From: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org (oppositeview-digest) To: oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Subject: oppositeview-digest V2 #139 Reply-To: oppositeview@smoe.org Sender: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-oppositeview-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk oppositeview-digest Saturday, October 21 2000 Volume 02 : Number 139 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: OV: CD's you're listening to [S J Pliska ] OV: Miami herald article, pt. 1 [Karen Scully-Clemmons ] OV: British Rock [Leah D Schenkenberg ] OV: CDs you're listening to [Cleo DelosAngeles ] Re: OV: CD's you're listening to ["Jen Woyan" ] OV: Herald article, pt.2 [Karen Scully-Clemmons ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:40:21 -0700 (PDT) From: S J Pliska Subject: Re: OV: CD's you're listening to Interesting taste all around... Here's a list of the last few artists/bands to grace my CD player: Bela Fleck Sarah Harmer Great Big Sea Mark O'Connor Natalie MacMaster Josh Clayton-Felt (I miss that dear boy) - -Sarah- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 14:26:50 -0400 From: Karen Scully-Clemmons Subject: OV: Miami herald article, pt. 1 This article was in our Sunday paper last week, and seems to fit in well with our current thread, which is the only reason I would send something so long. Sorry about that- I've broken it up into two submissions for easier reading. Hope you find it interesting. I particularly agree with the part about "touring, touring, touring." Published Sunday, October 15, 2000, in the Miami Herald The disappearing face of British rock: From the Beatles through Radiohead, rock from the British Isles has held a special place in the American imagination. But with the rise of U.S.-bred rap-rock and teen pop, is this the end of an era? BY HOWARD COHEN ``Radiohead rescues rock,'' screams a recent Time magazine cover tease touting the new CD from British rock band Radiohead. Similarly, Spin magazine devotes the cover of its November issue to the group, trumpeting the quintet as ``the world's greatest rock band.'' If it sounds curious for a mainstream news magazine like Time to credit Radiohead with rescuing a whole genre of music, it's also just as amazing that the album, Kid A, has proven to be one of the year's most downloaded titles on Napster, pre-release at that. To top it off, it's a British band that's garnering these accolades and audience attention in the United States. In 2000. Kid A debuts as Billboard's No. 1 album this week. The release of the megahyped Kid A Oct. 3, Robbie Williams' Sing When You're Winning last week and the favorable buzz surrounding U2's return to its rock roots on its upcoming All That You Can't Leave Behind underscores a question: Where are this generation's great British rock acts? After all, the '60s indelibly linked the term ``British Invasion'' with pop music as the Beatles, the Rolling Stones, The Who and the Kinks led the hit parade. The '70s brought the next wave, cresting with Led Zeppelin, Elton John, Pink Floyd, Yes, David Bowie, Queen and Sex Pistols. The late '70s/'80s had the Clash, the Police/Sting, Dire Straits, Depeche Mode, The Cure, The Smiths, Duran Duran and U2. These artists spawned devoted followings who flocked to record stores the day of release and who pored over album liner notes for hidden meaning; many of these were the acts deemed ``important'' by the rock establishment. But with the explosion of techno/dance music in England coupled with the onslaught of American rap-rock from the likes of Limp Bizkit, Korn and Eminem, the rise of boy bands Backstreet Boys and 'N Sync and teen queens Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera, the English dominance in rock has evaporated. The British tide began to recede in the American grunge-dominated early '90s, minus the occasional breakout band or two (Oasis, Bush) and, in terms of current domestic exposure, Radiohead is really the only relatively new example of Brit rock power, both critical and commercial. ``British youth culture is frankly often a lot more sophisticated,'' says Zev Borow, 27, contributing editor for Spin and the writer of the magazine's Radiohead cover story. ``It has a different sensibility to it, and a lot of British bands are making music that [fits into that.] What's popular now in the States is Britney [Spears] and Backstreet Boys or Limp Bizkit and Korn. Interesting stuff but certainly not as subtle as the British stuff being made, so that gap has widened between the average American kids'tastes and the average British kids' tastes. Therefore, you have bands that manifest that difference. ``With Radiohead, I think they are the exception. It's a bizarre alchemy like all great rock bands. Part of what they do, especially with the new record, is use a lot of electronic influences. One of the things that Nigel [Godrich], their producer, said to me is that the Stones and Beatles were trying to sound like black American R&B. [Radiohead] are white British kids trying to sound like Kraftwerk. And that's new and interesting and different.'' POP DEJA VU The American pop scene is now in a cultural return, of sorts, to the landscape of the early '60s, just before Beatlemania exploded. In John F. Kennedy, the United States had a youthful and popular president in the White House, much as is the case today with Bill Clinton. Then-popular American pop acts like Chubby Checker, Pat Boone, the Four Seasons and Bobby Vinton ruled the airwaves with producer- and outside-songwriter- controlled pop fare. But immediately after Vinton's No. 1 single, There! I've Said It Again, fell to the Beatles' first domestic chart-topper, I Want To Hold Your Hand, in February 1964 these acts were cast aside. Most would never see the Top 20 again. The pop music world's axis shifted toward self-contained rock groups, British ones like the Beatles who wrote their own music and created a distinct image. In addition, sophisticated lyricists, like the Stones and The Who, displaced their frothier American counterparts. But British rock today mostly can be found in one place -- Britain. Well-read English music magazines like Q and New Music Express (NME) flow rivers of favorable ink on acts like Radiohead, Williams, Travis, Gomez, doves, Richard Ashcroft (formerly of the Verve), Amanda Ghost, David Gray and Badly Drawn Boy. The latter recently won the United Kingdom's coveted Mercury Music Award for best British album, The Hour of Bewilderbeast. Even established Brit rock acts like Oasis still take residence among the Top 20 there. The photogenic and snarky Williams and accomplished rock act Travis enjoyed similar media hype here thanks to the deep pockets of major labels Capitol and Sony and well-oiled publicity machines. But the results weren't nearly the same. Williams' first domestic CD, last year's The Ego Has Landed, a compilation of his two previous British releases, performed below expectations, selling gold but failing to produce any major hit singles. The jury is still out on the new Sing When You're Winning, a recent No. 1 album in U.K. Its catchy first single, Rock DJ, has yet to make a dent in U.S. pop radio. Travis earned reviews rivaling Radiohead's for its fine The Man Who CD, but it didn't sell. Radiohead's 1997 release, OK Computer, landed on hundreds of year-end 10-best lists and garnered Grammy attention but never climbed higher than No. 21 domestically. Surprisingly, the climate proves considerably brighter for the more electronic-inspired Kid A, though. To crown the Billboard 200, the decidedly difficult CD sold 207,000 copies in its first week according to SoundScan, a career-high for Radiohead domestically. (Kid A also entered atop the British music charts earlier in the week). But the lack of a surefire single could stifle its long-term sales potential on singles-oriented American radio. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 18:46:35 GMT From: "Iain Gray" Subject: OV: Stuff you're listening too.... I wasnt gonna but ok...here goes!!! Lloyd Cole - Best of, just cant take this out of teh cd player just now! Eels - daisies of teh galaxy Goo Goo Dolls - Dizzy up teh girl Grandaddy - The Sophtware Slump Looper - the geometrid Best of Mott the Hoople....damned dels at new year! Badly Drawn Boy and other stuff! Iain. _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 14:39:49 -0500 From: Leah D Schenkenberg Subject: OV: British Rock Among all the British groups that can't seem to make it in America, why do you suppose The Police flopped in the UK and came to the US to make it? It was only after their club tour on the east coast that they were able to have success in the UK and re-released Roxanne. It had flopped the frist time around. Has the scene just changed that much since 1978? Leah In the name of honesty, in the name of what is fair: You always answer my questions, But they don't always answer my prayers... ~ carly simon ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 19:29:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Cleo DelosAngeles Subject: OV: CDs you're listening to Yo everyone...I am delurking for a bit...can't believe there are 3 other people who know BROTHER...cool Debbie, Cindy, & Noel...they are a great live band and I have been their fan since 1995...can't believe they haven't gotten signed yet...u guys can find their CDs at their website...www.brothermusic.com. Anywho, here are some of the CDs I am listening to: Travis--- the man who GUS---word of mouth parade Brother---the digging bone TONIC---sugar BNL---Maroon GUSTER---lost and gone forever DEL Amitri---hatful of rain Dishwalla---And You think u know what life's about Shad Hills Band The RED Elvises Crowded House---Recurring Dream Sarah McLachlan---Fumbling Towards Ecstacy ciao, Cleo > From: "debbie" > Hey, I'm impressed that other people know who > Brother are....and like them, > too. :-) I saw them once at the North Texas Irish > Festival (of all places) > a few years ago, which is where I heard of them and > I think they're great. > I've tried finding their other CDs (I only got the > one, "Black Stone > Tramp"), but I've been unsucessful so far. > > Have a great day! > debbie > - ----- Original Message ----- > From: "NOEL TYLLA" > > L7-not sure of which one > > Spacehog "The Chinese album" > > Marvelous Three-their first album > > Sex Pistols-Live > > Brother-Live > > Local H "Pack up the cats" > > Noel Tylla (N.T.) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 21:33:19 -0500 From: "Jen Woyan" Subject: Re: OV: CD's you're listening to Josh Clayton-Felt (I miss that dear boy) > Me too.... Everyone have a good weekend and kiss the ones you love... Cheers, Jen in Chicago - ----- Original Message ----- From: "S J Pliska" To: Sent: Friday, October 20, 2000 12:40 PM Subject: Re: OV: CD's you're listening to > > > Interesting taste all around... > > Here's a list of the last few artists/bands to grace my CD player: > > Bela Fleck > Sarah Harmer > Great Big Sea > Mark O'Connor > Natalie MacMaster > Josh Clayton-Felt (I miss that dear boy) > > -Sarah- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. > http://im.yahoo.com/ > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 14:33:21 -0400 From: Karen Scully-Clemmons Subject: OV: Herald article, pt.2 Other factors contribute to British artists' difficulties in breaking domestically. One is that there are considerably more records on shelves competing for prominence today than 25 years ago, when Elton John, the Stones and Zeppelin consistently soared to No. 1 soon after release. The American pop scene is now in a cultural return, of sorts, to the landscape of the early '60s. ``There is an enormous amount of music out there, far more than what [boomers] grew up with,'' agrees Marty Diamond, 42, president of the Little Big Man booking agency in New York. ``We can all sit there and say, `There's more outlets available.' But it still clogs the pipeline.'' A band is also stretched in more directions these days. ``As the world has opened up as a global market, a lot of British bands haven't had the opportunity to spend committed time here,'' Diamond explains. ``When The Who and the Stones were starting they toured Europe and America, and that was it. And now it's Australia and Asia and other places.'' But some people aren't ready to rule out another British Invasion. Some, in fact, think it's already here. Take Diamond, who has booked Williams, Ashcroft, Gray and Badly Drawn Boy, among others, in the United States. ``I'm more excited about the British music scene now than ever before. It is an industry fostering [dance-rock's] Fatboy Slim, [pop-rock's] Robbie Williams, [folk-rock's] Dido. Bet you can't do that with American bands now.'' He also says some acts just need time. ``We all think Elton John was huge but look at Border Song [his pre-Your Song single that stiffed in 1970.] It takes a minute or two, but we live in a world of faster, sooner, now. We have to give time and let bands mature.'' Diamond believes we're in a trough, waiting for the next wave. ``Everything cycles around. I think we're kind of in this morass of mediocrity, but the cool thing is there is Radiohead. . . . There are starting to be bright spots. David Gray sold 3,500 tickets in New York's Roseland with no airplay.'' WHY THE SUCCESS? So what has Radiohead done right? Three things: touring, touring and touring. ``If we harken back to the second wave with the Police and U2, look how much time they spent here -- they lived here,'' Diamond says. ``There will be bands you will start to see in the next year or so; they'll realize the market is ripe again. We saw it in the wave of the ['80s] Duran Durans and Depeche Modes and the Cures. And the wave before that was Elton and Rod Stewart. It comes in waves, and there are just a lot more fish today.'' ``You have to spend time here touring,'' agrees Shelby Meade of New York's Nasty Little Man publicity firm, the company handling Radiohead. ``That's why [Radiohead] have such a fan base, they are not just a band who put out a hit single and walked away. U.S. journalists like a nice Brit rock band, but if you don't come back, you don't solidify in each market. The bands that have been successful are U2, Radiohead and Supergrass, who are doing the Pearl Jam tour. Robbie Williams went gold in the U.S. because he did promotional gigs before his record came out, and no one knew him well because Take That [his former boy band-styled act] wasn't as huge here.'' But in Radiohead's case it's more than simply showing up on stage, Borow believes. ``A lot of bands tour. With Radiohead there's something about them. They go at everything with a seriousness and determination that propels them in ways other bands don't,'' he says. ``The five of them, since they were 15, knew this is their priority, and they have gone at it as such. This is not a band that takes a lot of drugs and [expletive] off. When you are on the road with Radiohead they play well each night.'' And, above all else, it's that very approach, that work ethic, that should spark the next British rock invasion. The signs are there. In addition to Radiohead's No. 1 debut, erstwhile Dire Straits founder Mark Knopfler managed a respectable No. 60 Billboard 200 entry last week for his new CD, Sailing to Philadelphia, without benefit of a hit single, video, tour or high profile. And when radio enters the equation, the results are even more spectacular. Los Angeles alternative rock station KROQ-FM has proven instrumental in introducing stateside audiences to the music of Oasis, Blur, Radiohead and Travis, among others. ``Alternative radio is leaning hard rock now; a lot of what we play is Korn, Rage Against the Machine, hard male music. But we've also built a base on playing British bands, and we're able to get away with a balance of hard rock and British,''says KROQ music director Lisa Worden. Worden offers an example citing the synergy between radio exposure and fan reaction. ``Travis played a sold-out show at [L.A.'s] Universal Amphitheatre and sold 6,000 seats.'' Locally, the news isn't quite so encouraging. Though some fledgling British acts have passed through South Florida, it's usually in a supporting role. (UnAmerican opened for The Who in September in West Palm Beach, and Gay Dad supported the Pretenders in Sunrise last year, but most people were waiting in beer lines during their sets; radio play for both has been nil; Radiohead last appeared in Miami as warm-up act for R.E.M.'s Monster tour back in '94). South Florida rock station Zeta (WZTA/94.9 FM) clings to the expected Bizkit-Creed-Korn sound and folds familiar warhorses like Led Zeppelin and Metallica into its mix. INTERNET RELIEF Relief might come from other sources outside the traditional radio and MTV base. Namely, the Internet. ``The cool thing is kids have a much more active involvement with bands than they used to using Web pages,'' Diamond says. ``When the Stereophonics go through Chicago with no airplay and sell 1,400 tickets in advance in a market where they haven't sold a record, something is going on.'' CDs to give your collection a distinctly British accent England has long been the source for new and interesting rock sounds for Western ears. The Beatles, anyone? Times haven't changed, England still leads America in terms of rock musical innovation and influence. The following CDs represent a small sampling of Britain's current rock beat. Do any top Let It Bleed, Goodbye Yellow Brick Road or Physical Graffiti? Nope. But any one of 'em will have you rethinking that recent Creed purchase. Radiohead, Kid A (Capitol). Music from a galaxy far, far away. Radiohead's futuristic OK Computer follow-up isn't really a rock album at all; rather, it's New Age electronica with leader Thom Yorke's glum vocals leaping out from behind corners. Fascinating or flawed, or both, depending on your perspective. Badly Drawn Boy, The Hour of Bewilderbeast (XL-Recordings/Beggars Banquet). Call it overlong and you won't get an argument here. (C'mon, 18 tracks?). But this Mercury Music Award album of the year winner from Manchester's BDB -- aka Damon Gough -- is musically rich. Elliott Smith-like melancholia with acoustic and electric guitars, bass and drums and exotic instrumental flourishes (cello, French horn, vibraphone). David Gray, White Ladder (ATO Records/BMG). A millennial Van Morrison? Maybe. White Ladder, recorded on the cheap in Gray's London flat folds folk and electronic elements into songs of disillusionment that somehow never seem depressing. American rock star Dave Matthews started his own label, ATO, and White Ladder is its first release. doves, Lost Souls (Astralwerks). Laid-back set from Manchester group echoes Echo and the Bunnymen in spots. Guitar-oriented and melodic Lost Souls finds yours. Travis, The Man Who (Epic/Independiente). This year's winner of two Brits (the U.K. equivalent of our Grammys): best British group and best album for this dreamy CD. The quartet's tuneful and plush rock occasionally comes with a sharp point attached, like the Oasis diss on Writing to Reach You. (``The radio is playing all the usual/And what's a wonderwall anyway?'') Amanda Ghost, Ghost Stories (Warner Bros.) A North London native of Indian and Spanish heritage, Ghost is edgy and wickedly forthright (``Could you make a suggestion / For an act I would enjoy?,'' she queries on the club-minded Filthy Mind). Touches on pop, rock and dance. Richard Ashcroft, Alone With Everybody (Virgin). The defunct Verve's former leader has released a moody, midtempo and melodic disc. It's lush and full of nooks and crannies. ------------------------------ End of oppositeview-digest V2 #139 **********************************