From: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org (oppositeview-digest) To: oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Subject: oppositeview-digest V4 #151 Reply-To: oppositeview@smoe.org Sender: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk oppositeview-digest Tuesday, June 11 2002 Volume 04 : Number 151 Today's Subjects: ----------------- OV: Dels/Cousteau [Kelly Doudna ] OV: What's next? [SngWrite1@aol.com] OV: What's next? ["Ed Minton" ] Re: OV: What's next? [Robert Martin ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 08:46:59 -0500 From: Kelly Doudna Subject: OV: Dels/Cousteau I returned from my trip to the UK to learn that all of the Macs in my office had been stolen the weekend before (they left the Windows machines. Hmm...). Anyway, in the course of attempting to recover lost files, I've been slowly re-MP3-ing the Del Amitri albums (for my own personal use, nothing more) and so have been listening to the back catalog which I had been forsaking in an attempt to hurry up and learn "Can You Do Me Good" before the concerts. I just have to say, wow! I had forgotten what an overall superb album "Twisted" is. They all are in their own ways, but "Twisted" is the one that stands out for me, even though some of my favorite favorite songs are on other albums. I'm attempting to "convert" my mother. Before I left on the trip, I mailed her my "Hatful of Rain" disc so that she could begin to understand why Del Amitri were an important part of my itinerary. After her first listening, she said she could hear some ELO influences, though I never got her to elaborate on that. Now she says she's listened to it three times and quite likes a lot of it. :-) Cousteau (the opening act for all but the last gig): Astute American concert-goers may have noticed a familiar tune in a Nissan Altima tv commercial. The car is pulling up to an intersection to the sound of a camera shutter being fired. After a few seconds, what do you hear but "the flugelhorn song," "Last Good Day of the Year" from their first album. I first saw the commercial a day or two after my return and knew I knew the music from somewhere... I have subsequently purchased Cousteau's album and am waiting on the second, which is released today, I believe. I know they weren't everybody's cup of tea, but I rather like them. They've got Italian and U.S. tour dates on their website. http://www.cousteau.tv Kelly Minneapolis ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 18:20:41 EDT From: SngWrite1@aol.com Subject: OV: What's next? If you're a fan of Del Amitri (and by nature of you being on this list you probably are) you might currently be wondering, as I do, what the future holds for the boys. Doesn't look like they're gonna make that 300,000 mark any time soon. The record company obviously has no interest in them, based on the non-existant "marketing" of the album and single. There has been no news of any record deal for the US either, which doesn't bode well for any hopes we Yanks may have had for some shows that didn't require trans-continental airfare. And it also appears Justin's writing contributions didn't make it onto the Ronan Keating record as thought. So what next? Just a slow slide into further obscurity? Was the brief, and highly praised UK tour a swan-song? We can all point fingers and guess as to what went wrong - bad label and bad management making bad decisions (consider this a pre-emptive strike Doug!) - but that doesn't answer the question. WHAT HAPPENS NOW? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 20:40:13 -0500 From: "Ed Minton" Subject: OV: What's next? Delurking momentarily to post a fairly negatively feeling response. Sorry, but I think you've answered your own question: "bad label and bad management making bad decisions" And, this is not new. It's been that way from the beginning. Further compounding the lack of promotion, they simply have not played enough. They have always been underexposed. Despite reading many references to their "alleged" extensive touring history, particulary in the British press, I'd be surprised if they've played 300 shows in America, or 500 worldwide, over the course of their whole career. If that number sounds like a lot, simply for a comparison, I can tell you that Wilco, for example, averages 125 per year. I'm not sure that the Dels ever personally understood that this is what is necessary to "make it" in America. Or, if they did, then "making it" is simply not something that they've ever been particularly interested in. I'd just like for them to be successful enough to continue to write, record, and play in America. I think that part of the problem is the huge difference in the British and American markets, too. From what I can tell, rock bands are still fairly common in the UK charts. Not in America. Not anymore. Here's the Top Ten, according to the current issue of Rolling Stone: 1) Musiq/Juslisen 2) Celine Dion/A New Day Has Come 3) Lauryn Hill/MTV Unplugged 4) Ashanti/Ashanti 5) Spider Man Soundtrack 6) Sheryl Crow/C'mon, C'mon 7) Kenny Chesney/No Shirt, No Shoes, No Problem 8) Various Artists/Now 9 9) Josh Groban/Josh Groban 10) Big Tymers/Hood Rich Easy to see why Del Amitri do not fit into anyone's marketing scheme in America. (Neither do I!!!!). The College Radio chart is a considerably more friendly. Bands of the moment, like "Creed," "Nickleback,"and "Sugar Ray" are more an exception than the rule on the American pop charts these days. I'm sure that those bands are playing 150+ shows per year over the last couple of years. The Goo Goo Dolls are a band that have been somewhat successful, largely due to enduring a grueling tour schedule for several years, prior to scoring a "hit." I've always wondered why the Dels are so driven by the pop market, but I've come to the conclusion that it's just their UK orientation. Justin goes on about wanting a number one single. Why in the world would he care? Name a "Number One" hit, (in America), from the past three years that didn't suck. Do you think "writers" like John Hiatt, for example, give a rat's ass whether or not they've written a hit single? I don't think so. Not these days. But I'll bet he plays that 125 to 150 shows every year, and makes a decent living. And I don't believe the Dels have it in them to do that. I think they wanna be "stars." So, back to your queston. WHAT HAPPENS NOW? Don't you see? As far as JPR is concerned, NOTHING EVER HAPPENS. Unfortunately, it seems to me that Justin and Iain have always seemed content to wait for someone else to make it happen for them, so if there's blame to talk about, then there's probably plenty to pass around. So, I'm afraid that as you say, "a slow slide into further obscurity" seems the most likely scenario. I hope I'm wrong, because I think that Justin is one of the most talented singer/songwriters out there today. Maybe some filmaker will use one of their songs and they'll sneak into the American conciousness through the back door.... Cheers, Ed "who thinks that if the Dels would play 125 shows in America every year, everything would take care of itself" Minton ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 21:33:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Martin Subject: Re: OV: What's next? hi ed and all, right on the button. there are certainly two groups of artists in america these days. live rock and roll bands and label generated puppet bands. the examples ed used, creed, nickelback, goo goo dolls and i'll add a few more, default, korn, p.o.d. and system of a down have all tremendous chart success because of relentless touring. other road warriors like blues traveller, the black crowes, widespread panic and the pat mcgee band, while not exactly burning up the charts, have carved out financial comfort from relentless touring. the dels could very easily fit into either of these two categories. with songs that rival the best of this or any generation and rock and roll chops to boot, they would be a sensation on the live circuit. you just got to be willing to take the bull by the horns. it's not too late... cheers, rob Ed Minton wrote: Delurking momentarily to post a fairly negatively feeling response. Sorry, but I think you've answered your own question: "bad label and bad management making bad decisions" And, this is not new. It's been that way from the beginning. Further compounding the lack of promotion, they simply have not played enough. They have always been underexposed. Despite reading many references to their "alleged" extensive touring history, particulary in the British press, I'd be surprised if they've played 300 shows in America, or 500 worldwide, over the course of their whole career. If that number sounds like a lot, simply for a comparison, I can tell you that Wilco, for example, averages 125 per year. I'm not sure that the Dels ever personally understood that this is what is necessary to "make it" in America. Or, if they did, then "making it" is simply not something that they've ever been particularly interested in. I'd just like for them to be successful enough to continue to write, record, and play in America. I think that part of the problem is the huge difference in the British and American markets, too. From what I can tell, rock bands are still fairly common in the UK charts. Not in America. Not anymore. Here's the Top Ten, according to the current issue of Rolling Stone: 1) Musiq/Juslisen 2) Celine Dion/A New Day Has Come 3) Lauryn Hill/MTV Unplugged 4) Ashanti/Ashanti 5) Spider Man Soundtrack 6) Sheryl Crow/C'mon, C'mon 7) Kenny Chesney/No Shirt, No Shoes, No Problem 8) Various Artists/Now 9 9) Josh Groban/Josh Groban 10) Big Tymers/Hood Rich Easy to see why Del Amitri do not fit into anyone's marketing scheme in America. (Neither do I!!!!). The College Radio chart is a considerably more friendly. Bands of the moment, like "Creed," "Nickleback,"and "Sugar Ray" are more an exception than the rule on the American pop charts these days. I'm sure that those bands are playing 150+ shows per year over the last couple of years. The Goo Goo Dolls are a band that have been somewhat successful, largely due to enduring a grueling tour schedule for several years, prior to scoring a "hit." I've always wondered why the Dels are so driven by the pop market, but I've come to the conclusion that it's just their UK orientation. Justin goes on about wanting a number one single. Why in the world would he care? Name a "Number One" hit, (in America), from the past three years that didn't suck. Do you think "writers" like John Hiatt, for example, give a rat's ass whether or not they've written a hit single? I don't think so. Not these days. But I'll bet he plays that 125 to 150 shows every year, and makes a decent living. And I don't believe the Dels have it in them to do that. I think they wanna be "stars." So, back to your queston. WHAT HAPPENS NOW? Don't you see? As far as JPR is concerned, NOTHING EVER HAPPENS. Unfortunately, it seems to me that Justin and Iain have always seemed content to wait for someone else to make it happen for them, so if there's blame to talk about, then there's probably plenty to pass around. So, I'm afraid that as you say, "a slow slide into further obscurity" seems the most likely scenario. I hope I'm wrong, because I think that Justin is one of the most talented singer/songwriters out there today. Maybe some filmaker will use one of their songs and they'll sneak into the American conciousness through the back door.... Cheers, Ed "who thinks that if the Dels would play 125 shows in America every year, everything would take care of itself" Minton Sign-up for Video Highlights of 2002 FIFA World Cup ------------------------------ End of oppositeview-digest V4 #151 **********************************