From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2013 #421 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Website:http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe:mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Thursday, October 31 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 421 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry [Anne Sandstrom ] Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career [Gerald P Kent Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry Well, I think that Katy Perry is a better songwriter than many give her credit for. Althought the lyrics aren't great, the melody to "Firework" is pretty darn good if you ask me. And her song "Wide Awake" is great IMHO.Yeah, she's got the bubble gum/blue hair schtick going on. Maybe she meant she'd give up on that whole facade? Who knows? The fact that she even knows who Joni is is rather impressive. Kind of reminds me of Taylor Swift inviting Shawn Colvin on stage to sing "Sonny Came Home" together. The contrast was striking. Gravitas vs. fluff. I'll let you guess which was which. Makes me wonder "if you like that music so much, how on earth do you come up with your stuff?" Puzzling. lots of love,Anne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2013 22:57:37 -0400 From: Gerald P Kent Subject: Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career BAA, BAA, BAA, BAA. Another of the sheep "herd" from!!!!! Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 30, 2013, at 1:10 AM, Sally wrote: > > I'm female...I'm not feeling marginalized. In saying what he said, Bob was speaking as a huge fan of a different woman. minor feeling the angst. > Bob...want me to "slap you with the splintered ruler"? ;) > > > >> On Oct 30, 2013, at 1:04 AM, "Arkay Adkisson" wrote: >> >> You are infinitely more patient and well-spoke than I.B >> >> >> >> I get angry not because I may or may not support Katy Perry's music, but >> because referring to her in such a derogatory and dismissive way, does in >> fact, continue the societal-wide marginalization of women. B >> >> >> >> >> Perhaps this result is indeed SO contrary to the true intention, that this >> becomes a moment of learning, thus un-learning, and a little growth >> happens.B >> >> >> >> Perhaps.B >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> b >> Sent from Mailbox for iPhone >> >> >> >> On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 10:05 PM, Vince Lavieri >> > wrote: >> What follows below is the wording of NPR. I am not a Katy Perry fan but I >> >> found the interview informative in that my perceptions were altered as to her >> >> depth. Not that she has to answer to me. The fact that Scott Simon did a >> >> piece on her says something profound about her. And I wish the Huffington >> >> Post article had had more content on Perry's Joni comment. >> >> >> What I know is this, that as a whole with some obvious exceptions the JMDL >> >> tends to trash on all younger female pop singers. An Erica Badu will get >> some >> >> respect but mention Taylor Swift and the knives come out. A blues-y jazzy >> Amy >> >> Winehouse gets love but a woman who sings in the pop category gets put down >> >> and castigated. And if a young female pop singer speaks of her respect for >> >> Joni, the hate fest erupts. As it did when Taylor Swift was connected to >> >> Joni, spoke well of her. The condescending comments were so numerous. >> >> >> Young male pop singers also get dissed but the venom is stronger on the >> >> females. >> >> >> I have said before and I will repeat, that too many (and one is too many) >> have >> >> forgotten two things: 1. hope I did before I get old and 2. Mothers, fathers >> >> through out the land, don't criticize what you don't understand. >> >> >> When I think of how my generation was in the late 60s and early 70s, with >> >> hair, clothes or lack thereof, sexual liberation, drugs, and all kinds of >> >> posing and self aggrandizement, a Katy Perry, Lorde, Miley Cyrus, Gaga, >> >> Kei$ha, are what they are: us reflected back at ourselves. They are us, >> >> current generation to our faded generation that mocks the way our parents >> >> mocked our music. The quip (which I suspect was said in humor, not to hurt) >> >> about blue hair would never be made about Cindi Lauper but then she is in her >> >> 40s or 50s. Katy Perry's hair has always been black to my knowledge but >> maybe >> >> I missed a color change. Prism is a powerful album, Roar to me is over done >> >> but so is all Led Zepplin. Not like she invented the arena sound. Teenage >> >> Dream was one of the great albums of this decade. One can respect what we do >> >> not like, understand what is not our genre, and realize that sometimes the >> >> snark comes on so strong it invites the charge of misogyny and reflects >> poorly >> >> on the elders who are pissed off by the music of the young, which of course >> >> the young should be doing, and that female pop singers do not diminish Joni >> by >> >> the fact of their talent and success. >> >> >> Vince who wishes people listened to what Miley sang when she twerked Robin >> and >> >> remembered that group sex in public was a fun fashion for people now in their >> >> 50s and 60s who are shocked, shocked that someone would act out why don't we >> >> do it in the road. And is in agreement with those who have been troubled by >> >> the Katy Perry comments today. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I found the following story on the NPR iPhone App: >> >> >> Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career >> >> by NPR Staff >> >> >> NPR - October 26, 2013 >> >> >> Katy Perry is among the world's biggest pop artists, but her fans know her >> >> current career is actually a second take. She first tried her hand in the >> >> music world as a teenager, making Christian music as Katy Hudson. She >> released >> >> an album in 2001, which failed to break through.... >> >> >> http://www.npr.org/2013/10/26/240760441/katy-perry-returns-with-a-roar?sc=17& >> >> f=7 >> >> >> >> >> Sent from my iPhone ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2013 23:25:38 -0400 From: Gerald P Kent Subject: Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career Enjoy your fleece Sally. It is very well deserved! Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 31, 2013, at 11:19 PM, Sally wrote: > > Well well well...if Bob's a sheep, fleece me with Bob's flock. I'm not getting the heavy duty angst out of what he said or meant and I'm going to repost my original post below. For some reason it never made it to the list. It was addressed to Gerald's initial post quoted below my response. Gak we need diagrams...just keep reading, you'll get it. > > > Hello Gerald, > > I'm confused. You seem to be saying that if you are "more informed", you are "less infatuated". Actually...I'm not being a smartass here but I am totally infatuated with Joni Mitchell and her amazing artistry and I do consider myself informed. > As for this dispute that's broken out here, I think people like the music that they like and they don't like the music that they don't like. If you're a fan of music, if you wake to it, let it put you to sleep at night, dream it, feel it, make love to it...if you are a freaking slave to the rhythm...then you're wide open to anything that moves you. It can be Bach, Joni, Miles Davis, Katy Perry, Eminem...whatever! Isn't it about doing something well? Isn't it? And isn't that why we all come together here? Our admiration for an astounding musical genius? There's room for anybody that moves us. If we close doors, crap...we miss so much beautiful sound. My two cents. > I don't take it personally...what Bob had to say. He just doesn't like something. "Pea brain" was the first thing he thought of! Amusingly descriptive. ;) Katy Perry is young. I hope she hangs in there and makes some songs that blow everyone away. We could use more of that all the time. > > PeaceLove, Sally > > Sent from Confunction Junction on my iPhone > >> On Oct 30, 2013, at 12:30 AM, Gerald P Kent wrote: >> >> Well said David. The listers go far in turning the less infatuated, more informed persons away from the incredible music of Joni Mitchell. It is very sad how they are destroying her legacy to the new generations. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Oct 30, 2013, at 12:14 AM, David Marine wrote: >>> >>> Dear List, >>> >>> I do enjoy posting here, but these missives will have to evolve over time. I'll probably turn into more of a James Joyce or a Shakespeare as I get older... >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> David > > Sent from Confunction Junction on my iPhone > >> On Oct 31, 2013, at 10:57 PM, Gerald P Kent wrote: >> >> BAA, BAA, BAA, BAA. Another of the sheep "herd" from!!!!! >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Oct 30, 2013, at 1:10 AM, Sally wrote: >>> >>> I'm female...I'm not feeling marginalized. In saying what he said, Bob was speaking as a huge fan of a different woman. minor feeling the angst. >>> Bob...want me to "slap you with the splintered ruler"? ;) >>> >>> >>> >>>> On Oct 30, 2013, at 1:04 AM, "Arkay Adkisson" wrote: >>>> >>>> You are infinitely more patient and well-spoke than I.B >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I get angry not because I may or may not support Katy Perry's music, but >>>> because referring to her in such a derogatory and dismissive way, does in >>>> fact, continue the societal-wide marginalization of women. B >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Perhaps this result is indeed SO contrary to the true intention, that this >>>> becomes a moment of learning, thus un-learning, and a little growth >>>> happens.B >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Perhaps.B >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> b >>>> Sent from Mailbox for iPhone >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 10:05 PM, Vince Lavieri >>>> > wrote: >>>> What follows below is the wording of NPR. I am not a Katy Perry fan but I >>>> >>>> found the interview informative in that my perceptions were altered as to her >>>> >>>> depth. Not that she has to answer to me. The fact that Scott Simon did a >>>> >>>> piece on her says something profound about her. And I wish the Huffington >>>> >>>> Post article had had more content on Perry's Joni comment. >>>> >>>> >>>> What I know is this, that as a whole with some obvious exceptions the JMDL >>>> >>>> tends to trash on all younger female pop singers. An Erica Badu will get >>>> some >>>> >>>> respect but mention Taylor Swift and the knives come out. A blues-y jazzy >>>> Amy >>>> >>>> Winehouse gets love but a woman who sings in the pop category gets put down >>>> >>>> and castigated. And if a young female pop singer speaks of her respect for >>>> >>>> Joni, the hate fest erupts. As it did when Taylor Swift was connected to >>>> >>>> Joni, spoke well of her. The condescending comments were so numerous. >>>> >>>> >>>> Young male pop singers also get dissed but the venom is stronger on the >>>> >>>> females. >>>> >>>> >>>> I have said before and I will repeat, that too many (and one is too many) >>>> have >>>> >>>> forgotten two things: 1. hope I did before I get old and 2. Mothers, fathers >>>> >>>> through out the land, don't criticize what you don't understand. >>>> >>>> >>>> When I think of how my generation was in the late 60s and early 70s, with >>>> >>>> hair, clothes or lack thereof, sexual liberation, drugs, and all kinds of >>>> >>>> posing and self aggrandizement, a Katy Perry, Lorde, Miley Cyrus, Gaga, >>>> >>>> Kei$ha, are what they are: us reflected back at ourselves. They are us, >>>> >>>> current generation to our faded generation that mocks the way our parents >>>> >>>> mocked our music. The quip (which I suspect was said in humor, not to hurt) >>>> >>>> about blue hair would never be made about Cindi Lauper but then she is in her >>>> >>>> 40s or 50s. Katy Perry's hair has always been black to my knowledge but >>>> maybe >>>> >>>> I missed a color change. Prism is a powerful album, Roar to me is over done >>>> >>>> but so is all Led Zepplin. Not like she invented the arena sound. Teenage >>>> >>>> Dream was one of the great albums of this decade. One can respect what we do >>>> >>>> not like, understand what is not our genre, and realize that sometimes the >>>> >>>> snark comes on so strong it invites the charge of misogyny and reflects >>>> poorly >>>> >>>> on the elders who are pissed off by the music of the young, which of course >>>> >>>> the young should be doing, and that female pop singers do not diminish Joni >>>> by >>>> >>>> the fact of their talent and success. >>>> >>>> >>>> Vince who wishes people listened to what Miley sang when she twerked Robin >>>> and >>>> >>>> remembered that group sex in public was a fun fashion for people now in their >>>> >>>> 50s and 60s who are shocked, shocked that someone would act out why don't we >>>> >>>> do it in the road. And is in agreement with those who have been troubled by >>>> >>>> the Katy Perry comments today. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I found the following story on the NPR iPhone App: >>>> >>>> >>>> Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career >>>> >>>> by NPR Staff >>>> >>>> >>>> NPR - October 26, 2013 >>>> >>>> >>>> Katy Perry is among the world's biggest pop artists, but her fans know her >>>> >>>> current career is actually a second take. She first tried her hand in the >>>> >>>> music world as a teenager, making Christian music as Katy Hudson. She >>>> released >>>> >>>> an album in 2001, which failed to break through.... >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.npr.org/2013/10/26/240760441/katy-perry-returns-with-a-roar?sc=17& >>>> >>>> f=7 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2013 #421 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here:mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe