From: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org (oppositeview-digest) To: oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Subject: oppositeview-digest V3 #11 Reply-To: oppositeview@smoe.org Sender: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk oppositeview-digest Friday, January 12 2001 Volume 03 : Number 011 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: OV: Grammies and taste in music [Debbie Cushing ] OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V3 #9 [Dirk von der Heyde Subject: Re: OV: Grammies and taste in music - --- Jon Hammer wrote: > At 04:50 AM 1/10/01, Debbie wrote: > > >Ugh not Steely Dan! I seem to remember Justin > wincing > >when I asked him how he felt about an article I'd > read > >in a magazine (maybe Entertainment Weekly) where > the > >Dels were compared to Steely Dan. You might not > want > >to tell him how you feel about them if you ever > meet > >Justin. LOL > > I don't know who would compare del amitri to Steely > Dan, but we're talking > apples and oranges. I don't blame Justin for > wincing. Whoever did that > clearly had no clue as to what they were talking > about. And I'll defend > Steely Dan to the end. Their music was such a > contrast to what was being > produced in the mid '70's (RE:disco). Saw them in > concert a few years ago > in a small hurricane and they were excellent. I'm > sorely tempted to go into > a rant, but won't. There's a perception of them > that's just wrong. Oh, you know, you're right about that...Steely Dan was definately a departure from disco and I would prefer hearing them to disco, although, truth be told, I personally would prefer not to listen to either. I have to admit, in the mid 70's I was about 8 years old, so really what appealed to me during that time was the Bay City Rollers, to be honest. Also, some of my faves (and the best, in my opinion) from the 70's were Rod Stewart, Blondie and Cheap Trick. Different stroke for different folks. I didn't mean to ruffle your feathers, so sorry about that. > > >Who did that song "Don Henley Must Die"? Anyone > >remember? Jon, buddy, looks like you're a bit > stuck > >in the 70's genre of bad music. It could be worse, > I > >suppose, you could be praising Journey, REO > >Speedwagon, or Foreigner. LOL > > Not the '70's. The '80's maybe. There's a > station here in Columbus that > is all '80's, all the time. They broadcast on the > web > (http://www.star1079.com) for any who are '80's > music fans. I heard After > the Fire's version of Der Kommisar the other day and > it didn't sound half > bad. But then they'll turn around and play some > really crappy '80's stuff, > so there's always a tradeoff. As for Journey, > don't knock 'em too much. > A lot of their early stuff when they still had Greg > Rollie was pretty good. > Their later stuff wasn't as good. My wife would > defend REO, but not me. And > I never cared for Foreigner. As for Mr. Henley, he > strikes me as somebody I > wouldn't like personally, but I do like his music. > The artist I listen to > the most is Bruce Hornsby. Most people know him from > "The Way It Is", but > his music has progressed and evolved over the years > that its impossible to > state what 'genre' he belongs in now. I've found it > frustrating when radio > stations or music industry execs try to pigeon hole > artists, like Bruce or > del amitri. Well, late 70's I definately remember being subjected to Journey and REO Speedwagon (I was in Junior High) and hated it very much. Something about Journey's music just gives me the creeps. Now when you talk 80's that's a whole new ball game. That's where The Alarm and U2 (the good stuff) came into being. That's where the music world was saved from the horrible 70's AOR, in my opinion. I've never heard of the Fire, but I loved "Der Kommisar" and "Rock Me Amadeus" by Falco. I even liked Madonna's stuff for a while in the 80's. Berlin was cool. I liked Pat Benetar, too. There were many more bands in the 80's that I liked. I was very glad to be saved from both disco and AOR. I liked the music of the 60's and the 80's through present (although there's bad stuff, too, as you mentioned) but in my mind, I'd prefer to pretend the 70's didn't happen. :-) Have a nice day, debbie Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online! http://photos.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:08:52 +0100 (NFT) From: Dirk von der Heyde Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V3 #9 A year without a dels concert is sort of pissing me off and I am in the kind of mood to point out a few of more or less critical views about the band. Surely, I will always find myself looking for the D section in a second hand music shop (thank god I am not a Depeche Mode fan if you know what I mean ;-). 1.) I dont like the cynical way of expressing things which is what the band used to do. In fact I never ever heard any reasonable, smart or witty comments on anything exept maybe the state of Glasgow during Thatcher's dictatorship. It seems the band is still dreaming of the number one top of the pops spot, or maybe it is the sense of humour which is hard to grasp for a non native. I am still pondering over the press statement to SOSP,(no acoustics, no song longer than 3 minutes etc.) which is absoluteley incomprehensible regarding to the actual product. 2.) I dont like the way we, the die-hard fans, are treated by eihter the management nor the band themselfes. Many of us hang on like 10-15 years, spending money on concerts, records and merchandise and doing inofficial promotion. I decided not to by the Hatful of Rain album, fully aware that there is going to be a special edition sooner or later, which finally happened. I ll do the same with the new album and stick to mp3's in the first place until there is that expensive import cd I am going to buy. I ve been to the Astoria recently in order to attend two nights of a special 20 year anniversary show of a band called New Model Army (I have known them for a while and like the music, not everyone's taste I know..), but the gigs were impressive because the band appreciated the support of the fans over the years and they played two nights, supporting themselfes, with two entirely different set lists, about 50 songs I guess.(They too released a b-side compilation a couple of years ago, however, it was packed with as many songs as possible and a booklet given with details to any song). Why doesnt Del do such things? I think they dont rely on a fan base due to the fact that the songs get a lot of airplay which is probably the main income. Of course, like somebody said on the list, they do not have to appreciate us, I have been supporting my local football team since ages and they dont care much about me either, maybe the hard core fan base is kind of bothering because they demand extra treatment or whatever. 3.) They sould a least give us a kind of tidbit, a new flexi disc would be fine. The official (snail)mailing list is absoluteley crap and finally I wouldnt call an album classic until it has received a decent reception, as many bands tried to work years on that number one album without any result. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:51:00 -0000 From: Hopping James W Subject: OV: RE: Re: oppositeview-digest V3 #9 I fear that you are somewhat missing the point. From what I gather, you are saying that because you have previously bought Dels records, merchandise etc you are somehow different and deserve to be given special treatment. Somewhat like being given a Platinum Credit card because you have banked witha certain bank for x number of years. Unfortunately, unlike banking, we are talking about a creative process here. For 'proper artists' turning out singles and albums isn't just a case of 'Oh it's Tuesday I think I'll write a ballad today'. Bands can't and don't stay still in what they are doing and should and must try new things, otherwise they end up sounding like Pub Cover bands, churning out the same old stuff with different words to the same old stuff (Genesis, AC/DC etc). If they don't move on they become irrelevant. You have to remeber that the reason many people get into music inthe first place is personal not so they can stand in front of 25,000 people and be a rock star. If you take away that personal feeling it all becomes souless and hollow. Look at what happened to bands like Oasis they strted off with a fresh outlook but ended up producing music by numbers just for the sake of it. Try listening to some new stuff that you haven't heard. I find doing this means when you revisit your older albums it puts a whole new slant on that as you see it with different perspectives. May I suggest Doves, Spearmint, Matthew Sweet (who our US friends here may well know) and so on. Jim - -----Original Message----- From: Dirk von der Heyde [mailto:vdheyde@uni-bremen.de] Sent: 11 January 2001 18:09 To: oppositeview@smoe.org Cc: oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V3 #9 A year without a dels concert is sort of pissing me off and I am in the kind of mood to point out a few of more or less critical views about the band. Surely, I will always find myself looking for the D section in a second hand music shop (thank god I am not a Depeche Mode fan if you know what I mean ;-). 1.) I dont like the cynical way of expressing things which is what the band used to do. In fact I never ever heard any reasonable, smart or witty comments on anything exept maybe the state of Glasgow during Thatcher's dictatorship. It seems the band is still dreaming of the number one top of the pops spot, or maybe it is the sense of humour which is hard to grasp for a non native. I am still pondering over the press statement to SOSP,(no acoustics, no song longer than 3 minutes etc.) which is absoluteley incomprehensible regarding to the actual product. 2.) I dont like the way we, the die-hard fans, are treated by eihter the management nor the band themselfes. Many of us hang on like 10-15 years, spending money on concerts, records and merchandise and doing inofficial promotion. I decided not to by the Hatful of Rain album, fully aware that there is going to be a special edition sooner or later, which finally happened. I ll do the same with the new album and stick to mp3's in the first place until there is that expensive import cd I am going to buy. I ve been to the Astoria recently in order to attend two nights of a special 20 year anniversary show of a band called New Model Army (I have known them for a while and like the music, not everyone's taste I know..), but the gigs were impressive because the band appreciated the support of the fans over the years and they played two nights, supporting themselfes, with two entirely different set lists, about 50 songs I guess.(They too released a b-side compilation a couple of years ago, however, it was packed with as many songs as possible and a booklet given with details to any song). Why doesnt Del do such things? I think they dont rely on a fan base due to the fact that the songs get a lot of airplay which is probably the main income. Of course, like somebody said on the list, they do not have to appreciate us, I have been supporting my local football team since ages and they dont care much about me either, maybe the hard core fan base is kind of bothering because they demand extra treatment or whatever. 3.) They sould a least give us a kind of tidbit, a new flexi disc would be fine. The official (snail)mailing list is absoluteley crap and finally I wouldnt call an album classic until it has received a decent reception, as many bands tried to work years on that number one album without any result. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:51:00 -0000 From: Hopping James W Subject: OV: RE: Re: oppositeview-digest V3 #9 I fear that you are somewhat missing the point. From what I gather, you are saying that because you have previously bought Dels records, merchandise etc you are somehow different and deserve to be given special treatment. Somewhat like being given a Platinum Credit card because you have banked witha certain bank for x number of years. Unfortunately, unlike banking, we are talking about a creative process here. For 'proper artists' turning out singles and albums isn't just a case of 'Oh it's Tuesday I think I'll write a ballad today'. Bands can't and don't stay still in what they are doing and should and must try new things, otherwise they end up sounding like Pub Cover bands, churning out the same old stuff with different words to the same old stuff (Genesis, AC/DC etc). If they don't move on they become irrelevant. You have to remeber that the reason many people get into music inthe first place is personal not so they can stand in front of 25,000 people and be a rock star. If you take away that personal feeling it all becomes souless and hollow. Look at what happened to bands like Oasis they strted off with a fresh outlook but ended up producing music by numbers just for the sake of it. Try listening to some new stuff that you haven't heard. I find doing this means when you revisit your older albums it puts a whole new slant on that as you see it with different perspectives. May I suggest Doves, Spearmint, Matthew Sweet (who our US friends here may well know) and so on. Jim - -----Original Message----- From: Dirk von der Heyde [mailto:vdheyde@uni-bremen.de] Sent: 11 January 2001 18:09 To: oppositeview@smoe.org Cc: oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Subject: OV: Re: oppositeview-digest V3 #9 A year without a dels concert is sort of pissing me off and I am in the kind of mood to point out a few of more or less critical views about the band. Surely, I will always find myself looking for the D section in a second hand music shop (thank god I am not a Depeche Mode fan if you know what I mean ;-). 1.) I dont like the cynical way of expressing things which is what the band used to do. In fact I never ever heard any reasonable, smart or witty comments on anything exept maybe the state of Glasgow during Thatcher's dictatorship. It seems the band is still dreaming of the number one top of the pops spot, or maybe it is the sense of humour which is hard to grasp for a non native. I am still pondering over the press statement to SOSP,(no acoustics, no song longer than 3 minutes etc.) which is absoluteley incomprehensible regarding to the actual product. 2.) I dont like the way we, the die-hard fans, are treated by eihter the management nor the band themselfes. Many of us hang on like 10-15 years, spending money on concerts, records and merchandise and doing inofficial promotion. I decided not to by the Hatful of Rain album, fully aware that there is going to be a special edition sooner or later, which finally happened. I ll do the same with the new album and stick to mp3's in the first place until there is that expensive import cd I am going to buy. I ve been to the Astoria recently in order to attend two nights of a special 20 year anniversary show of a band called New Model Army (I have known them for a while and like the music, not everyone's taste I know..), but the gigs were impressive because the band appreciated the support of the fans over the years and they played two nights, supporting themselfes, with two entirely different set lists, about 50 songs I guess.(They too released a b-side compilation a couple of years ago, however, it was packed with as many songs as possible and a booklet given with details to any song). Why doesnt Del do such things? I think they dont rely on a fan base due to the fact that the songs get a lot of airplay which is probably the main income. Of course, like somebody said on the list, they do not have to appreciate us, I have been supporting my local football team since ages and they dont care much about me either, maybe the hard core fan base is kind of bothering because they demand extra treatment or whatever. 3.) They sould a least give us a kind of tidbit, a new flexi disc would be fine. The official (snail)mailing list is absoluteley crap and finally I wouldnt call an album classic until it has received a decent reception, as many bands tried to work years on that number one album without any result. ------------------------------ End of oppositeview-digest V3 #11 *********************************