From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2014 #745 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Website:http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe:mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Thursday, August 6 2015 Volume 2014 : Number 745 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: sweet bird sings song [lcs4bike@yahoo.com] SC Jonifest 2015 - A couple of questions [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: Jazz [lcs4bike@yahoo.com] Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? [Clin] Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? [Cath] Re: JMDL Digest V2015 #388 [Laurie Antonioli ] Re: Good grief, if true! [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] RE: JMDL Digest V2015 #388 ["Susan E. McNamara" ] Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? [Bob.] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2015 07:36:58 -0500 From: lcs4bike@yahoo.com Subject: Re: sweet bird sings song Kennedy quoted: People hurry by so quickly ~Don't they hear the melodies ~In the chiming and the clicking And the laughing harmonies? Hi Kenney, I love this line!! And great VW bus trip story! Thanks for sharing. I had a friend in choir who used to say as we were warming up in a small room adjacent to the sanctuary minutes before we were to sing, "time stress, the feeling that time is running out." I have another friend who told me time is an illusion, that we really only have the present moment. I love not to hurry, and I think that's easier here in the south where we have such hot weather we can't move fast and we don't need to hurry to prepare for a snowy winter. I had a Staton Island friend tell me, "you aren't going to slow me down" when we were walking on a college campus in Mobile, Alabama in the early 80's. That is a frozen moment in my mind because I wasn't thinking of time, but she was. Another time she told me when I was stressing over studying for a test, "there's still time." Perception seems to be everything where time is concerned. Time to go to work! I saw your post and thought I can either think oh great a nice long post or who has time to read a long post? I chose the former and took time to enjoy responding. I'm looking forward to taking the time to join in the laughing harmonies in SC soon!!! Makes the rush of work demands tolerable to know I'm one day closer to SC each day. Love, Laura Sent from my iPhone ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2015 10:02:41 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: SC Jonifest 2015 - A couple of questions So...we're about a month away from Jonifest, we'll have fun and sun while hoodlums stick up Washington! (The Joni content) Meanwhile, here's a couple of things I'd like to know for my planning purposes. PLEASE just respond ONLY TO ME and NOT TO THE LIST. DON'T SELECT "REPLY ALL". Got it? Good. Here we go... What date/time are you arriving? If you're flying in, will you need a pick-up? Will you be expecting dinner on Thursday the 3rd? (Will be at The Lodge) What sorts of things would you like for breakfasts/brunches on Friday, Saturday & Sunday? Coffee - Regular or Decaf? And that's all I can think of right now. Thanks. Bob NP: The Heath Brothers, "Wall To Wall" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any and all computers and other devices. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 12:41:18 -0500 From: lcs4bike@yahoo.com Subject: Re: Jazz Laurie wrote: We can have a big discussion at the JoniFest on "what jazz is" and "why singers turn to jazz" later in their careers. Hi Laurie! This sounds cool!!! I have a lot to learn in the realm of jazz. It seems like THOSL started Joni's maturing into jazz. I'll be interested in what you have to say! Also, have you ever listened to Melody Gardot? If so, what do you think of her jazz? Have you heard her new album? I got it as a birthday gift from a big fan of her's and also have Melody's other 2 albums. She's very good in my opinion! Love, Laura Sent from my iPhone ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 15:27:13 +0000 (UTC) From: Clint Norwood Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? I completely understand what you are saying about jazz.I think that the Linda Ronstadt/Sinatra kind of thing is called "jazz" a lot because its style coincided with the early jazz age in America. If you turn on the "jazz channel" here in Memphis you will get a lot of show tunes and Sinatra-esque stuff. I think the word "jazz" is used to cover a lot of music that seems like it wouldn't offend "older" people. How things have changed! To me, (drum roll) I think jazz is a piece of music that has a basic head (like the beginning of Miles Davis' "So What!") but the rest of the tune has nothing but very broad chord charts to arrange the rest of the "song." In this way there is no melody excepting the beginning head. The rest of the tune (solos and trade offs between the musicians) must be played over those broad chord charts and the musicians can do anything they like to go with the music. In this way there is far less structure than the typical song but it makes the musicians communicate with each other in a way I don't think others have to do because it is not pre-decided. Remember also that show tunes and other pop songs can be made into jazz. "My Favorite Things" was turned into a jazz piece by Coltrane but I doubt that anyone who doesn't hear the opening head "Raindrops on Roses" etc., would recognize it.-Clint On Tuesday, August 4, 2015 8:28 AM, Catherine McKay wrote: Mark, as always, you express what I'm thinking so much better than I could myself. I agree that Joni did "Mingus" at Charles Mingus's request, and that she likely hadn't thought of going that far into jazz before that. I also agree with Muller that some of Joni's best singing was on the "Mingus" album, with "Sweet sucker dance" being the best of the best. I haven't heard the Annie Lennox one and have deliberately stayed away from it, because it does seem that *everyone* wants to do a "jazz" album, but I suspect you are right and that Annie's isn't really jazz either. As well, I don't think Linda Rondstadt's Nelson Riddle recordings were jazz either. They were more like big band pop, or whatever you want to call it, the kind of thing that was popular in the 40s. If it ain't rock'n'roll, do people just say it's jazz? and that led me to, "What the heck is jazz anyway?" which is why I stayed out of this to start with. I started wandering down the "What is jazz" road and got lost on the way. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Mark Scott To: Susan E. McNamara ; joni@smoe.org Cc: Sent: Tuesday, August 4, 2015 12:16 AM Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing JazzB Albums? Interesting that the writer didn't mention the 'Both Sides Now' CD which, to my mind anyway, is more along the lines of what she was writing about.B To me, 'Mingus' was Joni picking up the gauntlet that Mingus threw down, accepting the challenge, not about doing a Jazz album as a novelty item to revive a career.B As the writer mentioned, Joni was pretty much riding the crest of her popularity at the time.B The fact that she paid for it in terms of a loss of some of her radio airplay and fan base is not a really valid comment on the quality of the work. [...] The writer mentions Linda Ronstadt's recordings with the Nelson Riddle orchestra.B Would you call Nelson Riddle a jazz artist?B I think of his work more as very sophisticated pop than Jazz and I think of Linda's vocals on those records in the same way. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 13:21:08 +0000 (UTC) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? Mark, as always, you express what I'm thinking so much better than I could myself. I agree that Joni did "Mingus" at Charles Mingus's request, and that she likely hadn't thought of going that far into jazz before that. I also agree with Muller that some of Joni's best singing was on the "Mingus" album, with "Sweet sucker dance" being the best of the best. I haven't heard the Annie Lennox one and have deliberately stayed away from it, because it does seem that *everyone* wants to do a "jazz" album, but I suspect you are right and that Annie's isn't really jazz either. As well, I don't think Linda Rondstadt's Nelson Riddle recordings were jazz either. They were more like big band pop, or whatever you want to call it, the kind of thing that was popular in the 40s. If it ain't rock'n'roll, do people just say it's jazz? and that led me to, "What the heck is jazz anyway?" which is why I stayed out of this to start with. I started wandering down the "What is jazz" road and got lost on the way. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Mark Scott To: Susan E. McNamara ; joni@smoe.org Cc: Sent: Tuesday, August 4, 2015 12:16 AM Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? Interesting that the writer didn't mention the 'Both Sides Now' CD which, to my mind anyway, is more along the lines of what she was writing about. To me, 'Mingus' was Joni picking up the gauntlet that Mingus threw down, accepting the challenge, not about doing a Jazz album as a novelty item to revive a career. As the writer mentioned, Joni was pretty much riding the crest of her popularity at the time. The fact that she paid for it in terms of a loss of some of her radio airplay and fan base is not a really valid comment on the quality of the work. [...] The writer mentions Linda Ronstadt's recordings with the Nelson Riddle orchestra. Would you call Nelson Riddle a jazz artist? I think of his work more as very sophisticated pop than Jazz and I think of Linda's vocals on those records in the same way. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 08:51:50 -0700 From: Laurie Antonioli Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2015 #388 We can have a big discussion at the JoniFest on "what jazz is" and "why singers turn to jazz" later in their careers. I have many theories. FACT: Joni was heavily influenced by Annie Ross (who wrote the lyrics to "Twisted" which she of course recorded) and loves Ellington and Miles. These are influences she had before she transitioned and started hiring jazz musicians to work with her. If she was listening to Lambert, Hendricks & Ross (I worshiped at the alter of LHR and still do) as a young woman, for sure that has informed her music. Also the style and lyrics of vocalese (setting lyrics to pre-existing, recorded instrumental solos) is a very stream of consciousness kind of style. Note: "Twisted" is a horn solo by tenor saxophonist Wardell Grey who Annie then wrote words to. Vocalese is very clever, often funny, fearless and complex. Sound like anyone we know? : ) Laurie On Tue, Aug 4, 2015 at 8:29 AM, JMDL Digest wrote: > > JMDL Digest Tuesday, August 4 2015 Volume 2015 : Number 388 > > > > ========== > > TOPICS and authors in this Digest: > -------- > Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? > [Clin] > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 15:27:13 +0000 (UTC) > From: Clint Norwood > Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz > Albums? > > I completely understand what you are saying about jazz.I think that the > Linda > Ronstadt/Sinatra kind of thing is called "jazz" a lot because its style > coincided with the early jazz age in America. If you turn on the "jazz > channel" here in Memphis you will get a lot of show tunes and Sinatra-esque > stuff. I think the word "jazz" is used to cover a lot of music that seems > like > it wouldn't offend "older" people. How things have changed! > To me, (drum roll) I think jazz is a piece of music that has a basic head > (like the beginning of Miles Davis' "So What!") but the rest of the tune > has > nothing but very broad chord charts to arrange the rest of the "song." In > this > way there is no melody excepting the beginning head. The rest of the tune > (solos and trade offs between the musicians) must be played over those > broad > chord charts and the musicians can do anything they like to go with the > music. > In this way there is far less structure than the typical song but it makes > the > musicians communicate with each other in a way I don't think others have > to do > because it is not pre-decided. > Remember also that show tunes and other pop songs can be made into jazz. > "My > Favorite Things" was turned into a jazz piece by Coltrane but I doubt that > anyone who doesn't hear the opening head "Raindrops on Roses" etc., would > recognize it.-Clint > > > > On Tuesday, August 4, 2015 8:28 AM, Catherine McKay > wrote: > > > Mark, as always, you express what I'm thinking so much better than I could > myself. I agree that Joni did "Mingus" at Charles Mingus's request, and > that > she likely hadn't thought of going that far into jazz before that. I also > agree with Muller that some of Joni's best singing was on the "Mingus" > album, > with "Sweet sucker dance" being the best of the best. > > > I haven't heard the Annie Lennox one and have deliberately stayed away from > it, because it does seem that *everyone* wants to do a "jazz" album, but I > suspect you are right and that Annie's isn't really jazz either. As well, I > don't think Linda Rondstadt's Nelson Riddle recordings were jazz either. > They > were more like big band pop, or whatever you want to call it, the kind of > thing that was popular in the 40s. If it ain't rock'n'roll, do people just > say > it's jazz? > > > and that led me to, "What the heck is jazz anyway?" which is why I stayed > out > of this to start with. I started wandering down the "What is jazz" road and > got lost on the way. > > > > - ----- Original Message ----- > From: Mark Scott > To: Susan E. McNamara ; joni@smoe.org > Cc: > Sent: Tuesday, August 4, 2015 12:16 AM > Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing JazzB > Albums? > > Interesting that the writer didn't mention the 'Both Sides Now' CD which, > to > my mind anyway, is more along the lines of what she was writing about.B To > me, 'Mingus' was Joni picking up the gauntlet that Mingus threw down, > accepting the challenge, not about doing a Jazz album as a novelty item to > revive a career.B As the writer mentioned, Joni was pretty much riding the > crest of her popularity at the time.B The fact that she paid for it in > terms > of a loss of some of her radio airplay and fan base is not a really valid > comment on the quality of the work. > > [...] > > The writer mentions Linda Ronstadt's recordings with the Nelson Riddle > orchestra.B Would you call Nelson Riddle a jazz artist?B I think of his > work > more as very sophisticated pop than Jazz and I think of Linda's vocals on > those records in the same way. > > Mark in Seattle > > ------------------------------ > > End of JMDL Digest V2015 #388 > ***************************** > > ------- > To post messages to the list,sendto joni@smoe.org > Unsubscribe by clicking here: > mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe > ------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 12:39:56 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Good grief, if true! This is a story from ***The National Enquirer*** so let's not get too hung up about it. What I've read about Taylor Swift, like her or not she's a genuine sweet person and this seems way out of character for her. Bob NP: Red River Dialect, "Ring of Kerry" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any and all computers and other devices. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 16:44:28 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: JMDL Digest V2015 #388 Yeah! I can't wait for this discussion!! 29 days! - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Laurie Antonioli Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2015 11:52 AM To: JMDL Cc: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2015 #388 We can have a big discussion at the JoniFest on "what jazz is" and "why singers turn to jazz" later in their careers. I have many theories. FACT: Joni was heavily influenced by Annie Ross (who wrote the lyrics to "Twisted" which she of course recorded) and loves Ellington and Miles. These are influences she had before she transitioned and started hiring jazz musicians to work with her. If she was listening to Lambert, Hendricks & Ross (I worshiped at the alter of LHR and still do) as a young woman, for sure that has informed her music. Also the style and lyrics of vocalese (setting lyrics to pre-existing, recorded instrumental solos) is a very stream of consciousness kind of style. Note: "Twisted" is a horn solo by tenor saxophonist Wardell Grey who Annie then wrote words to. Vocalese is very clever, often funny, fearless and complex. Sound like anyone we know? : ) Laurie On Tue, Aug 4, 2015 at 8:29 AM, JMDL Digest wrote: > > JMDL Digest Tuesday, August 4 2015 Volume 2015 : Number 388 > > > > ========== > > TOPICS and authors in this Digest: > -------- > Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? > [Clin] > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 15:27:13 +0000 (UTC) > From: Clint Norwood > Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz > Albums? > > I completely understand what you are saying about jazz.I think that > the Linda Ronstadt/Sinatra kind of thing is called "jazz" a lot > because its style coincided with the early jazz age in America. If you > turn on the "jazz channel" here in Memphis you will get a lot of show > tunes and Sinatra-esque stuff. I think the word "jazz" is used to > cover a lot of music that seems like it wouldn't offend "older" > people. How things have changed! > To me, (drum roll) I think jazz is a piece of music that has a basic > head (like the beginning of Miles Davis' "So What!") but the rest of > the tune has nothing but very broad chord charts to arrange the rest > of the "song." In this way there is no melody excepting the beginning > head. The rest of the tune (solos and trade offs between the > musicians) must be played over those broad chord charts and the > musicians can do anything they like to go with the music. > In this way there is far less structure than the typical song but it > makes the musicians communicate with each other in a way I don't think > others have to do because it is not pre-decided. > Remember also that show tunes and other pop songs can be made into jazz. > "My > Favorite Things" was turned into a jazz piece by Coltrane but I doubt > that anyone who doesn't hear the opening head "Raindrops on Roses" > etc., would recognize it.-Clint > > > > On Tuesday, August 4, 2015 8:28 AM, Catherine McKay > wrote: > > > Mark, as always, you express what I'm thinking so much better than I > could myself. I agree that Joni did "Mingus" at Charles Mingus's > request, and that she likely hadn't thought of going that far into > jazz before that. I also agree with Muller that some of Joni's best > singing was on the "Mingus" > album, > with "Sweet sucker dance" being the best of the best. > > > I haven't heard the Annie Lennox one and have deliberately stayed away > from it, because it does seem that *everyone* wants to do a "jazz" > album, but I suspect you are right and that Annie's isn't really jazz > either. As well, I don't think Linda Rondstadt's Nelson Riddle recordings were jazz either. > They > were more like big band pop, or whatever you want to call it, the kind > of thing that was popular in the 40s. If it ain't rock'n'roll, do > people just say it's jazz? > > > and that led me to, "What the heck is jazz anyway?" which is why I > stayed out of this to start with. I started wandering down the "What > is jazz" road and got lost on the way. > > > > - ----- Original Message ----- > From: Mark Scott > To: Susan E. McNamara ; joni@smoe.org > Cc: > Sent: Tuesday, August 4, 2015 12:16 AM > Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing JazzB > Albums? > > Interesting that the writer didn't mention the 'Both Sides Now' CD > which, to my mind anyway, is more along the lines of what she was > writing about.B To me, 'Mingus' was Joni picking up the gauntlet that > Mingus threw down, accepting the challenge, not about doing a Jazz > album as a novelty item to revive a career.B As the writer mentioned, > Joni was pretty much riding the crest of her popularity at the time.B > The fact that she paid for it in terms of a loss of some of her radio > airplay and fan base is not a really valid comment on the quality of > the work. > > [...] > > The writer mentions Linda Ronstadt's recordings with the Nelson Riddle > orchestra.B Would you call Nelson Riddle a jazz artist?B I think of > his work more as very sophisticated pop than Jazz and I think of > Linda's vocals on those records in the same way. > > Mark in Seattle > > ------------------------------ > > End of JMDL Digest V2015 #388 > ***************************** > > ------- > To post messages to the list,sendto joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by > clicking here: > mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe > ------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 10:48:01 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? An interesting topic...the writer makes more of a case about the nosedive in Joni's popularity versus her actual performance on Mingus. Of course you could easily argue that Joni's jazz voice started way beyond that. Joni herself admits that she knew Mingus would be a career killer. I still claim that the album contains some her purest singing, "Sweet Sucker Dance" in particular. Bob NP: Brian Eno & David Byrne, "One Fine Day". From: "Susan E. McNamara" To: "'joni@smoe.org'" , Date: 08/03/2015 10:28 AM Subject: TodaysZaman.com: Why Do Pop Singers Keep Releasing Jazz Albums? Sent by: owner-joni@smoe.org Passable? Discuss ... http://secure-web.cisco.com/14GR398N-gz-XDCIfYzzQXZeTsO2LpIxzWFt2t5ND8lNhFrCOGIxKSUtWRyteMvEgIfsHFkFy1Ct2PGsJTSku_r2vXq8oRJNax6rPkrmakEBxKlIvzkQ8FqHhlkKGuMdiXNfyr4XFmcswjuyy35b0fGAT1GmGfpkrcB0Cweh_QC0/http%3A%2F%2Ftinyurl.com%2Fonl6loa Sue Tierney McNamara Email: sem8@cornell.edu - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any and all computers and other devices. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2014 #745 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here:mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe