From: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org (precious-things-digest) To: precious-things-digest@smoe.org Subject: precious-things-digest V6 #53 Reply-To: precious-things@smoe.org Sender: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "precious-things-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. precious-things-digest Saturday, March 24 2001 Volume 06 : Number 053 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: what is the Sufis? [acopperbeechDryad ] Re: vote for Tori on VH1.com [Thlayli ] Re: what is the Sufis? [Richard Handal ] Re: what is the Sufis? [violet@torithoughts.org] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:49:12 -0500 From: acopperbeechDryad Subject: Re: what is the Sufis? JNe9027355@aol.com wrote: > Earth-E? E as in Ecstasy im guessing since shamanism involves alot of drug > use/transcendence etc? not true. in most cultures of shamanism, hallucinogenic drugs are reserved only for special trance rituals, if at all. > Also, what's so big about the sufis? is it a mere tribal dance? > i dont think it's worth reading an entire book about... sufism is more than dance. it's about achieving a specific level of trance such that you communicate with the spirit world, to the benefit of your community, self or a specific individual. - -- ~ kelley acopperbeechDryad FINNatic #69 ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ "if buffy and spike get together, i'm going to belize" ~ me ___________________ The Saferoom Project http://www.saferoom.org/ ~ dryad's Tree ~ http://home.nc.rr.com/leafpile/dryad/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:22:59 -0500 From: Thlayli Subject: Re: vote for Tori on VH1.com Talula514@aol.com wrote: >some of you might already be aware of this, but I thought I'd just put the >word out there. VH1 is having a poll to decide the best religious themed pop >song and Tori's Crucify is nominated. In the summer, a show called "Rock >and Religion" will air on VH1 about the songs nominated. Currently, she is >in the lead by 53%! So I think you all should keep up the voting! Funny ... I've never thought of Crucify as being particularly "religious themed". God would have been more appropriate for a poll like this (or Icicle, but there's no video so that wouldn't do VH1 any good). - -- Thlayli thlayli23x@att.net http://www.geocities.com/~thlayli23x/home.html "Excuse me, but can I be you for a while?" - T. Amos "You be me for a while, and I'll be you." - P. Westerberg "Why can't I be you?" - R. Smith "You're just jealous 'cause you can't be me." - M. Ciccone ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 03:30:52 -0500 (EST) From: Richard Handal Subject: Re: what is the Sufis? AJ said: > Also, what's so big about the sufis? is it a mere tribal dance? > i dont think it's worth reading an entire book about...im interested in > what it is exactly and tori's relating Cruel's content w/it. Good info about Sufism was posted here. (Far more than *I* knew about it.) I suggest that to get too deeply into what Sufism is and to try to relate the details of it to Cruel would be to miss the overall idea of the line. I can't think that learning many details about the Sufis and trying to find a specific, obscure reference to them in Cruel would be anymore useful than studying the history of the city of Havana and trying to do the same thing. Once again, my general suggestion about the lyrics would be to try to put one's self in the head of the (usually) person or people whose perspective the story is being told by. Sometimes the fine details of the history of such a reference might be enlightening--knowing about the personality of Kaiser Wilhelm II, for example--but often the simple, superficial meaning of such a reference is all one needs to gain understanding. It's easy to miss the forest for the trees. I say, think "forest" not "pine needles." That's my opinion. > thanks You're welcome. Be seeing you, Richard Handal, H.G. N.P.: The World News Polka. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 12:49:38 -0800 From: violet@torithoughts.org Subject: Re: what is the Sufis? Richard wrote: >I suggest that to get too deeply into what Sufism is and to try to relate >the details of it to Cruel would be to miss the overall idea of the line. >I can't think that learning many details about the Sufis and trying to >find a specific, obscure reference to them in Cruel would be anymore >useful than studying the history of the city of Havana and trying to do >the same thing. I think that's absolutely true. If someone is interested in learning about things (like Sufism), there is [literally] centuries of material out there. It is very possible to broaden the mind using Tori's lyrics as a springboard. But in terms of the individual songs and what Tori means when she says specific things, it's much simpler. It's more about gut feeling. For her, when she wrote the song, that line probably translated as something like: "dance with the Sufis" = "try to attain a little enlightenment, would ya?" Or even more simply, perhaps ... "Get a clue." Violet xoxox ------------------------------ End of precious-things-digest V6 #53 ************************************