From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2007 #478 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, March 4 2008 Volume 2007 : Number 478 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Luciana and Larry [] Eric and Joni [missblux@googlemail.com] Joni a great artist... just how great...? [missblux@googlemail.com] the voice... [Michel BYRNE ] Re: Joni Tribute in CT ["Rachel Avery" ] Re: shining hissing smoking [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Luciana and Larry [Victor Johnson ] Re: Fave Joni "guest spot" ["Mark Scott" ] Re: shining hissing smoking [Michael Flaherty ] Re: Fave Joni "guest spot" ["Jerry Notaro" ] We are all Joni's greatest admirers [David Sapp ] Re: shining hissing smoking [Monika Bogdanowicz ] Re: shining hissing smoking ["Randy Remote" ] New book on Carole, Joni & Carly [Patti Parlette ] Re: New book on Carole, Joni & Carly [Bob Muller ] Joni Merchandise [KEVIN DOHENY ] Re: Joni Merchandise ["Jamie's Box of Paints" ] Tori covers Joni [KEVIN DOHENY ] Re: Tori covers Joni [notaro@stpt.usf.edu] RE: New book on Carole, Joni & Carly [Patti Parlette Subject: Luciana and Larry Thanks to Steve Dulson and his friend, musician Ashley Maher, we were clued into a one-night performance of Luciana Souza with Larry Klein and Larry Koonse tonight at the Jazz Bakery. Ahh, my. It was a flawless, compelling and transcendent night of music. I was not too familiar with her and heard mixed reviews here of her performance on Herbie's River and her new album The New Bossa Nova. Still any facsimilie of Brazilian music is my absolute drug and I had to see her. Please try to see them live. You will experience something very brilliant and rare. She said this is only her second night performing with her husband Klein. Maybe he makes the difference. I am amazed to say that as not a great fan, I was totally won over by him tonight. He played acoustic bass frequently like lead, like flamenco at times. He was incredible - and became Larry "Joao" Klein to me ;-) Luciana played a variety of small percussion instruments through the night and covered Joni's Down to You, Leonard Cohen's Here It Is, James Taylor's Never Die Young, Beach Boys God Only Knows, Jobim's Water of March, Pablo Neruda's Love Sonnets 49 and 99 set to music, an original composition collarborated with Klein about a romantic cheater that had the lyric "backstreet" throughout ;-) many Brazilian standards and more. She told a story of being around 10 years old in the 70s and her sister coming home with this "big album" by Joni Mitchell and how it was like nothing she had ever heard before in terms of words of music. She also announced that she and Larry are having a baby. They seem very much in love - you can feel such an affinity and warmth between them and it carries over stunningly in their performance together. I am also struck how much she really sounds very much like the early to middle era Joni but with a jazzy twist. I was somehow lucky to have as my seatmate, Matt Grief, a member of the Los Angeles Guitar Quartet, who toured and recorded with Luciana the past couple of years and he raved about her. Her website says she is touring to Italy next and then back around the states. She is truly a must see if you can catch her. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 11:15:41 +0100 From: missblux@googlemail.com Subject: Eric and Joni Kakki, just my words. She doesn't have the range she used to but it is the artistry with which she uses that new, old voice. But I want to add that somehow, the deterioration just emphasizes the history and the experience that is written into her voice and makes the listening more dramatic... somehow. There is something extremely intimate about the late material, particularly seen in the perspective of the early material. I hope you've recovered from that flu! Bene Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 17:01:54 -0800 From: Subject: Eric and Joni Hey Eric, I think 99% of people here love Joni's artistry and would even find gems to discuss at length if she sang the phone book. I love some of her incarnations more than others but I have always found value and intrigue in every piece she creates, whether music or painting. Regardless of personal preferences and favorite eras, can you just imagine if Joni's voice and style had ALWAYS stayed the same? Ugh! We would hardly be giving her the time of day that we passionately do. Whether one likes one Joni era and maybe not another is besides the point that she is great exactly because she does change and evolve. So don't feel frustrated - her changes are exactly what make her the artistic great that she is to us! It's all good and great ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 11:36:12 +0100 From: missblux@googlemail.com Subject: Joni a great artist... just how great...? From: Eric Taylor > GEEZ do any of us really realize WHAT A GREAT artist we have in Joni?????? Well... I think we all signed up here because we have an idea that she is pretty good.... But if someone doesn't feel moved by this or that piece she has written, then that's how they feel, and I would hate it if this was the list where everyone had to proclaim that everything she has ever done is wonderful. The discussions encourage me to listen more carefully to tracks I don't like that much, but they also make me think of why I love the songs that I do love. I'm an academic, and just like with an artist I take criticism and praise all the time. Someone will tell me what I have written is revolutionary, someone else will say about the same text that my argumentation is confused and incoherent. There are people who believe in me and people who for all sorts of reasons get off by putting me down. Joni has to endure the same thing, on a larger scale. I feel for her when critics are unkind, but then everybody's lives are like that. Hum, did this sound confused and incoherent...? Bene ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 10:41:09 +0000 From: Michel BYRNE Subject: the voice... I'm with you on the voice thing, Eric, though not on Joni's attitude to it - and i wouldn't want to place her in some league of greats. I admire the range and warmth of her voice in the pre-Hissing records, but it doesn't get me in the pit of the stomach like her later voice (I'll never forget first hearing the low notes of 'a night like this' in NRH!). And her 'low' versions of Case of You, Both sides Now and Last Time I Saw R, to me beat the originals hands down. What i do love about her high register, though, is the way she could use it as a counterpoint to a lower melody - at its most spine-tingling in Song for Sharon. But like somebody said recently, when she tried the same sort of thing on Come in from the Cold, it sounded pained and strangled (fitting, for the song maybe, but painful to listen to). That said, though, the ease of her voice in the mid-70s IS wonderful - on C&S, HSL and Hejira. I DO mostly like J's voice on Shine, but the vocal of This Place is to my ears painful and ugly - - notes cutting half way, undefined wobbles - it does shock, as the first sung track on the album. No other track on Shine shows quite the same weakness, and I'm surprised she went for that take as the definitive one. What makes things unnecessarily frought in discussing the voice issue is Joni's own defensiveness verging on arrogance. Contrast how relaxed she was about it on the BBC Dog Eat Dog interview - freely admitting she was losing range, and joking that she might be reduced in her later years to talking her songs. Now instead she comes across as self-deluded and arrogant. Regards to all.Mich _________________________________________________________________ Telly addicts unite! http://www.searchgamesbox.com/tvtown.shtml ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 07:57:24 -0500 From: "Rachel Avery" Subject: Re: Joni Tribute in CT Yes! I'm so glad you posted this Patti, i'd meant to do so last week. Dave Rave is a friend of ours, and he's actually the one responsible for getting me into Joni just over a decade ago. It will definitely be a fun show - everything Dave does is. With the exceptions of him and Lauren, though, i'm not familiar with the performers. Both of their myspaces are linked from the smalltownconcertseries page. Do go if you can! back to lurkdom/exams, ===== rachel "Seeing, contrary to popular wisdom, isn't believing. It's where belief stops, because it isn't needed any more." On 02/03/2008, Patti Parlette wrote: > I just got an email from an old high school friend. Seems like many dim years ago since I saw him face to face, so this is an unexpected pleasure: > > Dear Pattie, > I was recently in Chester CT having lunch with a friend of mine and I spotted the following tribute to Joni Mitchell music series being performed in Chester. Though you'd be interested. > > http://www.myspace.com/smalltownconcertseries > > ***** > > It always warms the cockles of my Joni heart and mind when someone hears something about Joni and associates her with me. Quel honneur, n'est-ce pas? > > Does anyone know these musicians? I'll have to check this out tomorrow. The more Joni fans in the world, the better! > > Love, > > Patti P. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 07:54:57 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: shining hissing smoking Sorry, Eric. I like you but the smoke is getting to your ears as well. Both Joan and Judy are older than Joni and tour continually, as opposed to singing in public once every few years. Both of their voices are much more clear and tonal than Joni's is now. That is a physical fact, not an opinion. Now you may prefer Joni's now deepened tones with a smaller range, but that is subjective. And just because some of us recognize this physical change does NOT mean we prefer her earlier work, or don't recognize the genius of her later work. It is just a fact. Jerry > > i don't hear the other non-smoking Joans (Baez & Collins) sound NEARLY SO good ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 09:21:39 -0500 From: Victor Johnson Subject: Re: Luciana and Larry On Mar 3, 2008, at 2:43 AM, wrote: > > Her website says she is touring to Italy next and then back around > the states. > She is truly a must see if you can catch her. > > Kakki You guys get all the cool shows! I wish I could teleport to California. I visited her website and her stops in Italy will be performances of "The Passion of St. Mark" by Golijav which I saw her in a year ago with the ASO at Emory University. This was my first exposure to her and she was mesmerizing. I would love to have seen her in a jazz club. Looks like she'll be hitting NYC, Chicago, and D.C. It seems like she's in such an unique place in her life, having all these different perspectives of Joni. The whole scenario probably doesn't happen very often. Victor ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 05:48:04 -0800 From: "Mark Scott" Subject: Re: Fave Joni "guest spot" - ----- Original Message ----- From: "KEVIN DOHENY" >..I had no idea Joni sang with Seal..i am definetly going to check >that out..Love Seal.. I think Joni's duet with Seal on 'If I Could' is my favorite Joni appearance on another artist's work. It's such a beautiful song and the two of them just seem to blend with and play off of each other so beautifully. I get a strong sense that Joni really respects the material she is contributing to and the artist she is backing up. >A close second would be her work on David Crosby's brilliant If I >could only remember >my name.. If my ears don't decieve me "what are >there names" contains what could be a > fantasy pairing of Joni and grace slick.. I bought 'If I Could Only Remember My Name' sometime while I was in college in the 70s for the sole reason that it had both Joni and Grace listed in the credits. At that time, they were my 2 idols. I saw them as completely different and representing 2 distinct sides of my personality. Alter-egos, if you will. lol! I have to admit I never listened to the record more than once or twice and then put it away as a sort of curio. I have often thought about trying to find it on cd to see what I may have missed. I seem to remember seeing it on cd once or twice. Although I like CSN, CSNY, etc, I have never been as big a fan of theirs as some people here. I was always more fascinated and drawn to the female artists. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 06:43:48 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Flaherty Subject: Re: shining hissing smoking >>GEEZ do any of us really realize WHAT A GREAT artist we have in Joni?????? ~MOJO: What about your voice? A lot of critics have complained that smoking caused you to lose your ability to hit the old high notes. Has it?~ WHAT an insulting STUPID question! No, Eric, no one here appreciates Joni but you. The rest of us are just stupid and insult her with our unworthiness. It seems to me that whatever any of us say you're going to read what you believe so ... count me out. A list that's sole purpose would be to see who can praise Joni the highest would be pretty boring, I think. Michael Flaherty (who will be less annoyed by all of this later in the day when he'll think "oh, well, whatever".) ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 10:15:29 -0500 (EST) From: "Jerry Notaro" Subject: Re: Fave Joni "guest spot" Mark Scott wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "KEVIN DOHENY" >>..I had no idea Joni sang with Seal..i am definetly going to check >>that out..Love Seal.. > > I think Joni's duet with Seal on 'If I Could' is my favorite Joni > appearance on another artist's work. As per usual, Mark and I agree on this one. I used to hang at a place that had music videos on a big screen. They had this one and all I had to do was walk near the booth and the DJ would say, "I know. I know. If I Could!" Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 09:42:36 -0800 (PST) From: David Sapp Subject: We are all Joni's greatest admirers I don't want to start a flame war here but I have to get this off my chest... Eric Taylor I appreciate your wonderful exuberance about Joni and your lively posts... but your constant assertion that you are the only one who truly appreciates Joni's genius is getting a bit overwrought and tiresome. I've been a member of this list since 2000 and have found that each of us are well aware of the genius of Joni and appreciate her in our own way... I believe each of us are her greatest admirers. Everyone have a good day...... signing off for now, Peace, David - --------------------------------- Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 10:54:12 -0800 (PST) From: Monika Bogdanowicz Subject: Re: shining hissing smoking I think you are preaching to the choir when you ask if we can even comprehend Joni's genius or whatever. Perhaps you should take that part of your post to a general music messageboard rather than a Joni Mitchell discussion list. You know? We all came here because of Joni's music, the way it has touched us personally and individually, and to connect with others who know the feeling. You dig? As for people talking about Joni's early work, well I suppose once again perhaps the casual Joni fans (or general public) go on about Big Yellow Taxi and Blue and that's it. I think the JMDL has healthy discussions of all of Joni's work (some favoring some of her early albums, some not digging the early ones as much, some favoring the later ones, some not digging the later ones, etc etc). In fact, I believe there are a couple of people who said they DIDN'T like Joni's voice (early records) until C&S when it deepened a bit. She wasn't really just "folk" by that time. I can't recall anyone saying they don't like a particular album (later album) because of Joni's voice on the JMDL. I believe some songs hit you and some songs don't as people explain frequently on here. As for cigarettes themselves, they are by far not a pollutant to the Earth but yes, they are dangerous to you individually. Sure household cleaners are toxic as well but you're not drinking Draino or inhaling the fumes everyday as a smoker does with cigarettes. That's fine if you want to smoke though. As George Harrison said, "do what you want to do" but cigarettes are bad for your lungs and can cause cancer. That is fact man. My own uncle smoked all his life and died a couple of years ago from lung cancer. That wasn't from anything household. I'm just saying and I mean no disrespect but I won't pretend smoking doesn't cause you any harm. -Monika Eric Taylor wrote: i really enjoy the lively exchange over Joni's pre/post voice! even though it seems like i'm in the vast minority 2 me smoking tobacco has only improved her voice over the past 40 years the smoke-nazis are SO out of touch, blaming nicotine & THC for all our woes when actually most of our household cleaners are far more toxic & cancer causing do fans want or expect Joni to sound the same way she did some 30 years ago??? MY GOD THE WOMAN IS 64 i don't hear the other non-smoking Joans (Baez & Collins) sound NEARLY SO good Lena Horne likewise sounded better at 70 than she did at 20 the MOJO article deserves far more contemplation: ~When I interviewed her in 2004, she spoke openly for nearly six hours about, among many other things, the reasons for her disenchantment with the business, including 'asinine' critics who charged that smokinh had ruined her voice.~ GEEZ do any of us really realize WHAT A GREAT artist we have in Joni?????? ~MOJO: What about your voice? A lot of critics have complained that smoking caused you to lose your ability to hit the old high notes. Has it?~ WHAT an insulting STUPID question! u folk snobs who expect Joni to regurgitate her early work endlessly really grate on my nerves MY GOD PEOPLE do we even begin to comprehend what a TOTAL GENIUS joni is? light up an additive-free cigarette & plant a tree for our poor little planet ET - --------------------------------- Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 11:04:31 -0800 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Re: shining hissing smoking Wow...a good dose of twisted logic in this post...(with due respect) From: "Eric Taylor" > 2 me smoking tobacco has only improved her voice over the past 40 years Just your opinion-but we don't know, it might be twice as good if she was not a chain smoker. Anyway, I disagree. I think her voice has deteriorated. I don't find it charming, worldly, or whatever, just less flexible, hence, less expressive. Do I accept it? Yes. I'll take Joni the way she is, what choice is there? > the smoke-nazis are SO out of touch, blaming nicotine & THC for all our > woes Smoke nazis?...Do you think wanting to breathe clean air for yourself and children is nazi-like? > when actually most of our household cleaners are far more toxic & cancer > causing How does that make smoking healthy? > u folk snobs who expect Joni to regurgitate her early work endlessly > really grate on my nerves I have not heard anyone say that, so you are beating a dead horse there. > light up an additive-free cigarette & plant a tree for our poor little > planet Tree, yes. Smoke, no thanks. As an aside-myself and others believe that "virginia cure" tobacco is much more dangerous and cancer-causing than "turkish" because the virginia cure is soaked in sugar, and you know what sugar looks like when it burns. English, French and American cigarettes use this sugar process. Which is not to say that tobacco in any form is not a health hazard, obviously it is. Anything burned and inhaled is carcinogenic, and of course leaves a residue on your lungs, which are designed to deliver oxygen to your blood. Most diseases thrive in a low-oxygen environment, and worldwide oxygen levels are already historically lower than in the past. Do what you want, but don't bullshit yourself. You and Joni against the world is a delusion. You're not any closer to her because you smoke. Defending her chain-smoking does not mean that you care for her more than others do, or "get" her more than the rest of us stupids. Sorry. RR ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 22:34:26 +0000 From: Patti Parlette Subject: New book on Carole, Joni & Carly FYI: From Carlysimon.com: "Carly Simon Biography - Recommended Reading We are pleased to announce that Sheila Weller's new book Girls Like Us - Carole King, Joni Mitchell, Carly Simon and the Journey of a Generation, is a well researched and elaborate biography of her life and career. Ms. Weller (a New York Times best-selling author) writes in a chorus-of-voices style, where friends of each artist tell the stories of their unique experiences with each woman. The format is intimate and engrossing. At 592 pages, Girls Like Us is an epic treatment of these three women who dared to break tradition and become what none had been before them - confessors in song, rock superstars, and adventurers of heart and soul. Even if you've read every article and seen every interview about Carly Simon, this is a must read....full of new information and perspective." **** Caroleking.com and jonimitchell.com (hey! xoxox!!) don't have anything about it. Barnes & Noble's website says it will be released April 8th. xo, pp _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 16:05:11 -0800 (PST) From: Bob Muller Subject: Re: New book on Carole, Joni & Carly Are you sure? Check again.... ;o) Can't do anything about Ms King's website but we are up to speed at JM.com, PP - thanks for the scoop, Betty Boop. Bob NP: U2, "Yahweh" ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 16:27:34 -0800 (PST) From: KEVIN DOHENY Subject: Joni Merchandise Why can I buy dvd's for the first few seasons of any cheesy 80's tv show or get a boxed set from Limp Bizkit and there is so little available re: Joni... Something tells me the little tidbits that appear on YouTube are only the tip of a very large iceberg...The available dvd's sell fairly well so I can't imagine why there is much more :) Needing a visual Joni fix...Kev - --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 00:41:42 +0000 From: "Jamie's Box of Paints" Subject: Re: Joni Merchandise I know... we're missing Joni at Carnegie Hall Joni in London (several times!!!!!) Joni Paints Joni Goes Shopping Joni Kicks Maid in the Shins (Courtroom Drama) lol of course the last one has been available on TNT network, usually right after 'Not Without My Camels' On 04/03/2008, KEVIN DOHENY wrote: > Why can I buy dvd's for the first few seasons of any cheesy 80's tv show or get a boxed set from Limp Bizkit and there is so little available re: Joni... Something tells me the little tidbits that appear on YouTube are only the tip of a very large iceberg...The available dvd's sell fairly well so I can't imagine why there is much more :) Needing a visual Joni fix...Kev > > > --------------------------------- > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > - -- I am a lonely Painter I live in a Box of Paints I'm frightened by the devil But I'm drawn to those ones that 'aint afraid... Jamie Zubairi can be found for voice-overs at http://uk.voicespro.com/jamie.zubairi1 acting CV and showreel at http://uk.castingcallpro.com/u/81749 http://www.jamiezubairi.co.uk Facebook me! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 19:56:51 -0800 (PST) From: KEVIN DOHENY Subject: Tori covers Joni I love Tori Amos' cover of A case of you... Ive seen her live more than any other performer and have been lucky enough to hear her play it several times...She has said that it is the only song she wished she had written..She also calls it a "perfect song" and her performance of it(the studio recording is so great as well as live) is just wonderful..My question is does anyone know if Tori covered anymore of Joni's songs? I wonder if Joni has ever really listened to any of tori's albums..They are soul sisters no need for comparisons like joni said prince was like her and sly stone's kid..tori is the product of a lesbian affair between joni and laurie anderson with kate bush included..lol.. - --------------------------------- Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 23:11:58 -0500 (EST) From: notaro@stpt.usf.edu Subject: Re: Tori covers Joni A quick search of JoniMitchell.com gives you the answer: Amos, Tori A Case Of You, "Cornflake Girl -- Limited Edition (UK)", 1994 River, "(live performance)", 2001 The Circle Game, "Auditorium Theatre, Chicago IL 4/15/05", 2005 > I love Tori Amos' cover of A case of you... Ive seen her live more than > any other performer and have been lucky enough to hear her play it several > times...She has said that it is the only song she wished she had > written..She also calls it a "perfect song" and her performance of it(the > studio recording is so great as well as live) is just wonderful..My > question is does anyone know if Tori covered anymore of Joni's songs? I > wonder if Joni has ever really listened to any of tori's albums..They are > soul sisters no need for comparisons like joni said prince was like her > and sly stone's kid..tori is the product of a lesbian affair between joni > and laurie anderson with kate bush included..lol.. > > --------------------------------- > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 04:44:30 +0000 From: Patti Parlette Subject: RE: New book on Carole, Joni & Carly Musik Meister Muller wrote: Can't do anything about Ms King's website but we are up to speed at JM.com, PP - thanks for the scoop, Betty Boop. **** Way to GO, Team Joni! And Richard, how did you ever find that excerpt? Applause, applause! I only got to speed-read it tonight, so pardon my inchoate impression, but it struck me as pretty deep. Do think you think it is well-written? Joni was so brave! All alone and pregnant and making her way. (When I found out I was pregnant, I was scared merdeless -- and I had a husband and a family, albeit no farm). Vive la Joan et la JMDL! Love, Betty Boop-oop-eee doop! (a.k.a. Patti Poopah) _________________________________________________________________ Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser! http://biggestloser.msn.com/ ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2007 #478 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)