From: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org (precious-things-digest) To: precious-things-digest@smoe.org Subject: precious-things-digest V2 #204 Reply-To: precious-things@smoe.org Sender: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "precious-things-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. precious-things-digest Wednesday, July 30 1997 Volume 02 : Number 204 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Fiona Apple [Chris Semon ] re: t-shirts [Blair Gibson ] Re: Fiona Apple [Alexander Jay Timin ] Buzz Clips [Dave Woodson ] Tori vs. Fiona [emeraldnymph@juno.com] Tori vs Fiona [Sshaggie@aol.com] Re: CDNow [IceInHeart@aol.com] Re: Tori vs Fiona [HereNmyHed@aol.com] Re: tori vs. fiona ["noah mclaughlin" ] Re: tori vs. fiona [Jennifer Gerbi ] Re: tori vs. fiona [LMC4PEACE@aol.com] Re: tori vs. fiona [Richard Handal ] Re: tori vs. fiona [MiSTeR37@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 08:28:42 -0700 From: Chris Semon Subject: Fiona Apple Jeannie recommends Fiona Apple's "Tidal".... I have to second that! I went out yesterday and bought her CD and LOVE it!! It is very similar in many ways to Tori's style with their piano playing and vocal use, although Tori strikes me more of a minimalist in her own way. I really enjoyed the CD and am hoping she will release more soon. :) Chris Semon wombats@earthlink.net ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 09:44:46 -0700 From: Blair Gibson Subject: re: t-shirts Speaking of Tori t-shirts, do any of you Canadian EWF's out there know of any place that sells them up here? I've never seen them in any record stores (or any other store for that matter) in Ottawa, but I'm interested in purchasing one. email me back if anyone out there can help. Thanx back to lurking... Blair ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 10:41:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Alexander Jay Timin Subject: Re: Fiona Apple Isn't Fiona Apple going to be on MTV unplugged tonight (tuesday) at 10:30? Alex I have stuff to trade by the following: Live The Posies The Grays Jason Falkner Jellyfish Big Star The Caulfields Counting Crows Our Lady Peace Dave Matthews Band Tori Amos Ben Folds 5 Smashing Pumpkins more on the way! email me for trading! **I am especially looking for DAT recordings! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 08:08:46 From: Dave Woodson Subject: Buzz Clips Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 21:47:25 -0700 From: dilbert@metro.net Subject: SATY video and Winter Was the SATY video a buzzclip on MTV? Were any of her other videos buzzclips? SATY was a buzzclip. That was the first time I ever saw or heard Tori. I went out to buy the album afterwards, but I couldn't remember her name, only that her last name probably started with an "A". So I looked over all the cassettes in 3 record stores until I finally recognized The Box Photo and remembered the name when I saw it. -Dave ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 11:38:22 -0400 From: emeraldnymph@juno.com Subject: Tori vs. Fiona >> It is very similar in many ways to Tori's style with their piano playing and vocal use, although Tori strikes me more of a minimalist in her own way.<< whoa! i cold not disagree with you more. yeah, fiona and tori both play the piano, but that is where the similarities end. tori's music is technically more complex than fiona's. and their voices are completely different! if anything, fiona is the minimalist here, not tori. fiona's music has more of a jazzy bluesy sound reminiscent of nina simone. tori has a very distinct vocal style (take BfP, for example). i like them both, but there is absolutely no way they can be compared in the same context. ((*)) kelly ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 12:03:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Sshaggie@aol.com Subject: Tori vs Fiona Wow....what a great debate. As I sit here listening to Fiona and her music I sit and think...Yeah she is great, but to compare the complexities of her piano to Tori is unquestionably unfair. I play some Piano and Fiona's music is easier to play than Tori's.....THe chords that Tori whips out are rarely the same throughout and entire piece and she loves to jump around the keyboard. It seems like she treis to touch every note, flat and sharp. Tori's music is much more complex. But all piano music aside they are both wonderful artists. I saw Fiona last weekend at Lilith Fair and she was very powerful.....If I had to chose who was better I am currently in favor of Fiona, but let's not take this the wrong way. By no means is Tori weak in any way. She truly is one of the greats. Mike Detroit listener ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 13:24:33 -0400 (EDT) From: IceInHeart@aol.com Subject: Re: CDNow In a message dated 97-07-28 20:33:39 EDT, you write: << If you ever want to buy ANYTHING related to music or Tori, do, please do, buy it from CDNow. I only deal with them now after numerous bad, icky, and generally nasty experiences over the Internet. CDNow is reliable, helpful, and excells at customer service. You can trust 'em. Karen in Minneapolis >> Well, I disagree with this.. I've shopped from Music Boulevard, they're albums and singles are cheaper.. Not to mention the fact that I've had many people tell me they've had loads of problems with CDnow as of late.. MB is extremely quick as well.. Here's the URL: http://www.musicblvd.com/cgi-bin/tw/15248_0_/mb2/live/main/main.txt robert.. _^_http://members.aol.com/candlesdie/heart.htm_^_ (c) copyright RiSKfacade 1997 IRC - "candles" - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Goth Code 3.1 [GoNQ TJt1 PLPaDr cBk(Lbr)-s6S V6s M2ZGon C6] [a19= n5 b52 H186 g5T??96A m@Z3 w5T v1 r4P] [p51565Zz D66 h7 sm9M SrNn k5 N1295CE RzS*2p1 LusNY5] [/^v-~~a cloud hangs over me, marks every move~~-v^\] - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 13:22:11 -0400 (EDT) From: HereNmyHed@aol.com Subject: Re: Tori vs Fiona Okay. I think it is so true that, as it was already said, the similarity between Tori and Fiona stops at the fact that both of them play the piano. Tori, in large because she's over 10 years older than Fiona, is much more experienced life wise and we sense that in her music. Fiona's music is very heart felt, yes, but I think it lacks the depth that Tori's music has. I hope we can stop comparing the two though, i really feel that there is no good comparison to Tori. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 15:46:19 -0400 From: "noah mclaughlin" Subject: Re: tori vs. fiona this really is a good debate. and i can see a lot of different views b/c i love both tori and fiona. but, the resemblance really does come to an end with the fact that they both play piano and are womyn. really, though, you have to think in context when you compare the two. _tidal_ is fiona's very first album. she recorded it when she was 19, and you have to bring into thinking that her producer probably had a lot of sway with the writing and the album: she thanx him profusely in the liner notes, andi think he plays on a few tracks. the same is true about LE. tori has simply had more time to expiriment and develop as a person and an artist. whether or not fiona or tori are minimalists: i don't think either of them are. fiona's songs (so far) tend to be a little more simplistic, chord wise at least, but then they are based primarily on the blues. blues songs usually have only 3 chords, four maybe. tori, on the other hand, really doesn't have a root style (not that i can discern, perhaps classical training, but she sheds it often.) if anything, i would argue that tori has more ability towards minmalism. she has written really bare songs (horses, twinkle, me and a gun, bells for her.) and is able to perform really heavily-produced songs with just her and a piano (SATY, Crucify.) i haven't seen fiona perform, though, so maybe she does that, too. so, i think that boils it down for me. oh, by the way: i'm new. nice to meet you all. :-) hugs and hot pizza njm noah mclaughlin: llmclaug@monumental.com narkim@hotmail.com - - what did you hear? - - ordinary eternal machinery Leonard Cohen, "Beautiful Losers" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 15:43:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Jennifer Gerbi Subject: Re: tori vs. fiona On Tue, 29 Jul 1997, noah mclaughlin wrote: > this really is a good debate. and i can see a lot of different views b/c i > love both tori and fiona. but, the resemblance really does come to an end > with the fact that they both play piano and are womyn. I like them both too, but fiona only for her voice. She doesn't play piano as an art form, like tori- she uses it, occasionally, to accompany her voice, only. Tori speaks as much through her piano, if not more, than her voice. Fiona put out an album, heavily produced by someone else, manufactured in a studio- she never played live, and still has barriers to overcome in that respect, I believe. tori, again, is the opposite- she has been playing live and grew up that way. The contact, the dialog, between tori and the audience is something I have not seen with any other performer, and with fiona, again it is a very distinct difference. I'm not knocking fiona. I think she has a beautiful voice, and when she gets a little older, and maybe eats something, she will rise above the crowds of mindless, skinny shallow teenagers that seem to throng to her shows, and become an independent, graceful artist. But I think that even attempting to "compare" her to Tori is impossible. I think there are a lot of great artists in the music world. Tori strikes me as one of the only true geniuses. Fiona is a beginning artist. But even geniuses have their y kant tori reads, where the almost exclusively male producers mold the artist into their perverted idea of what will sell. And sure, I have fiona's cd, and her producer did not put out a y kant tori read. :) -j ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 19:00:56 -0400 (EDT) From: LMC4PEACE@aol.com Subject: Re: tori vs. fiona In a message dated 97-07-29 16:36:15 EDT, you write: << she recorded it when she was 19 >> actually that isn't true.. fiona recorded Tidal when she was 17. I read that in a magazine.. and she wrote some of her songs at 14 and 15 (such as never is a promise, which she wrote at 15) i think that tori and fiona are both incredible women with a lot of emotion and they're phenomenally talented.. i just choose not to compare them because they're just well... fiona and tori.. if you get what i mean. later.. **Lane** http://members.aol.com/lmc4peace/welcome2.htm <---my Fiona Apple page ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 19:37:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Handal Subject: Re: tori vs. fiona Noah said: > tori has simply had more time to expiriment and develop as a person and > an artist. And I doubt Fiona was as much of a child prodigy as Tori (if at all), either, so Tori's had an enormous head start, too. > fiona's songs (so far) tend to be a little more simplistic, chord > wise at least, but then they are based primarily on the blues. blues > songs usually have only 3 chords, four maybe. tori, on the other hand, > really doesn't have a root style (not that i can discern, perhaps > classical training, but she sheds it often.) Classical music forms are some of the big influences on Tori's playing and composition, yes. She's really got a wider spectrum of influences--and wears them on her sleeve--than almost any musician I can think of, though. But there are so many of them and they come from such a wide variety of different forms of music that even being familiar enough with that much music to be able to recognize most of them is not something many people are up to: even music critics. This is one reason I think it's going to take a while before the critics and music scholars really catch on to what she's doing, and how musically astonishing it is on as many levels as it is. She really makes it all into her *own* style, though--even when she's copping specific licks and making definable musical references, such as the Beatles reference in Happy Phantom. This is one reason why the "she's stealing from Kate Bush" people make me totally insane. What are they focused on? Kate Bush. What are they gonna hear? You go to a surgeon and you'll likely be told you need surgery. Were the "Tori's stealing from Kate Bush" people less focused on hearing Kate in their mind's ear to the point of hearing every woman through that aural lens then they might have a chance to see more of the true stylistic influences on Tori--most of whom are male. And from many different realms of music. All they're hearing are some superficial sonic similarities. > oh, by the way: i'm new. nice to meet you all. :-) Hi. :-) Be seeing you, Richard Handal, H.G. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 00:06:40 -0400 (EDT) From: MiSTeR37@aol.com Subject: Re: tori vs. fiona i think it's ridiculous that this would even be a topic, but i shouldn't be surprised because that's what is wrong with every other mailing list i am on.. Tori is Tori and Fiona is okay, that's just my opinion - -mr37 ------------------------------ End of precious-things-digest V2 #204 *************************************