From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2009 #96 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, April 7 2009 Volume 2009 : Number 096 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: JMDL Digest V2009 #110 [Glen Saunders ] Tin Angel ["Jeff Hankins" ] Re: Tin Angel [Gerald Notaro ] SV: Tin Angel ["Marion Leffler" ] Re: Tin Angel [Laura Stanley ] Re: Tin Angel ["Donna Binkley" ] Re:Tin Angel [Dave Blackburn ] Re: Tin Angel [Catherine McKay ] Re: Tin Angel [Dflahm@aol.com] Re: Tin Angel [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] re: Tin Angel [mia _ ] WTRF [Azeem Ali Khan ] Tracy and Joni [Oddmund Kaarevik ] re: Tin Angel [Catherine McKay ] Re: Tracy and Joni [Bob Muller ] re: Tin Angel [Mags ] Re: WTRF [Lori Fye ] Re: WTRF [Gerald Notaro ] Re: Tin Angel ["Mark Scott" ] re: Tin Angel ["anon anon " ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 19:10:34 +1200 From: Glen Saunders Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2009 #110 Listen to Tim Rush if you have any doubt. This is a very fine song. G - ---------------------- Glen Saunders glen.saunders@gmail.com PO Box 45, Diamond Harbour, Christchurch, 8941, New Zealand +64 (0)21 329 156 - ---------------------- 2009/4/6 JMDL Digest > > JMDL Digest Monday, April 6 2009 Volume 2009 : Number 110 > > > > ========== > > TOPICS and authors in this Digest: > -------- > Tin Angel [Monika Bogdanowicz >] > Tin Angel [Monika Bogdanowicz >] > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2009 21:17:20 -0700 (PDT) > From: Monika Bogdanowicz > Subject: Tin Angel > > What does everyone think of this song? I have to tell you, in the last > few > days this song has grown on me immensely! I have been listening to it, on > repeat sometimes, and eating it up. It is strange because although I liked > this song right off the bat when I first heard it, it wasn't one of my > favorites off the album. In fact, I would sometimes skip it to get to my > favorites. > However, now, I really dig it. It is very expressive. Very poetic.. I > can > picture the images Joni illustrates in the song in my head. Very profound. > I also really like the tone of the song. It has sort of a lonely sound to > it, you know what I mean? The light, almost sporadic picking and strumming > of > the guitar sets up the entire feel of the song. > - -Monika > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2009 21:17:10 -0700 (PDT) > From: Monika Bogdanowicz > Subject: Tin Angel > > What does everyone think of this song? I have to tell you, in the last > few > days this song has grown on me immensely! I have been listening to it, on > repeat sometimes, and eating it up. It is strange because although I liked > this song right off the bat when I first heard it, it wasn't one of my > favorites off the album. In fact, I would sometimes skip it to get to my > favorites. > However, now, I really dig it. It is very expressive. Very poetic.. I > can > picture the images Joni illustrates in the song in my head. Very profound. > I also really like the tone of the song. It has sort of a lonely sound to > it, you know what I mean? The light, almost sporadic picking and strumming > of > the guitar sets up the entire feel of the song. > - -Monika > > ------------------------------ > > End of JMDL Digest V2009 #110 > ***************************** > > ------- > Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org > Unsubscribe by clicking here: > mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe > ------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 08:38:03 +0100 From: "Jeff Hankins" Subject: Tin Angel Monica asked >What does everyone think of this song? One of my faves. I've always loved it from the moment I stuck Clouds on the turntable, Christmas Day 1970. And because its in standard tuning, it was accessible to a bit of amateur guitar twiddling... And for years I could hardly hear it, or try-and-play-it without a few stupid tears (stupid because its not really a sad song...its something about the fall of the chords, there) When I heard Tom Rush doing it, I realized it could be a man song too...and also it makes me wonder why on earth it hasn't been covered a zillion times for Mr Muller to catalogue. Its a perfect marriage of melody and lyric; I thought I was the only welsh guy who realized that until I picked up a copy of 'Taplas' (a welsh folk music magazine) a few years ago, and - wouldja believe it - some bloke had written a whole page-long article about this song and how it was a perfect marriage of melody and lyric. (oh and the chillingly sparse accompaniment. did I mention that?) Its a beauty. And because it's so little mentioned... it feels a bit like a hidden, secret beauty. so shhh. don't tell everyone. Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 07:30:11 -0400 From: Gerald Notaro Subject: Re: Tin Angel An early masterpiece and a tempting morsel, predictor of more genius yet to come. I've always loved this song. Jerry On Mon, Apr 6, 2009 at 3:38 AM, Jeff Hankins wrote: > Monica asked >What does everyone think of this song? > > One of my faves. I've always loved it from the moment I stuck Clouds on the > turntable, Christmas Day 1970. > And because its in standard tuning, it was accessible to a bit of amateur > guitar twiddling... > And for years I could hardly hear it, or try-and-play-it without a few > stupid tears (stupid because its not really a sad song...its something about > the fall of the chords, there) > When I heard Tom Rush doing it, I realized it could be a man song too...and > also it makes me wonder why on earth it hasn't been covered a zillion times > for Mr Muller to catalogue. > > Its a perfect marriage of melody and lyric; I thought I was the only welsh > guy who realized that until I picked up a copy of 'Taplas' (a welsh folk > music magazine) a few years ago, and - wouldja believe it - some bloke had > written a whole page-long article about this song and how it was a perfect > marriage of melody and lyric. (oh and the chillingly sparse accompaniment. > did I mention that?) > Its a beauty. > And because it's so little mentioned... it feels a bit like a hidden, > secret beauty. > so shhh. don't tell everyone. > Jeff > - -- Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 13:28:43 +0200 From: "Marion Leffler" Subject: SV: Tin Angel That song gave me a chill when I first heard it a very long time ago. It confirmed what I then had only just realized: that falling in love is not just that dizzy dancing way you feel but a very complex set of emotions right from the start. "Dark with darker moods is he" does not indicate an altogether happy anticipation of a relationship that's just starting, does it? I still listen to Tin Angel once in a while. With a lot of Joni's songs, my initial take has changed, I understand the lyrics in different ways, but not with this one. Marion - -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Fren: owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org] Fvr Monika Bogdanowicz Skickat: den 6 april 2009 06:17 Till: Joni people! Dmne: Tin Angel What does everyone think of this song? I have to tell you, in the last few days this song has grown on me immensely! I have been listening to it, on repeat sometimes, and eating it up. It is strange because although I liked this song right off the bat when I first heard it, it wasn't one of my favorites off the album. In fact, I would sometimes skip it to get to my favorites. However, now, I really dig it. It is very expressive. Very poetic.. I can picture the images Joni illustrates in the song in my head. Very profound. I also really like the tone of the song. It has sort of a lonely sound to it, you know what I mean? The light, almost sporadic picking and strumming of the guitar sets up the entire feel of the song. - -Monika ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 05:23:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Laura Stanley Subject: Re: Tin Angel Hi Monika, I love the song. It has always been one of my favorites. I wonder what particular "angel made of tin" she was talking about? The crying sound of the song and the idea of throw away love replaced with new love captivates me. I have thrown away letters and things from former loves and felt the sentiments of the song... letting go with a sorrow of a sort in the reserved joy of somebody new. I don't know if it is possible to ever really let go completely though. "Reflections of loves memory," the memorabilia, can be thrown away but the memories and mark on one's heart are still there. Tin is cheap, and I get the feeling Joni is saying love is cheap through the song. Throw away the old, and the new could be thrown away at some point too. The tin angel guy seems to have been thrown away or thrown away love in the past too given his sorrowful disposition. The concept of the prince is gone for both of them. He doesn't have to be that, and she doesn't have to expect that. So, on some level it is coming into the reality of tarnishing of love, losing the innocent childhood idea of love. Loving is always taking a chance. The hope in the song comes in her taking this chance again. Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Apr 2009 09:36:04 -0500 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: Tin Angel Hi Monika, I've always loved this song. A sort of melancholy hope is what it brings to mind. She "found someone to love today", yet the whole tone of the song seems so sad. For me it also ties in with "I Don't Know Where I Stand" because she found someone to love, then doesn't know whether to send the love note or not. Glad to hear you bring this one up, an all time fave for me. db >>> Monika Bogdanowicz 4/5/2009 11:17 PM >>> What does everyone think of this song? I have to tell you, in the last few days this song has grown on me immensely! I have been listening to it, on repeat sometimes, and eating it up. It is strange because although I liked this song right off the bat when I first heard it, it wasn't one of my favorites off the album. In fact, I would sometimes skip it to get to my favorites. However, now, I really dig it. It is very expressive. Very poetic.. I can picture the images Joni illustrates in the song in my head. Very profound. I also really like the tone of the song. It has sort of a lonely sound to it, you know what I mean? The light, almost sporadic picking and strumming of the guitar sets up the entire feel of the song. - -Monika ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 06:59:43 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: Re:Tin Angel Monika, It's funny that you bring up Tin Angel. Clouds is an album I rarely listen to. I don't care for the sound of the recording or the song selection. But I have my ipod on Shuffle most of the time and out of 6442 songs what should come on it yesterday morning but Tin Angel. I even said to Robin that we should work that one up. It reminds me of the vibe of The Dawntreader, a lonely sound as you point out. Jeff Hankins also sang it beautifully at the Holycombe JoniFest if you ever downloaded that recording. (I wrongly titled it though calling it "I found someone to love today" on that recording) Dave On Apr 6, 2009, at 12:00 AM, onlyJMDL Digest wrote: > onlyJMDL Digest Monday, April 6 2009 Volume 2009 : > Number 095 > > > > ========== > > TOPICS and authors in this Digest: > -------- > Tin Angel [Monika Bogdanowicz > ] > Tin Angel [Monika Bogdanowicz > ] > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2009 21:17:20 -0700 (PDT) > From: Monika Bogdanowicz > Subject: Tin Angel > > What does everyone think of this song? I have to tell you, in > the last few > days this song has grown on me immensely! I have been listening to > it, on > repeat sometimes, and eating it up. It is strange because although > I liked > this song right off the bat when I first heard it, it wasn't one of my > favorites off the album. In fact, I would sometimes skip it to get > to my > favorites. > However, now, I really dig it. It is very expressive. Very > poetic.. I can > picture the images Joni illustrates in the song in my head. Very > profound. > I also really like the tone of the song. It has sort of a lonely > sound to > it, you know what I mean? The light, almost sporadic picking and > strumming of > the guitar sets up the entire feel of the song. > - -Monika > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2009 21:17:10 -0700 (PDT) > From: Monika Bogdanowicz > Subject: Tin Angel > > What does everyone think of this song? I have to tell you, in > the last few > days this song has grown on me immensely! I have been listening to > it, on > repeat sometimes, and eating it up. It is strange because although > I liked > this song right off the bat when I first heard it, it wasn't one of my > favorites off the album. In fact, I would sometimes skip it to get > to my > favorites. > However, now, I really dig it. It is very expressive. Very > poetic.. I can > picture the images Joni illustrates in the song in my head. Very > profound. > I also really like the tone of the song. It has sort of a lonely > sound to > it, you know what I mean? The light, almost sporadic picking and > strumming of > the guitar sets up the entire feel of the song. > - -Monika > > ------------------------------ > > End of onlyJMDL Digest V2009 #95 > ******************************** > > ------- > Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org > Unsubscribe by clicking here: > mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 07:19:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Tin Angel This was the first song on the first Joni album I ever bought and it stood our very clearly for me, not just on first listen but on subsequent listens. It is, in many ways, one of my favourite Joni songs. It sets the tone for the whole album. It's interesting because it's a song about finding love, which you might expect to sound happier and yet, it is mostly in a minor key, except that each sequence ends in a major note, but then goes back to the minor for the beginning of the next sequence. At least, that's how it sounds to me. I think it starts in e-minor and ends with e-major, only to return to e-minor for the next verse. And if my brain remembers this correctly, the final ending sounds kind of major and kind of minor, so maybe there is a sus chord of some kind mixed in. So it's a tenative sort of song talking about the possible beginning of a love affair with a person who is "dark with darker moods" and who has "a sorrow in his eye," so it's very befitting the subject matter that she waivers between the positive (major) and the negative (minor). The overall effect is one of melancholy and tentativeness, kind of a musical, "He loves me, he loves me not" exercise. I always had a good visual image on hearing that song, although my visual images tend to be more on the impressionist side, so they're a bit blurry. That may be just my very bad eyesight. I could see a box full of memories of past love affairs that she's looking at, getting ready to discard them. The "angel made of tin" came across to me as a cheap Christmas decoration - something that could look very beautiful in the right setting but which was, ultimately, still cheap. So, I have the feeling that she's about to embark on this love affair and knows deep down that is probably isn't going to work out, but is willing to go there anyway. - --- On Mon, 4/6/09, Monika Bogdanowicz wrote: > From: Monika Bogdanowicz > Subject: Tin Angel > To: "Joni people!" > Received: Monday, April 6, 2009, 12:17 AM > What does everyone think of > this song? I have to tell you, in the last few > days this song has grown on me immensely! I have been > listening to it, on > repeat sometimes, and eating it up. It is strange > because although I liked > this song right off the bat when I first heard it, it > wasn't one of my > favorites off the album. In fact, I would sometimes > skip it to get to my > favorites. > However, now, I really dig it. It is very > expressive. Very poetic.. I can > picture the images Joni illustrates in the song in my > head. Very profound. > I also really like the tone of the song. It > has sort of a lonely sound to > it, you know what I mean? The light, almost sporadic > picking and strumming of > the guitar sets up the entire feel of the song. > -Monika > __________________________________________________________________ Be smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk email the boot with the All-new Yahoo! Mail. Click on Options in Mail and switch to New Mail today or register for free at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 10:49:56 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: Tin Angel I did work on Tin Angel with a singer and found that harmonically, it reminded me of Edith and the Kingpin: I hear similar blendings of minor and major chords. As a jazz piece, it has its template in the Miles Davis "modal period," vividly exemplified by the MILES AHEAD album (1957), arranged by Gil Evans, especially in The Meaning of the Blues. DAVID LAHM **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221621488x1201450096/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fwww.freecreditreport.com%2Fpm%2Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID %3D62%26bcd%3DAprilfooterNO62) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 11:10:22 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Tin Angel That would be Gini Dustin, correct? You gave me that CD when I was in NYC. I agree with Jeff that there should be many more covers of Tin Angel than there are -(4) so far, but significant in that this is one of Joni's songs that premiered via a cover (Tom Rush's in 1968), and then wasn't covered again until 2002 when the other three versions came out. It is a beautiful song - the melody doesn't rest on the ear as easily as some of her other songs but for me that is a major part of its attraction. Bob NP: Apples In Stereo, "7 Stars" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 12:07:11 -0500 From: mia _ Subject: re: Tin Angel Monika,I love Tin Angel! It's my favorite song to play in standard tuning, and I think it is so amazing how Joni found such powerful chord patterns with such minimalist chords structures.Tin Angel is sung with a sad heavy heart. The lyrics seem to reflect Joni's transition from childhood to maturity as she is giving up all her girly-girly romantic items (from the first verse)in favor of mature grown-up love. Yet, she finds this grown-up love to be nothing but disillusionment. There doesn't seem to be any going back though, she must trek forward, even if the love she finds is only for a day. But I think there is some sense of hope that keeps her going. Pieces of the song seem like remnants from her failed marriage - not the golden prince who's come - but she'll take a chance anyway. Sort of like how she haphazardly entered into her marriage. And the line about "what will happen if I try to place another heart in him" reminds me of Joni's hesitance to put her foot down and force Chuck to bring the child into their home, not knowing for sure if he has it within himself to do so.Mia _________________________________________________________________ Quick access to your favorite MSN content and Windows Live with Internet Explorer 8. http://ie8.msn.com/microsoft/internet-explorer-8/en-us/ie8.aspx?ocid=B037MSN5 5C0701A ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 19:17:47 +0100 From: Azeem Ali Khan Subject: WTRF I'm firmly in the doubters camp. Chinese Cafe is a truly great addition to the Joni canon, Love is pretty good (though not exactly original lyrically!) - and the rest leaves me cold. Playing is mostly fine, Joni's voice sounds great, but most of the songs are disposable not just by her exceptional standards, but by the standards of any decent singer-songwriter. I still think Mingus is her last truly great album, and judging by Shine, it's likely to remain so. Thanks to everyone who welcomed me back a couple of weeks ago, by the way - I really appreciated it. These days I'm generally working or being Daddy, and don't have quite the same energy to devote to the List as I used to - but it's worth every second, obviously. Amelia (generally known as Amy, but I must maintain the JC...) is coming up to three and a half and is an utter delight. Shame about the nights we've been having in the last few weeks, but you can't have it all I guess. Good luck on your adventure Victor! My Best To You All, Azeem in London NP: Eleni Mandell - Miss Me (generated by Shuffle! Speaking of which, I should give credit where it's due for the Randomiser idea: loads of magazines seem to do something like it now, but the first place I saw it was the Word Magazine website, where David Hepworth starts it off) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 22:28:49 +0200 From: Oddmund Kaarevik Subject: Tracy and Joni I just listened to this interview on youtube Proves out that Tracy would like to sing with Joni Oh how I would love that to happen. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlzGI3u5xYI Best Oddmund And Mr.Muller, you know I do respect your opinin and love my ipod ( : And I'm aware that you think that all other than her debut album is not worthwile but aint that "Sing to you" just to sweet to be ignored in such a way? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUbFcrZBxPk ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 13:35:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: re: Tin Angel - --- On Mon, 4/6/09, mia _ wrote: > And the line about "what will happen if I try to place > another heart in him" > reminds me of Joni's hesitance to put her foot down and > force Chuck to bring > the child into their home, not knowing for sure if he has > it within himself to > do so.Mia Wow, or maybe I should say d'oh! as I smack myself upside the head. Your having said that now makes me think of the Tin Woodman in the Wizard of Oz who was looking for a heart. I'm enjoying all this talk of "Tin Angel." I'm not even that fond of the "Clouds" album anymore, although I just LOVED it way back in those days and would play it over and over. I never would have thought it was in standard tuning, once I discovered that most of Joni's stuff is NOT in standard tuning. When I discovered it was indeed done in standard tuning, I wondered, how the heck does she do that? I've never been very good at working out song arrangements to sound like the original. It never occurred to me to try to play along with a record, so I would just go from what I remembered it to sound like. Yeah, kinda stupid, i guess. I have the original "Joni Mitchell songbook" and learned how to play her songs from it. Once I found out about alternate tunings, I just assumed everything was in alt tuning. Later on - much later - I got the Hits and Misses songbooks (or maybe I should call them folios!) and discovered it was in standard after all. Here's a little plug for the website, with a link to the songbook. This book dates back to 1969. http://jonimitchell.com/library/viewmedia.cfm?id=54 You can find these on e-bay sometimes. Les, if you're reading this, the website says "No information on this. Can you help?" what kind of info do you want? __________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 16:17:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Muller Subject: Re: Tracy and Joni Thanks Oddmund, Tracy has already played with so many giants, as she said there are not many left for her to pick from. Glad she mentioned Joni. The new song you sent is just another reminder that she is not likely to scale the heights she climbed with her debut album anytime soon. Throwaway melody, banal lyrics. I do love her though and she is way talented, and seems like a real sweet and kind person. Bob NP: Robin Adler, "Down To You" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 16:49:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Mags Subject: re: Tin Angel thanks to all concerned for the invitation to revisit Wild Things Run Fast as well as the song, Tin Angel. WTRF: fwiw, I love Chinese Cafe. speaks to the sentimental sap within ;-) Tin Angel: It's been a while since Ive listened to Clouds. Tin Angel is a gorgeous, sad song. Only four years after Joni's baby girl was relinquished, tied in with the heart break of failed relationships, marriage and otherwise. No wonder she sounds, not only sad, but reluctant as hell to get involved again. a few thoughts scribbled down on a piece of paper: 'reflections' of love's memories...I thought this might be in reference to photographs but then the next stanza talks about letters. Perhaps both? Maple leaves: signifier of Canada, which she likes to do in other songs too (javex bleach bottles etc) Bleeker street cafe ... Bleaker/bleak? the tone of the song certainly is bleak. As is the nature of the quandry she's in.. minor chords: represents past hurts? fear of future ones (knowing that's coming anyway, due to her experiences) major chords, hmm hopefullness...she might take a chance, but she sure if reluctant all the same. Mia, I like your idea about Chuck Mitchell and whether or not he wanted to raise Joni's child in the face of their musical future. Having just read Girls Like Us, there are a few different interpretations as to how that went down. I believe Joni though, he wasnt interested. For Joni, a time of great confusion. Not an easy decision for her to make either way, there's hell to pay. One thing that GLU describes very well is the climate within which she became pregnant. Hard to believe that this is the way it was. Major complications no matter which way she turned. Life long repercussions, that we can hear in many of her songs, as well as stories told, then and now. Close friends were witness to the pain, and thankfully, Joni had at least somewhere to try and lay that down in her songs. Some of her friends said that the pain of her losing her baby stayed with her throughout her life. Joni is a woman who feels her life deeply as she has demonstrated time and time again. I agree, Girls Like Us may be seen as a socialogical/feminist perspective of what it was like to be a woman in the music industry when all three women were starting out. Again, complications all round. GLU, well worth the read. I think I gained a deeper understanding vis a vis the struggle that Joni has faced in her life. It is very interesting to read about her roots on the prairie, the vast landscape upon which she grew, and yet, she felt so claustrophobic and was driven by her urge for going. Just a few thoughts. Mags - --- On Mon, 4/6/09, Catherine McKay wrote: From: Catherine McKay Subject: re: Tin Angel To: motitan75@yahoo.com, joni@smoe.org, "mia _" Received: Monday, April 6, 2009, 4:35 PM - --- On Mon, 4/6/09, mia _ wrote: > And the line about "what will happen if I try to place > another heart in him" > reminds me of Joni's hesitance to put her foot down and > force Chuck to bring > the child into their home, not knowing for sure if he has > it within himself to > do so.Mia Wow, or maybe I should say d'oh! as I smack myself upside the head. Your having said that now makes me think of the Tin Woodman in the Wizard of Oz who was looking for a heart. I'm enjoying all this talk of "Tin Angel." I'm not even that fond of the "Clouds" album anymore, although I just LOVED it way back in those days and would play it over and over. I never would have thought it was in standard tuning, once I discovered that most of Joni's stuff is NOT in standard tuning. When I discovered it was indeed done in standard tuning, I wondered, how the heck does she do that? I've never been very good at working out song arrangements to sound like the original. It never occurred to me to try to play along with a record, so I would just go from what I remembered it to sound like. Yeah, kinda stupid, i guess. I have the original "Joni Mitchell songbook" and learned how to play her songs from it. Once I found out about alternate tunings, I just assumed everything was in alt tuning. Later on - much later - I got the Hits and Misses songbooks (or maybe I should call them folios!) and discovered it was in standard after all. Here's a little plug for the website, with a link to the songbook. This book dates back to 1969. http://jonimitchell.com/library/viewmedia.cfm?id=54 You can find these on e-bay sometimes. Les, if you're reading this, the website says "No information on this. Can you help?" what kind of info do you want? __________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com. __________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 17:47:45 -0700 From: Lori Fye Subject: Re: WTRF > its weird how jonis music declined at the beginning of the 80s generally speaking... Not really. A whole lot of music declined at the beginning of the 80s. Lori Santa Rosa, CA ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 20:52:49 -0400 From: Gerald Notaro Subject: Re: WTRF Amen, sister. On Mon, Apr 6, 2009 at 8:47 PM, Lori Fye wrote: > > its weird how jonis music declined at the beginning of the 80s generally > speaking... > > Not really. A whole lot of music declined at the beginning of the 80s. > > Lori > Santa Rosa, CA > - -- Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Apr 2009 18:09:31 -0700 From: "Mark Scott" Subject: Re: Tin Angel - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine McKay" To: ; ; "mia _" Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 1:35 PM Subject: re: Tin Angel > --- On Mon, 4/6/09, mia _ wrote: > >> And the line about "what will happen if I try to place >> another heart in him" >> reminds me of Joni's hesitance to put her foot down and >> force Chuck to bring >> the child into their home, not knowing for sure if he has >> it within himself to >> do so.Mia > > > Wow, or maybe I should say d'oh! as I smack myself upside the head. > Your having said that now makes me think of the Tin Woodman in the > Wizard of Oz who was looking for a heart. That's what the lyric and title always made me think of, Catherine! 'There's a sorrow in his eyes/like the Angel made of tin/what will happen if i try/*to place another heart in him*'. But I like Mia's interpretation. I had never thought of if that way before. 'Clouds' is an odd album, I think. There is a definite difference from 'Song to a Seagull' and 'Tin Angel' as an opener is certainly indicative of that difference to my ears. There is something a bit heavy-handed about it in comparison to the delicacy I hear in 'STAS'. It is fascinating to read what the more musically knowledgable have to say about the play back and forth between major and minor keys. Gives me a whole new appreciation of 'Tin Angel'. But 'Clouds' was almost like Joni was falling to earth (after looking down on everything - but that was later wasn't it?) Of course the whole sound of STAS has a haunting, echoing, ethereal quality to it that has been mentioned many times before. 'Clouds' was my second Joni Mitchell album (after 'Court and Spark'). I bought it mainly because I had heard a few of the songs on it before, recorded by other artists. It was *so* different from C&S that it almost sounded primitive to my ignorant, young, college-student ears. After more recent listenings, I find I appreciate it more and more. Kinda rambling here. Maybe it's because I'm getting over a head cold that had me down most of Saturday. On the mend now but thinking I should stop here or here or maybe here or..... Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 02:08:42 +0000 From: "anon anon " Subject: re: Tin Angel oz never did give nothing to the tin man that he didn't already have... - -----Original Message----- Date: Monday, April 06, 2009 4:38:50 pm To: motitan75@yahoo.com;joni@smoe.org;hvnphun16@hotmail.com From: Catherine McKay Subject: re: Tin Angel - --- On Mon, 4/6/09, mia _ wrote: > And the line about "what will happen if I try to place > another heart in him" > reminds me of Joni's hesitance to put her foot down and > force Chuck to bring > the child into their home, not knowing for sure if he has > it within himself to > do so.Mia Wow, or maybe I should say d'oh! as I smack myself upside the head. Your having said that now makes me think of the Tin Woodman in the Wizard of Oz who was looking for a heart. I'm enjoying all this talk of "Tin Angel." I'm not even that fond of the "Clouds" album anymore, although I just LOVED it way back in those days and would play it over and over. I never would have thought it was in standard tuning, once I discovered that most of Joni's stuff is NOT in standard tuning. When I discovered it was indeed done in standard tuning, I wondered, how the heck does she do that? I've never been very good at working out song arrangements to sound like the original. It never occurred to me to try to pla ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2009 #96 ******************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe