From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2013 #333 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Website:http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe:mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Thursday, August 29 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 333 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RE: Minor chords ["Susan E. McNamara" ] Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #1207--dulcimers [BarbaRent7@aol.com] Re: Minor chords [Dave Blackburn ] Re: Minor chords [Anita ] More Joni dulcimer [Steve Dulson ] renaldo and clara / art noveau [Andreas Schmitz ] RE: Minor chords ["Susan E. McNamara" ] Laura Allan's influence [Steve Dulson ] Laura Allan's influence [Steve Dulson ] RE: Minor chords ["Susan E. McNamara" ] RE: Minor chords ["Susan E. McNamara" ] RE: Minor chords [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: Minor chords [Dave Blackburn ] Re: Minor chords [Dave Blackburn ] Re: Minor chords [Victor Johnson ] RE: Laura Allan's influence ["Susan E. McNamara" ] Re: Minor chords [Michael Paz ] Re: Minor chords [Michael Paz ] Joni & The Mountain Dulcimer + Joelen Lapidus + Chords [est86mlm@ameritec] Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #1217 [kbhla@fastmail.fm] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 13:47:32 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: Minor chords That turn in Yvette in English kills me every time. Pain and joy ... it's amazing how music can mix the emotions like that. Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Dave Blackburn Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 6:26 PM To: Dave Blackburn Cc: Corey Blake; Steve Dulson; joni-digest@smoe.org; joni@smoe.org; jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com Subject: Re: Minor chords Well, since that went over okay, here are some more moments employing chords from the parallel minor/major chord scales ; ideal for your next stump the dinner guests game and sure to result in their prior commitments when you invite them over again: Passion Play "like washing on a LINE" borrowing the minor V chord from Dminor Yvette in English "little bit of instant BLISS" using the bVI chord from Dbminor and moving to the VI chord of Db major., Court and Spark - moves throughout between E major and E minor tonalities. Blue -last chord unexpectedly converts the "expected" Bminor into a B7. Called a Picardie third in traditional music theory. Cotton Avenue - the whole intro is in minor and moves to parallel major when the lyric begins, And many more. These are off the top of my head. Stop me when/if this gets tiresome :-) Dave On Aug 27, 2013, at 10:35 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > Ha, Corey! Be careful what you wish for! > > If there are others that might like to read about this stuff I'd be glad to write about some facets of JM's music pertaining to theory and method, and make sure it doesn't get too esoteric. As Jim said there is the Lloyd Whitesell book that gets a bit too exhaustive even for the keen student. Joni's music is often an odd mix of pedestrian and highly original, and the fact that she may not know which was which makes it all the more interesting. I believe she trusted her "feelers" so much that no other guidelines were needed or heeded. > > Dave > > > On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: > >> Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. >> >> -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 10:35:16 -0400 (EDT) From: BarbaRent7@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #1207--dulcimers I used to have one of those 'lap guitars' once. But I was a dullard with a dulcimer so sold mine to a girl in TN. Your band names all sound pretty good. Dueling Dulcimers sounds great. But can you play that song from "Deliverance" on them? ha Cheers to you all, Calamity Babs and my howling herd ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:58:07 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: Re: Minor chords Yes, indeed it is, Anita. That's the bIII chord borrowed from the parallel minor key. Good ear. Although the technique is by no means unique to Joni, she makes good use of it and has done so since track 1, side 1, album 1 of her career. On Aug 28, 2013, at 7:09 AM, Anita wrote: > Dave, at the very end of 'A Case of You' , Joni chucks in a really unexpected chord that throws up a question mark. What is that? Is it the same thing you're talking about here? > > Anita > >>> >>> >>> On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: >>> >>>> Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. >>>> >>>> -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 15:09:32 +0100 From: Anita Subject: Re: Minor chords Dave, at the very end of 'A Case of You' , Joni chucks in a really unexpected chord that throws up a question mark. What is that? Is it the same thing you're talking about here? Anita On 28 Aug 2013, at 14:47, "Susan E. McNamara" wrote: > That turn in Yvette in English kills me every time. Pain and joy ... it's amazing how music can mix the emotions like that. > > Susan Tierney McNamara > email: sem8@cornell.edu > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Dave Blackburn > Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 6:26 PM > To: Dave Blackburn > Cc: Corey Blake; Steve Dulson; joni-digest@smoe.org; joni@smoe.org; jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com > Subject: Re: Minor chords > > Well, since that went over okay, here are some more moments employing chords from the parallel minor/major chord scales ; ideal for your next stump the dinner guests game and sure to result in their prior commitments when you invite them over again: > > Passion Play "like washing on a LINE" borrowing the minor V chord from Dminor Yvette in English "little bit of instant BLISS" using the bVI chord from Dbminor and moving to the VI chord of Db major., Court and Spark - moves throughout between E major and E minor tonalities. > Blue -last chord unexpectedly converts the "expected" Bminor into a B7. Called a Picardie third in traditional music theory. > Cotton Avenue - the whole intro is in minor and moves to parallel major when the lyric begins, > > And many more. These are off the top of my head. Stop me when/if this gets tiresome :-) > > Dave > > > > > On Aug 27, 2013, at 10:35 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > >> Ha, Corey! Be careful what you wish for! >> >> If there are others that might like to read about this stuff I'd be glad to write about some facets of JM's music pertaining to theory and method, and make sure it doesn't get too esoteric. As Jim said there is the Lloyd Whitesell book that gets a bit too exhaustive even for the keen student. Joni's music is often an odd mix of pedestrian and highly original, and the fact that she may not know which was which makes it all the more interesting. I believe she trusted her "feelers" so much that no other guidelines were needed or heeded. >> >> Dave >> >> >> On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: >> >>> Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. >>> >>> -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 20:41:37 -0400 From: Steve Dulson Subject: More Joni dulcimer Posted on a dulcimer chat group: the dulcimer works, santa monica i am carmi simon of the dulcimer works. I am not that old! along with twins bobby and albert fratti, and in partnership with bob riskin and water camp of mccabes guitar shop and sometimes apprentices from antioch college we made over 1000 dulcimers. most were solid walnut with spruce tops, carved pegheads, heart sound holes and violin pegs. some were elaborate with fancy wood, inlays and banjo pegs. an indian rosewood model is the dulcimer heard on "blue". Jul 25, 2011 - --- The dulcimer my friend has is a Dulcimer Works model. Intriguing. *************************************************** Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA FAR-West (Folk Alliance Region - West) tinkersown@ca.rr.com www.far-west.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 10:46:14 +0200 From: Andreas Schmitz Subject: renaldo and clara / art noveau I am writing the following lines again since nobody answered the previous time. Hopefully somebody can help me with the following: In my holidays I finally found the time to read the book about Joni by Katherine Monk. The Creative Odyssey. During my reading I learned a lot of new information about Joni's artistic life. I asked myself whether the bootleg video of Bob Dylan's "Renaldo and Clara" really don't contain any scenes with Joni. I am talking about the video that is supposed to run about 260 minutes. And the internet sources do tell us that Joni is part of the cast. On wikipedia I found the info that Dylan later edited a cinema version of his material lasting only about 2 hours. Perhaps this is the answer to the question. The writer of the book, K. Monk, often repeats that Joni can't be seen in individual scenes because Joni decided against her commitment to this project. Do you know whether the long video does include footage with Joni that finally was left out for the shorter version? My second question is about Joni's male alter ego that she has nurtured over the years. It would be wonderful to finally get the chance to see Art Noveaus appearance in a short film called The Black Cat in the Black Mouse Socks (part of the compilation "Love" done by several female artists). On the internet I didn't find any video material. I know that the film was shown in Munich a couple of months ago. But they couldn't help me either. It would be great if someone could send me useful information on Renaldo and Art. Thank you very much, Best wishes Andreas. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:26:29 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: renaldo and clara / art noveau Hi Andreas, I'm sure the reason that no one responded is that no one really has any information such as you are looking for. I can't say anything about Renaldo & Clara other than I'm aware of the project. I had the "Love" film on VHS, I must have loaned/given it to another JMDL'er because I can no longer locate it. I did watch it in its entirety once, and let me tell you, once is plenty. The entire film is awful, and Joni's segment is the worst because it forces you to watch someone you deeply admire in a truly wretched piece of work. The writing, the acting, the story, the direction, the entirety of the segment is meandering and pointless. There's a good reason it got buried and stays hidden. To quote "O Brother Where Art Thou": "Do NOT seek the treasure!" Bob - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:58:07 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: Re: Minor chords Yes, indeed it is, Anita. That's the bIII chord borrowed from the parallel minor key. Good ear. Although the technique is by no means unique to Joni, she makes good use of it and has done so since track 1, side 1, album 1 of her career. On Aug 28, 2013, at 7:09 AM, Anita wrote: > Dave, at the very end of 'A Case of You' , Joni chucks in a really unexpected chord that throws up a question mark. What is that? Is it the same thing you're talking about here? > > Anita > >>> >>> >>> On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: >>> >>>> Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. >>>> >>>> -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 13:47:32 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: Minor chords That turn in Yvette in English kills me every time. Pain and joy ... it's amazing how music can mix the emotions like that. Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Dave Blackburn Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 6:26 PM To: Dave Blackburn Cc: Corey Blake; Steve Dulson; joni-digest@smoe.org; joni@smoe.org; jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com Subject: Re: Minor chords Well, since that went over okay, here are some more moments employing chords from the parallel minor/major chord scales ; ideal for your next stump the dinner guests game and sure to result in their prior commitments when you invite them over again: Passion Play "like washing on a LINE" borrowing the minor V chord from Dminor Yvette in English "little bit of instant BLISS" using the bVI chord from Dbminor and moving to the VI chord of Db major., Court and Spark - moves throughout between E major and E minor tonalities. Blue -last chord unexpectedly converts the "expected" Bminor into a B7. Called a Picardie third in traditional music theory. Cotton Avenue - the whole intro is in minor and moves to parallel major when the lyric begins, And many more. These are off the top of my head. Stop me when/if this gets tiresome :-) Dave On Aug 27, 2013, at 10:35 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > Ha, Corey! Be careful what you wish for! > > If there are others that might like to read about this stuff I'd be glad to write about some facets of JM's music pertaining to theory and method, and make sure it doesn't get too esoteric. As Jim said there is the Lloyd Whitesell book that gets a bit too exhaustive even for the keen student. Joni's music is often an odd mix of pedestrian and highly original, and the fact that she may not know which was which makes it all the more interesting. I believe she trusted her "feelers" so much that no other guidelines were needed or heeded. > > Dave > > > On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: > >> Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. >> >> -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 11:45:45 -0400 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Laura Allan's influence Sue wrote: > I should probably get a dulcimer. I've been thinking about it all year!!! :-) I'd be happy to teach a Dulcimer 101 course in New Orleans. And Chuck could no doubt do the BA, MA and PhD courses. :) *************************************************** Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA FAR-West (Folk Alliance Region - West) tinkersown@ca.rr.com www.far-west.org ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 10:11:10 -0400 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Laura Allan's influence Jim wrote: > I hear Laura Allan in Joni's "I Had A King" and "Eastern Rain". The way she slipped into those freaky minor chords. But Joni wrote those WAY before she met Laura... *************************************************** Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA FAR-West (Folk Alliance Region - West) tinkersown@ca.rr.com www.far-west.org ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 17:33:02 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: Minor chords The Music of Joni Mitchell by Lloyd Whitesell Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 1:22 PM To: Corey Blake Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: Minor chords There is a whole book about this. Bob, what is the title? Jim L On Aug 27, 2013, at 12:37 PM, Corey Blake wrote: > Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 17:59:33 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: Minor chords Thanks Professor Dave. Can't wait to see you in NO so we can talk about this stuff again. I love what you say here about her rhythm. You first are daunted by the tunings and the phrasing but you really don't know what you are getting into until you try to play Joni with a band. As long as I live I will love our drummer for "getting it" when the band threw me a bone and said I could play "Help Me". If it wasn't for her exceptional talent we would have been lost. Maybe that's why Joni often fell for drummers!! :-) Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Dave Blackburn Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 10:41 AM To: Steve Dulson Cc: joni-digest@smoe.org; joni@smoe.org; jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com Subject: Minor chords Jim, and others, comment on Joni's use of minor chords from time to time and the music teacher in me goes "ooh, ooh, ooh!" If I may... What she often employed, like Lennon and McCartney and numerous other songsmiths is the use of the Parallel Minor in the context of a major key song. For example a song in the key of E using chords native (diatonic) to E major could employ an Eminor chord (the parallel minor means the root note is the same but the tonality changes.) This creates a pronounced mood shift. The ear accepts the transition readily as the tonic note has not changed: only the tonality or mood. I Had a King is a good example, as is My Old Man ("He's a dancer in the DA-RK.") The Dawntreader does it the other way - going to the parallel major chord (D) in a song that establishes itself in a minor key (Dmin). McCartney's Michelle and Penny Lane are some more fine examples of the technique. Joni innately understood the emotional pull of certain chords and voicings, for which she is duly praised, and she employed interesting harmony with great taste as she does most things. As we know, her theory knowledge was and maybe still is pretty scant but her ear led her to use techniques like Parallel Minor/Parallel Major interchange because they are effective. She does similar things with rhythm, introducing odd meter bars in the context of even meter compositions, and uneven phrase lengths, but that topic is for another post! Dave ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:28:10 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: RE: Minor chords That Whitesell book is a TOUGH read - if you've had plenty of music theory study, you'll get more out of it. Another one is the book by James Bennighof which I found a bit more accessible: http://goo.gl/pVZc6c Bob From: "Susan E. McNamara" To: "jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com" , Corey Blake , Cc: "joni@smoe.org" Date: 08/27/2013 01:35 PM Subject: RE: Minor chords Sent by: owner-joni@smoe.org The Music of Joni Mitchell by Lloyd Whitesell Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 1:22 PM To: Corey Blake Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: Minor chords There is a whole book about this. Bob, what is the title? Jim L On Aug 27, 2013, at 12:37 PM, Corey Blake wrote: > Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 15:43:27 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: Re: Minor chords > Passion Play "like washing on a LINE" borrowing the minor V chord from Dminor Correction: it's actually on the word TREMBLING where the borrowed chord falls. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 10:35:04 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: Re: Minor chords Ha, Corey! Be careful what you wish for! If there are others that might like to read about this stuff I'd be glad to write about some facets of JM's music pertaining to theory and method, and make sure it doesn't get too esoteric. As Jim said there is the Lloyd Whitesell book that gets a bit too exhaustive even for the keen student. Joni's music is often an odd mix of pedestrian and highly original, and the fact that she may not know which was which makes it all the more interesting. I believe she trusted her "feelers" so much that no other guidelines were needed or heeded. Dave On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: > Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. > > -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 11:00:23 -0400 From: Victor Johnson Subject: Re: Minor chords I have always loved using parallel minor/parallel major interchanges from early on. There's something very magical about it and I agree it is very effective. I think that's probably something that drew me into Joni's music in the first place. The song I was recently listening to "On the Road to Happiness" by The Lilac Time uses that quite effectively. Nick Drake (the inspiration for the name 'The Lilac Time') also did this very effectively and also used alternate tunings quite effectively as well in songs like "River Man". Nick and Joni seem very akin to one another in that respect...another topic for another post! On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 at 10:40 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > Jim, and others, comment on Joni's use of minor chords from time to time > and the music teacher in me goes "ooh, ooh, ooh!" If I may... > > What she often employed, like Lennon and McCartney and numerous other > songsmiths is the use of the Parallel Minor in the context of a major key > song. For example a song in the key of E using chords native (diatonic) to > E major could employ an Eminor chord (the parallel minor means the root > note is the same but the tonality changes.) This creates a pronounced mood > shift. The ear accepts the transition readily as the tonic note has not > changed: only the tonality or mood. I Had a King is a good example, as is > My Old Man ("He's a dancer in the DA-RK.") The Dawntreader does it the > other way - going to the parallel major chord (D) in a song that > establishes itself in a minor key (Dmin). McCartney's Michelle and Penny > Lane are some more fine examples of the technique. > > Joni innately understood the emotional pull of certain chords and > voicings, for which she is duly praised, and she employed interesting > harmony with great taste as she does most things. As we know, her theory > knowledge was and maybe still is pretty scant but her ear led her to use > techniques like Parallel Minor/Parallel Major interchange because they are > effective. > > She does similar things with rhythm, introducing odd meter bars in the > context of even meter compositions, and uneven phrase lengths, but that > topic is for another post! > > Dave ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 14:36:05 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: Laura Allan's influence Wow, the bouzouki looks nice, Anne. (checking them out on youtube.com). Double stringed like a mandolin, although they do have a dulcimer sound. Is that the same kind of bouzouki Beth Patterson played at Pazfest II? She was amazing. :-) Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu - -----Original Message----- From: Anne Sandstrom [mailto:asandstrom@demandware.com] Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 10:21 AM To: Susan E. McNamara; jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: RE: Laura Allan's influence All this talk about dulcimers has me thinking. I did have a dulcimer at one point. Frankly, I couldn't really play it comfortably because of the position of the hands (more like a keyboard, only worse - it hurt my wrists). Lately, I've been playing Irish bouzouki. It sounds VERY much like a dulcimer to me, especially when tuned in particular ways. Plus, the hand positions are like a guitar, which I'm comfortable with. It has 8 strings - 4 pairs (or courses). The Trinity model is quite nice. And you can get some great sounds from it even if you only learn the basic chords. Lots of love, Anne This e-mail message and all attachments transmitted with it may contain privileged and/or confidential information intended solely for the use of the addressee(s). If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any reading, dissemination, distribution, copying, forwarding or other use of this message or its attachments is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete this message, all attachments and all copies and backups thereof. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 11:27:09 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Minor chords What a cool thread kids! Thanks for the info. I hear it but could have never just said it. Paz (in San Antonio Texas for the next 6 days) NPIMH-Michelle Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com On Aug 27, 2013, at 10:00 AM, Victor Johnson wrote: I have always loved using parallel minor/parallel major interchanges from early on. There's something very magical about it and I agree it is very effective. I think that's probably something that drew me into Joni's music in the first place. The song I was recently listening to "On the Road to Happiness" by The Lilac Time uses that quite effectively. Nick Drake (the inspiration for the name 'The Lilac Time') also did this very effectively and also used alternate tunings quite effectively as well in songs like "River Man". Nick and Joni seem very akin to one another in that respect...another topic for another post! On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 at 10:40 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > Jim, and others, comment on Joni's use of minor chords from time to time > and the music teacher in me goes "ooh, ooh, ooh!" If I may... > > What she often employed, like Lennon and McCartney and numerous other > songsmiths is the use of the Parallel Minor in the context of a major key > song. For example a song in the key of E using chords native (diatonic) to > E major could employ an Eminor chord (the parallel minor means the root > note is the same but the tonality changes.) This creates a pronounced mood > shift. The ear accepts the transition readily as the tonic note has not > changed: only the tonality or mood. I Had a King is a good example, as is > My Old Man ("He's a dancer in the DA-RK.") The Dawntreader does it the > other way - going to the parallel major chord (D) in a song that > establishes itself in a minor key (Dmin). McCartney's Michelle and Penny > Lane are some more fine examples of the technique. > > Joni innately understood the emotional pull of certain chords and > voicings, for which she is duly praised, and she employed interesting > harmony with great taste as she does most things. As we know, her theory > knowledge was and maybe still is pretty scant but her ear led her to use > techniques like Parallel Minor/Parallel Major interchange because they are > effective. > > She does similar things with rhythm, introducing odd meter bars in the > context of even meter compositions, and uneven phrase lengths, but that > topic is for another post! > > Dave ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 11:27:09 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Minor chords What a cool thread kids! Thanks for the info. I hear it but could have never just said it. Paz (in San Antonio Texas for the next 6 days) NPIMH-Michelle Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com On Aug 27, 2013, at 10:00 AM, Victor Johnson wrote: I have always loved using parallel minor/parallel major interchanges from early on. There's something very magical about it and I agree it is very effective. I think that's probably something that drew me into Joni's music in the first place. The song I was recently listening to "On the Road to Happiness" by The Lilac Time uses that quite effectively. Nick Drake (the inspiration for the name 'The Lilac Time') also did this very effectively and also used alternate tunings quite effectively as well in songs like "River Man". Nick and Joni seem very akin to one another in that respect...another topic for another post! On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 at 10:40 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > Jim, and others, comment on Joni's use of minor chords from time to time > and the music teacher in me goes "ooh, ooh, ooh!" If I may... > > What she often employed, like Lennon and McCartney and numerous other > songsmiths is the use of the Parallel Minor in the context of a major key > song. For example a song in the key of E using chords native (diatonic) to > E major could employ an Eminor chord (the parallel minor means the root > note is the same but the tonality changes.) This creates a pronounced mood > shift. The ear accepts the transition readily as the tonic note has not > changed: only the tonality or mood. I Had a King is a good example, as is > My Old Man ("He's a dancer in the DA-RK.") The Dawntreader does it the > other way - going to the parallel major chord (D) in a song that > establishes itself in a minor key (Dmin). McCartney's Michelle and Penny > Lane are some more fine examples of the technique. > > Joni innately understood the emotional pull of certain chords and > voicings, for which she is duly praised, and she employed interesting > harmony with great taste as she does most things. As we know, her theory > knowledge was and maybe still is pretty scant but her ear led her to use > techniques like Parallel Minor/Parallel Major interchange because they are > effective. > > She does similar things with rhythm, introducing odd meter bars in the > context of even meter compositions, and uneven phrase lengths, but that > topic is for another post! > > Dave ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 18:31:26 -0500 From: est86mlm@ameritech.net Subject: Joni & The Mountain Dulcimer + Joelen Lapidus + Chords Check out this article - from pages 18-24. Page 23 is an article from Joelen Lapidus "How Joni Mitchell Came To Play One of My Dulcimers" http://issuu.com/dulcimerplayersnewsinc/docs/37.2__watermarked_ Laura ******************************* Garnier Fructis Triple Nutrition Hair Sample Click on the link in their post here, and fill out the form that will appear. https://tinyurl.com/n7jrs5r ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 13:20:04 -0700 From: kbhla@fastmail.fm Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #1217 I agree - thanks, Dave! Felt like a bright lightbulb came on in my head after 40+ years. A great "aha" moment! Kakki > This is another of those things that makes this list so great. Getting > introduced to Laura Allen one day and then some sound complex musical > theory made simple the next. Absolutely brilliant. Thanks, Dave. > > Anita ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2013 #333 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here:mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe