From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2007 #318 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Monday, October 8 2007 Volume 2007 : Number 318 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Shine [Bob Muller ] Dutch video review of Shine [Bob Muller ] SV: SV: Too many people/too little land ["Marion Leffler" ] 2007's Big Yellow Taxi [jeannie ] Shine impressions [Michael ] Shine on Ela Gandhi [Patti Parlette ] BYT 2007 : the price to visit the tree museum [rian afriadi ] Re: BYT 2007 : the price to visit the tree museum ["Jerry Notaro" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 05:58:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Muller Subject: Re: Shine Hi Dan, welcome back, and thanks for your Shiny thoughts. Keep them coming. Bob NP: Ingrid Michaelson - --------------------------------- Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 07:35:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Muller Subject: Dutch video review of Shine Here's a short video review from my favorite country: http://www.vk.tv/video/14090/na-vijf-jaar-nieuwe-cd-joni-mitchell.html Here's a translation of what Dutch journalist Gijsbert Kamer is saying. "After Paul McCartney, Joni Mitchell has also decided to let Starbucks release her new CD's in America. Her comeback is indeed very special. Five years ago she said: I have had it with pop music, I am going to paint, to spend time alone with my family, I will not play again. On Shine, her first new CD in 5 years, it is especially kind hearted forth rippling music to set the tone. The jazzy chords that we are used to, ripple away nicely. Her voice has become darker, shows perhaps some rusty spots and I think she stays a bit too much flat in one pitch. Shine is beautiful, but a bit too good/respectable." Bob NP: Peter Case, "Ain't Gonna Worry No More" - --------------------------------- Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 17:30:03 +0200 From: "Marion Leffler" Subject: SV: SV: Too many people/too little land Dear Jeannie, thank you for your heart-warming words of encouragement! They lift up my spirits and make me realise that it doesn't do to run and hide because somebody got me wrong. It's just that I still feel some bad vibrations from the really bad exchange of words I had with a list member a couple of weeks ago, and I wouldn't ever want to be drawn into anything like that again. I love this list, and I do enjoy Monika's postings -- she is the last person I would want to feel upset about. So this misunderstanding made me sad but it's all cleared up now. Let's all shine on! Love, Marion - -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Fren: owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org] Fvr jeannie Skickat: den 7 oktober 2007 02:49 Till: motitan@aol.com; marionleffler@telia.com; joni@smoe.org Dmne: Re: SV: Too many people/too little land Oh, Dearest Marion, You're too right on to be misconstrued here on the JMDL. I meant to tell you days ago, after you felt livelier after that little bout of feeling sort of lowdown with the seasonal changes, that your Shine review was written and expressed so beautifully. You're gifted in so many ways, Marion. So, just don't ever give up your fight for the light, nor let yourself get dimmed. You're light years ahead of the game and I'm so glad you are here. Lovingly, Jeannie PS: Monika's one of the coolest of the coolest fair and tender, young maidens here on the JMDL and extremely intelligent. motitan@aol.com wrote: B Hey, all is well then.B I didn't mean to upset you but from what I read (oh how writing is so easily misconstrued) anything with anyone and Hitler in the same sentence (in any sort of relation) is never a good thing (especially when it comes to Joni!).B I realize you don't actually think Joni's thinking is like Hitler's but the one comment suggested some similarity so I just wanted some clarification.B B This is what a discussion list is for!B No hard feelings, much Joni love to you. - -Monika - -----Original Message----- From: Marion Leffler To: motitan@aol.com; joni@smoe.org Sent: Sat, 6 Oct 2007 2:07 pm Subject: SV: Too many people/too little land Hi Monika, ince I was the one who mentioned Hitler I have to clarify one major mportant thing here: I did not compare Joni's thinking to Hitler. What I aid was that some people might get the idea that reducing population would ave the earth, and that was what I compared to Hitler's cry for Lebensraum. elieve me, Monika, I do know German history! And I was very clear in my ost that I did not mean to say that Joni was suggesting something like hat. So this time you really did misunderstand me. I sure hope nobody else id, because if so, I will unsub because I couldn't stand the thought of nybody believing I compared Joni to Hitler. The sheer absurdity is psetting me. arion - -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- rC%n: owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org] FC6r otitan@aol.com kickat: den 6 oktober 2007 05:24 ill: joni@smoe.org mne: Too many people/too little land "There's just too many people now oo little land..." ? I can't find who it is my email folder but someone recently mentioned eing uneasy with this particular line.? A JMDL poster said it seemed like oni was?suggesting (unintentionally I suppose) some sort of population ontrol and compared Joni's?thinking in this line to what Hitler was trying o do.? I have to say I don't find this line far off the mark at all.? In act, there's a lot of truth in it.? We, as humans, keep reproducing at a asty, hasty rate, using up resources (especially limited one with such ase), building here, building there,?etc etc.? I don't think Joni was rying to suggest killing anyone off or any means of population control at ll.? She was simply stating?what she thought.?? And it's unfair to compare her thinking to Hitler.? Hitler wasn't trying o reduce the population.? He was trying to exterminate certain groups of eople while ENCOURAGING reproduction among others he found to be superior his Aryan race...I believe his goal was to have some x million German, ryan babies be born but the number was?closer to x hundred thousand or so). That's not the same at all.? Joni speaks the truth.? Hitler spoke from his wn twisted misconceptions. Monika??? ________________________________________________________________________ mail and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - ttp://mail.aol.com ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com - --------------------------------- Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 17:22:16 +0200 From: "Marion Leffler" Subject: SV: SV: Too many people/too little land Hi Monika, Alright, no hard feelings then. I know you didnt mean to upset me and maybe I was too sensitive but I just hate to be misunderstood because it makes it so hard to have a good discussion. And I really thought I had made myself clear. I love this list, though, and I usually enjoy your postings very much! So keep bringing it on:-) Marion _____ Fren: motitan@aol.com [mailto:motitan@aol.com] Skickat: den 6 oktober 2007 23:59 Till: marionleffler@telia.com; joni@smoe.org Dmne: Re: SV: Too many people/too little land Hey, all is well then. I didn't mean to upset you but from what I read (oh how writing is so easily misconstrued) anything with anyone and Hitler in the same sentence (in any sort of relation) is never a good thing (especially when it comes to Joni!). I realize you don't actually think Joni's thinking is like Hitler's but the one comment suggested some similarity so I just wanted some clarification. This is what a discussion list is for! No hard feelings, much Joni love to you. - -Monika - -----Original Message----- From: Marion Leffler To: motitan@aol.com; joni@smoe.org Sent: Sat, 6 Oct 2007 2:07 pm Subject: SV: Too many people/too little land Hi Monika, Since I was the one who mentioned Hitler I have to clarify one major important thing here: I did not compare Joni's thinking to Hitler. What I said was that some people might get the idea that reducing population would save the earth, and that was what I compared to Hitler's cry for Lebensraum. Believe me, Monika, I do know German history! And I was very clear in my post that I did not mean to say that Joni was suggesting something like that. So this time you really did misunderstand me. I sure hope nobody else did, because if so, I will unsub because I couldn't stand the thought of anybody believing I compared Joni to Hitler. The sheer absurdity is upsetting me. Marion - -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Fren: owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org ] Fvr motitan@aol.com Skickat: den 6 oktober 2007 05:24 Till: joni@smoe.org Dmne: Too many people/too little land "There's just too many people now Too little land..." ? I can't find who it is my email folder but someone recently mentioned being uneasy with this particular line.? A JMDL poster said it seemed like Joni was?suggesting (unintentionally I suppose) some sort of population control and compared Joni's?thinking in this line to what Hitler was trying to do.? I have to say I don't find this line far off the mark at all.? In fact, there's a lot of truth in it.? We, as humans, keep reproducing at a hasty, hasty rate, using up resources (especially limited one with such ease), building here, building there,?etc etc.? I don't think Joni was trying to suggest killing anyone off or any means of population control at all.? She was simply stating?what she thought.?? ? And it's unfair to compare her thinking to Hitler.? Hitler wasn't trying to reduce the population.? He was trying to exterminate certain groups of people while ENCOURAGING reproduction among others he found to be superior (his Aryan race...I believe his goal was to have some x million German, Aryan babies be born but the number was?closer to x hundred thousand or so). ? That's not the same at all.? Joni speaks the truth.? Hitler spoke from his own twisted misconceptions. - -Monika??? ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com _____ size=2 width="100%" align=center> Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail ! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 18:19:25 +0200 From: missblux@googlemail.com Subject: Billy influence? Listening to If I had a heart, does anyone else think Billy Holiday about the way she sings "We've set our lovely sky - our lovely sky - -..."? This is in the department for tiny little details I know.... Bn ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 18:01:19 +0200 From: missblux@googlemail.com Subject: shiny love songs Hey there, it just struck me: yes, I do miss the love songs, but then if I want to know anything about how Joni feels about love at this point in her life, she already gave it to us, abundantly I think, on Both Sides Now. I guess that is why that is one of my favourite Joni Mitchell albums. Of course she hides behind other artist's lyrics but her interpretations are extremely personal. Maybe she just thinks that that is all she wants to reveal about her personal affairs right now. Ah but what if next time she mixes the sentiment of BSN with the musicality of Shine. Just think about that! And THEN try to calm down... Bene Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 16:09:49 -0600 From: Robert Procyk Subject: shiny love songs Ok, i will comment here: it's not that I miss the love songs, per se, but the autobiographical stuff. You know, I have to say that while I love DED and the social commentary on that album, I am just getting tired of the whole "the world is a hell and everyone and everything is to blame." And I know that that is a sweeping statement, so please don't react to it. But what I mean is, I am not necessarily looking for songs of passionate love, but just maybe her take of love/sex/dating/relationships/solitude/whatever at this point of her life. And as I myself age and realize that I am closer to 40 than I am to 30 now, the lines from "Nothing Can Be Done" really hit home with me (I know most people, Muller included, hated that one), especially the "I am not old, I'm told/But I am not young" and the "must I surrender with grace what I loved when I was younger" bit. Anyway, after we have been privy to so much of her life through song, I'd love to h ear her thoughts and feel her emotions, especially now that she has lost her mother, and is single, and has a complicated relationship with her daughter, what regrets she has, what she looks forward to, and all of that. I know the world can be a hell. I know that some people are greedy and shallow. I know that the business sucks. But what about the rest of it? I think that is what I long for. Not so much the love songs, but the life songs. But she's at the piano again, so that almost makes up for it! Rob ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 15:15:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jerry Notaro" Subject: Annie Lennox Want to plug Annie Lennox's new cd, Songs of Mass Destruction. It is sensational. If you like her, get it. Much better than her last, Bare. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 13:55:21 -0700 (PDT) From: jeannie Subject: 2007's Big Yellow Taxi I'm not going to comment yet how I unbelievably love and enjoy this version, immensely. For the first time, just a few minutes ago, I decided to peek into the album's booklet, just to see what all instrumentation was used in the making of this incredibly beautiful, Big Yellow Taxi. Joni did all instruments by herself. This song will now be considered by me, the No. 1 song of all of my life, the most joyful one I've ever had the pleasure to listen to, which makes me the happiest inside---even when I get frustrated with the creatures and I scream at them, "Get down off of there," like Joni did in the song, 'Centerpiece,' from The Hissing Of Summer Lawns album, it has never failed to switch me from pissy over to some super-dooper joyful Joni juke box dives. Can one of the maestros please tell me exactly what instrumentation was used in this masterpiece by Joni--my musical centerpiece that stays forever young and eternally beautiful and like Hana, never gives up! jeannie PS: I still need to take a vacation to skate down a river with Herbie Hancock. For now, I'm still flying with the birds and the bees and Joni Mitchell!! - --------------------------------- Check out the hottest 2008 models today at Yahoo! Autos. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 21:31:02 +0000 From: Michael Subject: Shine impressions I am finally among the initiated - my partner forund a copy of Shine in a local record shop and offered it to me for my birthday. Overall I enjoy it lots. I was surprised by the staccato feeling and repetition of many of the rhythms, as in One Week Last Summer. Joni's chord progressions on the piano sound very different to me on this album. It's like she has resolved something within herself. I sense less longing and restlessness in the music. Despite the darkness of some of the lyrics, the music overall is actually very soothing, like a balm over a wound. If I were to critique, I can't say I care for the synthy and staccato sound of some of the arrangements - it would have been so much more beautiful with a string quartet or something similar, but I have come to expect that Joni always delivers a new sound with each of her albums, and this one is no exception. The only song I'm not wild about is Hana, all the rest are just fine. She saved the best for last as the album progresses. If is classic Joni at her finest. And I love the new BYT - the music is great fun. Below is just a teaser from the Globe & Mail review of the album. It was free a few weeks back, but now we must pay per view. As I recall, it was not an overly enthusiastic review, although Green is a big fan. ROBERT EVERETT-GREEN Globe and Mail Update SHINE Joni MitchellHear Music/Starbucks**Anger makes some people articulate and active, while others lapse into blocked silence. Joni Mitchell has known both sides in her reactions to what we're doing to the Earth. Her first album of new songs after almost a decade of silence finds words for the problem, and some of them are powerful. Michael in Quebec _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself with free Messenger emoticons. Get them today! http://www.freemessengeremoticons.ca/?icid=EMENCA122 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 21:31:58 +0000 From: Patti Parlette Subject: Shine on Ela Gandhi Dear Joniamigos: Last Thursday I attended: "The Crises of the 21st Century - Some Gandhian Solutions," a lecture delivered by Ela Gandhi, peace activist and granddaughter of Mahatma (Sanskrit, I think, for "Great Soul") Gandhi. She carries his torch, but unfortunately you don't see it very often. I thought some of you might have the urge for going with me, so I took some notes. I daresay Joni would have jumped up from her seat and clapped very hard at the end of this talk. I was really looking forward to this lecture and got there half an hour early, so as not to be denied a seat. When I arrived at the Student Union the vestibule was PACKED and I was afraid it was overflow, lost and lonely ones trying to get in. Thankfully, they hadn't opened the doors yet. Phew! I didn't want to have to resort to violent action to get into a lecture on non-violence! Lots of pretty people there, of all ages. I saw a lot of peace symbols on pocketbooks and notebooks and backpacks, and a t-shirt on a young man that made me smile: the peace symbol, with the words "Back by popular demand." Ms. Gandhi outlined ten crises (breakdowns) of this century: 1. Very limited access to information; information control (subjugation of knowledge, selective information). 2. Power of the media over our thinking and behavior (encourages violence, pornography, etc.). 3. Development of prejudices (learned from society and media; xenophobia leads to war and the loss of humanity). 4. Nature of our education (there has been a shift from the humanistic development of body, mind & soul to a technological approach by technocrats with little knowledge of humanity ("Frankenstein technologies"). We need more non-violence programs in primary school-level curricula. 5. Consumerism (high pressure marketing to buy, buy, buy and make as much money as we can) ("...Money, money, money... Money makes the trees come down It makes mountains into molehills Big money kicks the wide wide world around....") 6. Environmental issues (get new "stuff", discard old stuff, the need for armaments to protect our goods) ("...Too much rage and desire It makes you feel so feeble now It's so out of hand..."). 7. Globalization (can be good and bad; the world is now a village, but resources are controlled). 8. Dehumanization (compassion, empathy, unconditional love and undivided attention are scarce today). 9. Violence, terror and warfare (use the stick) ("Strong and wrong!"). We need right over might, she says. 10. Patriarchy more and more entrenched (despite a strong feminist movement, lives have not been improved; women still do "double shifts"). She spoke of the spiral of violence over and over again, and how a third party of innocents is led into war thinking they are patriotic citizens and who suffer great physical and psychological harm. ("Shine on dying soldiers In patriotic pain") and that we need to have passion for the causes of non-violence, dignity, human rights, greening, self-sufficiency, the "whole person", truth, peace, justice, and love. She ended, in her soft spoken way, by saying: "The future is in your hands." One woman about my age stood up with the question (that had already formed in my heart and mind): "I have been to marches and vigils and signed petitions and called my legislators but nothing seems to change. What else can we do?" I was hoping for an easy answer, but of course there is none. No Mighty Mouse or Superman. Ms. Gandhi replied: "Increase the number of people who will stand up with you. Take power in your hands. Yes, it is frustrating, but continue! The force is inside you. Accept the suffering that comes from this work. Don't lose hope!" Of course, that made me think of: If you can force your heart And nerve and sinew To serve you After all of them are gone And so hold on When there is nothing in you Nothing but the will That's telling you to hold on! Hold on! and Hana says when life's a drag Don't cave in Don't put up a white flag Raise up A white banner In this manner- Straighten your back Dig in your heals And get a good grip on your grief! Hana says, "Don't get me wrong This is no simple Sunday song Where God or Jesus comes along And they save ya." You've got to be braver than that You tackle the beast alone With all its tenacious teeth! Light the lamp. And you know there are many more Joni lyrics to support Ms. Gandhi's vision. The lecture was both sides now. Hope and hopelessness. Bad dreams are good in the great plan, I guess, if you can "hold on!" and keep hearing Joni inspire us with words like this: Cause you've got the fight You've got the insight You've got the fight You've got the insight Love, Patti P. P.S. Inspired by these two great women, I share two good websites; And I'm sending you out This signal here I hope you can pick it up Loud and clear http://iraqmoratorium.org/ If you click on "see who's signed the petition" on the right, you can look for people you know in your state who have signed the pledge. If you sort by location, you can see me in Mansfield CT, a broadcasting tower, waving for you! and www.imaginepeace.com now has a video message from Dennis Kuchinich. Please share these websites with like-minded people. You won't see these things on your TV screen or in the newspapers these days. It's up to us to spread the word. Merci beaucoup! http://media.www.dailycampus.com/media/storage/paper340/news/2007/10/05/News/Ela-Gandhi.Tells.Of.Apartheid.Struggle-3015031.shtml _________________________________________________________________ Peek-a-boo FREE Tricks & Treats for You! http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 17:32:22 -0700 (PDT) From: rian afriadi Subject: BYT 2007 : the price to visit the tree museum 37 years ago, the tree museum charged $1.5 to see the trees now joni says that the three museum charges an arm and a leg what does it mean? inflation huh? - --------------------------------- Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 20:43:19 -0400 From: "Richard Flynn" Subject: RE: 2007's Big Yellow Taxi Umm. I think it's a synthesizer (maybe synthesizer and guitar). Glad you like it. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of jeannie Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 4:55 PM To: joni@smoe.org Subject: 2007's Big Yellow Taxi Can one of the maestros please tell me exactly what instrumentation was used in this masterpiece by Joni--my musical centerpiece that stays forever young and eternally beautiful and like Hana, never gives up! - --------------------------------- Check out the hottest 2008 models today at Yahoo! Autos. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 21:03:50 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jerry Notaro" Subject: Re: BYT 2007 : the price to visit the tree museum rian afriadi wrote: > 37 years ago, the tree museum charged $1.5 to see the trees > > now joni says that the three museum charges an arm and a leg > > what does it mean? > > inflation huh? > She's changed the price several times of the years. I remember her once saying 25 bucks in a recording. Shows her passion to stay contemporary and her disdain for keeping things stagnant. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 22:22:58 -0700 (PDT) From: jeannie Subject: RE: 2007's Big Yellow Taxi Hello, Richard. I don't know much about synthesizers because it reminds me of that Madonna, post disco days, pop tart sound. But with Joni, it all flows out in such exquisite beauty, that I forget. Today, my son was explaining to me about Joni's work with Thomas Dolby on Dog Eat Dog, telling me things I didn't know. That's his favorite album. He likes the synthesizer sound. Does the synthesizer make the accordian sound on BYT? Or is that a harmonica? I feel so dumb asking these questions, but that sound is so new to Joni's music and I love it! I love the whole new arrangement. I can't believe Joni's genius when it comes to creation. jeannie PS: Thanks, Maestro! Richard Flynn wrote: Umm. I think it's a synthesizer (maybe synthesizer and guitar). Glad you like it. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of jeannie Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 4:55 PM To: joni@smoe.org Subject: 2007's Big Yellow Taxi Can one of the maestros please tell me exactly what instrumentation was used in this masterpiece by Joni--my musical centerpiece that stays forever young and eternally beautiful and like Hana, never gives up! - --------------------------------- Check out the hottest 2008 models today at Yahoo! Autos. - --------------------------------- Check out the hottest 2008 models today at Yahoo! Autos. ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2007 #318 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)