From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2006 #301 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Sunday, October 22 2006 Volume 2006 : Number 301 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Joni and God...? [Benedicte Nielsen ] Re: Joni and God...? [J Kendel Johnson ] RE: Real or fake? [J Kendel Johnson ] Older recording artists ["Gerald A. Notaro" ] Re: Older recording artists ["Gerald A. Notaro" ] real or fake ["Marianne Rizzo" ] STAS ["Marianne Rizzo" ] STAS ["Marianne Rizzo" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Oct 2006 11:46:37 +0100 From: Benedicte Nielsen Subject: Joni and God...? Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2006 03:01:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Alice Brown Subject: Re: Justice in our own hands NJC Hi JoniBuds, Benedicte wrote: >What confuses me about the US is that it seems to me that it is the > same > section of the population which is on the one hand anti-abortionist and > fundamentally Christian and on the other pro-death penalty. How do > these > things come together? I validate your confusion about this. After all, isn't god/jesus love? No!!!!! Remember that I am an atheist, so when I'm critical of god/jesus, I am only criticising a myth. But the god in the O.T., N.T., and Koran, is not loving. He says he is. But his ACTIONS show contempt for humanity, a disregard for human feelings, human life, animal life, and moral accoutability. He violated most of the ten commandments: murdered 10s of thousands of people including "civilians: women and children, stealing (pilfering), divorced Israel, covets the worship and love of humans, and "lies" says he's merciful and compassionate, but destroyed and crippled thousands for their disobidence and will torture most people forever because they don't accept his "love." So, is it any wonder that his followers talk and push for "moral values" while showing a disregard for human feelings and human life?? Makes all the sense in the "world" to me, oun intended. That's why our mostly religious world is about to destroy itself. Love, Alice P.S. The ten commandments that he didn't violate all have to do with worshiping and loving him above all else. He does a perfect job of that! - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Alice! You are trying to get into trouble here! In any case, I guess he only became the God of Love after he had Jesus. The miracle of parenthood...! Is there anything we know about JM and religion? I was surprised when I heard The Sire of Sorrow / Job's Sad Song and God must be a Boogie Man (which I don't understand), because I hadn't noticed any religious references in anything else she'd written. I guess that and too much big band is where I get a bit turned off, to be honest. Not over the fact that she would be religious, it's the singing about it. Have a nice Saturday all over! Benedicte NP: Black Rebel Motorcycle Club "Gospel song" (just remembered that some people can sing about jesus without sounding cheasy) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2006 05:52:06 -0700 (PDT) From: J Kendel Johnson Subject: Re: Joni and God...? Benedicte Nielsen wrote: Is there anything we know about JM and religion? I was surprised when I heard The Sire of Sorrow / Job's Sad Song and God must be a Boogie Man (which I don't understand), because I hadn't noticed any religious references in anything else she'd written. I guess that and too much big band is where I get a bit turned off, to be honest. Not over the fact that she would be religious, it's the singing about it. Joni perhaps alluded to her state of personal religious beliefs in The Same Situation (C&S): So I sent up my prayer Wondering where it had to go With heaven full of astronauts And the Lord on death row and So I sent up my prayer Wondering who was there to hear... But in the SEVERAL instances later in which she adapts Biblical text for lyrics, they're employed as social commentary and metaphor, due to their profound place in Western culture -- like the passages she also draws on from Shakespeare and Yeats -- not a sharing of any personal religious beliefs. God Must Be A Boogie Man was adapted from text in Charles Mingus' autobiography during Joni's collaboration with him at the end of his life. I've always taken it as a painting of the dichotomy of life experience -- the successes, the trials and tribulations -- and the breadth of behavior possible for even just one man (person), and, stepping back from that painting, taking in the reality, and saying, if this is the way things go, God must be a boogie man! It think it's also a simple, meant-to-shock (many) on first appearance, and humorously ironic way of saying life's downsides -- old age, sickness, death and loss -- suck! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2006 06:29:48 -0700 (PDT) From: J Kendel Johnson Subject: RE: Real or fake? I just looked at the additional pics in the eBay seller's listing and got out my LP cover and compared. I was hopeful that the seller had a study done by Joni, but, comparing the exection of several sections -- the flowers, in particular -- it doesn't look like a study done with the same facility, inclination or style as the artist (Joni) that did the cover of JM. (I hate calling it STAS). Not even a younger Joni. I think it looks like a study done by another artist -- who knows when? I haven't read every entry about this. Have any art instructors, art historians, or other professionals weighed in on this? J "P. Henry" wrote: (My correspondence with the seller, so far...) Hi Jane, I am a member of the Joni Mitchell group where you are undoubtedly getting most of your questions about this item from It's getting a lot of airplay on our mailing list. You just might strike it rich with this one. Imagine my surprise when I was looking over the details on your auction page and noticed that, although you give your location as Bakersfield, your zip code, or the person who actually has the print, is mine also, right here in Tamuning, Guam! How about that? So... I was wondering if it would be possible somehow to see it or even scan it into a jpeg firsthand. Putting extra pics up was a good move but it might be worth your while to scan it yourself and post it full size on your auction as there is a raging discussion going on right now and, as I'm sure you've noticed, you are getting a LOT of traffic on it. It's intriguing for us Joni fans as it could just be a copy by someone or it might just be an original first-draft one-of-a-kind must-have history piece. Cheers, Pat - --------------- Thanks so very much for the info Pat but I have no clue how to scan it to the computer like that or I would. I had no clue this would make such a fuss. I have no way of telling if it's an original of hers or a good copy by a fan???? I will try to do the scan thing but I dont think it will fit on my scanner, can that hurt it? Jane - --------------- Thanks for responding Jane, I appreciate it. It sounds like it will be some hassle for you but the best would be if you could scan it (no it shouldn't hurt it if you're gentle) in sections like you did the pics and then pay for 'supersize' images on your setup. Heck, you've already sold it for $20 and I bet there will be a showdown at the end. It would be worth the trouble in dollars and cents, I'm sure, since it already is. I have sold a few things myself and, IMO, those supersize scans could definitely mean money in your pocket. BTW, I am one of those who think this just might be the real deal. Again, thanks for writing me back. Regards, Pat ps - What about that zip code? Are you really here on Guam? - -- "The last time I saw Joni was Detroit in '68..." http://www.angelfire.com/pq2/phenryboland/ - -- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2006 10:05:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gerald A. Notaro" Subject: Older recording artists Despite Joni's diatribes about the music industry, and following Dylan's entry into the #1 album spot, this week's Top 5 include Tony Bennett, Jimmy Buffett, and Rod Stuart. She better get into the studio quickly to ride the latest wave! Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2006 10:16:19 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gerald A. Notaro" Subject: Re: Older recording artists That would be STEWART! Gerald A. Notaro wrote: > Despite Joni's diatribes about the music industry, and following Dylan's > entry into the #1 album spot, this week's Top 5 include Tony Bennett, > Jimmy Buffett, and Rod Stuart. She better get into the studio quickly to > ride the latest wave! > > Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2006 21:36:58 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: real or fake I think y'all should bid on this just in case. : -) I think maybe I am not seeing something right, but I printed out the part of the drawing (on ebay) that has the "joni MIthcell" on it . . and I cannot find it written like that on the album cover. . I mean, it is written on the album cover. . but not in the same shape. but, like I said, I just think I am missing something . . or something Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2006 20:39:49 +1000 (ChST) From: "P. Henry" Subject: RE: Real or fake? Richard wrote: "I compared the printed lettering and the art on the album cover (remember those?) to the picture on ebay, and I am at least 95% certain that it's a fake." Why? - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2006 20:44:24 +1000 (ChST) From: "P. Henry" Subject: RE: Real or fake? Kakki wrote: "FAKE. Fakety, fake, fake fake!" mmm... yeah... I guess I just want to believe. :) heh heh : -) _________________________________________________________________ Get FREE company branded e-mail accounts and business Web site from Microsoft Office Live http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2006 22:05:25 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: STAS Isn't it beautiful how we are talking about cover of Song to a Seagul? and the songs on Song to a Seagul ? How lovely. (I think you did this Les) From: "Richard Flynn" Subject: Nostalgia was [RE: Real or fake?] You know, I must be dated! I still love that cover. I can vividly remember going down to the "Soul Shack" at 12th & G in DC specifically to buy the record (I was 13 at the time and had gotten my D-28 in January as a combination birthday/Christmas gift from my parents). There used to be little classified ads in the back of _Sing Out_ magazine advertising lead sheets for Joni Mitchell songs from Gandalf Music. (I sent away for some lead sheets, but they never arrived.) I had heard Ian & Sylvia and Tom Rush and Buffy Sainte-Marie and Judy Collins's versions of Joni's songs. I don't remember how I heard the album was coming out, but I was there to buy it on the day of its release. After listening to it countless times, I decided to figure out some songs--I think I began with "Cactus Tree"--and I realized I had to detune my guitar, so I taught myself open D and open G, playing, I'm sure, approximations of her arrangements--it was all by ear. In a very short time, some older friends started trotting me out at local coffee houses. "Here's this young boy who plays Joni Mitchell songs." I remember one girl (she was 18 and I was 14) who took me to play at DC's Iguana Coffee House off Thomas Circle. Under her and her boyfriend's wing I also attended a Pete Seeger fundraiser for the DC (Dow Chemical) 9--also in a church--how progressive and friendly churches were to me in my youth! Anyway, when I look at the cover of STAS, I experience Proustian epiphanies--I can never look at it with even an ounce of irony. Perhaps it's arrested development, but Joni Mitchell has been my personal soundtrack since I was a child. I've been doing my own serious writing for most of today and guess I was on a roll when I decided to post here--forgive the length. Richard _________________________________________________________________ Stay in touch with old friends and meet new ones with Windows Live Spaces http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwsp0070000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://spaces.live.com/spacesapi.aspx?wx_action=create&wx_url=/friends.aspx&mkt=en-us ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2006 22:08:49 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: STAS So now I am wondering. . . . How did it go that the album Song to a Seagull is also called "Joni MItchell." Did it not officially have a title? Because it was her first album. . was it called Joni Mitchell? ~ _________________________________________________________________ Try the next generation of search with Windows Live Search today! http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&source=hmtagline ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2006 #301 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)