From: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org (oppositeview-digest) To: oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Subject: oppositeview-digest V4 #266 Reply-To: oppositeview@smoe.org Sender: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk oppositeview-digest Friday, October 25 2002 Volume 04 : Number 266 Today's Subjects: ----------------- OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #265 [Dominiccrrll@aol.com] OV: What's on the CD? [=?iso-8859-1?q?Michael=20Holt?= ] Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 ["Jen Woyan" ] Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 [doug brown ] Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 [kristen hartwigsen ] Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 [debbsc67 ] OV: Eye Candy ["Rachel Wifall" ] OV: cd player ["Leah Schenkenberg" ] OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #265 [WENDY.CHEN@hakuhodo.co.jp] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 04:57:18 EDT From: Dominiccrrll@aol.com Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #265 Hey guys - My playlist at the moment - Savage Garden - Affirmation Tori Amos & BT - Blue Skies Omega and the Mechanical Animals The Wildhearts - Fishing For Luckies Del Amitri - Twisted Kevin Bloody Wilson - Santa Claus you C*nt. So, did we work out what the Del's are up to these days? D.C ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 19:40:14 +1000 (EST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Michael=20Holt?= Subject: OV: What's on the CD? Del Amitri - Lousy with Love U2 - Joshua Tree Cold Chisel AU - Chisel Gold Powderfinger AU - Odyssey Number 5 Pete Murray AU - The Game Miles From Nowhere AU - Shimmering Blue Way to Blue: An Introduction to Nick Drake Take care, Michael:) --- Dominiccrrll@aol.com wrote: > Hey guys - > My playlist at the moment - > > Savage Garden - Affirmation > Tori Amos & BT - Blue Skies > Omega and the Mechanical Animals > The Wildhearts - Fishing For Luckies > Del Amitri - Twisted > Kevin Bloody Wilson - Santa Claus you C*nt. > > So, did we work out what the Del's are up to these > days? > > D.C http://careers.yahoo.com.au - Yahoo! Careers - - 1,000's of jobs waiting online for you! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 12:18:47 +0100 From: "Tina Maidman" Subject: OV: what's in my cd/minidisc Oh your so funny Nigel - cd for a tea tray.....;.))))) ! My current fav's 1. Foo Fighters (live bootleg from Reading 2002) 2. Supergrass Life On Other Planets 3. Police/Sting Greatest Hits 4. Badly Drawn Boy (anything I get my hands on!) 5. Sugababes Angels with Dirty Faces 6. The Hives My Favorite.... Tina x ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 09:34:30 -0500 From: "Jen Woyan" Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 Don't taunt me, Welshman.... In an enlightened society, one is allowed, nay, encouraged, to explore circumstances and worldviews divergent from their own. Aristotle I believe said something to the effect, "The unexamined life is not worth living..." I love Sting as a live artist and as a nurturer of live talent. And, the man used to make me hot (sometimes he still does - but that's beside the point). I feel happy and safe in a world where I can embrace the openness and freedom to love Sting. And Radiohead. And Peter Gabriel. And Robbie Williams. And. Melissa ferrick. And Sam Cooke. And Sarah Vaughn. And Pink Floyd. And Dave Brubeck. And Queens of the Stone Age. And Sons of the Never Wrong. And. Stone Temple Pilots. And Elvis Costello. And Joe Jackson. And Mansun. And Blur. And Roxy Music. (you get the idea...) If nothing else, this entire thread has made it plain yet again that musical affection and musical taste are wholy subjective animals which aren't easily classified - and, if I can get off on another tangent - are in no way being developed nor nurtured by radio or media in general on any level, in any marketplace. When a corporation like Clear Channel can own 65% of US radio stations (including 40% of college radio stations), and 45% of all US concert venues AND (as they recently have done) offered to sell the demographic information gleaned from these holdings back to the record labels as "market research" for their new releases (which of course comes off the top as "recoupable expenses") - we seem doomed to radio and other media outlets spewing out the identical dreck ad infinitum. So it's heartening to see that a myriad of good music is loved by a myriad of good people, as least as witnessed by OV's little slice of the humanity pie in this thread. But seriously, thank you, Nigel, for openning up this dialogue, of a sort (even if it's only in my head). The Video/DVD in question (Sting) has a really good vibe of musicians working together in a creative environment - and what's wrong with that, eh? Gives me a warm fuzzy when I watch it. And isn't that the point of music and entertainment? Luv ya & hope to hook up in January, Jen in Chicago - ----Original Message Follows---- From: NIGELBLUES@aol.com To: oppositeview@smoe.org Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 19:48:04 EDT Jen Woyan writes writes: > Sting - ...All This Time > (if you can get the video of the 9/11/01 performance in Tuscany > - I HIGHLY recommend it!) > Jen - I hope you're highly recommending it as a tea tray rather than an audio visual masterpiece. I mean - Sting?? _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 09:38:38 -0500 From: "Jen Woyan" Subject: Re: OV: what's in my cd/minidisc Actually, stick a CD in your microwave for 2-4 seconds and after the snap-crackle-popping ends, it gets this brilliant pattern in it which makes a pretty candle-coaster... It's a good thing. (hell, if Martha Stewart's goin' to prison, does that mean it's open season on her home decor/lifestyle empire? Just a thought...) Cheers, Jen - ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Tina Maidman" To: "ovlist" Subject: OV: what's in my cd/minidisc Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 12:18:47 +0100 Oh your so funny Nigel - cd for a tea tray.....;.))))) ! My current fav's 1. Foo Fighters (live bootleg from Reading 2002) 2. Supergrass Life On Other Planets 3. Police/Sting Greatest Hits 4. Badly Drawn Boy (anything I get my hands on!) 5. Sugababes Angels with Dirty Faces 6. The Hives My Favorite.... Tina x _________________________________________________________________ Internet access plans that fit your lifestyle -- join MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:11:41 -0700 (PDT) From: doug brown Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 Geez quit blaming the music industry for the sorry state of the biz when the real problem is ... yes females. Who buys N'Synch, Backstreet Boys, Britney, S Club, Spice Girls and all the other radio pop fluff? It isn't the guys. Who judges bands entirely by the attractiveness of the lead singer and other people in the band? Do you really think the Dels would have gotten as far as they have if Justin and Iain were ugly? At Dels shows the guys sit in the back and enjoy the music and the women crowd the stage to drool over Justin ("he stepped on my hand and sweated all over me sigh!") Iain and Andy (lol). I've never heard any female talk about Sting without having to listen to how sexy is. If you like his crappy music fine but give me a break with the tantric sex appeal haha. He's some northern git that (this is true) does not use soaps or deoderants. If women ever got to smell him he'd be selling a lot less CDs. So pulease stop blaming the poor beleaguered music industry for just giving their biggest spending consumers what they want, and take a good look at who's buying the stuff and why. > If nothing else, this entire thread has made it > plain yet again that musical > affection and musical taste are wholy subjective > animals which aren't easily > classified - and, if I can get off on another > tangent - are in no way being > developed nor nurtured by radio or media in general > on any level, in any > marketplace. ===== - -Doug . Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:15:21 -0700 (PDT) From: "Carol D'Amico" Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 Justin and Ian ARE ugly....and for the record, i hate sting with every bone in my body...his vioce, his music and YES his looks. he sux carol doug brown wrote:Geez quit blaming the music industry for the sorry state of the biz when the real problem is ... yes females. Who buys N'Synch, Backstreet Boys, Britney, S Club, Spice Girls and all the other radio pop fluff? It isn't the guys. Who judges bands entirely by the attractiveness of the lead singer and other people in the band? Do you really think the Dels would have gotten as far as they have if Justin and Iain were ugly? At Dels shows the guys sit in the back and enjoy the music and the women crowd the stage to drool over Justin ("he stepped on my hand and sweated all over me sigh!") Iain and Andy (lol). I've never heard any female talk about Sting without having to listen to how sexy is. If you like his crappy music fine but give me a break with the tantric sex appeal haha. He's some northern git that (this is true) does not use soaps or deoderants. If women ever got to smell him he'd be selling a lot less CDs. So pulease stop blaming the poor beleaguered music industry for just giving their biggest spending consumers what they want, and take a good look at who's buying the stuff and why. > If nothing else, this entire thread has made it > plain yet again that musical > affection and musical taste are wholy subjective > animals which aren't easily > classified - and, if I can get off on another > tangent - are in no way being > developed nor nurtured by radio or media in general > on any level, in any > marketplace. ===== - -Doug . Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 16:32:43 +0100 From: "Tina Maidman" Subject: Fw: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tina Maidman" To: "ovlist" Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 4:19 PM Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 > Couldn't agree more with ya Jen! > I was lucky enough to be at the 'All This Time' show in Italy, it was > without doubt one of the best shows I've ever seen. Whatever you think of > Sting he is still one of the best singer/songwriters to perform live. > > ... I'll go back to my hole now. > Tinax > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jen Woyan" > To: ; > Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 3:34 PM > Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 > > > > Don't taunt me, Welshman.... > > > > In an enlightened society, one is allowed, nay, encouraged, to explore > > circumstances and worldviews divergent from their own. Aristotle I believe > > said something to the effect, "The unexamined life is not worth living..." > I > > love Sting as a live artist and as a nurturer of live talent. And, the > man > > used to make me hot (sometimes he still does - but that's beside the > point). > > I feel happy and safe in a world where I can embrace the openness and > > freedom to love Sting. And Radiohead. And Peter Gabriel. And Robbie > > Williams. And. Melissa ferrick. And Sam Cooke. And Sarah Vaughn. And > Pink > > Floyd. And Dave Brubeck. And Queens of the Stone Age. And Sons of the > > Never Wrong. And. Stone Temple Pilots. And Elvis Costello. And Joe > Jackson. > > And Mansun. And Blur. And Roxy Music. (you get the idea...) > > > > If nothing else, this entire thread has made it plain yet again that > musical > > affection and musical taste are wholy subjective animals which aren't > easily > > classified - and, if I can get off on another tangent - are in no way > being > > developed nor nurtured by radio or media in general on any level, in any > > marketplace. When a corporation like Clear Channel can own 65% of US > radio > > stations (including 40% of college radio stations), and 45% of all US > > concert venues AND (as they recently have done) offered to sell the > > demographic information gleaned from these holdings back to the record > > labels as "market research" for their new releases (which of course comes > > off the top as "recoupable expenses") - we seem doomed to radio and other > > media outlets spewing out the identical dreck ad infinitum. So it's > > heartening to see that a myriad of good music is loved by a myriad of good > > people, as least as witnessed by OV's little slice of the humanity pie in > > this thread. > > > > But seriously, thank you, Nigel, for openning up this dialogue, of a sort > > (even if it's only in my head). The Video/DVD in question (Sting) has a > > really good vibe of musicians working together in a creative environment - > > and what's wrong with that, eh? Gives me a warm fuzzy when I watch it. > And > > isn't that the point of music and entertainment? > > > > Luv ya & hope to hook up in January, > > Jen in Chicago > > > > ----Original Message Follows---- > > From: NIGELBLUES@aol.com > > To: oppositeview@smoe.org > > Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 > > Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 19:48:04 EDT > > > > Jen Woyan writes writes: > > > > > > > Sting - ...All This Time > > > (if you can get the video of the 9/11/01 performance in Tuscany > > > - I HIGHLY recommend it!) > > > > > > > Jen - I hope you're highly recommending it as a tea tray rather than an > > audio > > visual masterpiece. I mean - Sting?? > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online > > http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:40:56 -0500 From: "Jen Woyan" Subject: OV: OT - Kinda - Clear Channel pushes research firm Mediabase in showdown against ri Clear Channel pushes research firm Mediabase in showdown against rival Nielsen BDS http://www.latimes.com/templates/misc/printstory.jsp?slug=la%2Dfi%2Dradio23oct23§ion=%2Fbusiness By Jeff Leeds LA Times Staff Writer October 23 2002 In 140 cities across the country, music detectives at a research service called Mediabase sit in front of personal computers listening to seven-second snippets of radio broadcasts. It is, in a sense, the high-stakes corporate equivalent of "Name That Tune." For a decade, record labels relied on Nielsen Broadcast Data Systems to track how often their songs received play -- or "spins" -- on radio stations. But three years ago, broadcasting giant Clear Channel Communications Inc. entered the game when it bought Mediabase. Now, Mediabase's sales staff is receiving backup from Clear Channel's radio programmers, who wield enormous clout at record labels starving for airplay. San Antonio-based Clear Channel owns about 1,200 radio stations, six times more than its most powerful rival, Viacom Inc.'s Infinity Broadcasting. Record executives say Clear Channel's aggressive push for Mediabase is the latest example of how the industry giant is using its size and reach to tap into the tens of millions of dollars spent on radio promotion by major record labels. Clear Channel executives deny that they require their own stations to use Mediabase data. But recently, the music director at Clear Channel's Z-100 in New York, an influential pop radio station, had some news for record industry officials. "Z-100 exclusively only looks at Mediabase for any song information," music director Cubby Bryant said in an e-mail to a label pitching a new R&B record. "I thought I'd give you the scoop. We only care about Mediabase numbers." Bryant said his station's policy is not part of a mandate from Clear Channel management. But he also made clear that he doesn't mind helping out a sister company. "We knew the rest of the country wasn't quite on the Mediabase bandwagon yet," he said. "But after awhile we said we should start spreading the word." Record executives say Bryant isn't the only Clear Channel programmer touting Mediabase. Besides Clear Channel's muscle, another advantage that Mediabase has over BDS is cost. In many cases, Mediabase is able to offer its service to record labels at a lower price because it is effectively subsidized by its deals with stations. The two services essentially square off in a matchup of man versus machine. BDS places inaudible "tags" in new songs and positions computer-equipped radio tuners in more than 125 markets to listen for the tags as they are broadcast from more than 1,100 stations. The equipment forwards the information to BDS, which tallies the number of plays of each song and compiles nationwide data for delivery every morning -- and in another BDS service, those numbers are updated online every few minutes. By contrast, Mediabase relies on people, not computers, to track airplay. The company "skims," or samples, broadcasts from radio stations, and in turn sends audio feeds to 135 music experts scattered around the country. Their task is to determine whether each clip is a lyrical blast from Eminem, guitar solos from U2 or snippets of a Christina Aguilera melody, then fill in the song's title on a station log sent to a central database. "Every piece of audio passes a human ear before it is journaled," said Rich Meyer, Mediabase's president. "That gives Mediabase an edge, for example, in identifying a 'leaked' song," which BDS may not have entered into its computers. BDS, however, maintains that its electronic monitors are superior to humans, and it remains the dominant market research company at major labels. "Our product is more accurate and ... is delivered in a more timely manner than our competitor's," said Rob Sisco, executive vice president for Nielsen BDS. The company is a unit of Dutch conglomerate VNU, which also owns the Nielsen TV ratings service and Billboard magazine. (Billboard, the music industry bible, bought an interest in BDS long ago when it began using the company's statistics on its pages.) Before BDS pioneered electronic monitoring, play charts were based entirely on verbal reports made by radio personnel, whom executives say were easily corrupted with gifts and money from record labels. Radio play remains the most powerful tool to sell new music. BDS and Mediabase monitor the playlists of 1,100 radio stations among the 12,000 stations scattered across the country. The five major record conglomerates pay about $15 million a year for the two rival tracking services -- sometimes buying both BDS and Mediabase numbers in order to cross-check them -- but the total amount of money at stake is considerably greater. Playlists have a domino effect on music promotion campaigns, record store retail orders, concert bookings and bonuses awarded to record label promotion executives. With album sales sliding amid rampant music piracy, record labels are scrambling to cut costs and are questioning whether they can support two duplicative airplay services. Earlier this year, the world's biggest music company, Universal Music Group, owned by Vivendi Universal, threatened to drop BDS and keep only Mediabase. Ultimately, Universal Music cut a one-year contract for access to BDS at a lower cost, according to industry sources. "This is a horrible choice," said one Universal executive. Because of BDS' higher fees, "you'd love it if you could go with their competitor. But then you say to yourself, do you really want to empower Clear Channel? You're sort of caught." But Mediabase's influence is growing. In addition to being the service used by many large radio stations, its charts are published in Radio & Records magazine and serve as the rankings for programs such as "Rick Dees Weekly Top 40," which is syndicated by Clear Channel unit Premiere Radio Networks. For its part, New York-based BDS isn't standing still. It has started moving more aggressively into Mediabase's traditional turf, pursing radio stations as clients; BDS now claims 350 stations as subscribers. Mediabase has 1,100 radio station clients -- of which about 25% are owned by Clear Channel, the company said. A Clear Channel spokeswoman said she was not aware of any of the company's 1,200 stations using BDS's services. BDS contends, however, that's not because they aren't interested. "Many Clear Channel programmers have told us they would prefer to subscribe to BDS," asserted Sisco, the Nielsen executive, "but are forbidden to by corporate edict." _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:46:55 -0400 From: "Josh Neas" Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #265 Yes, I cannot resist either. Jurassic 5 - _Power in Numbers_ : The return of one of hip-hop's most vibrant and diverse community of MCs. Their 2000 masterpiece, _Quality Control_, really gave me high standards for this album but it totally meets the expectations. At first listen it didn't grab me, but upon repeated spins..it just gets better. It's more subtle than the hooky, immediate brilliance of their previous work. The Cash Brothers - _How Was Tomorrow?_ : I heard their song "Nebraska" on a Loose Records compilation. (Some of you UK folk might know Loose.) It totally floored me. A song..about a guy..who gets dumped..and he's sitting in his car waiting for the light to turn green (heh - metaphor) and listening to Bruce Springsteen's _Nebraska_ album. So perfect. The album is a precious gem of how good alt-country still is. Q and Not U - _Different Damage_ : So, a band forms, they start a distinctive style of post-punk, they lose their bass player, totally re-invent themselves and the result is an album every bit as inventive and different as their debut was. This is the result. These guys are on Dischord Records, the granddaddy of post-punk labels in the US. I love it. Nicolai Dunger - _Soul Rush_ : Swedish Van Morrison! That's all I hear! This album is like a modern-day _Astral Weeks_, I shit you not. Jazz backing band, those vocals. It's really good. and a few songs I love recently... Bob Dylan - "All I Really Wanna Do" from _Another Side of.._ : Playful, funny Dylan was so great back in the day. He still is (e.g. "Poor Boy" from _Love and Theft_) The Church - "Under the Milky Way" from _Starfish_ : I played this on my radio show last night and it's such a beautiful song. I don't know that anyone can...but if you're in the Greensboro/Winston-Salem/High Point area of North Carolina, check out 90.9 FM WQFS Guilford College radio. On Wednesday nights from 6pm-8pm is my show, J's Indie/Rock Mayhem. I play a ton of different stuff, so yeah. I'm also the head music director..so if you listen to a rotation show, my imprint is all over that, too. ;) josh. _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 16:41:43 +0100 From: "Libby Graham" Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 Doug, Doug, Doug ....... I love your polemics! May I just mention Kylie Minogue - what other explanation is there rather than men fancying her rather than her "musical talent" ....... anyone here remember the fuss about that white outfit in that video?? And I'd say more ugly blokes have hits than ugly girls ...... how else can you explain Shane McGowan? I bet a female equivalent of him wouldn't even get near a record label. And the majority of singles are bought by young children (of both genders) and sales are based on what the chart return shops stock and what gets onto radio playlists. Depressing, but there it is. Older people have stopped buying the singles format hence the kiddies views hit the charts and immediately drop out again. It's a pretty long time since we have had records that spent months climbing the charts. It's just that record labels are owned by mega-corps who don't understand the concept of investing in and developing talent. More happy to go for the quick rise and crash of Hear Say rather than develop a long-term career. And I have been to concerts and seen grown men drooling over female performers - one of my funniest memories of being at aCowboy Junkies concert and having a drunk west-countryman (a stranger) shouting to the lead singer about how much he loved her :-) And various others around saying how gorgeous she looked! Back to lurking again ..... Libby - ----- Original Message ----- From: "doug brown" To: Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 4:11 PM Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 > So pulease stop blaming the poor beleaguered music > industry for just giving their biggest spending > consumers what they want, and take a good look at > who's buying the stuff and why. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 09:02:46 -0700 From: " Lauree Perry" Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 Doug, Sorry, I don't buy music by any of those bands, and I can't stand Sting - either musically or physically. And I think guys drool over girls in bands just as much as girls do over guys - - even going back as far as the days of the Go-Gos, and Deborah Harry from Blondie. (Though I do like Blondie) Lauree On Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:11:41 -0700 (PDT) doug brown wrote: > Geez quit blaming the music industry for the > sorry > state of the biz when the real problem is ... > yes > females. Who buys N'Synch, Backstreet Boys, > Britney, S > Club, Spice Girls and all the other radio pop > fluff? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:02:13 +0200 From: "Webcameraden" Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #265 This is indeed one of the best albums ever made. I listen to it almost every week (well... Let's say: month). Check out the Jason Falkner solo-album 'Can you still feel'!!! ief > > > 5. Jellyfish - Bellybutton (I don't know why I didn't > > > get into them more than I did at the time I got this. > > > What was wrong with me? Oh yeah, still blinded by the > > > Dels :-) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 18:28:40 +0100 From: "Duncan Conry" Subject: OV: No Dels Content I went to see Alison Moyet at Royal Concert Hall in Glasgow the other night and she was fantastic.Her voice range was amazing,she still looks the same after all these years.She looked to be really enjoying herself.I have saw many bands over the years but never have I heard such a powerful voice. My five are Richard Ashcroft-new album Alison Moyet-new album Kiss-Psycho Circus ELO-Greatest Hits Motley Crue-Theatre Of Pain ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:42:35 -0700 (PDT) From: kristen hartwigsen Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 Okay, I agree here to a point. Those girls that are drooling over Coldplay because they think that Chris Martin is sexy but really couldn't tell you athing about the music, or go see John Mayer because they wish that "Your Body is a Wonderland" was written for them really make me mad. Those girly girls are the reason that I can no longer go see Coldplay or John Mayer at a smaller more intimate venue, and I am sorry, but seeing them in a stadium, cool as it might be for them, is just not the same experience. Elvis Costello still plays the smaller venues, but then Cruel Smile, the new one, is stuck at 180 on Billboard, where Coldplay entered at #5, so... It wasn't until I saw the Trouble video that I even associated Coldplay with people, until then they were just a good band that I am sure had members, but I didn't really care, just so long as they were making good music. It is much the same way for me with Del Amitri, sure, I am trying to convince my friend to call me Ruby now, so that I can be the next Justin Currie (a female one at that! HA!) but most of the time I don't think about them as people, but as a group. Twisted is the only album that really showcases their seperate talents in my mind. And take a look at someone like William Topley. Decidedly unattractive, I mean really, but even here in Colorado the guy is a huge success, because it doesn't matter, we all like his music, it is catchy and it is interesting, and the fact that he is short, has a belly and has that long hair but is balding on top look going doesn't really matter. So I think, yes, those silly litlle girls that were all over N'SYNC because they were hot and are now strying into good music ruin it for all of us, but I also think that there are plenty of females out there that are in it for the music. For the record I would like to beat all those silly girls up if given the opportunity. Well folks, that was my rant for the day, sorry! Have a good one! Kris - --- doug brown wrote: > Geez quit blaming the music industry for the sorry > state of the biz when the real problem is ... yes > females. Who buys N'Synch, Backstreet Boys, Britney, > S > Club, Spice Girls and all the other radio pop fluff? > It isn't the guys. Who judges bands entirely by the > attractiveness of the lead singer and other people > in > the band? Do you really think the Dels would have > gotten as far as they have if Justin and Iain were > ugly? At Dels shows the guys sit in the back and > enjoy > the music and the women crowd the stage to drool > over > Justin ("he stepped on my hand and sweated all over > me > sigh!") Iain and Andy (lol). I've never heard any > female talk about Sting without having to listen to > how sexy is. If you like his crappy music fine but > give me a break with the tantric sex appeal haha. > He's > some northern git that (this is true) does not use > soaps or deoderants. If women ever got to smell him > he'd be selling a lot less CDs. > > So pulease stop blaming the poor beleaguered music > industry for just giving their biggest spending > consumers what they want, and take a good look at > who's buying the stuff and why. > > > If nothing else, this entire thread has made it > > plain yet again that musical > > affection and musical taste are wholy subjective > > animals which aren't easily > > classified - and, if I can get off on another > > tangent - are in no way being > > developed nor nurtured by radio or media in > general > > on any level, in any > > marketplace. > > ===== > -Doug > > > > . > Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site > http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 12:00:48 -0700 (PDT) From: debbsc67 Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #265 Hey, thanks for the tip! I really don't know anything about the members of the band, but I guess I'd better go back and learn more. I probably wouldn't have thought about them at all, but when I was in Glasgow in December, Russ Hunt (The Wonder Stuff lead singer's brother) was really raving about Jellyfish and was excited about a new boxed set that was coming out. I was going through some old stuff a couple of weeks about and ran across Bellybutton, so out it finally came. (The CD, not *my* bellybutton. LOL) I've also checked out another couple of CDs since I posted the other day. I've listened to the new Rhett Miller CD. There's at least one song that's nothing more than a string of cliches, which is disappointing, but overall it's pretty good. It's more back to his original "folk kid" stuff, than Old 97's which is fine by me. I liked him when he was just a little folkie kid with glasses and a big guitar. 8-) The other is Spirit of the West. I *finally* got some Spirit of the West!!! Man am I glad I did. I'm really enjoying it! have a great day, debbie - --- Webcameraden wrote: > This is indeed one of the best albums ever made. I > listen to it > almost every week (well... Let's say: month). Check > out the Jason > Falkner solo-album 'Can you still feel'!!! > > ief > > > > > > 5. Jellyfish - Bellybutton (I don't know why I > didn't > > > > get into them more than I did at the time I > got this. > > > > What was wrong with me? Oh yeah, still blinded > by the > > > > Dels :-) Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 12:44:11 -0700 (PDT) From: debbsc67 Subject: Re: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #264 All right now, we're being a bit harsh here now aren't we? You can't say that Justin and Iain ARE ugly (beauty is in the eye of the beholder), but you're certainly entitled to feel that they seem ugly TO YOU. And as far as Sting goes. I liked him in The Police and even when he first went solo (not to the extent that Jen does, though), but I've never thought he was sexy in any way, shape, or form. As far as the boy/girl band fluff, I've never bought a lick of the stuff, so sorry, Doug, you're wrong there in blaming women in general, especially in blaming "females" for the entire state of the music industry!? Ridiculous! I'd be quite willing to speculate that the majority of the corporate "big-wigs" using the marketing formula Jen referred to are men. We could blame the kids, since they're the one's buying the tasteless crap. That might be fair, but if it weren't out there for them to buy, they'd buy something else wouldn't they? No, I think we're right to blame the music execs who foist this junk on the buying public. If you found yourself at a vending machine and they only had juice and water for sale, you wouldn't be able to buy soda would you? You'd have to buy something good for ya. :-) something to think about, debbie - --- Carol D'Amico wrote: > Justin and Ian ARE ugly....and for the record, i > hate sting with every bone in my body...his vioce, > his music and YES his looks. he sux > carol > doug brown wrote:Geez quit > blaming the music industry for the sorry > state of the biz when the real problem is ... yes > females. Who buys N'Synch, Backstreet Boys, Britney, > S > Club, Spice Girls and all the other radio pop fluff? > It isn't the guys. Who judges bands entirely by the > attractiveness of the lead singer and other people > in > the band? Do you really think the Dels would have > gotten as far as they have if Justin and Iain were > ugly? At Dels shows the guys sit in the back and > enjoy > the music and the women crowd the stage to drool > over > Justin ("he stepped on my hand and sweated all over > me > sigh!") Iain and Andy (lol). I've never heard any > female talk about Sting without having to listen to > how sexy is. If you like his crappy music fine but > give me a break with the tantric sex appeal haha. > He's > some northern git that (this is true) does not use > soaps or deoderants. If women ever got to smell him > he'd be selling a lot less CDs. > > So pulease stop blaming the poor beleaguered music > industry for just giving their biggest spending > consumers what they want, and take a good look at > who's buying the stuff and why. > > > If nothing else, this entire thread has made it > > plain yet again that musical > > affection and musical taste are wholy subjective > > animals which aren't easily > > classified - and, if I can get off on another > > tangent - are in no way being > > developed nor nurtured by radio or media in > general > > on any level, in any > > marketplace. > > ===== > -Doug > > > > . > Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site > http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ > Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 15:41:07 -0400 From: "Rachel Wifall" Subject: OV: Eye Candy >Geez quit blaming the music industry for the sorry >state of the biz when the real problem is ... yes >females. Who buys N'Synch, Backstreet Boys, Britney, S >Club, Spice Girls and all the other radio pop fluff? >It isn't the guys. Who judges bands entirely by the >attractiveness of the lead singer and other people in >the band? Hold on...I've found it disturbing to notice how girls and women like boy bands and male musicians because they're "cute," whereas it's the female performers who seem to feel the need to sell their bodies like mad. N'Synch and the Backstreet Boys sing and dance completely clothed, as do Sting and Justin Currie. Sure, Enrico Iglesias plays up on a latino sexiness, but he's also not singing in a g-string. It's the "women" like Britney, Christina Aquilera, Mariah Carey (who, incidentally, went to grade school and high school with me) and others who are getting slutty to make money. Are we women telling them to do this? Are we the ones checking out their bodies and buying their music because they're "hot?" Are women running the music industry and marketing other women in this way? Think about it. Rachel _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 22:00:54 -0500 From: "Leah Schenkenberg" Subject: OV: cd player well, now that the list has sufficiently spilled forth their dislike for sting, I guess I'll plug in my five, not that they've changed much since the last time we did this: jim croce - great love songs police - message in a box #2 police - message in a box #1 del amitri - change everything pete yorn - musicforthemorngingafter john mayer - room for squares self esteem mix tape - made by best friend, includes you're unbelievable, i'm too sexy, theme from space odyssey, take a chance on me, et al. I know I know, I'm a groupie. I've taken notes from a few suggestions though...I'm trying to break out of my del amitri/the police/carly simon mode (no carly on the list this time at least). nobody's perfect... leah The yellow fog that rubs its back upon the window-panes, The yellow smoke that rubs its muzzle on the window-panes Licked its tongue into the corners of the evening, Lingered upon the pools that stand in drains, Let fall upon its back the soot that falls from chimneys, Slipped by the terrace, made a sudden leap, And seeing that it was a soft October night, Curled once about the house, and fell asleep. --The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock, T.S. Eliot ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 16:50:51 +0900 From: WENDY.CHEN@hakuhodo.co.jp Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V4 #265 David Wartik wrote: >I was so excited to see that someone else has heard of Paul Kelly!! >To anyone out there, see if you can pick up any of Paul's CD's (like Words & Music or Songs from the South or Nothing but a Dream). Paul Kelly is a legend! There is not another musician alive or dead out there that I respect more. It doesn't surprise me that there are other fans of his on this list, being that we all have such good taste musically and lyrically to begin with. For anyone thinking of giving Paul a go, I second getting Songs from the South first. It is a fantastic retrospective of his work. I see him as Australia's John Lennon, Bob Dylan and Bruce Springsteen all in one. Nothing But a Dream recently won an ARIA (Oz Grammy) for best adult contemporary album. Here's a sample of what you can expect: http://www.paulkelly.com.au/lyrics/just-about-to-break.html also check out the Woomera Song on the top page. In the absence of more news on the Dels you won't go wrong with PK. Wendy in Tokyo (ex Melbourne) ------------------------------ End of oppositeview-digest V4 #266 **********************************