From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2007 #335 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, October 23 2007 Volume 2007 : Number 335 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Deep and meaningful ["Gordon MacKie" ] Sing on your phone, Kate ["Oddmund Kaarevik" ] Re: Vancouver and environs - Sechelt ["Allison Crowe Music Mgmt" ] Re: Deep and meaningful [Catherine McKay ] answering machine [LCStanley7@aol.com] HerStory: Maggie Thatcher ["William Elliott" ] Re: shine on the catholic church... [LCStanley7@aol.com] Catholics [Kate Johnson ] faux strumming [Dave Blackburn ] Re: His Story SJC [Monika Bogdanowicz ] Re: Malaysian "Shine" ["Jamie's Box of Paints" ] SHINE [rian afriadi ] Another English Lesson [rian afriadi ] Re: Another English Lesson [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: Another English Lesson [Jeannie ] Subject: Vancouver [Bryan ] Re: Another English Lesson [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: Deep and meaningful [Dflahm@aol.com] Re: Another English Lesson [Jeannie ] Joy [William Waddell ] Re: Another English Lesson [Jerry Notaro ] Subject: No Fiddle on American Bravo [Bryan ] Re: Another English Lesson [merk54@aol.com] Re: Vancouver and environs - Sechelt ["Allison Crowe Music Mgmt" ] Re: shine on the catholic church... [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: Joy [Andy Stancliffe ] Re: Another English Lesson ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: Another English Lesson [Jeannie ] hopeful girl in a dreamy dress [Deb Messling ] Shine/JC ["Mike & Alice Hicks" ] Re: BYT (2007) ["Eric Taylor" ] Re: Joy ["Eric Taylor" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 07:59:41 +0100 From: "Gordon MacKie" Subject: Deep and meaningful Hello Mitchellistas, Something Jerry N said made me think. ( always a positive thing) He mentioned the possibiltiy of Joni's antipathy to catholicism as being 'deep seeded'. I liked the notion a lot - I had always thought the phrase was 'deep-seated' . So a google later, I found this http://wsu.edu/~brians/errors/deep.html Whilst this explains 'deep-seated' as being correct, I still like deep seeded.I think it sounds like a Mitchellism. Maybe we need a Joni dictionary. Bye Gordon in dry but cold Glasgow ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 09:52:13 +0200 From: "Oddmund Kaarevik" Subject: Sing on your phone, Kate Dear Kate of the North ! For many years I've used lines from "All I want" singing on my answering machine: "i'm on a lonely road, travelling, trwvelling, travelling, looking for something, what can it be? Oh I hate you some, I hate you some, but I love you, sooo- oome, I love you when i forget about me...?" Isn't that just something !? Love from Oddmund, Norway ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 01:03:14 -0700 From: "Allison Crowe Music Mgmt" Subject: Re: Vancouver and environs - Sechelt p.s. if you're aiming to visit Sechelt as a day-trip, from Vancouver Island, you will find it much simpler, and much cheaper, to take a seaplane rather than drive; there's a couple of companies that fly seaplanes from Nanaimo (near Departure Bay - any Diana Krall fans...), to Sechelt - and that takes all of 20 - 30 minutes, instead of 2.5 - 5 hours each way; the fare per flight is also less than that for a car and driver to make the journey. If you have time to overnight on the Sunshine Coast, then driving can be a good option - as you can be mobile once you're there. By flying, you can take the public transit bus between Sechelt and Gibsons, if you want (that's one hour - by car, you can make it in 30 or 40) - and/or just walk around Sechelt, visit the Sunshine Coast Arts Centre, a well-known haunt of Joni's (she's a patron of the arts, naturally). From Vancouver/the mainland, it's easier to do the Sunshine Coast as a day trip by car. Still on a sunny day, those seaplanes are worth every penny just for the view! Slan, Adrian ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 08:28:10 +0000 From: Michel BYRNE Subject: This Place Re David's comments on the rhythm of This Place - it's the 'mixed' waltz rhythm she first gave us on Cherokee Louise, and then on Turbulent Indigo, then on Crazy Cries of Love - looks like we're going to get one on every Joni album now! She described it as her own version of ...the Shuffle? would that be right? A kind of mixture of 3/4 on the guitar, but 6/8 and possibly 2/4 in the melody? I'm always surprised that she can keep the rhythmic tension going when singing these things solo. I love the addition of pedal-steel guitar in This Place - it stops the soing being too reminiscent of Crazy Cries and the others. M _________________________________________________________________ Get free emoticon packs and customisation from Windows Live. http://www.pimpmylive.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 07:20:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Deep and meaningful - --- Gordon MacKie wrote: > Hello Mitchellistas, > > Something Jerry N said made me think. ( always a > positive thing) He mentioned the possibiltiy of > Joni's antipathy to catholicism as being 'deep > seeded'. I liked the notion a lot - I had always > thought the phrase was 'deep-seated' . So a google > later, I found this > > http://wsu.edu/~brians/errors/deep.html > > Whilst this explains 'deep-seated' as being correct, > I still like deep seeded.I think it sounds like a > Mitchellism. Maybe we need a Joni dictionary. > I also thought it was "seated" but when I saw "seeded", thought maybe I was wrong all along. Jerry is always right ;-) I didn't bother looking it up in the dictionary, though. Lazy me. Still don't understand why the word "seed" is used in tennis, but there's a lot about tennis I don't understand. Catherine ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 08:20:59 EDT From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: answering machine I pay a high price for my open talking Like you do for your silent mystery Come and talk to me Please talk to me Talk to me talk to me ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 06:16:12 -0700 From: "William Elliott" Subject: HerStory: Maggie Thatcher Yes, Maggie is a shining albeit rare example of the un-male, power-hungry tyrant. What she did to the miners in the north was criminal; the scene in BILLY ELLIOT, where the line of riot police confront the striking miners, to the sound of London Calling, by The Clash, provides a brief but powerful depiction of the conflict. For me, the spectre of Maggie inhabits that scene. I was delighted when, in 2002, some daring soul paid a visit to the newly unveiled stone statue of Maggie, outside the House of Parliment, and promptly decapitated her. That incident still gives me a giggle. Sadly, it is being replaced by a seven foot sculpture of Maggie in bronze. I can only hope that some bravely-bitter, torch-weilding welder pays her a visit in the middle of the night. www.maggiethatcher.com Save on Contractor Training. Click Here

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Unlimited Email Storage – POP3 – Calendar – SMS – Translator – Much More! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 09:49:13 EDT From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: shine on the catholic church... Cath-erine wrote: but I think your mother was probably right. God goes up the chimney like childhood Santa Claus The good slaves love the good book, a rebel loves a cause! Hi Catherine, When I took my kids to school this morning, I turned on the CD player in our van as usual, and it was right on the same line you quoted, "God goes up the chimney...." It got me thinking, what in life isn't a fairy tale? We see everything through the eyes of our own reality, our own minds. "It's life's illusions I recall, I really don't know life, at all." Religion is a human attempt at making sense of a reality too big for our little human minds to fully comprehend... just like fairy tales are an attempt to relate big people realities in little stories to children. If there weren't people there'd be no religion; just like if there weren't children there wouldn't be fairy tales. Religion in my opinion is a human thing, and to cast it all off, to condemn it by focusing only on the corruption and bad rather than seeing the human beauty, the art, in it is not very tolerant. Yin without the yang and the ball don't roll. Love, Laura ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 08:11:49 -0500 From: Kate Johnson Subject: Catholics On 22-Oct-07, at 2:00 AM, onlyJMDL Digest wrote: > So, is Saskatchewan mainly a Protestant province? I would assume > there are a lot of Lutherans there, having a large northern European > population. There are more Protestant churches than Catholic churches in most towns that are big enough to have more than one church, yeah. Wadena, for instance, the town I live closest to, has a Baptist, a United, a Lutheran, an Anglican and Ukrainian Orthodox, Ukrainian Catholic and Roman Catholic churches. Wadena has a population of about 1500 although I don't think that includes the rural surroundings. My mom used to like to tell a story about the time she took me on a bus trip when I was two or three years old. When I saw two ladies dressed in colourful saris I gasped "Angels!" and when I saw two nuns I said, frightened, "Witches!" Thanks for answering machine tips, you guys! Kate (du Nord) - -- http://xoetc.antville.org Who Does She Think She Is? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 07:52:39 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: faux strumming Thanks Paz for nailing the exact keyboard. I can't imagine for the life of me why she would think that was hip instead of playing the DANG GUITAR! I mean she's rated as one of the top 50 guitarists in rock or something isn't she? After several more listens to Shine I'm afraid it has not grown for me. The compositions, lyrically, melodically and emotionally seem lightweight and bland . The mix is irritating because the voice is tucked too deep and the faux instruments are so....1992. Glad everyone else loves it though.. Dave On Oct 21, 2007, at 1:14 PM, onlyJMDL Digest wrote: > Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2007 12:17:20 -0500 > From: Michael Paz > Subject: Re: Bad Dreams are Good? > > That sound is a patch on a Yamaha synth called a Motif 8 ES. I have > one of them and I always liked it. The keyboard has a programmable > arpeggiator in it to give it that strum sound. > > best > > Paz > > Michael Paz > michael@thepazgroup.com > > Tour Manager > Preservation Hall Jazz Band > http://www.preservationhall.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 08:02:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Monika Bogdanowicz Subject: Re: His Story SJC Queen Elizabeth, though a good Queen I suppose, wasn't exactly the kind of person you'd sit down and have dinner with. Very icy I think. Then there's always Queen Mary (aka Bloody Mary) who had more than a few screws loose.... -Monika "We all come and go unknown..." Jeannie wrote: I just remembered that Anne Coulter's another cold one from the same barrel of that bitter bitches' brew. Jeannie wrote: It's true what you say about Thatcher. I hadn't thought of that. Then I thought of Janet Reno, too. Just-Ice type of women--cold hearted--just like stone commissions in a park. Witch hunters from a bitter bitches brew. Jean NP: Sweet Bird~~Herbie Hancock Martin Giles wrote: Margaret Thatcher didn't start a war or caused genocide. But she took 40,000 families apart when she destroyed the UK coal industry. (The affected communities took many years to recover). She ordered the sinking of the General Belgrano (3,000 souls) at the beginning of the Faulkland Island conflict. Took away free school milk before she even became Prime Minister. No-one can say that she was being manipulated by men and not be laughed at. She was tougher than any man in her cabinet at any time. Not exactly peaceful and nurturing. Of course you can't draw any useful conclusions from one woman's actions; you've probably got to be a tough son/daughter-of-a-bitch to succeed in politics in the first place. Martin. In London. > Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2007 10:06:59 +0200 > From: "Marion Leffler" > Subject: SV: His Story SJC > > Let me ask another (rhetorical!) question: is there any queen in history > under whose reign there wasn't a war or other violent actions? You could > say > that women in power are still subject to men in power but that's just a > little too simple. Women like queen Elizabeth I and queen Christina of > Sweden certainly did have minds of their own and real power. What I am > trying to say is that we cannot know if women are more peaceful "by > nature" > than men. There has not been a society yet in which women in sufficiently > large numbers had enough power to act in ways different from men's ways in > politics. Hence we do not know if women in power would not start wars. It > would depend on the kind of society they would be able to create. > Marion > > - -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- > Fren: owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org] Fvr Eric > Taylor > Skickat: den 21 oktober 2007 09:09 > Till: jmdl > Dmne: His Story SJC > > Just a little comment on "men love war, is that what history/God is for?" > Just the sound of it shakes my soul. > ~A mass murder mystery, history, his story.~ > I likewise concluded that long ago. > Can anyone here name one woman who started a war or caused genocide? > Besides OK Ann Cunter...??? > Oh lord I'm in trouble now! Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 16:10:48 +0100 From: "Jamie's Box of Paints" Subject: Re: Malaysian "Shine" LOL I was wondering this myself. I'd bought my mum a copy from BAng!CD from whom I have bought before and there is a little hologram thingy in the corner which I rec0ognised as I lived in Malaysia for 16 years. They are bona fide. Malaysia are a CD producing nation (cheap labour, you know how it goes) and they are hyper aware of CD piracy. High-street shops will have the little hologram sticker on it. 'Market' bought cds tend not to and don't have the little sticker. It is good to know that products made in Malaysia for the foreign market have a higher health and safety standard and are usually of better quality than items produced for the local market. I was a little surprised myself. My brother in fact pointed it out. The little sticker is from the Government of Malaysia and has the seal of approval. The CD that I bought at the normal price (12.99 from HMV) didn't have this sticker. I wonder if this was why the cd has the blue band across it. To protect the delicate eyes of the muslim children who might be handling the cd in the shops? lol. I suspect not. Much Joni Zooby On 21/10/2007, Jussi Pukkila wrote: > Hi > > Thought I'd drop a line about my copy of "Shine" that I just got. I > ordered it from CDwow, based on their reasonable pricing. It was 12, > shipping included. It was my first time buying from them. On the > website, they say that their stock can originate basically from anywhere > in the world. So after a bit of wait, "Shine" arrived and the CD is made > in Malaysia! Quite exotic. Well, to me. Not if you live in Malaysia of > course. > > Now I'm quite a "seasoned" music collector and I've seen bootlegs and > shifty pressings, but this looks like the real thing. There are no silly > typos in the small print, which I've seen on Chinese CD's. Also the > artwork is crisp, although I don't have any Western counterpart to > compare it to. I'm in Finland and here you can come across Russian dodgy > CD's, often sold at market places and they can mostly be told from the > real thing with a quick glance. > > The Malaysian copy has the blue strip around it, the "radiant return" > sticker was on the plastic wrapper and there's a hologram on the front > booklet. The case is one of those SACD cases (Super Jewel Box, > apparently), with round corners and the weird shaped back insert. Are > they all like this? > > Btw, how is one supposed to get the booklet out safely, it's got tabs on > both sides - anyone know? Booklet has 32 pages and there's a promo note > about ringtones attached. Sadly no Joni though - the usual Gwens and > Rihannas only. > > The CD has the nightsky design. There are 'Universal' logos etched on > the data side of the disc. hear music/Universal 0888072304574 > > So, to me everything looks OK about this copy. Productwise I'm happy, > although this kind of commerce, with goods travelling halfway around the > world can't be environmentally that sound... I ordered the new Chaka > Khan album from the same store. It will be interesting to see where that > one comes from. > > > --jussi > - -- I am a lonely Painter I live in a Box of Paints I'm frightened by the devil But I'm drawn to those ones that 'aint afraid... Jamie Zubairi can be found for voice-overs at http://uk.voicespro.com/jamie.zubairi1 acting CV and showreel at http://uk.castingcallpro.com/u/81749 http://www.jamiezubairi.co.uk Facebook me! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 09:11:47 -0700 (PDT) From: rian afriadi Subject: SHINE Everybody has stated their opinion about Shine, well, heres mine: When she sang money, money, money... on This Place, I thought she was going to finish it with makes the world go round. But she finished it with make the trees come down It slapped me a little since Indonesia is #1 in deforestation rate. Next lines : it turn mountains into molehills. Well, THAT happens in my own hometown. Joni knows what she talks about. And that folk (Robert Xgau?) who claimed Joni is a bad example of environmentalism surely didnt know what he babbled about. I think the messages about environment (which this album has) can be (or should be) effective. Youngsters may not listen to this album. But a fan of Joni surely will. I believe that most of her fan must be in their 40s or 50s or 60s, we can say : at the top of their career/ as a decision maker. Sadly, our president, Susilo Bambang Yudhono is not a fan of Joni. But, you can hope Hillary or Obama or Gore, your next president, hear this album. Beside This Place, If I Had A Heart and Bad Dreams also belong to my favorite. BYT2007? This is the first song from Shine that i listened. I was a little bit afraid at first. BYT 1970 is one of my favorite. I was just afraid Joni will destroy this song, just the way she did to some songs on Travelogue (mostly Woodstock  strangely, she got a grammy for that). But after listening to it, i knew i was just paranoid. I dont love this version, but i also dont hate it. But i have to say, she gave a new dimension to that song by adding the word so before they paved paradise and put up a parking lot and by changing $1.5 with an arm and a leg (which made this song timeless, no need to worry about inflation). Hana? That song freaked me out. Maybe just like those who listen to Joni since the 60s and shocked by heavily-synthed Dog Eat Dog. The sound of Hana is like Joni meets Shlomo or Dokaka or Bell or any other weird musician who collaborate with Bjork. Conclusion: i think i like this album more than i like Turbulent Indigo but less than i like NRH. 3.5 stars out of 5. NP: Madonna  Like A Prayer Soon will play : The 5,6,7,8s  Woo Hoo (from Kill Bill) Oh yah, i hate the album cover. Just the way i hate CMIARS and NRH album cover. I wish on her next album (if theres any) shell use her painting again. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 09:28:45 -0700 (PDT) From: rian afriadi Subject: Another English Lesson Dear English Native Speakers over there, I can't understand the term "Raised on Robbery" Please explain it. Thank you. Rian -- INA Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 13:21:12 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Another English Lesson In order to get by, one needs resources. Most folks choose an honest lifestyle, working at a job and making money to pay for what they need. Others scam, rob & con their way through life. In my mind, I think Joni was saying that the character in the song (a hooker trying to pick up a customer) falls into the latter category, so much so that she declares to be brought up in the lifestyle of illicit behavior. Bob NP: Ray Bailey, "Satan's Horn" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:25:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeannie Subject: Re: Another English Lesson I never saw the girl on, 'Raised On Robbery,' as a prostitute. I saw her more like one of those toughie off-night back street gals living on the fringes. She's a pretty good cook, too. I've never heard of hookers inviting clients up to their kitchen to share her best recipes with. But, I could be wrong, Bob. Maybe Joni meant for her to be a whore. She reminds me of those tough type of women that could take off to live the lifestyle of a Carney or work the Circus circuit, a free-wheeling and dealing type of woman who's never really ready to settle. NPIMH: a 'River' gently flowing Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: In order to get by, one needs resources. Most folks choose an honest lifestyle, working at a job and making money to pay for what they need. Others scam, rob & con their way through life. In my mind, I think Joni was saying that the character in the song (a hooker trying to pick up a customer) falls into the latter category, so much so that she declares to be brought up in the lifestyle of illicit behavior. Bob NP: Ray Bailey, "Satan's Horn" nj Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:29:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Bryan Subject: Subject: Vancouver Subject: Vancouver Hi All from Vancouver Island-Does anyone know the the exact area where Joni has her place here? I would love to see the general area. I am off tomorrow and I am suppose to get together with my old pal Yael tomorrow. We are suppose to go to a Blueberry Farm and have a cook out and party a bit. This area of the world is so beautiful. I would love to spend some more time up here. As I understand it, Joni's place ("This Place") is not on Vancouver Island, but is near Vancouver (which is not on the island). Yes, it is a gorgeous part of the world. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 14:46:03 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Another English Lesson "I'm sitting on my groceries.." Think about that for a moment in regards to the female anatomy. "Come up to my kitchen, I'll show you my best recipes" has NOTHING to do with food. Bob NP: Joni, "The Arrangement" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 14:58:50 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: Deep and meaningful Given what we understand the term to mean (very difficult to reverse or remove) one version seems as good as the other. LAHM ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:59:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeannie Subject: Re: Another English Lesson Ugghh! That sounds get down dirty! :P Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: "I'm sitting on my groceries.." Think about that for a moment in regards to the female anatomy. "Come up to my kitchen, I'll show you my best recipes" has NOTHING to do with food. Bob NP: Joni, "The Arrangement" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. ------------------------------------------------------------ nj Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 19:13:03 +0000 From: William Waddell Subject: Joy I find myself walking along streets and singing bits from Shine and realise Joni's in my head again, anew. Joy. I love Joni. Just absolutely love her. WtS x _________________________________________________________________ 100s of Music vouchers to be won with MSN Music https://www.musicmashup.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 15:23:57 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Another English Lesson > I never saw the girl on, 'Raised On Robbery,' as a prostitute. Just desperate for attention. One of those bar flies, for sure. > I saw her more like one of those toughie off-night back street gals living > on the fringes. > > She's a pretty good cook, too. I've never heard of hookers inviting clients > up to their kitchen to share her best recipes with. > > But, I could be wrong, Bob. > Maybe Joni meant for her to be a whore. I think that she is "sitting on her groceries" makes it pretty clear. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:32:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Bryan Subject: Subject: No Fiddle on American Bravo So, one wonders when the American broadcast will be, or if there will be one. And Charlie Rose, and Tavis Smiley, etc. The Shine media campaign seems to have shut down. Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 16:23:32 -0400 From: merk54@aol.com Subject: Re: Another English Lesson In my mind, she is definitely?a prostitute.? You mention that she's a cook, but didn't include the following: ? I'm a pretty good cook I'm sitting on my groceries. She is using cooking as a metaphor for sex, and her "groceries" are her bootie.? One can only imagine what her "best recipes" would consist of. That's always been my take on it anyway. Jack ? - -----Original Message----- From: Jeannie To: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Cc: joni@smoe.org Sent: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 1:25 pm Subject: Re: Another English Lesson I never saw the girl on, 'Raised On Robbery,' as a prostitute. I saw her more like one of those toughie off-night back street gals living on the fringes. She's a pretty good cook, too. I've never heard of hookers inviting clients up to their kitchen to share her best recipes with. But, I could be wrong, Bob. Maybe Joni meant for her to be a whore. She reminds me of those tough type of women that could take off to live the lifestyle of a Carney or work the Circus circuit, a free-wheeling and dealing type of woman who's never really ready to settle. NPIMH: a 'River' gently flowing Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: In order to get by, one needs resources. Most folks choose an honest lifestyle, working at a job and making money to pay for what they need. Others scam, rob & con their way through life. In my mind, I think Joni was saying that the character in the song (a hooker trying to pick up a customer) falls into the latter category, so much so that she declares to be brought up in the lifestyle of illicit behavior. Bob NP: Ray Bailey, "Satan's Horn" nj Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 00:43:54 -0700 From: "Allison Crowe Music Mgmt" Subject: Re: Vancouver and environs - Sechelt Sechelt is where you want to visit if it"s Joni's native land you seek. From Vancouver (AKA the mainland), or Vancouver Island (which is another boat to reach the mainland), you'd need to travel to Horseshoe Bay (in West Vancouver). From there you catch a 40 or so minute ferry to Langdale - about ten minutes drive from the town of Gibsons. It's about one hour's drive north from there to Sechelt. Visit http://www.bcferries.com for schedules etc. It's not far in miles, but it can take a long time, eg. 2 - 4 hours, to reach if you have to make a two-boat ferry connection.) This entire coast is beautiful. Sometimes, though, it's nice to see the rainforest be less rainy! Enjoy your visit and exploring ( : Slainte, Adrian ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 18:35:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: shine on the catholic church... - --- LCStanley7@aol.com wrote: > Religion is a human attempt at making sense of a > reality too big for our > little human minds to fully comprehend... just like > fairy tales are an > attempt to relate big people realities in little > stories to children. If there > weren't people there'd be no religion; just like if > there weren't children > there wouldn't be fairy tales. > > Religion in my opinion is a human thing, and to > cast it all off, to > condemn it by focusing only on the corruption and > bad rather than seeing the > human beauty, the art, in it is not very tolerant. > Yin without the yang and the > ball don't roll. > I think it's possible to have a religion, or a philosophy, of life that tries to explain the point of it all without the bureaucracy attached. I guess my main grip with the catholic church (a gripe that can be applied to many other religions, but my personal experience is with the RC church) is that, each time the believer tries to see the things about the faith that are beautiful, they are slapped back into reality by fundamentalist types imposing too many ridiculous rules about what is and isn't OK to believe in, about who can/can't say mass, and so on. I've known a lot of religious Catholic people who were wonderful, caring open-minded individuals who embraced other beliefs and faiths as easily as they did their own and saw them all as equally valid, but then there are the rule-setting petty-minded little tyrants who want to impose their own narrow views on everyone. And those are the ones who want to slap down anyone who tries to be more liberal-minded. And then they get ridiculous with the "mysteries" of the church - such as, when the priest consecrates the bread and wine, he is *literally* turning it into the body and blood of Jesus, which is foolish, illogical and, let's face it, cannibalistic and gross. I can get beautiful concepts and philosophies from many sources and I love reading myths from many cultures and religions and, despite being agnostic, I certainly do love the *idea* of a god or goddess of some kind, but ultimately, I believe that whatever is godly lies within us all. I am quite sure that the abusers are a small minority, but it's the petty-mindedness and literal interpretations of bible text by some of the priesthood and the faithful that drives me crazy. There's a lot of art and beauty in that faith, as there are in many faiths, but it's undermined by the other foolishness. And it's just too male-dominated for my liking. Let them elect a pope (or would that be a Big Mama?) who is female and under 80 and maybe I'll pay attention. Catherine ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 18:55:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Another English Lesson - --- Jeannie wrote: > I never saw the girl on, 'Raised On Robbery,' as a > prostitute. > I saw her more like one of those toughie off-night > back street gals living on the fringes. > > She's a pretty good cook, too. I've never heard of > hookers inviting clients up to their kitchen to > share her best recipes with. > Well, I don't think she's talking about those kinds of recipes, if you get my drift (nudge-nudge, wink-wink, say no more.) However, I don't see her as a hooker either, but more of a good-time gal, out for a good time and trying to get a man to buy her some drinks and then she'll bring him home for a little roll in the hay. Catherine ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 19:03:52 EDT From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: shine on the catholic church... In a message dated 10/22/07 5:36:11 PM, anima_rising@yahoo.ca writes: > but then there > are the rule-setting petty-minded little tyrants who > want to impose their own narrow views on everyone. And > those are the ones who want to slap down anyone who > tries to be more liberal-minded. > LOLLLLLLLLL this is a very colorful description!!!! I love it!!! My family is wondering why I'm ROFL!!! Would that be slapping down with a ruler perhaps?! Thank God I only had liberal nuns when I was in gradeschool, but I've heard of the slap you down with a ruler ones. I did have a ruler slapper named Mrs. Willy in 3rd grade, but I had her at the public school I transfered to for 4 years. She slapped desks not kids, but it made a sound I'll never forget. Love, Laura ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 16:40:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Stancliffe Subject: Re: Joy Hi William, This is my reaction to Shine too! I keep finding myself singing snippets of the new songs too, and it's been so long since I've had new Joni songs in my head. It's pure joy. Andy Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 19:13:03 +0000 From: William Waddell Subject: Joy I find myself walking along streets and singing bits from Shine and realise Joni's in my head again, anew. Joy. I love Joni. Just absolutely love her. WtS x _________________________________________________________________ 100s of Music vouchers to be won with MSN Music https://www.musicmashup.co.uk Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 21:46:36 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: Another English Lesson Jeanie said > I never saw the girl on, 'Raised On Robbery,' as a prostitute. > I saw her more like one of those toughie off-night back street gals living on the fringes. > She's a pretty good cook, too. I've never heard of hookers inviting clients up to their kitchen to share her best recipes with. I'm with Muller on this one. Jeanie, let's start with lyric. Joni said, >>He was sitting in the lounge of the Empire Hotel >>He was drinking for diversion >>He was thinking for himself Far from home, this guy is alone, drinking in a hotel lounge. *She* approaches him. >>She says, "Drinkin' alone's a shame >>It's a shame it's a crying shame." How often does a non-prostitute walk into a bar and strike up a conversation with a stranger who is drinking alone? She doesn't have anything to say except a cliche, which she says three times, in place of a *thoughtful* remark. >>"Hey honey, you've got lots of cash. >>Bring us 'round a bottle, >>We'll have some laughs." Jeanie, she wants some of his money. After the remark about hockey, it's the third thing she says to him. >>"Gin's what I'm drinking. >>I was raised on robbery." In recent conversations about this, I learned that hookers and strippers order clear drinks because the bartender actually serves them water. It's part of the arrangement so they can keep "working", eh? Next, there's a literary device called a "double entendre" which means the words have two intentions, two meanings. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_entendre There's an innocent meaning but also a vulgar or humorous meaning. Here's an example, in the form of a joke: "A blonde knockout walks into a bar. She asks the bartender for a Double Entendre... So he gave it to her." In this joke, "he gave it to her" has 2 meanings: 1.) It appears to mean that the bartender served the drink she ordered. 2.) The true meaning is derived from the setting. At the beginning of the joke, the customer is a "blonde knockout" which means that she's a sex object. Since she's a sex object, the punch line "he gave it to her" means that the bartender "serviced" her. Back to Joni, who said, >>I'm a pretty good "cook" >>I'm sitting on my groceries I put "cook" in quotes because she cooks with her hips. She's not offering tea & biscuits. She's sitting on her "goodies", her "groceries". >>Come up to my kitchen, I'll show you my best "recipe". >>I try and I try but I can't save a cent. >>I'm up after midnight, "cooking", >>trying to make my rent. >>Come home with me honey Cooks don't hustle customers in hotel bars. Hookers hustle customers in hotel bars. Jim L'Hommedieu the lyric is at: http://jonimitchell.com/musician/song.cfm?id=RaisedOnRobbery ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 19:00:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeannie Subject: Re: Another English Lesson I mean, Jim, I've been around all over this place, but I just don't know how a hooker struts her stuff. How do you know these things, huh?!? (just kidding---for real, Jim) Water for Gin? Geez, we're really into the bitches' brew tonight! Jean Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: Jeanie said > I never saw the girl on, 'Raised On Robbery,' as a prostitute. > I saw her more like one of those toughie off-night back street gals living on the fringes. > She's a pretty good cook, too. I've never heard of hookers inviting clients up to their kitchen to share her best recipes with. I'm with Muller on this one. Jeanie, let's start with lyric. Joni said, >>He was sitting in the lounge of the Empire Hotel >>He was drinking for diversion >>He was thinking for himself Far from home, this guy is alone, drinking in a hotel lounge. *She* approaches him. >>She says, "Drinkin' alone's a shame >>It's a shame it's a crying shame." How often does a non-prostitute walk into a bar and strike up a conversation with a stranger who is drinking alone? She doesn't have anything to say except a cliche, which she says three times, in place of a *thoughtful* remark. >>"Hey honey, you've got lots of cash. >>Bring us 'round a bottle, >>We'll have some laughs." Jeanie, she wants some of his money. After the remark about hockey, it's the third thing she says to him. >>"Gin's what I'm drinking. >>I was raised on robbery." In recent conversations about this, I learned that hookers and strippers order clear drinks because the bartender actually serves them water. It's part of the arrangement so they can keep "working", eh? Next, there's a literary device called a "double entendre" which means the words have two intentions, two meanings. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_entendre There's an innocent meaning but also a vulgar or humorous meaning. Here's an example, in the form of a joke: "A blonde knockout walks into a bar. She asks the bartender for a Double Entendre... So he gave it to her." In this joke, "he gave it to her" has 2 meanings: 1.) It appears to mean that the bartender served the drink she ordered. 2.) The true meaning is derived from the setting. At the beginning of the joke, the customer is a "blonde knockout" which means that she's a sex object. Since she's a sex object, the punch line "he gave it to her" means that the bartender "serviced" her. Back to Joni, who said, >>I'm a pretty good "cook" >>I'm sitting on my groceries I put "cook" in quotes because she cooks with her hips. She's not offering tea & biscuits. She's sitting on her "goodies", her "groceries". >>Come up to my kitchen, I'll show you my best "recipe". >>I try and I try but I can't save a cent. >>I'm up after midnight, "cooking", >>trying to make my rent. >>Come home with me honey Cooks don't hustle customers in hotel bars. Hookers hustle customers in hotel bars. Jim L'Hommedieu the lyric is at: http://jonimitchell.com/musician/song.cfm?id=RaisedOnRobbery nj Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 22:31:32 -0400 From: Deb Messling Subject: hopeful girl in a dreamy dress I just read an article about The Fiddle and the Drum (it's just been added to the JMDL library) which says: "A recurring motif is provided by a little girl in a white dress who might represent our future, despite civilization's unchecked efforts to derail her innocence." So, I'm guessing the reference in the song Shine is to this girl. I'm eagerly awaiting reactions to the Bravo show from my lucky Canadian friends. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Deb Messling -^..^- dlmessling@rcn.com http://www.sensibleshoes.vox.com - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 22:22:47 -0400 From: "Mike & Alice Hicks" Subject: Shine/JC I've been off the list for almost a couple of years now, but had to get back to the "garden" to read reviews of Joni's latest. For me, Shine is a terriffic album. The songs blend beautifully in the order they are in, but could have been in any order and been just as good. I may have missed this post since I am tardy at signing back on, but does anyone think that in the title song "Shine on a hopeful girl in a dreamy dress" may have been referring to Joni herself? I get the feeling by looking at the picture on the page of the girl in the cd booklet that it is Joni standing there in her dancing attire. As soon as I heard this I got this eerie feeling of what all she could have meant by that line. And, I just wondered why she chose that picture to put in the booklet. I feel very strongly on this one. Does anyone else agree? And please tell me if this is old news to you guys, it won't hurt much. Feels real good to be back! "Good morning people. It's a new dawn." Mike(from S.C.) NPOMC: Foma-You've Killed Private Pyle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 00:44:26 -0400 From: "Eric Taylor" Subject: Re: BYT (2007) Marian Russell wrote: >> I *love* BYT on Shine. It's just terrific in so many ways: Joni's beautiful voice, new melodic ideas, very interesting instrumentation, great rhythm. I feel happy when I listen to it. It's not a song that has ever been a favorite of mine until now. It is a pleasant and unexpected surprise and IMO it's possibly one of the most creative reworking of one of her songs that she has ever done. Go, Joni! << YES Marian! I feel exactly the same about BYT2007. I've heard Joni play it about a dozen different ways and like this version by far the best. She does a masterful job with every amazing sound on this great song. How many pop stars today could write such a catchy tune, let alone play all the instruments? Answer: none. They're all exhausted in rehab. SHINE totally intoxicates me and there is not one weak song on this ********** album. The one-listen critics have their heads up their butts. I haven't been this excited about a new Joni release since Turbulent Indigo and this one surpasses all of my hopes and expectations. The Voice. The piano. The guitar. The lyrics. The phrasing. The total artistry!!! After 30 hearings I still rate it my favorite Joni album EVER. So that would make it my favorite album ever. Sorry if my overwhelming enthusiasm irritates some fans stuck on Hijera or Blue. Sometimes I feel embarrassed for sharing my strong opinions with total strangers worldwide but it also feels good to be in the company of people who relate to my love of Joni! ET "You see those lovely hills? They won't be there for long They're gonna tear them down and sell them to California... When this place is a moonscape don't tell me I didn't warn ya!" ~Joni 2007 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 01:51:10 -0400 From: "Eric Taylor" Subject: Re: Joy William Waddell shared: >> I find myself walking along streets and singing bits from Shine and realize Joni's in my head again, anew. Joy. I love Joni. Just absolutely love her. << I hear ya WW!!! Today I was finally able to harmonize to several Shine songs and belted them out the window of my car during constant rush hour. I adore having Joni's music and wisdom bouncing around my brain somehow turning the ugliness of our brutal world into total beauty. I share your love and it is so good to know that there are people out there who feel the same way! ET ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2007 #335 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)