Professional Widow thoughts (long) [Mystyglass@webtv.net (Cynthia Glasson] Take To The Sky [Mystyglass@webtv.net (Cynthia Glasson)] Re: take to the sky [Ashley Blaize ] Re: take to the sky (new stuff) [kel11@scasd.k12.pa.us (Kim/BlkSwan07)] Re: Take To The Sky [Nadyne Mielke ] wedding songs [Jennifer Cypres ] Professional Widow interpretation [Jennifer Cypres ] Re: take to the sky [Lady Eorann ] Re: take to the sky ["[the ocean miles away]" ] Re: Re: Professional Widow interp--LONG [Kristina ] Re: Professional Widow interp--LONG [RAINN18@aol.com] Re: Where can I find...? [JEDAS1@aol.com] Re: Where can I find...? [Nadyne Mielke ] Re: precious-things-digest V2 #319 [rlones@juno.com (Marla/Antigone E. F.] Re: Prorfessional Widow....Hmm.. [RAINN18@aol.com] Re: take to the sky ["Ray Bailey" ] Take to the Sky ["Ray Bailey" ] Re: Take To The Sky ["Ray Bailey" ] Re: The Happiness of Depression? ["Ray Bailey" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 10:03:07 -0800 From: rain Subject: Re: take to the sky i think the sword is a reference to Y KANT TORI READ because she got so much shit for it and everything was just going wrong and she was just left there standing with her Y KANT TORI READ sword saying "yeah well screw you im gonna take to the sky" am i just talking out my rear or deos anyone see my point? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~rain~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Amanda Ross wrote: > > I love this song and the way it shows such determination to stand up for > oneself and never surrender. At my lowest points this brings me back up, > ready to fight again. I was wondering if anyone had the lyrics to this (I > had to listen to try and figure them out). Plus I was wondering about the > line "And here I stand, with this sword in my hand." What does the sword > stand for? I love that part about "And my preist says: you've been saving > no souls. And my father says you been making any money? And my doctor > says you just took it to the limit..." Go Tori! Show us all what > determination's about! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 01:29:10 -0500 (EST) From: Lady Eorann Subject: Re: take to the sky On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Amanda Ross wrote: > "And here I stand, with this sword in my hand." What does the sword > stand for? I think it has a double meaning. First i think it's more determination. You know, defending yourself against these attacks from every side about what your dreams are and how you're supposed to fail at them. Also, it's obviously a reference to her Y Kant Tori Read days. I don't know if you've seen the cover of that album, but she's got a sword (which I don't know, but I recall reading in "All These Years" that she still owns it--is this true?). It's that first "stab" at trying to fulfill your dreams. This is one of my favorite songs too! TTFN! Bright Blessings and Lollipops! Yvette. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Definitions are limiting. Limitations are deadening. To limit oneself is a kind of suicide. To limit another is a kind of murder. To limit poetry is a Hiroshima of the human spirit." --Tom Robbins ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 01:57:26 -0600 From: Mystyglass@webtv.net (Cynthia Glasson) Subject: Professional Widow thoughts (long) OK, you guys beat me to it...I just caught up on my mail and I was all ready to be the super smarty pants here and say that China White refers to heroin, as does "brown may be sweeter"...how do I know this? Because my boyfriend is an ex-junkie and he caught the lyrics in the song and then proceeded to tell me so..but this is just one little piece of the puzzle, this is a complex puzzle, but I think it started with one main vein(so to speak), and the references kind of branched off as they went along. So no, this doesn't mean the song is about drugs. When I first heard the song, I had no bloody idea whatsoever to tell you the truth...then someone gave me a very convincing argument that it was indeed about someone in particular, that being, of course, Courtney Love. They first explained why there was this alleged animosity between the two...and maybe some of you have heard and debated the rumours, one being that Courtney was in big part responsible for Tori's parting ways with Trent Reznor. Then he told me of a major "dissing" Courtney had done to Tori when reviewing the single "Cornflake Girl" in a music magazine. (Apparantly she said in essence that she was just a "Kate Bush wannabe") Then the lyrics, of course, providing essential clues..."don't blow those brains yet, we gotta be big boy" being the most tell tale one in the bunch..."starfucker, just like my daddy"... apparantly Courtney's dad was a Grateful Dead hanger-onner, and then, as most of us know, she kind of followed in her father's footsteps and became a hanger-onner as well...then the "Rest your shoulders, Peaches and Cream...everywhere a Judas as far as you can see, beautiful angel, calling 'we got every re-run of Muhammad Ali'" To be honest, I'm not sure where that actual quote comes from, but what I perceived from this was the Widow(let's call her "Courtney" since I'm already on that train)holding the "baby" in her arms and whispering in his or her ear...this could be EITHER her man or her child, and telling them that noone is to be trusted but me and I'll protect you even if I have to throw a few punches... then the drug references, "Mother Mary" and "she will supply"....your mother,your angel,your savior will supply you with anything you need...love,drugs....but you gotta be BIG. This much you must do for ME. Now this is not "the interpretation" of course but a combination of the argument presented to me and my own conclusions drawn from it. I'm also well aware that she denies this song being about Courtney Love...in fact I asked someone who asked her the question directly and he told me that her response was defensive when she replied "Not EVERYTHING is about Courtney Love!" And to me, personally, truer words were never spoken, but we are just talking about ONE song and not "everything". I think perhaps she just doesn't want to start a direct war or be unclassy about it or confrontational to the extreme, but who knows really. I think she's dropped hints. I read from one interview when asked about this song she says something to the effect of trying to disguise the song but she didn't think she did a really great job of it...that she put kind of a Jackie O suit on it...I'm sorry, I don't have the direct quote, so definately don't quote me on that! (But I do remember the Jackie O suit bit for sure) Anyhow, interesting stuff. Being a songwriter,personally I find it easiest to write from personal experiences, and in the case of that song, I think that may have been true for Tori as well....but that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.... (finding the Dennis Miller disclaimer appropriate as always) Cynthia ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 02:51:28 -0600 From: Mystyglass@webtv.net (Cynthia Glasson) Subject: Take To The Sky Hey I dig this song too. In fact the one time I did meet Tori I bothered to make a mention of this being my favorite b-side that she's done. I told her it helped motivate me in getting out of a very emotionally destructive live in relationship that I had been suffering from for a year and a half. I love the sound of that drum.... But in response to the question concerning the "here I stand with this sword in my hand" reference, that comes from the cover of Y Kant Tori Read in which she holds the sword over her head. It was a testament to that part of her spirit that was still alive I suppose, the spirit that was telling her to rise above all the negative feedback and do her own thing. Very inspirational indeed! Cynthia ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 04:37:00 -0800 (PST) From: Ashley Blaize Subject: Re: take to the sky She asked for the lyrics, here they are: This house is like Russia with eyes cold and grey, You've got me movin in a circle I dyed my hair red today. I just want a little passion to hold me in the dark I know I've got some magic buried, buried deep in my heart but my priest says you ain't saving no souls My father says you ain't making any money my doctor says you just took it to the limit and here I stand with this sword in my hand. You can say it one more time what you don't like Let me hear it one more time then have a seat while I take to the sky My heart is like the ocean it gets in the way So close to touching freedom then I hear the guards call my name but my priest says you ain't saving no souls My father says you ain't making any money my doctor says you just took it to the limit and here I stand with this sword in my hand. ou can say it one more time what you don't like Let me hear it one more time then have a seat while I take to the sky If you don't like me just a little, well, why do you hang around? If you don't like me just little why do you take it? This house is like Russia You can say it one more time you can say it one more time You can say it one more time what you don't like Let me hear it one more time then have a seat while I take to the sky There ya go! :) Ashley === "Hold on to nothing as fast as you can" - Tori Amos Tea With the Waitress - http://www.comsource.net/~nacho/Tori_Amos/ - ---Lady Eorann wrote: > > On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Amanda Ross wrote: > > > "And here I stand, with this sword in my hand." What does the sword > > stand for? > > I think it has a double meaning. First i think it's more determination. > You know, defending yourself against these attacks from every side about > what your dreams are and how you're supposed to fail at them. Also, it's > obviously a reference to her Y Kant Tori Read days. I don't know if > you've seen the cover of that album, but she's got a sword (which I don't > know, but I recall reading in "All These Years" that she still owns it--is > this true?). It's that first "stab" at trying to fulfill your dreams. > This is one of my favorite songs too! TTFN! > > Bright Blessings and Lollipops! > > Yvette. > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Definitions are limiting. Limitations are deadening. > To limit oneself is a kind of suicide. To limit > another is a kind of murder. To limit poetry is a > Hiroshima of the human spirit." --Tom Robbins > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > __________________________________________________________________ Sent by Yahoo! Mail. Get your free e-mail at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:39:23 -0500 (EST) From: kel11@scasd.k12.pa.us (Kim/BlkSwan07) Subject: Re: take to the sky (new stuff) .Hmm I always thought that the 'sword in my hand' was a reference to her ack what is it? I want to say arthritis, but I know it's something different. Anyways, that's how I always interperted her doctor and sword thing. And with the dad reference-she wasn't making ANY money at that point, she had spent all her savings on recording studio time and all the Y KANT TORI READ? stuff, so her dad was probably like "Hey, you're not making any money here Tori, you've got to move on with your life." I dunno that's how I always saw it. - --Kim "Actually I think the muppets have a pretty good grip on things." - --Ray Lesch ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:39:50 -0500 (EST) From: Nadyne Mielke Subject: Re: Take To The Sky On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Cynthia Glasson wrote: [snip snip snip] > year and a half. I love the sound of that drum.... I hate to say this . . . but that drumbeat has always sounded to me like she had a couple of the sound techs playing ping-pong in the background. ;) Regardless, TttS is one of my favourite Tori songs. /nad *************************************************************************** * Nadyne Mielke, CS majour, Southern Tech, Marietta, GA * * * * "I regret to say that we of the FBI are powerless to act in cases of * * oral-genital intimacy, unless it has in some way obstructed interstate * * commerce. " -- J. Edgar Hoover * *************************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 09:11:41 -0500 From: Jennifer Cypres Subject: wedding songs Alicia wrote: >>>For a wedding, if I had to chose one, I'd say the most appropriate one I can think of is "Beauty Queen/Horses",<<< You've got to be kidding. Horses says, "They say that your demons can't go there..." Demons? At a wedding? "Thank You" is much more appropriate done in Tori style. - -Jen ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 09:02:14 -0500 From: Jennifer Cypres Subject: Professional Widow interpretation Laurie wrote: >>>So basically, my interpretation of the song is that it's about a really mean woman who's trying to get her boyfriend to kill himself because she's mad at him, and she's telling him that Heaven would be better than here, and he'll go to Heaven. Or, even more generally, that women can be bastards too, and it's not just men who are playing games and hurting people.<<< I loved your interpretation of Professional Widow. I have been lurking and just watching the interpretations fly by, and have not yet gone, "Yes, that's it!" But I have to say that I think you nailed it on the head. Good going! - -Jen ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:59:44 -0700 From: Dave Woodson Subject: Tori's sword Amanda Ross wrote: >I love this song and the way it shows such determination to stand up for >oneself and never surrender. At my lowest points this brings me back up, >ready to fight again. I was wondering if anyone had the lyrics to this (I >had to listen to try and figure them out). Plus I was wondering about the >line "And here I stand, with this sword in my hand." What does the sword >stand for? I've always thought it was a reference to Y Kant Tori Read because Tori is holding a sword on the album cover. She had that sword hanging on the wall while she was writing the songs for LE, and "Take To The Sky" is a LE b-side. The lyrics are printed on an insert in the Winter single. Here they are, as printed there: Take To The Sky This house is like Russia with eyes cold and grey you got me movin in a circle I dyed my hair red today I just want a little passion to hold me in the dark I know I've got some magic buried deep in my heart yeah but my priest says you ain't savin no souls my father says you ain't makin any money my doctor says you just took it to the limit and here I stand with this sword in my hand you can say it one more time what you don't like let me here it one more time then have a seat while I take to the sky My heart is like the ocean it gets in the way so close to touching freedom then i hear the guards call my name if you don't like me just a little why do you hang around there she goes again wearing those purple panties there she goes again wearing her heart there she goes again why do you take it -Dave ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 11:00:59 -0500 (EST) From: Lady Eorann Subject: Re: take to the sky Hi. Just a note... there are also lyrics that are overlapped at the end, when she's saying "If you don't like me just alittle why do you hang around..." I have the lyrics, but I lent the disc to my mom so I can't consult them. Does anyone know what is said int he background? Thanks! :) Bright Blessings and Lollipops! Yvette. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Definitions are limiting. Limitations are deadening. To limit oneself is a kind of suicide. To limit another is a kind of murder. To limit poetry is a Hiroshima of the human spirit." --Tom Robbins ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 11:39:10 -0600 From: "[the ocean miles away]" Subject: Re: take to the sky Amanda Ross wrote: > > I love this song and the way it shows such determination to stand up for > oneself and never surrender. At my lowest points this brings me back up, > ready to fight again. I was wondering if anyone had the lyrics to this (I > had to listen to try and figure them out). Plus I was wondering about the > line "And here I stand, with this sword in my hand." What does the sword > stand for? take to the sky was one of the first songs tori wrote after the end of yktr, and tori's yktr 'thing' was a sword... she was holding it in several y kant tori read pictures. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 13:09:16 -0500 (EST) From: Kristina Subject: Re: Re: Professional Widow interp--LONG You are totally right about that! Also brown heroine is usually much purer then white... > >I believe that China White is a name for a type of heroin that is imported > >from Southern Asia. Another type of heroin that comes from Central and > >South American is called 'brown' because it's a darker color and less pure. > > > > Graham > Don't just switch from beef to chicken: Get the slaughter-house out of your kitchen!!!! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 21:27:55 +0100 From: Marcel F G Rijs Subject: The Happiness of Depression? Hi, Following the recent discussion about Professional Widow, I don't "get" that reference to "my daddy" either. But then, I find the lyrics on Boys for Pele quite incomprehensible alltogether. "Talula" was analyzed by a British mag last year and to me it looked like nonsense! Then someone wrote about his/her wedding and what ToriSong she could use for that. It made me think long and hard but I couldn't come up with a _happy_ Tori song at all. She seems to be quite gloomy, she's been so on all three albums and it seems like she's always depressed. Now it may seem that I am putting her down, but that's not true. I still love her music, but I have to admit that I was more of a fan back in 1992 when I was pretty depressed myself. Since mid last year, I've felt a lot better towards and with myself and it was then that my interest in Tori declined. I am asking the following because I don't know myself, but is it possible to enjoy Tori when you're not in the mood for "heavy" stuff? And what positive, uplifting song has she recorded? (Yeah, I know, catharsis can be positive and uplifting, but I'm not going for that kind of positive at the moment.) An interesting one to chew on, methinks..... Kind regards, Marcel Rijs "Conan the Librarian" Den Haag, The Netherlands EUROPE MY BRAND NEW HOMEPAGE: www.bart.nl/~mfgr ORDER THE KATE BUSH COVERED CD! Check my homepage for details. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:17:55 -0500 (EST) From: RAINN18@aol.com Subject: Re: Professional Widow interp--LONG In a message dated 97-11-14 05:11:15 EST, you write: << Also, it was funny to see that tori was sorta echoing Sarah's comment back to her, about the "we are playing one woman on the radio right now and so we can't play you". I wonder who came up with it first. It is interesting that sarah particulary targets Tori in that quote, but Tori doesn't target anyone. >> I found this strange also. I remember hearing Sarah McLachlan say that about Tori, so when I saw Tori say it I was slightly confused. Anyone out there that can clear this up? angie ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:27:56 -0500 (EST) From: JEDAS1@aol.com Subject: Re: Where can I find...? >>Could somebody tell me in which singles I can find these songs (I know they're in "some more for pele", but I don't think I'll ever come close to one again)? They are:<< Okay here ya go! Hey Jupiter (dakota version) is found on the "HEY JUPITER" - special five song EP. This also contains live perf. of sugar, honey, prof. widow (merry widow version) and somewhere over the rainbow. That's What I Like Mick (the sandwhich song), and This Old Man, and Toodles Mr. Jim are found on the "CAUGHT A LITE SNEEZE SINGLE" also includes a short song called graveyard. London Girls, Samurai, and Frog On My Toe are found on the "TALULA CD MAXI SINGLE. On this you'll find the tornado album version of talula, and a talula that's a Bt's synethasia mix. Hungarian Wedding Song, Sister Named Desire, Alamo, Amazing Grace/ Till the Chicken, that I know of are found on this CD I got called "The Broadcasts and Bsides." Butterfly is found on the Higher Learning Soundtrack, and so is Losing my Religion. That's all I can help you with. =) I know the Past The Mission Cd single has Amazing Grace/Till the Chicken - but it's hard to find that CD. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 17:05:47 -0500 (EST) From: Nadyne Mielke Subject: Re: Where can I find...? On Fri, 14 Nov 1997 JEDAS1@aol.com wrote: [snip snip snip] > That's all I can help you with. =) I know the Past The Mission Cd single has > Amazing Grace/Till the Chicken - but it's hard to find that CD. Well, you're right and wrong. The PtM single doesn't have the songs you listed, but it is kinda hard to find. ;) Amazing Grace/Til the Chicken are both available on the UK Talula. /nad *************************************************************************** * Nadyne Mielke, CS majour, Southern Tech, Marietta, GA * * * * "I regret to say that we of the FBI are powerless to act in cases of * * oral-genital intimacy, unless it has in some way obstructed interstate * * commerce. " -- J. Edgar Hoover * *************************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 17:49:29 EST From: rlones@juno.com (Marla/Antigone E. F.) Subject: Re: precious-things-digest V2 #319 << does anyone know if she has ever preformed this song live the *album version* way >> Actually, when I saw Tori in NYC on May 13, she did about the first half or so of PW with the harpsichord. I kept going "OH MY GOD!" AND she did bits of Talula on the harmonium...a great night... Marlantigone - --- "I'm a million different people from one day to the next." - The Verve ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 22:42:53 -0500 (EST) From: RAINN18@aol.com Subject: Re: Prorfessional Widow....Hmm.. << honey bring it close to your lips yes (could mean a lot) don't blow those brains yet >> Even though this song has had so many interpretations floating around, in reference to this being about courtney love , I think this part is about kurt cobain. I have heard tori talk about kurt and even cover his song, so i think this is more about him then the kennedys. Even though I really have no clue what is the real meaning behind this song, only wish tori would stop by and tell us!!! its starting to make me crazy!! :) angie ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:36:17 PST From: "Ray Bailey" Subject: Re: take to the sky >There ya go! :) >Ashley Hey Ashley, "Take to the Sky" is my absolute FAVORITE Bside... thanks so much for the lyrics! *hug* Ray "You can say it one more time, what you don't like... LET ME HEAR IT ONE MORE TIME..." -Tori[Goddess] ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:50:25 PST From: "Ray Bailey" Subject: Take to the Sky Okay... I'm thinking that what Tori means is this... She still has the sword in her hand, because people at that time were still judging her by YKTR, and I don't think she liked this much at all. Bad thing is, people still judge her by that (Heavy Metal singer... heh. *grin*) Ray ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:45:16 PST From: "Ray Bailey" Subject: Re: Take To The Sky >I hate to say this . . . but that drumbeat has always sounded to me like >she had a couple of the sound techs playing ping-pong in the background. ;) But Tori can make anything sound so kewl! *grin* >Regardless, TttS is one of my favourite Tori songs. >/nad Yeah, mine too! I just love it... I'm so glad I have the Winter single now to listen to it all the time (THANKS DAVID)! Ray "God, sometimes you just don't come through..." -Tori ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:55:59 PST From: "Ray Bailey" Subject: Re: The Happiness of Depression? >And what positive, uplifting song has she recorded? (Yeah, I know, >catharsis can be positive and uplifting, but I'm not going for that kind >of positive at the moment.) >Marcel Rijs Hmm... I think Take to the Sky is positive. I feel like it's about her overcoming obstacles... (maybe even a specific obstacle; any speculation there?) Happy Phantom is a very positive outlook on death, with which I agree fully (100%). So I don't think Tori is all dreary and negative... she's just a realist. =) Ray "So you can make me come, that doesn't make you JESUS." -Tori ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ End of precious-things-digest V2 #322 *************************************