From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2013 #417 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Website:http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe:mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Wednesday, October 30 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 417 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry [Rick Hobbs-Seeley ] Re: This Katy Perry/Joni thing [Sally ] Joni on Cover of UNCUT Magazine [est86mlm@ameritech.net] Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career [Vince Lavieri ] Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry [Gerald P Kent ] Re: Joni on Cover of UNCUT Magazine [mflaher3@yahoo.com] Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] RE: ["Susan E. McNamara" ] Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry [Clint Norwood ] Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career [Sally ] Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry [Dave Blackburn ] Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career ["Arkay Adkisson" ] Re: Bob is a good guy [Gerald P Kent ] Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry [Gerald P Kent ] Original painting by Joni up for auction [Les Irvin ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:57:26 -0500 From: Rick Hobbs-Seeley Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry Gerald, Vince, Victor and Bob, I've been reading, albeit off and on, this discussion group for 14 years. I've learned more from the folks on this group about music than I could ever learn in any music appreciation class. More about the music and influence of Miss Joni Mitchell than I knew in all the years - pre Internet - when I admired her talent assumably alone. Smart, articulate people. Some of whom have sacrificed their time from friends and family to educate the rest of us on others that also find her music inspiring, others who discover her tunings, others who plan gatherings to share our common, sometimes fanatic, romanticism. Some of whom, I've grown to love as friends. Okay, that's what I must say. Now for the confessional. As I age, I find it more and more difficult to connect with the popular artists of today. I'm not an expert on the music scene of today, but, it seems to me that things have changed. Today's artists are clearly talented in one way or the other, it just seems less home grown than what we learned to love in days past. Maybe more manufactured and subjected to focus groups. What I do know is we have to change with the times. We must focus our musical interests to those that turn us on. Be it "throw back" singer songwriters we find on PBS radio or local artists we find in open mike nights and concerts. Some of us understand the music industry of today and can appreciate the breakthrough some artists make due to their vocal, musicianship fortitude or songwriting skills. Some of us can't. No harm, no foul. It's all about taste. I do think we, as a group, need to respect the opinions of others on both sides of the artistic equation. However, we need to refrain from challenging one another on our opinions. Just state them and let go if you feel so compelled . Some readers and writers did just that on the Perry discussion. I must also say we must refrain from sniping the talent or lack thereof of current artists who our younger readers may hold in high esteem. A larger part of our mission here is to educate and involve our "youngers" on the music of Joni Mitchell to keep her music alive for the generation(s) to come. We don't fulfill that mission without acceptance and appreciation. While I have no regrets. I sign off as your friend, CoyoteRick Sent from my iPhone On Oct 29, 2013, at 8:31 PM, Gerald P Kent wrote: Another one of my few responses to the discussion group. As a long time member and one who really appreciates much of Joni's music I once again find it quite appalling at how condescending many of you are. I find it very complimentary to joni that a young person would recognize her and acknowledge her longitivity. Really appalling comments. How disappointing that this group had evolved into this. Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 29, 2013, at 4:05 PM, Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: > > Well, she could release an album all about her hair and call it BLUE. > > Bob > > NP: Arcade Fire, "Flashbulb Eyes" > > > > > From: Dave Blackburn > To: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com, > Cc: Jimmy Stewart , JMDL JMDL > Date: 10/29/2013 03:54 PM > Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry > > > > Maybe she meant crabbier and more reclusive. > >> On Oct 29, 2013, at 11:04 AM, Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: >> >> That silly quote is about a month old...I laughed when I read it..."I'll > >> probably turn into more of a Joni Mitchell as I get older", which in her > >> pea-brain means she will play the acoustic guitar. As for me, I'm ready > to >> turn into George Clooney. >> >> Bob > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > The information transmitted is intended only for the person > or entity to which it is addressed and may contain > proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. > If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are > hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, > distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon > this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please > contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. > > Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual > sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. > ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 02:26:09 -0400 From: Sally Subject: Re: This Katy Perry/Joni thing Hey Rob! Well said! And I LOVE Flock of Seagulls! Yeeeehaaaa! And Stevie....my Sister of the Moon. A genius of course. I'd have to say that I preferred Live Through This to Celebrity Skin. I just don't know if you can do better than Miss World, right? But both were great records. I had a real attitude about Miley Cyrus. Then a friend of mine sent me a link to a YouTube video of her performing Jolene. I about fell out. The subject line of the email was: Reconsider Miley Cyrus. After I watched that video, I did. It was awesome. The lesson...why turn away from any music? It's what drives us so why not be open to anything? If it's good, it's ear candy. I think Joni herself might just like to give Katy's Last Friday Night a spin and dance her ass off! It's a fun little tune meant for that. > On Oct 30, 2013, at 1:48 AM, Rob Procyk wrote: > > I gotta say I am a big fan of Katy Perry - I have pre-teen daughters and have spent more than a little time listening to "their" music, so I too have Miley and Katy and everyone else on my iPods. Anyway, I really like Katy. That being said, I don't think Bob's comment was offensive at all - it was meant as a joke and I don't think it is misogynistic that he basically scoffed that Katy would grow into a Joni Mitchell. Different artists, different talents, and come on - its apples and oranges. About musical snobbery - I've been on this list for 15 years, and I've always had different tastes than most on here. When I die, I will go to Heaven where it's always the early 80s, and new romantics and goths and all the other eyeliner wearing angels will be dancing to The Cure and New Order and Flock of Seagulls, and then we will all shimmy over to another cloud where 80s Industrial angels will be making righteous noise, and then we will wind our nights down with funk and top 40. With! > Stevie Nicks on continual twirl. > Basically, what I'm trying to say is that I don't give a shit what ANYONE thinks of what I like. Hell, I don't care for Dylan, don't get Nyro, nor do I claim to understand the brilliance of many other list favorites. People like what they like, and that's fine with me. If people here are snobby about top 40 artists? Whatever. I think Stevie Nicks is a genius - 98% on the list don't, but it doesn't bother me - to each his/her own. I remember way back when, defending Hole's Celebrity Skin album, and getting frustrated because the list didn't like even the mention of Courtney Love. But does it matter? This is the Joni list, so this isn't your typical list - its special, just like Joni is special. And while I still think Celebrity Skin is amazing, it doesn't matter to me that nobody else does. And when Katy does make this silly Joni reference, I chuckled too, even though I like her and own all her albums. > Long story short: we all come from such different sets of circumstance - which lead to different musical journeys. So, those who are spinning Nyro and Television and Ani and whatever else speaks to, rock on. I'll be here in the basement keeping it real with the synth crowd and Prince and Stevie. But regardless of what we like and don't like, we have Joni in common. Isn't that cool? The last 4 albums played on my iPod are by Arcade Fire, No Doubt, and 2 albums by Skinny Puppy. What are yours? > > Just my rambly 2 cents on a cold Saskatchewan night, > > Rob > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On 2013-10-29, at 10:25 PM, owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) wrote: >> >> >> JMDL Digest Wednesday, October 30 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 1468 >> >> >> >> ========== >> >> TOPICS and authors in this Digest: >> -------- >> Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career [Gerald P Kent > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:24:29 -0400 >> From: Gerald P Kent >> Subject: Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career >> >> Vince, thank you for your honesty in addressing what I consider the JMDLer's (which I am one of) collective (sorry to many for the generalizing) disrespectful, condescending and somewhat uninformed opinions they/we develop relevant to any of the new persons in popular music. It makes me think of Sonny and Sher and the pop music they developed. Didn't the same promoter (aka David Geffen) develop them along with Laura Nyro (who wrote a number of tunes popularized by the 5th dimension, God forgive their "popness") and others? Thank you for being one of the few "listers" with the courage to challenge the others, the Joni I know would love it!!! >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Oct 29, 2013, at 11:01 PM, Vince Lavieri wrote: >>> >>> What follows below is the wording of NPR. I am not a Katy Perry fan but I >>> found the interview informative in that my perceptions were altered as to her >>> depth. Not that she has to answer to me. The fact that Scott Simon did a >>> piece on her says something profound about her. And I wish the Huffington >>> Post article had had more content on Perry's Joni comment. >>> >>> What I know is this, that as a whole with some obvious exceptions the JMDL >>> tends to trash on all younger female pop singers. An Erica Badu will get some >>> respect but mention Taylor Swift and the knives come out. A blues-y jazzy Amy >>> Winehouse gets love but a woman who sings in the pop category gets put down >>> and castigated. And if a young female pop singer speaks of her respect for >>> Joni, the hate fest erupts. As it did when Taylor Swift was connected to >>> Joni, spoke well of her. The condescending comments were so numerous. >>> >>> Young male pop singers also get dissed but the venom is stronger on the >>> females. >>> >>> I have said before and I will repeat, that too many (and one is too many) have >>> forgotten two things: 1. hope I did before I get old and 2. Mothers, fathers >>> through out the land, don't criticize what you don't understand. >>> >>> When I think of how my generation was in the late 60s and early 70s, with >>> hair, clothes or lack thereof, sexual liberation, drugs, and all kinds of >>> posing and self aggrandizement, a Katy Perry, Lorde, Miley Cyrus, Gaga, >>> Kei$ha, are what they are: us reflected back at ourselves. They are us, >>> current generation to our faded generation that mocks the way our parents >>> mocked our music. The quip (which I suspect was said in humor, not to hurt) >>> about blue hair would never be made about Cindi Lauper but then she is in her >>> 40s or 50s. Katy Perry's hair has always been black to my knowledge but maybe >>> I missed a color change. Prism is a powerful album, Roar to me is over done >>> but so is all Led Zepplin. Not like she invented the arena sound. Teenage >>> Dream was one of the great albums of this decade. One can respect what we do >>> not like, understand what is not our genre, and realize that sometimes the >>> snark comes on so strong it invites the charge of misogyny and reflects poorly >>> on the elders who are pissed off by the music of the young, which of course >>> the young should be doing, and that female pop singers do not diminish Joni by >>> the fact of their talent and success. >>> >>> Vince who wishes people listened to what Miley sang when she twerked Robin and >>> remembered that group sex in public was a fun fashion for people now in their >>> 50s and 60s who are shocked, shocked that someone would act out why don't we >>> do it in the road. And is in agreement with those who have been troubled by >>> the Katy Perry comments today. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> I found the following story on the NPR iPhone App: >>> >>> Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career >>> by NPR Staff >>> >>> NPR - October 26, 2013 >>> >>> Katy Perry is among the world's biggest pop artists, but her fans know her >>> current career is actually a second take. She first tried her hand in the >>> music world as a teenager, making Christian music as Katy Hudson. She released >>> an album in 2001, which failed to break through.... >>> >>> http://www.npr.org/2013/10/26/240760441/katy-perry-returns-with-a-roar?sc=17& >>> f=7 >>> >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> End of JMDL Digest V2013 #1468 >> ****************************** >> >> ------- >> To post messages to the list, sendtojoni@smoe.org. >> Unsubscribe by clicking here: >> mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe >> ------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 17:24:21 -0500 From: est86mlm@ameritech.net Subject: Joni on Cover of UNCUT Magazine Joni is on the December 2013 cover of the UK magazine, UNCUT. It's sold as an import at Barnes & Noble. Just got off the phone and was told it should arrive in-store about November 17. Here's a cover shot on eBay. Item Number: 141102889520 http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNCUT-MAGAZINE-DECEMBER-2013-JONI-MITCHELL-KING-CRIMSON-AC-DC-SPRINGSTEEN-CD-/141102889520?pt=UK_Magazines&hash=item20da633a30 Laura ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 23:01:23 -0400 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career What follows below is the wording of NPR. I am not a Katy Perry fan but I found the interview informative in that my perceptions were altered as to her depth. Not that she has to answer to me. The fact that Scott Simon did a piece on her says something profound about her. And I wish the Huffington Post article had had more content on Perry's Joni comment. What I know is this, that as a whole with some obvious exceptions the JMDL tends to trash on all younger female pop singers. An Erica Badu will get some respect but mention Taylor Swift and the knives come out. A blues-y jazzy Amy Winehouse gets love but a woman who sings in the pop category gets put down and castigated. And if a young female pop singer speaks of her respect for Joni, the hate fest erupts. As it did when Taylor Swift was connected to Joni, spoke well of her. The condescending comments were so numerous. Young male pop singers also get dissed but the venom is stronger on the females. I have said before and I will repeat, that too many (and one is too many) have forgotten two things: 1. hope I did before I get old and 2. Mothers, fathers through out the land, don't criticize what you don't understand. When I think of how my generation was in the late 60s and early 70s, with hair, clothes or lack thereof, sexual liberation, drugs, and all kinds of posing and self aggrandizement, a Katy Perry, Lorde, Miley Cyrus, Gaga, Kei$ha, are what they are: us reflected back at ourselves. They are us, current generation to our faded generation that mocks the way our parents mocked our music. The quip (which I suspect was said in humor, not to hurt) about blue hair would never be made about Cindi Lauper but then she is in her 40s or 50s. Katy Perry's hair has always been black to my knowledge but maybe I missed a color change. Prism is a powerful album, Roar to me is over done but so is all Led Zepplin. Not like she invented the arena sound. Teenage Dream was one of the great albums of this decade. One can respect what we do not like, understand what is not our genre, and realize that sometimes the snark comes on so strong it invites the charge of misogyny and reflects poorly on the elders who are pissed off by the music of the young, which of course the young should be doing, and that female pop singers do not diminish Joni by the fact of their talent and success. Vince who wishes people listened to what Miley sang when she twerked Robin and remembered that group sex in public was a fun fashion for people now in their 50s and 60s who are shocked, shocked that someone would act out why don't we do it in the road. And is in agreement with those who have been troubled by the Katy Perry comments today. I found the following story on the NPR iPhone App: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career by NPR Staff NPR - October 26, 2013 Katy Perry is among the world's biggest pop artists, but her fans know her current career is actually a second take. She first tried her hand in the music world as a teenager, making Christian music as Katy Hudson. She released an album in 2001, which failed to break through.... http://www.npr.org/2013/10/26/240760441/katy-perry-returns-with-a-roar?sc=17& f=7 Sent from my iPhone ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:14:57 -0400 From: David Marine Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry Dear List, I do enjoy posting here, but these missives will have to evolve over time. I'll probably turn into more of a James Joyce or a Shakespeare as I get older... Best, David ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:30:58 -0400 From: Gerald P Kent Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry Well said David. The listers go far in turning the less infatuated, more informed persons away from the incredible music of Joni Mitchell. It is very sad how they are destroying her legacy to the new generations. Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 30, 2013, at 12:14 AM, David Marine wrote: > > Dear List, > > I do enjoy posting here, but these missives will have to evolve over time. I'll probably turn into more of a James Joyce or a Shakespeare as I get older... > > Best, > > David ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 17:50:39 -0500 From: mflaher3@yahoo.com Subject: Re: Joni on Cover of UNCUT Magazine I have a feeling that Blue Notes CD might be Joni related. Maybe some covers? Uncut often does something like that. Michael F. Sent from my iPhone On Oct 29, 2013, at 5:24 PM, est86mlm@ameritech.net wrote: > Joni is on the December 2013 cover of the UK magazine, UNCUT. > > It's sold as an import at Barnes & Noble. Just got off the phone and was told it should > arrive in-store about November 17. > > Here's a cover shot on eBay. Item Number: 141102889520 > http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNCUT-MAGAZINE-DECEMBER-2013-JONI-MITCHELL-KING-CRIMSON-AC-DC-SPRINGSTEEN-CD-/141102889520?pt=UK_Magazines&hash=item20da633a30 > > Laura ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 14:04:55 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry That silly quote is about a month old...I laughed when I read it..."I'll probably turn into more of a Joni Mitchell as I get older", which in her pea-brain means she will play the acoustic guitar. As for me, I'm ready to turn into George Clooney. Bob NP: Arcade Fire, "P*rno" From: FMYFL@aol.com To: joni@smoe.org, Date: 10/29/2013 01:51 PM Subject: Joni mention by Katy Perry Sent by: owner-joni@smoe.org According to the Huffington post : http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/27/katy-perry-joni-mitchell_n_4004733.html Jimmy - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 14:34:26 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: Yes, Laura, Fests are included!!! Fill out the survey!! :) Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu From: LC Stanley [mailto:sillyseabird7@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2013 8:19 AM To: Joni List; Susan E. McNamara Subject: Sue wrote: > > >> I would love to send her a card with an insert that chronicles all > > >> the > > Joni > > >> Tributes that have happened in the last year, and tell her how much > > >> her music is appreciated by all ages, all over the world. I'm sure > > >> the website and JMDL archives can give me a comprehensive list with > > >> some other research done Hi Sue and all, What about including our Jonifest information too? How many and where and who and from where attended? This would be more personal from the JMDL. I think she appreciates how we are linked together with each other throughout the world by our common love for and appreciation of her music. Our existence as friends who wouldn't have met if it wasn't for Joni is a big tribute to her. My friends on this list have greatly impacted my life. And it is because Joni was so giving of herself through her music and art. Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 12:15:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Clint Norwood Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry Oh God! Joni Mitchell is not a singer or person but a style!! HAW HAW!! Like making a career move or going to a different wardrobe - -Clint On Tuesday, October 29, 2013 1:25 PM, "Bob.Muller@Fluor.com" wrote: That silly quote is about a month old...I laughed when I read it..."I'll probably turn into more of a Joni Mitchell as I get older", which in her pea-brain means she will play the acoustic guitar. As for me, I'm ready to turn into George Clooney. Bob NP: Arcade Fire, "P*rno" From: FMYFL@aol.com To: joni@smoe.org, Date: 10/29/2013 01:51 PM Subject: Joni mention by Katy Perry Sent by: owner-joni@smoe.org According to the Huffington post : http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/27/katy-perry-joni-mitchell_n_4004733.h tml Jimmy - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 01:10:09 -0400 From: Sally Subject: Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career I'm female...I'm not feeling marginalized. In saying what he said, Bob was speaking as a huge fan of a different woman. minor feeling the angst. Bob...want me to "slap you with the splintered ruler"? ;) > On Oct 30, 2013, at 1:04 AM, "Arkay Adkisson" wrote: > > You are infinitely more patient and well-spoke than I.B > > > > I get angry not because I may or may not support Katy Perry's music, but > because referring to her in such a derogatory and dismissive way, does in > fact, continue the societal-wide marginalization of women. B > > > > > Perhaps this result is indeed SO contrary to the true intention, that this > becomes a moment of learning, thus un-learning, and a little growth > happens.B > > > > Perhaps.B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b > Sent from Mailbox for iPhone > > > > On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 10:05 PM, Vince Lavieri > > wrote: > What follows below is the wording of NPR. I am not a Katy Perry fan but I > > found the interview informative in that my perceptions were altered as to her > > depth. Not that she has to answer to me. The fact that Scott Simon did a > > piece on her says something profound about her. And I wish the Huffington > > Post article had had more content on Perry's Joni comment. > > > What I know is this, that as a whole with some obvious exceptions the JMDL > > tends to trash on all younger female pop singers. An Erica Badu will get > some > > respect but mention Taylor Swift and the knives come out. A blues-y jazzy > Amy > > Winehouse gets love but a woman who sings in the pop category gets put down > > and castigated. And if a young female pop singer speaks of her respect for > > Joni, the hate fest erupts. As it did when Taylor Swift was connected to > > Joni, spoke well of her. The condescending comments were so numerous. > > > Young male pop singers also get dissed but the venom is stronger on the > > females. > > > I have said before and I will repeat, that too many (and one is too many) > have > > forgotten two things: 1. hope I did before I get old and 2. Mothers, fathers > > through out the land, don't criticize what you don't understand. > > > When I think of how my generation was in the late 60s and early 70s, with > > hair, clothes or lack thereof, sexual liberation, drugs, and all kinds of > > posing and self aggrandizement, a Katy Perry, Lorde, Miley Cyrus, Gaga, > > Kei$ha, are what they are: us reflected back at ourselves. They are us, > > current generation to our faded generation that mocks the way our parents > > mocked our music. The quip (which I suspect was said in humor, not to hurt) > > about blue hair would never be made about Cindi Lauper but then she is in her > > 40s or 50s. Katy Perry's hair has always been black to my knowledge but > maybe > > I missed a color change. Prism is a powerful album, Roar to me is over done > > but so is all Led Zepplin. Not like she invented the arena sound. Teenage > > Dream was one of the great albums of this decade. One can respect what we do > > not like, understand what is not our genre, and realize that sometimes the > > snark comes on so strong it invites the charge of misogyny and reflects > poorly > > on the elders who are pissed off by the music of the young, which of course > > the young should be doing, and that female pop singers do not diminish Joni > by > > the fact of their talent and success. > > > Vince who wishes people listened to what Miley sang when she twerked Robin > and > > remembered that group sex in public was a fun fashion for people now in their > > 50s and 60s who are shocked, shocked that someone would act out why don't we > > do it in the road. And is in agreement with those who have been troubled by > > the Katy Perry comments today. > > > > > > > I found the following story on the NPR iPhone App: > > > Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career > > by NPR Staff > > > NPR - October 26, 2013 > > > Katy Perry is among the world's biggest pop artists, but her fans know her > > current career is actually a second take. She first tried her hand in the > > music world as a teenager, making Christian music as Katy Hudson. She > released > > an album in 2001, which failed to break through.... > > > http://www.npr.org/2013/10/26/240760441/katy-perry-returns-with-a-roar?sc=17& > > f=7 > > > > > Sent from my iPhone ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 12:55:09 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry Maybe she meant crabbier and more reclusive. On Oct 29, 2013, at 11:04 AM, Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: > That silly quote is about a month old...I laughed when I read it..."I'll > probably turn into more of a Joni Mitchell as I get older", which in her > pea-brain means she will play the acoustic guitar. As for me, I'm ready to > turn into George Clooney. > > Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 22:04:33 -0700 (PDT) From: "Arkay Adkisson" Subject: Re: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career You are infinitely more patient and well-spoke than I.B I get angry not because I may or may not support Katy Perry's music, but because referring to her in such a derogatory and dismissive way, does in fact, continue the societal-wide marginalization of women. B Perhaps this result is indeed SO contrary to the true intention, that this becomes a moment of learning, thus un-learning, and a little growth happens.B Perhaps.B b Sent from Mailbox for iPhone On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 10:05 PM, Vince Lavieri > wrote: What follows below is the wording of NPR. I am not a Katy Perry fan but I found the interview informative in that my perceptions were altered as to her depth. Not that she has to answer to me. The fact that Scott Simon did a piece on her says something profound about her. And I wish the Huffington Post article had had more content on Perry's Joni comment. What I know is this, that as a whole with some obvious exceptions the JMDL tends to trash on all younger female pop singers. An Erica Badu will get some respect but mention Taylor Swift and the knives come out. A blues-y jazzy Amy Winehouse gets love but a woman who sings in the pop category gets put down and castigated. And if a young female pop singer speaks of her respect for Joni, the hate fest erupts. As it did when Taylor Swift was connected to Joni, spoke well of her. The condescending comments were so numerous. Young male pop singers also get dissed but the venom is stronger on the females. I have said before and I will repeat, that too many (and one is too many) have forgotten two things: 1. hope I did before I get old and 2. Mothers, fathers through out the land, don't criticize what you don't understand. When I think of how my generation was in the late 60s and early 70s, with hair, clothes or lack thereof, sexual liberation, drugs, and all kinds of posing and self aggrandizement, a Katy Perry, Lorde, Miley Cyrus, Gaga, Kei$ha, are what they are: us reflected back at ourselves. They are us, current generation to our faded generation that mocks the way our parents mocked our music. The quip (which I suspect was said in humor, not to hurt) about blue hair would never be made about Cindi Lauper but then she is in her 40s or 50s. Katy Perry's hair has always been black to my knowledge but maybe I missed a color change. Prism is a powerful album, Roar to me is over done but so is all Led Zepplin. Not like she invented the arena sound. Teenage Dream was one of the great albums of this decade. One can respect what we do not like, understand what is not our genre, and realize that sometimes the snark comes on so strong it invites the charge of misogyny and reflects poorly on the elders who are pissed off by the music of the young, which of course the young should be doing, and that female pop singers do not diminish Joni by the fact of their talent and success. Vince who wishes people listened to what Miley sang when she twerked Robin and remembered that group sex in public was a fun fashion for people now in their 50s and 60s who are shocked, shocked that someone would act out why don't we do it in the road. And is in agreement with those who have been troubled by the Katy Perry comments today. I found the following story on the NPR iPhone App: Katy Perry On The 180 That Saved Her Career by NPR Staff NPR - October 26, 2013 Katy Perry is among the world's biggest pop artists, but her fans know her current career is actually a second take. She first tried her hand in the music world as a teenager, making Christian music as Katy Hudson. She released an album in 2001, which failed to break through.... http://www.npr.org/2013/10/26/240760441/katy-perry-returns-with-a-roar?sc=17& f=7 Sent from my iPhone ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:17:20 -0400 From: Debra Mann Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #1464 Bring on philogyny!! Peace, Debra Mann > > JMDL Digest Wednesday, October 30 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 1464 > > > > ========== > > TOPICS and authors in this Digest: > -------- > Re: Njc, lets all chill. [Arkay Adkisson ] > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 23:04:09 -0500 > From: Arkay Adkisson > Subject: Re: Njc, lets all chill. > > Of course I'm angry! Yes, I'm ranting! It is a natural and normal response > to the constant barrage of judgemental misogyny. > > Sigh. > > > On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 8:35 PM, wrote: > >> Your rant against "hate speech" was over the top. Your own tone seems >> more angry and insulting than the original post. >> >> Jim > > ------------------------------ > > End of JMDL Digest V2013 #1464 > ****************************** > > ------- > To post messages to the list, sendtojoni@smoe.org. > Unsubscribe by clicking here: > mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe > ------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:25:59 -0400 From: Gerald P Kent Subject: Re: Bob is a good guy Another sheep in the herd!!! Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 30, 2013, at 12:19 AM, Shari Eaton wrote: > > Hello > > I can attest to Bob's good nature and complete lack of misogynistic ways (a Joni fan, by definition, could be nothing of the sort). To publicly slander someone that way is pretty low. This is a free speech board with opinions that will differ. If he, or anyone else, chooses to be a music snob that is their decision and they shouldn't be shamed because of it. Not saying that he is a music snob, but if he were it doesn't really affect you. Get what you will out of these email exchanges and ignore what 'offends' you. Life is short, you haven't got time for the pointlessness of being offended. > > > Lots of Joni, > Shari ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 21:31:47 -0400 From: Gerald P Kent Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry Another one of my few responses to the discussion group. As a long time member and one who really appreciates much of Joni's music I once again find it quite appalling at how condescending many of you are. I find it very complimentary to joni that a young person would recognize her and acknowledge her longitivity. Really appalling comments. How disappointing that this group had evolved into this. Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 29, 2013, at 4:05 PM, Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: > > Well, she could release an album all about her hair and call it BLUE. > > Bob > > NP: Arcade Fire, "Flashbulb Eyes" > > > > > From: Dave Blackburn > To: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com, > Cc: Jimmy Stewart , JMDL JMDL > Date: 10/29/2013 03:54 PM > Subject: Re: Joni mention by Katy Perry > > > > Maybe she meant crabbier and more reclusive. > >> On Oct 29, 2013, at 11:04 AM, Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: >> >> That silly quote is about a month old...I laughed when I read it..."I'll > >> probably turn into more of a Joni Mitchell as I get older", which in her > >> pea-brain means she will play the acoustic guitar. As for me, I'm ready > to >> turn into George Clooney. >> >> Bob > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > The information transmitted is intended only for the person > or entity to which it is addressed and may contain > proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. > If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are > hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, > distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon > this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please > contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. > > Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual > sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. > ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 11:38:44 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: Original painting by Joni up for auction https://www.facebook.com/events/515789495168673/ ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2013 #417 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here:mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe