From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2013 #58 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Website:http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe:mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Thursday, February 14 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 058 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: When? [Michael Paz ] Re: TS is no Joni ["Eaton, Shari" ] Last chance for Tales of Joni ["Kimel, Taryn" ] Re: TS is no Joni [Richard Flynn ] Re: TS is no Joni [Dan Olson ] TS is no Joni [Kevin Foehr ] Re: TS is no Joni [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] The TS debate [Sally ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2013 09:49:04 -0600 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: When? Still working on this for potential Labor Day get together. Cannot commit as yet do to work issues but it is highly likely we can pull it together. Luv Paz On Feb 12, 2013, at 9:18 AM, LC Stanley wrote: When are we going to meet again in that continental Paz suite and sing to people 30 stories down? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpiSMceXa7c ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2013 09:45:35 -0800 From: "Eaton, Shari" Subject: Re: TS is no Joni Second that! On Feb 13, 2013, at 8:31 AM, Susan Tierney McNamara wrote: > Hi Gerald, > > I'm sure I'm not the only one who would love to hear about your experiences seeing Joni pre-California!!! > > Sue > > Susan Tierney McNamara > email: sem8@cornell.edu > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Gerald Kent > Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2013 10:01 AM > To: Kevin Foehr > Cc: joni@smoe.org; sendtojoni@smoe.org > Subject: Re: TS is no Joni > > I am sorry to disagree Kevin. In her early days joni was very much the "glamor girl" wearing silver mini skirts and very bright lip stick and looking incredibly good. I had the very great pleasure of seeing her in the village in her early 60's per California valley days. > > Sent from my iPad > > On Feb 13, 2013, at 9:33 AM, Kevin Foehr wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> I haven't commented on this yet, but I am increasingly disappointed >> that this idea of TS playing Joni persists. IMHO, TS is no Joni and >> shouldn't play her. She will taint the representation of Joni with >> her own persona of mainstream pop success, bright red lipstick, glam, etc. >> >> Joni was never >> mainstream, and she was not into glam in the 60s. Look at her on the >> cover of FTR; does that look like TS? And I don't mean just her physical features. >> I'm talking about her clothes and make-up and the backdrop/location >> conveying environmentalism, natural beauty, individuality (not >> glamorous fashion), solitude, and peace. This is the image of Joni I >> would like to see conveyed in the movie, if there is to be one, and imo, TS can't pull that off. >> >> Secondly, I really doubt TS would agree to play Joni at this point in >> her career. I don't follow pop music these days, but it appears she >> is near the top of the heap and near the zenith of her career, so I >> don't think she would want to portray someone else. She would want to >> portray herself, if she did a movie. I.e., I think she has become too >> big to play Joni (even though we know she is no where close to being as great a talent / genius as Joni). >> >> I think >> it would take an unknown actress to pull it off. Joni is unique, so >> imo, the actress has to be a blank slate in order to paint Joni's >> unique persona and story upon it. >> >> TS would always be TS in the movie, never Joni. So for TS to play her >> would be a travesty. Joni deserves much better. And many who have >> been fans of hers for decades, like me, would be deeply disappointed >> to see her image besmirched by an inaccurate portrayal of her and her >> work and all she has stood for. >> >> Kevin >> >> >> ________________________________ >> From: JMDL >> Digest >> To: joni-digest@smoe.org >> Sent: Tuesday, >> February 12, 2013 1:26 PM >> Subject: JMDL Digest V2013 #225 >> >> >> JMDL Digest >> Tuesday, February 12 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 225 >> >> >> >> ========== >> TOPICS and authors in this Digest: >> -------- >> Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #222 >> [Catherine McKay ] >> Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #222 >> [LC Stanley ] >> Re: She will never, never, >> never... ["Randy Remote" > Re: She will never, never, >> never... [Shari Eaton ] >> Re: She will never, never, >> never...NJC [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] >> New Library item: The show >> goes on [TheStaff@JoniMitchell.com] >> Re: She will never, never, >> never... [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] >> >> =?UTF-8?Q?New_Library_item:_Whitney_Houston_Remembere?= >> =?UTF-8?Q?d_at_Clive_Davis=E2=80=99s_All_Star_Pre_Grammy_Bash?= [] >> RE: JMDL >> Digest V2013 #222 [Mary Morris ] >> When? >> [LC Stanley ] >> Re: Piano >> transcriptions! ["Randy Remote" ] >> Re: She >> will never, never, never... [Michael Flaherty > Re: She >> will never, never, never...NJC [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] >> Re: She >> will never, never, never...NJC [Shari Eaton Subject: Last chance for Tales of Joni I've posted about it before, but I just want to send a note that the last performance of Tales of Joni Mitchell at 54 Below will take place on Monday, February 18 at 9:30pm. More information about the show, including video of past performances, can be found at our website here: http://54below.com/wordpress/?artist=tales-of-joni As a special offer to Joni Mitchell fans, you can use the code JONISOCIAL to get $5 off the cover charge for the Main Dining Room. It's a really special evening with some fantastically talented performers from the theatre and cabaret community. I hope you can join us! Taryn Kimel 54 Below CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail transmission, and any documents, files or prior e-mail messages attached to it, are intended solely for the use of the named addressees, and may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient or a person responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of any of the information contained in or attached to this transmission is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify the sender immediately and destroy the original transmission and its attachments without reading or saving in any manner. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2013 11:07:20 -0500 From: Richard Flynn Subject: Re: TS is no Joni I am no fan of TS, but I'm neutral about whether or not she plays Joni in the movie. The bigger question is: with the need to clear so many rights and permissions for music in the film, will it really ever be made? Richard Flynn Professor of Literature Georgia Southern University https://sites.google.com/a/georgiasouthern.edu/rflynn/ On Feb 13, 2013, at 10:22 AM, Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: > Not to mention that a major studio is going to employ makeup folks, > costume folks, lighting, camera lenses, etc in order to physically > duplicate Joni's look as best they can. > > Their objective is NOT to best capture Joni or project her genius, their > objective is to MAKE MONEY. Using TS as opposed to an unknown actress > locks them into a lot of box office. It was no mere coincidence that TS > kicked off the Grammys. Her involvement with Girls Like Us assures a > certain level of success. > > Make no mistake, everyone wants their work to be commercially successful. > Some artists, like Joni, refuse to compromise their artistic side (some of > her 80's stuff notwithstanding) in order to achieve that success, others > will do it in a heartbeat or in the case of film are mandated to do it by > the Producers who are funding the work expecting to reap a profit on their > investment. > > Bob > ------------------------------------------------------------ > The information transmitted is intended only for the person > or entity to which it is addressed and may contain > proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. > If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are > hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, > distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon > this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please > contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. > > Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual > sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. > ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2013 17:47:55 -0600 From: Dan Olson Subject: Re: TS is no Joni Well then, I may just have to chime in one more time. I think TS is an extremely talented and poised young woman. She already looks perfect to play Joni. She is a singer AND a guitar player (a musician). If she sets her mind to acting, I have no doubt that she will excel at it (she has already played minor parts in several movies, mostly cameos). If she were to immerse herself in this role, she could probably learn to actually play Joni's guitar parts, and she would have the MUSICAL CHOPS to lip synch Joni's vocals (or sing them herself). She would expose LITERALLY MILLIONS of her fans to Joni; I think this would fundamentally change Joni's standing in the history of culture, not to mention music. Virtually no one younger than (I don't know, pick a number, 45) has even heard of Joni. How many people that STARTED listening to music in the 80's purchased WTRF, DED, or CMiaRS? (not very many). In the 90's, Joni's fans from the 70's picked up on NRH, TI, TTT, and BSN; she didn't acquire many new fans with these releases. I personally would enjoy seeing the film with my daughter, who incidentally loves TS (and "hates" JM) - I hope they make it. ~Dan On Wed, Feb 13, 2013 at 1:44 PM, Kevin Foehr wrote: > Say it ain't so, Gerald. You guys are breaking my heart. > > She will always > be, in my mind, the quintessential "earth mother" whose intelligence causes > her to transcend mainstream culture, politics, and commercialization of her > art. I don't think anyone who wrote lyrics like hers could be anything > other > than that. > > Besides, everyone (or very nearly so) was conservative and > mainstream in the 50s and early 60s. She intellectually matured and became > "liberated" in the mid 60s just like most other young people at that time. > > Andif money making is the objective of the movie, which I'm sure it is, > then > of course TS would be a great choice. And because the whole thing is out > of > our hands anyway, why are we even debating it? > > So let them do what they > will with the movie; I'm happy with my Joni fantasies, and I'll shut-up now > and return to them... > > > > ________________________________ > From: Gerald Kent > > To: Kevin Foehr > Cc: > "joni@smoe.org" ; "sendtojoni@smoe.org" < > sendtojoni@smoe.org> > Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2013 10:01 AM > Subject: Re: TS is no Joni > > I am > sorry to disagree Kevin. In her early days joni was very much the "glamor > girl" wearing silver mini skirts and very bright lip stick and looking > incredibly good. I had the very great pleasure of seeing her in the > village > in her early 60's per California valley days. > > Sent from my iPad > > On Feb 13, > 2013, at 9:33 AM, Kevin Foehr wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > I > haven't commented on this yet, but I am increasingly disappointed > > that this > idea of TS playing Joni persists. IMHO, TS is no Joni and shouldn't > > play > her. She will taint the representation of Joni with her own persona of > > > mainstream pop success, bright red lipstick, glam, etc. > > > > Joni was never > > mainstream, and she was not into glam in the 60s. Look at her on the > cover > of > > FTR; does that look like TS? And I don't mean just her physical > features. > > I'm talking about her clothes and make-up and the > backdrop/location conveying > > environmentalism, natural beauty, individuality > (not glamorous fashion), > > solitude, and peace. This is the image of Joni I > would like to see conveyed > > in the movie, if there is to be one, and imo, TS > can't pull that off. > > > > Secondly, I really doubt TS would agree to play Joni > at this point in her > > career. I don't follow pop music these days, but it > appears she is near the > > top of the heap and near the zenith of her career, > so I don't think she would > > want to portray someone else. She would want to > portray herself, if she did a > > movie. I.e., I think she has become too big > to play Joni (even though we know > > she is no where close to being as great a > talent / genius as Joni). > > > > I think > > it would take an unknown actress to > pull it off. Joni is unique, so imo, the > > actress has to be a blank slate in > order to paint Joni's unique persona and > > story upon it. > > > > TS would always > be TS in the movie, never Joni. So for TS to > > play her would be a travesty. > Joni deserves much better. And many who have > > been fans of hers for decades, > like me, would be deeply disappointed to see > > her image besmirched by an > inaccurate portrayal of her and her work and all > > she has stood for. > > > > > Kevin > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: JMDL > > Digest > > > To: joni-digest@smoe.org > > Sent: Tuesday, > > > February 12, 2013 1:26 PM > > Subject: JMDL Digest V2013 #225 > > > > > > JMDL > Digest > > Tuesday, February 12 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 225 > > > > > > > > ========== > > TOPICS and authors in this Digest: > > -------- > > Re: JMDL > Digest V2013 #222 > > [Catherine McKay ] > > Re: JMDL > Digest V2013 #222 > > [LC Stanley ] > > Re: She > will never, never, > > never... ["Randy Remote" > Re: > She will never, never, > > never... [Shari Eaton ] > > > Re: She will never, never, > > never...NJC [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] > > New Library item: The show > > goes on > [TheStaff@JoniMitchell.com] > > Re: She will never, never, > > never... > [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] > > > > > =?UTF-8?Q?New_Library_item:_Whitney_Houston_Remembere?= > > > =?UTF-8?Q?d_at_Clive_Davis=E2=80=99s_All_Star_Pre_Grammy_Bash?= [] > > RE: > JMDL > > Digest V2013 #222 [Mary Morris ] > > > When? > > [LC Stanley ] > > > Re: Piano > > transcriptions! ["Randy Remote" ] > > Re: She > > will never, never, never... [Michael Flaherty > > Re: She > > will never, never, never...NJC > [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] > > Re: She > > will never, never, never...NJC [Shari > Eaton Subject: TS is no Joni Hi all, I haven't commented on this yet, but I am increasingly disappointed that this idea of TS playing Joni persists. IMHO, TS is no Joni and shouldn't play her. She will taint the representation of Joni with her own persona of mainstream pop success, bright red lipstick, glam, etc. Joni was never mainstream, and she was not into glam in the 60s. Look at her on the cover of FTR; does that look like TS? And I don't mean just her physical features. I'm talking about her clothes and make-up and the backdrop/location conveying environmentalism, natural beauty, individuality (not glamorous fashion), solitude, and peace. This is the image of Joni I would like to see conveyed in the movie, if there is to be one, and imo, TS can't pull that off. Secondly, I really doubt TS would agree to play Joni at this point in her career. I don't follow pop music these days, but it appears she is near the top of the heap and near the zenith of her career, so I don't think she would want to portray someone else. She would want to portray herself, if she did a movie. I.e., I think she has become too big to play Joni (even though we know she is no where close to being as great a talent / genius as Joni). I think it would take an unknown actress to pull it off. Joni is unique, so imo, the actress has to be a blank slate in order to paint Joni's unique persona and story upon it. TS would always be TS in the movie, never Joni. So for TS to play her would be a travesty. Joni deserves much better. And many who have been fans of hers for decades, like me, would be deeply disappointed to see her image besmirched by an inaccurate portrayal of her and her work and all she has stood for. Kevin ________________________________ From: JMDL Digest To: joni-digest@smoe.org Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2013 1:26 PM Subject: JMDL Digest V2013 #225 JMDL Digest Tuesday, February 12 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 225 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: - -------- Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #222 [Catherine McKay ] Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #222 [LC Stanley ] Re: She will never, never, never... ["Randy Remote" ] Re: She will never, never, never...NJC [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] New Library item: The show goes on [TheStaff@JoniMitchell.com] Re: She will never, never, never... [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] =?UTF-8?Q?New_Library_item:_Whitney_Houston_Remembere?= =?UTF-8?Q?d_at_Clive_Davis=E2=80=99s_All_Star_Pre_Grammy_Bash?= [] RE: JMDL Digest V2013 #222 [Mary Morris ] When? [LC Stanley ] Re: Piano transcriptions! ["Randy Remote" ] Re: She will never, never, never... [Michael Flaherty Subject: The TS debate In reality, Joni could wear a burlap sack and who would give a Crap. The sixties were full of people coming to life, being outlandish, experimenting. Joni was looking for everything...including (I would assume) herself and her place in the madness! How she looked did not define her. I would guess that the Taylor Swift we have been seeing lately in magazine print and so forth, is on a serious campaign to land the role in the movie. It's probably not the 'real' her anyway. I will say this, I think we are debating it because we revere Joni, and we want people to be drawn to her music because of who she is. If Taylor Swift can pull that off, no problem. I just don't want Joni and her art to be marginalized in favor of some idiotic portrayal. I was NOT a fan of the book, but am a fan of all three of those wonderful artists on whom it was based. I wonder who will be cast in the other parts. Finally, I am a huge fan of Bonnie Raitt from way back. Bonnie has been misunderstood by most non-listeners from the start of her career. Nothing grates on my nerves more than to have her mentioned as a "country artist", especially in circles where people should know better. It's kind of like calling Led Zep a metal band. I DO care how artists are portrayed. If they bother to write about them, make movies about them, whatever...care should be taken to be accurate and respectful. It matters to fans and it sure as hell must matter to the artists! Sent from Confunction Junction on my iPhone On Feb 13, 2013, at 2:44 PM, Kevin Foehr wrote: > Say it ain't so, Gerald. You guys are breaking my heart. > > She will always > be, in my mind, the quintessential "earth mother" whose intelligence causes > her to transcend mainstream culture, politics, and commercialization of her > art. I don't think anyone who wrote lyrics like hers could be anything other > than that. > > Besides, everyone (or very nearly so) was conservative and > mainstream in the 50s and early 60s. She intellectually matured and became > "liberated" in the mid 60s just like most other young people at that time. > > Andif money making is the objective of the movie, which I'm sure it is, then > of course TS would be a great choice. And because the whole thing is out of > our hands anyway, why are we even debating it? > > So let them do what they > will with the movie; I'm happy with my Joni fantasies, and I'll shut-up now > and return to ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2013 #58 ******************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here:mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe