From: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org (precious-things-digest) To: precious-things-digest@smoe.org Subject: precious-things-digest V3 #378 Reply-To: precious-things@smoe.org Sender: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-precious-things-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "precious-things-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. precious-things-digest Wednesday, October 28 1998 Volume 03 : Number 378 Today's Subjects: ----------------- in defense of tori. [Talulagrl1@aol.com] Re: Bachelorette? (tori lyrics) [Choirgrl@aol.com] Re: while we are discussing Bsides... [Choirgrl@aol.com] Re: OMG! cool on yr island VIDEO [Choirgrl@aol.com] Still looking for Tori Trades ["Smith, Monty" ] ...so when we died... [Talulagrl1@aol.com] Time sensative info needed!!!! [godgirl318@juno.com (dejernet m farder)] Re: numbers at the M&G's ["Thomas Mazorlig" ] I have a question ["Phillip Garcia" ] Re: while we are discussing Bsides... ["Master Guru" ] Providence Show - 10/25 [".:.:.:.:." ] Providence 10/25/98 tape for trade [Jason Bilsky ] New issue of ROCKRGRL out next week!! [queen of carrot flowers ] Re: OMG! cool on yr island VIDEO [Carrie-Ellen ] Dayton show [HaughtyGrl@aol.com] excuse me ["turbid blue" ] Re: quote of the day; honey ["Ockle Zine" ] Re: quote of the day; honey [Lacy ] Re: Bachelorette? [~ * ~ ] re: thoughts on providence ["Jacqueline Starr" ] Re: Meet and Greet: Earn it [Katapilla7@aol.com] Meet and Greet: Earn it [Beth Coulter ] thanks eric ["turbid blue" ] Re: [toriandmore] Meet and Greet: Earn it [Aimee Lortskell I Hate Tori Girlsreally pisses me off. please go visit. make sure to leave an intelligent message in the guestbook. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 22:48:26 EST From: Choirgrl@aol.com Subject: Re: Bachelorette? (tori lyrics) for *all* tori lyrics go to fairy tales... http://stuff.to/tori/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 22:58:26 EST From: Choirgrl@aol.com Subject: Re: while we are discussing Bsides... it's definitely between honey and here in my head. sister janet is up there too, and so are merman and siren, if they count. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 00:06:04 EST From: Choirgrl@aol.com Subject: Re: OMG! cool on yr island VIDEO that's what i thought too, but there's *also* a big picture video on it.. he says that there are *two* y kant tori read promo videos. so if it's not cool on your island, it's something else from YKTR. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 07:41:00 -0800 From: "Smith, Monty" Subject: Still looking for Tori Trades I have eight Tori shows (92-98) and am looking for more. I also have a few hundred other shows from 52 other artists dating back to 1965. There's bound to be something that interests you! Please send me your trading list (please make sure to include time and sound quality of all shows). Your list gets mine. Monty ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 23:03:29 EST From: Talulagrl1@aol.com Subject: ...so when we died... << and I think I could leave your world/if she was the better girl/so when we died/I tried to bribe the undertaker"? >> i'll just slip out of the back door quietly since you have a new girl and she is obviously better than me. so when (we)our relationship died i did everything i could to save it. (even bribing the undertaker) (that could be a greek reference.who was that persephone and orpheous?) thats what i think. rachel ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 07:00:32 -0600 From: godgirl318@juno.com (dejernet m farder) Subject: Time sensative info needed!!!! howdy y'all. i need to know the time the Meet and Greet starts tomorrow, 10/29 for the Northwestern show. And for those of you who are going, what tyme are you getting there? this will be my first tyme meeting her, so I'm a bit anxious. Thanks a lot! In Tori, DeJernet ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 07:03:06 PST From: "Thomas Mazorlig" Subject: Re: numbers at the M&G's OK Several people have given me nice, detailed responses on the M&G's. I send a big "Thank You" out to those folks. It sounds like the only nearly sure way to meet Tori is to get to the venue at the crack of dawn. Unfortunately, this is not an option for me for this show. I think I'll concentrate on getting good seats at the show itself instead (it's general admission). If any of y'all are going to the Ithaca show, give me a holler. fair winds and blue skies, Tom "the snakes they are my kin" ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 11:42:18 PST From: "Phillip Garcia" Subject: I have a question Hey, does anyone know if Tori will make it back to the West Coast by the end of the current tour? I live in California and have been to two shows already and am going crazy. I guess i already know that she wont, but ......is there any chance? phillipg ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 23:28:48 -0500 From: "Master Guru" Subject: Re: while we are discussing Bsides... - -----Original Message----- From: Lacy To: Precious Things Date: Tuesday, October 27, 1998 10:34 PM Subject: while we are discussing Bsides... > >What would everyone say is the best Bside Tori's done? > >Personally, I think I'd go with *Sugar* or *Here. in my head*.> Ohh, Honey gives me chills, definitely my favorite, and of course, one of the few songs i've never heard live *sigh* My .02 Phil ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 23:35:32 -0500 From: "Master Guru" Subject: Plugged Shirt.. I purchased a shirt at the last show i went to, and its the black t, with the bluish front and tori lying down, and on the back it has Plugged 98, with a bunch of cities listed. The strange part is that Storrs CT is listed, and she's not playing there. Would this imply perhaps the venue was the reason she's not playing there? I mean i'm sure her tour people have some input as to the cities listed on a tour shirt? Perhaps they thought they were playing there, and the wonderful people at UCONN decided not? My .02 Phil ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 16:09:02 -0500 From: ".:.:.:.:." Subject: Providence Show - 10/25 Oh my goddess, the show at PPAC on Sunday night was absolutely *amazing*!! Wow...so so much better than the Boston show I went to on 8/1. Anyway, I need to know: did ANYONE tape it and can I possibly get a copy? Please, I'm quite anxious. Thanks a lot. :) - -Allison - -- roller coaster>> http://bigfoot.com/~lyddie "..I love to turn my little blue world upsidedown inside my head the noise Chatter chatter chatter.." - -Tori Amos ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 13:29:26 -0500 From: Jason Bilsky Subject: Providence 10/25/98 tape for trade well, guys, I did it again. I got my tape deck into the Providence show. Even though everyone around me was standing up the entire show, the recording came out great. I think it may be even better than my boston 8/1 tape. And it is the complete show. no songs are cut. so, I'm looking to trade for any *plugged* shows that I don't have (sorry, I have all the pre-1998 shows I need). My list is at: http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Alley/4370/tapes.html I'm also willing to do 2:1s, but I will be giving priority to people who are trading me shows. you all know what to do... - -- Jason Bilsky fuzzbox@world.std.com http://world.std.com/~fuzzbox "If every cigarette you smoke takes seven minutes off of your life, then every game of Dungeons and Dragons you play delays your loss of virginity by seven hours." -Marilyn Manson ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 13:31:40 -0500 (EST) From: queen of carrot flowers Subject: New issue of ROCKRGRL out next week!! Just got this in from Estrolist. Thought some of you might find it of interest. > >My interview with Tori Amos is on the cover of the new issue of ROCKRGRL, out >next week. > >For info on how to order a copy (subscribers get it before it hits news >stands) visit http://www.rockrgrl.com. - ---- Chelsea, the mod pixie home: away: tugboat@channel1.com odyshape@hotmail.com "I started out as a missionary, but I couldn't find a religion which didn't promise things to some people at the exclsion of others. The personal voyage into that kind of light shouldn't be denied to anybody." -- Patti Smith ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 05:40:14 -0800 (PST) From: "Stacy N. Delmonte" Subject: boots...anyone have Baltimore? I have Atlanta!! Hi all, I'm just responding to everyone. For the person, I think Pokadot, who wanted a copy of the Atlanta show. I have the April 20th show, at the Roxy, on CD. So if you, or anyone else, wants to trade....let me know!! Email me privately please cause I dont always get to checking this.. Also, does anyone have a copy of Tori's recent Baltimore show on Oct. 17th???????? I really want to get a copy of that show...we can trade or anything!!! One final thing...is anyone out there going to the 2 Pennsylvania shows, Nov. 6 and 7th, my friend and I are thinking of flying from San Francisco to go and I'd just like to talk to anyone familiar with the area. Thanks all!!! - --Stacy (delmst00@usfca.edu) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 23:27:27 -0500 From: "Master Guru" Subject: Re: numbers at the M&G's Hi, there's been a lot of discussion on the list about the M & G's, and numbering and so forth and so on.. I think i can settle this for everyone in one fell swoop. The Early Bird Catches the Worm. The people who are there from 9am on, and stay ALL day, are almost guaranteed to get to meet Tori. If you're not in the first 2, perhaps 3 rows even, you may not even get a glimpse of her, she's not really tall you know =) Thats the big secret i suppose. Get there early, you don't need a number if you plant yourself at the barrier as soon as its put up, and you're guaranteed success. If you leave, or rely on the number system, its not going to work, and usually people with number higher than 20, 25 maybe, are completely useless. My .02 Phil ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 00:04:26 -0500 (EST) From: Carrie-Ellen Subject: Re: OMG! cool on yr island VIDEO I actually don't think there is one. I'd watch out if I were you because I traded someone for a compilation they said had Cool On Your Island on it, but it was actually Big Picture. On Tue, 27 Oct 1998 Choirgrl@aol.com wrote: > > i'm getting a compilation video with the cool on your island video on it! > OMGOMGOMG! ::raises the roof:: i didnt even know there WAS a cool on your > island video but my friend got a compilation tape and it's on there! whoopee! > ::dances:: > ~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Carrie-Ellen Batcheller 14 McDaniel Dr. Box 2110 Durham NH 03824 http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/9523 trade page: http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/9523/tori.html Say hi (: ICQ #: 20170937 "So I thought I'd make some plans But fire thought she'd rather be water instead..." ~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 03:12:38 EST From: HaughtyGrl@aol.com Subject: Dayton show I went to the Dayton show tonight and it was WONDERFUL. I guess part of my excitement was that I got there early (although not as early as Adam and Meghan who camped out overnight!) and so I got to stand RIGHT against the stage during the concert! I'll never have a position like that again! I was maybe 12 feet from Tori. I saw her tongue moving when she sang :) She played a great concert but I'll wait for someone else to post about it because I'm too hyper right now. I wondered if anyone booted the show? I know the security was *really* tight. If you did, please email me. For the most part, I thought the other Tori fans were really cool (especially the ones I went with - thanks Joe!). Still, it's kind of sad when I look down the other people who made it to the front row and I see people who have been to almost every concert this tour standing in that row. I couldn't say anything personally because I was very happy with my position, but if I was stuck in the back, I would have been very upset to see people who get to see Tori every day taking the front positions. Spread the wealth a little, hmmm? Maybe it's time to give some others a chance. Anyways, the show kicked ass :) - - vicTORIa ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 13:21:45 CST From: "turbid blue" Subject: excuse me hiya, this will hopefully be my last post regarding this debate, really. (: i just wanted to say "sorry" for the total lack of tact my last email, in response to beth, may have had. oops! hehe. i did not mean to come across as a bitch at all. i just get so frustrated with the meet and greet thing and it affected me a bit much, i guess. anyway, i think i misunderstood some of the things beth said, and i totally respect her opinion. i think it was just a few comments she made that i took offense to. in some ways, i think she's right, actually. that those who have something important to share with tori deserve to be able to share it with her. i don't necessarily think it's all that fair, but life's not fair, and nobody owes you anything, right? but, really, i was still just ranting about the numbers and the way the meet and greets are run. which i still think is wrong when they are managed by the same group of fans. ;p but anyways, yeah. sorry. i hope i didn't upset anyone. (: just wanted to clear up any hard feelings. toodles. peace, gina ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 04:30:36 PST From: "Ockle Zine" Subject: Re: quote of the day; honey >My second question is about a lyric in "Honey". I'm not sure I fully understand its meaning, so what do you all think it means when she says "and I think I could leave your world/if she was the better girl/so when we died/I tried to bribe the undertaker"? I assume "we" refers to her and the guy, but I could be wrong on that...thoughts right now on this?>> Ahhh. Those lines made that song for me. Made me feel Tori had opened up my diary and written a song from it. I always interpreted "we" as the couple. When the couple fell apart, the speaker tried one last time to work things out, to just buy a few more minutes together, to not have it end. I don't know if I can express it properly, but it always touched me deeply. In my case, he picked the better girl and the undertaker buried me. antigone - --------------------------------------------------------------------- "We were all sitting around...and the pathetic ghost of Jon Benet Ramsey appeared and told us that she had proof that Fox's alien autopsy was fact." - - paraphrase from Melora, Rasputina (real quote TK) http://members.tripod.com/~marlantigone (random home page) http://members.tripod.com/~marlantigone/toriboot.htm (trade list) http://members.tripod.com/~marlantigone/ockle.htm (Ockle zine page) - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 23:52:01 -0500 (EST) From: Lacy Subject: Re: quote of the day; honey On Tue, 27 Oct 1998, Erin Martin wrote: > > Hi! I had a couple questions. First, I was wondering what happened to > the Quote of the Day list. I think the server changed and I didn't >quite change with it. If anybody can tell me how to resubscribe, I'd like to know this myself! anyone? > My second question is about a lyric in "Honey". I'm not sure I fully understand its meaning, so what do you all think it means when she says "and I think I could leave your world/if she was the better girl/so when we died/I tried to bribe the undertaker"? I assume "we" refers to her and the guy, but I could be wrong on that..thoughts right now on this? > huh. that's one of my favorite lyrics! "and i think i could leave your world if she was the better girl"-- i think its something about her and said guy,and some kind of love triangle with another girl, and she knows she could give the guy up, if she thought the other girl was bettr for him or loved him more. "so when we died"--i think is when they as a couple died, as in broke up, or realized that things werent working out or whatever. "i tried to bribe the undertaker", i'm not sure how to take this, cause i dont know what the bribe was, but i think the undertaker is that other girl. just my .02. Lacy An absolutely authentic Lacyism. :) - ----------------------------------- ophelia@virginia.edu gingerspice@virginia.edu And do you know? Hey do you know What this is doing to me? Oh here, here, here, here in my head. --tori What to do with this love that Im in? I have given you all of my soul. Flying all my life like a rose in the wind, Tell me why I am always alone..... ---anggun ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 00:10:55 -0600 From: ~ * ~ Subject: Re: Bachelorette? Bachelorette You come around us and you bat your eyes You can turn dust into champagne You even dream about his name Bachelorette The graves are painful, pain for bachelorettes You tried to shove him, but he can But you can never rush your man You must remember You're a car, girl You're a star, girl You are at the door The tide will turn There's a window There's a window Yeah, mmm You climb around us, and you mmm them You tried to shove him, but he can But you can never rush your man You know, say Bachelorette The things you do, girls, to your bachelorettes You thought that mmm, and light it isn't But I lie-di-di-di-died You must remember You're a car, girl You're a star, girl You are at the door The tide will turn There's a window There's a window Bachelorette You fly along, oh, and you cry sometimes There's nothing like it in the world You'll go to Paris on your own Oh, just Bachelorette You climb all over them, you bachelorette You can turn dust into champagne You even yi-di-di-di-di-di-di-di, i, i... sorry... At 04:00 PM 10/27/98 -0800, you wrote: > >Does anyone really know all the lyrics to "Bachelorette?" I know most >of them, but there are still some lyrics I am confused on. Any help >would be appreciated. > >Apple green ice cream with molasses, > >Angela > >"Any kind of touch I think is better than none even upside down." Tori > > *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Love and Light... http://www.cu-online.com/~raccoon/ "I can be Cruel, I don't know why." ~~Tori Amos "I think I made you up inside my head" --Sylvia Plath "In three words I can sum up everything I've learned about life: It goes on." ~~~Robert Frost "Rest assured that when I start to make you nervous and I'm going to extremes, Tomorrow I will change and today won't mean a thing" - --Meridith Brooks "We all want something beautiful...I wish I was beautiful" ~~~Counting Crows *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 21:04:53 PST From: "Jacqueline Starr" Subject: re: thoughts on providence me again :) richard and i conversed: |> i did see some people with red numbers on their hands but the whole |>numbering system seemed to fall apart...per usual so it seems. | |This is confusing to me. I was like six rows back, and surely there |were around 50 people in those six rows. Clearly, you were pretty far |back, Jackie. What was it that makes you say it fell apart? well, it seems as though when i got there (uhm...not until 2:40 or so i think...we got lost as anything), there WAS a line and everything looked very organized. but as time went on, the crowd seemed to push forward and the couple of dozen people in back of us ended up pushing their way through the crowd until i couldn't see em anymore. we was standing out there for over 45 minutes before i saw anyone with a number on their hand (it was 90-something) and it was only because the girl walked by me, trying to get around the bus to the other side of the street. by the time tori came, i was standing at the way back of the pack and i knew getting up front was pretty much hopeless. *shrugs* i had nothing to be signed or anything to give. anything i could ever say to tori couldn't be said in a matter of seconds so my friend and i just decided to wait and see how lowell goes. we stayed there, near the back, until tori had left. i saw a lot of unnumbered hands coming out through the crowd with signed items and so on. granted, their stuff could have been handed up but one would think the numbered folks would be "first pick." i *did* notice a LOT of people seemed to be getting their time with tori and then leaving; giving others their time up front. seemed a lot different than boston and like Phil (master guru), i'd like to extend my thanks to the respectable people who did just that. thanks for giving everyone else a chance :) (btw, phil...my friend saw you reading and pointed ya out. she wanted to know what you were reading!) richard when on to say: >It's wonderful seeing shows these days. And I'm so relieved that she >seems to be getting *happier* as time passes rather than the reverse, >which was what last tour did to her. as i wasn't an EWF yet during the previous tour, i'm not real sure on the timing of things...but you've gotta keep in mind, tori was pregnant for probably the last month or so of the DDI tour. if anything, the stress/worry/everything else factor could have very well played a major role her her dwindling...uhm...happiness? doesn't seem like the right word, but you get what i mean... i hope... ;) wow. my two longest posts to PT within a matter of 24 hours. you guys must be getting tired of me! :P take care, all. -jackie ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 01:28:54 EST From: Katapilla7@aol.com Subject: Re: Meet and Greet: Earn it In a message dated 98-10-28 00:19:36 EST, you write: << I think every person who attends the meet and greet should be able to finish the following statement: "Tori, your music inspired me to...(fill in good works here)". >> I dont know where this came from in this on going conversation but it is a good point that is kind of off the subject. I have this ex friend that is a total selfish bitch doormat very petty person and she is so so selfish and has never helped another soul or felt compassion or sorrow for anothers hurt. Her world is all that is important. She also thinks she is tori fan and once when we were friends I bought 2 tickets to a tori concert and she thought she deserved to go to the concert and I didnt think so. I think that tori would hate her and think she is a selfish idiot and I refused to tell her abou the onsale dates nor any other info about the concerts. See she didnt even go to the effort of getting a ticket so I just think there are some people that say they are tori fans and totally give tori and her message a bad name. i didnt think she deserved to go to the meet and greets with me nor take up a sit in a concert. I dont know I get a slight vibe kind of similar from some of the regulars that they are just not living up to what they say they believe in. Just like my ex friend she said she believed in what tori says but all she really was was a fake who only loved herself and no others. which is kindof harsh to generalize about but I will disclaim. I feel that tori is a very selfless person who lets us into her life and helps us through things thru her very personal music. and some (I stress a minute few that seemed bigger because of their shitty attitudes) of toris groupies seem selfish and totally seem to just think they are so important and they are the only ones that are important well if tori thought that she would help rainn and she wouldnt give us her music nor take the time to meet us. so I think some (again a few) of the groupies should really look into themselves and take into consideration others. I mean really they act like 5 year olds with a new toy they dont know how to share. and if you mention it they throw a fit. and someone said that tori recognises the people she likes even if they arent on the front row and she still talks to them. this is a very good point. it is true I saw it happen with some really considerate nice regulars that were on the 2nd or 3rd row and she grabed his hand and said hi to him asked him how he was doing. so I dont see the point of being right up front when tori would recognize you on the next few rows. woa did that make sense I just went off and I hope my thoughts flowed. and damn I bet I get flamed for that opinion. haha I dont care kat ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Oct 1998 00:14:19 -0500 From: Beth Coulter Subject: Meet and Greet: Earn it *Warning--Cross Posted All Over The Place. Prepare To Delete. Apologies In Advance. At 02:50 PM 10/27/98 PST, Thomas Mazorlig wrote: >>We are all on this list because something about Tori >has touched our lives, all of our lives. No one here has any more valid >connection to her or her work than any other one of us (unless you >happen to be someone in one of her songs or a freind of hers which I >have to believe is not true for 90% of us). And we'd like the >opportunity to tell her and thank her. That's all. > I really have tried to stay out of this conversation, but folks, the M&G's have gotten to a point where they are impossible. Tori is not obligated to meet each and every person who is touched by her music. It isn't humanly possible for her to hear every voice that wants to personally tell her thank you. I'd like to know about the 10% that Tori counts on seeing? Those are the folks you are complaining about. She relys on certain people who have been part of her core audience to ground her in a way in every concert. Seeing the same people (and the 10% that you are speaking of isn't a huge number of people, maybe 5 at each concert) gives her a sense on continuity and safety. Personally I feel that if you want to truly thank Tori for how she has touched you, then you should reach out to others and help them. Work your ass off and after you have gotten Tori's attention, then you should have the opportunity to meet her. But that's just my opinion. And we all know what my opinion is worth. :) Seriously. Tori knows how many people love her and appriciate her. Sure it's nice to hear. But it feels so much better to see your words inspire someone else to make a difference. I think every person who attends the meet and greet should be able to finish the following statement: "Tori, your music inspired me to...(fill in good works here)". If you answer, "But I'm so busy" or "I don't have any way to help" or any excuse for not helping your fellow human beings and making this world a better place, then what makes you think Tori would be excited to see you? After all Tori Amos gives to her fans, you'd think instead of complaining about the rudeness and unfairness of it all, they would take her words to heart. *bethey taking $%&**@!%@ soapbox and smashing it to smithereens* Boy, I sound like a pompous ass, don't I? But if you got this far, you must sorta kinda see my point. Thanks for reading and I release you back to the real world. :) Fairy Blessings, Bethey I'm OK when everything's not OK cause it's the Fairies Revenge they say and I have always been a Fairy *************************************************************** *~**Fairy Blessings**~* ~~ tori trades and really deep thoughts~ a proud member of the Tori Traders Ring updated at least monthly http://www.angelfire.com/pa/bethey/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 03:08:53 CST From: "turbid blue" Subject: thanks eric Eric.. Thanks for your positive input. I pretty much agree. I understand that Tori likes the people that attend most of the shows, and I think that's really cool. (= And, I do know that people have their reasons to talk to Tori, if it is their last show for example. At one of the meet and greets I was at, it was one of the "groupies" (i hope nobody minds that term).. it was his last show, and it was touching to see him say goodbye to Tori. Anyway, I just don't think that because Tori likes them, and knows them, that that means they need to be in the front all the time... it would be nice to give others a chance, etc. etc. you know the argument. And, of course any meet and greet is better than no meet and greet. That has crossed my mind many times. I am very grateful for just being able to attend the ones I went to. They are, in themselves, very important experiences I will never forget. And.. I totally agree with your suggestion about forming a line and approach tori one at a time.. I thought of that, too. It's probably too late for any kind of change anyway. But these are some things to think about. (: I'll shut up now. You guys take care. peace, Gina - --------------------------------------------------------------------- Gina: Thank you for your honest report about your Meet&Greet experiences. I think that you certainly have all right to feel like you do and that you write in a very fair and appropriate way. But I do not think there is an easy solution. It would be nice if all people attending a Meet&Greet would sit together and decide who deserves to see Tori most on that particular day. On the day you mention in your post, you would have certainly been one of them. It would really be even more fascinating if it would work like this - I just do not think this is very realistic. Because everybody would have very good reasons to meet Tori - including the ones that have met Tori before (e.g. it might be their last show and they want to say good-bye). Unfortunately, there are not many ways to make sure that you are able to talk to Tori. None of them is comfortable. Either arriving very early for the pre-show Meet&Greet or leaving the show before the last song to be in front for the after-show Meet&Greet. And even this is no guarantee, because although Tori likes to meet us, she might be too tired or too much in a hurry or just not feeling well on that particular day. I absolutely agree with your opinion about people selling pictures at Meet&Greets. If somebody really would ask more for a picture than he paid for making the copy of it himself, this would be at least as bad as selling an audience bootleg for a high price. About selfishness of frequent Meet&Greet participants: I believe that Tori really likes at least some of these people. And if she recognizes them, she also tries to communicate with them even if they are not in the first row. I heard her adressing one of them at a Meet&Greet with the words 'my dear friend'. I believe she gets a lot of energy out of meeting her fans and especially those people that she recognizes and has some kind of distant relationship with. Is it selfish of the frequent M&G participants to try to continue this at the next show? Maybe - but who would really behave differently in this situation, honestly. Is it all fair? Probably not. But how could it be? The alternative might be no Meet&Greets at all - which would be much worse in my opinion. Does anybody have other suggestions? I would be possible to simply form a line and try to approach Tori at the Meet&Greet one after another. But if Tori would only spend 30 seconds on average with each person in line, this would already mean spending 30 minutes at the Meet&Greet with 60 people present. She just cannot do that. Things like this were possible during Dew Drop Inn - it is different now. And I am very happy that Tori gets even more attention and has more fans now. She deserves it. Everybody enjoy 'your' shows, Eric (with a 'c') ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 04:33:55 -0600 (CST) From: Aimee Lortskell Subject: Re: [toriandmore] Meet and Greet: Earn it On Thu, 29 Oct 1998, Beth Coulter wrote: > *Warning--Cross Posted All Over The Place. Prepare To Delete. Apologies > In Advance. christ in butter, beth! you are the empress of cross-posting! :) [snips] > I'd like to know about the 10% that Tori counts on seeing? Those are the > folks you are complaining about. She relys on certain people who have been > part of her core audience to ground her in a way in every concert. Seeing > the same people (and the 10% that you are speaking of isn't a huge number > of people, maybe 5 at each concert) gives her a sense on continuity and > safety. i don't buy it. the meet'n'greets ARE insane now, and my reaction as someone who got to speak to her 4 different times on the DDI tour is that it's time for those of us who've already gotten the chance to speak to her to step back and let new people have a shot to thank tori and experience speaking to her face to face. in STL this year there were very few people, fortunately, so almost everyone got to talk to tori. we made sure that a girl who'd never met tori got to the front. shocking, eh? i hung back a little and took pictures for people while juggling about 8 cameras. and what was tori's reaction? she noticed and thanked me, she said she apppreciated what i was doing. and while i do believe tori likes to see familiar faces, that doesn't mean those faces have to be up front every time and hogging her presence. in fact, she complained about that kind of thing in the ultrasound interview. she can see those familiar faces around at the meet'n'greet and during the show. those faces don't have to be right in *her* face every damn day. and we all know that if we have gifts to send back, they can be safely given to joel or steve. [snip] > Personally I feel that if you want to truly thank Tori for how she has > touched you, then you should reach out to others and help them. that's a bullshit answer, beth. maybe the people who follow tori everywhere and hog the front of the meet'n'greet line at every show should be the ones to take this advice. i firmly believe that many of the more "established" fans have been selfish bastards on this tour. i've never seen such kicking and shoving and rushing and manipulation of hand-numbering in my life, and it disgusts me. what the hell happened to lining up single file? > Work your > ass off and after you have gotten Tori's attention, then you should have > the opportunity to meet her. get tori's attention? how can anyone do that when the same 10 people are up front every time? and doing good deeds doesn't really get tori's attention - the chick ain't psychic. i've helped raise thousands of dollars for RAINN through toricon, i've counselled tons of people myself, but you don't see tori calling me up to thank me even though she actually IS aware of it. nor should she. we don't do this stuff to get tori's attention, do we? christ, i sure hope not. but we do go to meet'n'greets to spend just a moment of time with her. [snips] > I think every person who attends the > meet and greet should be able to finish the following statement: "Tori, > your music inspired me to...(fill in good works here)". i think most of them already can. that's why they're *there*. the problem is that they never get the chance to say it to tori. a lot of them maybe go to only 1 or 2 shows, and so they have limited chances to even be at the meet'n'greets. the rest of us, especially those who psychotically deadhead after tori (and i'm one of 'em, i've seen 9 tori shows this year and have 2 more this weekend), should be stepping back and letting others experience the joy of talking to tori and getting a hug from her. that's my policy. i can't make anyone else follow it, but i can damn well let people know they should. Aimee * losing your faith is a lot like losing your virginity; * * you don't realize how irritating it was 'til it's gone * * - AEL * * and when they say 'take of his body' * * i think i'll take from mine instead - Tori Amos * * once i could see...now i am blind - Trent Reznor * ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Oct 1998 13:35:02 -0500 From: Beth Coulter Subject: Re: [toriandmore] Meet and Greet: Earn it At 04:33 AM 10/28/98 -0600, you wrote: >On Thu, 29 Oct 1998, Beth Coulter wrote: >> *Warning--Cross Posted All Over The Place. Prepare To Delete. Apologies >> In Advance. > >christ in butter, beth! you are the empress of cross-posting! :) > Merci. At least I took the care to warn people. >i don't buy it. the meet'n'greets ARE insane now, and my reaction as >someone who got to speak to her 4 different times on the DDI tour is that >it's time for those of us who've already gotten the chance to speak to her >to step back and let new people have a shot to thank tori and experience >speaking to her face to face. Yes, that would be nice. Remember, I've only ever met tori once and she still owes me a hug. But it won't be at a meet and greet. >and what was tori's reaction? she noticed and thanked me, she said she >apppreciated what i was doing. and while i do believe tori likes to see >familiar faces, that doesn't mean those faces have to be up front every >time and hogging her presence. in fact, she complained about that kind of >thing in the ultrasound interview. she can see those familiar faces >around at the meet'n'greet and during the show. those faces don't have to >be right in *her* face every damn day. Exactly!!! Who the fuck are they to hog Tori's time? What the fuck have they done to earn the right to see her over and over and over? She's sick of them. They are vampires to her. She wishes they would go away and she could meet someone new. She appriciates that they like her. That's it. The "core" audience I'm speaking of are the ones who have supported Tori since her LE tour. the few that show up at every meet and greet. Very few. Like Richard. Everyone else at the meet and greet, well then, that's a different story. >> Personally I feel that if you want to truly thank Tori for how she has >> touched you, then you should reach out to others and help them. > >that's a bullshit answer, beth. maybe the people who follow tori >everywhere and hog the front of the meet'n'greet line at every show should >be the ones to take this advice. So do I. Some of them I literally dislike because they do nothing but absorb everybodies energy and hog the field. I wish they would do something to earn the right. > i firmly believe that many of the more >"established" fans have been selfish bastards on this tour. i've never >seen such kicking and shoving and rushing and manipulation of >hand-numbering in my life, and it disgusts me. what the hell happened to >lining up single file? > It got lost in the self-centered, self-absorbed additude of the New Fans. Those "established fans" the ones who got started on the DDI tour and continued the madness to this tour are selfish basterds. They do nothing for society. NOTHING. They are losers. What can Tori possibly say to them after seeing them for the umpteenth time. "uh, don't you have a life?" >> Work your >> ass off and after you have gotten Tori's attention, then you should have >> the opportunity to meet her. > >get tori's attention? how can anyone do that when the same 10 people are >up front every time? and doing good deeds doesn't really get tori's >attention - the chick ain't psychic. i've helped raise thousands of >dollars for RAINN through toricon, i've counselled tons of people myself, >but you don't see tori calling me up to thank me even though she actually >IS aware of it. nor should she. we don't do this stuff to get tori's >attention, do we? christ, i sure hope not. but we do go to meet'n'greets >to spend just a moment of time with her. > Right Aimee. YOU ARE ONE OF THOSE WHO DESERVE TO MEET TORI AND TELL HER WHAT YOU HAVE DONE BECAUSE OF HER INSPIRATION. SHE WOULD WANT TO MEET YOU!!! Nope, she ain't gonna call you up and say thanks. But if you tell her (cause sometimes she isn't psychic like you said), then she gets to smile and feel good and say "Thank You". The people who are spending ridiculous amounts of money to see Tori and do nothing else have no right to be taking your place. Period. Or any other person who has earned the right. >[snips] >> I think every person who attends the >> meet and greet should be able to finish the following statement: "Tori, >> your music inspired me to...(fill in good works here)". > >i think most of them already can. No, most of them are there to say, "I met Tori x times. I'm better than you are, na na na na naa." Because the ones who do deserve to meet Tori are the ones who are polite and think maybe fairness will reign so the assholes take over. There are very few in that core audience I speak of, the ones she needs to see. The ones everyone is complaining about, the deadheads who can't deal without seeing tori up close, the ones who do nothing else for her or anyone else should get out of the way. But they won't. so I say, EARN IT! Damn it. You have earned it, so have others. Why are you being cheated? Because of assholes. You agree with me. You just don't realize it yet. Fairy Blessings, Bethey I'm OK when everything's not OK cause it's the Fairies Revenge they say and I have always been a Fairy *************************************************************** *~**Fairy Blessings**~* ~~ tori trades and really deep thoughts~ a proud member of the Tori Traders Ring updated at least monthly http://www.angelfire.com/pa/bethey/ ------------------------------ End of precious-things-digest V3 #378 *************************************