From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2012 #361 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Website:http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe:mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Friday, October 26 2012 Volume 2012 : Number 361 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: All this talk of holiness now [Rob Wh ] All this talk of holiness now [Paul Ivice ] Two items [Michael Sentance ] re: Leonard Cohen's tale of redemption [c Karma ] Re: joni and james [Anita ] Re: All this talk of holiness now [Paul Ivice ] Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2012 #360 [Stdoherty ] New Library item: THE FLOWERING OF JONI MITCHELL [TheStaff@JoniMitchell.c] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 07:51:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Rob Wh Subject: Re: All this talk of holiness now ________________________________ Hmmm ... according to Wikipedia, JT's Mud Slide Slim (the cover of which features his most conspicuous suspender-wearing) was released in April 1971, whereas JM's For the Roses (containing the only song of hers I can think of that mentions suspenders) didn't come out until November 1972. Just sayin' Pack your suspenders: In a 1988 interview, Joni directly addresses this lyric: "With my early songs there was so much gossip concerning it! I wrote a song for James Taylor that mentioned his suspenders. And then on his next album he went and wore his bloody suspenders on the cover! Well, then the cat was completely out of the bag!" Paul Ivice ;>) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 04:05:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Paul Ivice Subject: All this talk of holiness now I only recently learned about Bob Dylan's God phase and haven't yet taken the time to see what all of that was about but This morning I was singing through All this talk about holiness now Must be the start of the latest style Is it all books and words or do you really feel it? Do you really laugh? Do you really care? Do you really smile when you smile? You criticize and you flatter. Imitate the best (Woody Guthery) And the rest you memorize (ouch) You know the times you've impressed me most are the times when you don't try. When you don't even try. Do you think she was referring to Dylan here? I'd even venture to say this verse is directed toward him as well: After the rush, when you come back down You're always disappointed Nothing seems to keep you high Drive your bargains Push your papers Win your medals Fuck your strangers Don't it leave you on the empty side? Thoughts? I am convinced she had James Taylor in mind when she wrote that song, and much of the rest of FTR. "After the rush when you come back down, you're always disappointed, nothinig seems to keep you high" refers to Taylor's heroin addiction On the JoniMitchell.com site, there is an excerpt from an interview with her about another song on FTR: Pack your suspenders: In a 1988 interview, Joni directly addresses this lyric: "One manifestation of [Joni's then-marriage to Larry Klein] is that Mitchell is no longer pouring the state of her romantic life into her song lyrics. "Secret Place" is the only love song on the new album, and it's veiled. Dog Eat Dog had only the fey "Lucky Girl." Since Wild Things, the open-hearted wedding album, Joni Mitchell has closed that door to her fans. "Yeah," she nods. "I don't want business on the street regarding us. I'm very happily married. With my early songs there was so much gossip concerning it! I wrote a song for James Taylor that mentioned his suspenders. And then on his next album he went and wore his bloody suspenders on the cover! Well, then the cat was completely out of the bag!" Paul Ivice ;>) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 10:10:45 -0400 From: Michael Sentance Subject: Two items Rolling Stone has a review of Taylor Swift's "Red" which is described, among other things, as "her Joni Mitchell-influenced maturity binge". As most of you have noted, the "Taylor as Joni" casting in "Girls Like Us" is less certain no matter how much she works her hair to resemble 1970 Joni. I've tried to like some of Swift's works and look to see if it is evolving in any way in the depth of her writing. Not happening. If the reviewer - I hesitate to call him a "writer" - sees some Joni in her work, then he knows nothing about Joni Mitchell. There is also an exhibition of the photographs of David Gahr at the Morrison Hotel gallery in New York City. Among his many photographs of musicians are some early Joni photos at Newport in 1969. One photo finds her almost gleeful in a very short skirt: https://www.morrisonhotelgallery.com/photo/default.aspx?photographID=8965 The gallery is at 124 Prince Street, New York, NY and the exhibition opens today.* * ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 16:07:27 +0000 From: c Karma Subject: re: Leonard Cohen's tale of redemption I liked this article. Did we have so clear a road map to tie Leonard Cohen to "Rainy Night House" earlier? Lyrically, it all made sense but I was unaware of the actual visit to Leonard's family home. I think I'll do some research on those "golden factories" too. CC ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 09:38:17 +0100 From: Anita Subject: Re: joni and james I understand where you are coming from now,thanks. I also feel that Joni's description of her mother and,particularly,grand mother's frustrated musical ambitions are also key to her protection of her musical and artistic ambition and independence.I think she says something somewhere about "doing it for these women" in her family which may also have affected her involvement or lack of it with men.Whether that's tragic or not is a whole other discussion! :-) Anita On 25 Oct 2012, at 23:29, Shari Eaton wrote: > I am drawing the link because I think her desire to play Roy Rogers' character was one of her first sought after forays into the glamorous world of image and story. She was incredibly young. The image of her in the outfit shows her at around 6 or 7. I am positing that since that experience, she perhaps always felt a man could come along and forbid or even flatly take away her right to play as well as lead in play. So she was fiercely protective of it. Even when all of the cells in her body are singing 'love, freedom, understanding' as they did during this point in her writing .. she held onto a fear that (I believe) stunted her growth. And I don't blame her for it .. I just think that it affected her love life rather tragically. > > Just my opinion, of course. > > > On Oct 25, 2012, at 12:33 PM, Anita wrote: > >> On 25 Oct 2012, at 19:00, "Eaton, Shari" wrote: >> >>> I think the Roy Rogers role playing experience she had as a child set her up for strained relationships with men. >> >> Shari,I'm not sure I see the link you are making.Do you mean because they wouldn't let her be Roy Rogers? Or is it something else? >> Anita ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 11:07:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Paul Ivice Subject: Re: All this talk of holiness now Hmmm ... according to Wikipedia, JT's Mud Slide Slim (the cover of which features his most conspicuous suspender-wearing) was released in April 1971, whereas JM's For the Roses (containing the only song of hers I can think of that mentions suspenders) didn't come out until November 1972. Just sayin' So what? Cover art is one of the last things done to complete an album before release. Songs are written long before that, and in the case of a prolific songwirter as Joni was in those days, she would occasionally hold a song she'd written earlier for release on an album of other songs it fits better with. Furthermore, Joni herself admits that at least one other song on FTR is about JT, so what's your point? Pack your suspenders: In a 1988 interview, Joni directly addresses this lyric: "With my early songs there was so much gossip concerning it! I wrote a song for James Taylor that mentioned his suspenders. And then on his next album he went and wore his bloody suspenders on the cover! Well, then the cat was completely out of the bag!" Paul Ivice ;>) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 05:58:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Stdoherty Subject: Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2012 #360 (I've always suspected James Taylor, but I have no evidence of that, and the "holiness" certainly fits Cohen more.) I thought of James Taylor too - for the obvious reasons - and James did let the holiness creep into his songs from time to time. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 19:17:22 -0600 (MDT) From: TheStaff@JoniMitchell.com Subject: New Library item: THE FLOWERING OF JONI MITCHELL Title: THE FLOWERING OF JONI MITCHELL Publication: Telegraph Date: 1991.2.23 http://jonimitchell.com/library/view.cfm?id=2535 ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2012 #361 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here:mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe