From: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2005 #244 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Saturday, August 27 2005 Volume 2005 : Number 244 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: "Fountain of Sorrow"? [Jamie Zubairi ] Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... [Catherine McKay ] Re: Joni and Younger Musicians (SJC?) [Patti Witten ] Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... ["Bree Mcdonough" ] joni fest in winnipeg [mags h ] Fountain of Sorrow (SJC) ["Lindsay Moon" ] Re: "Fountain of Sorrow"? [kate@katebennett.com] Re:Re: "Fountain of Sorrow"? [Warrenkeith91354@aol.com] Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... [Monafitz@aol.com] Re: New Library addition: 'Five Grossest Song Lyrics of All Time' [Bob Mu] Joni And Jackson: the plot thickens ["Richard Flynn" Subject: Re: "Fountain of Sorrow"? For me what links this song to Joni is the refrain in the background of towards the end (you have to turn it up really loud) "Help me I think I'm falling in love again..." towards the end? ;-) hee hee - --- Smurf wrote: > "Fountain" isn't listed in JoniMitchell.com's list > of > songs about Joni: > > << > http://www.jonimitchell.com/ListsInspiredByInspiredByJMYear.htm > >> > > I can easily see why anyone would think it's about > Joni, though, with lyrics like "running of in search > of a perfect stranger" and even the single word > "sorrow!" > > The lyrics: ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 06:46:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... - --- Les Irvin wrote: > Regarding the just-added article to the Library, I > have just two comments: > > "Huh??" > > and > > "What the...?" > > I hope you all 'enjoy' it as much as I did. > > http://www.jmdl.com/library/view.cfm?id=1332 > > Puzzled, > Les > I'm equally puzzled. I'm not sure the guy necessarily understands what the word "gross" means. He got paid to write that? Scratching my head... Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- __________________________________________________________ Find your next car at http://autos.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:47:15 +0100 From: "Azeem" Subject: RE: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... I had quite a strong reaction to this collection of puerile and asinine observations, which certainly doesn't merit the name "article". It's the sort of thing a twelve-year-old boy with his first access to a computer and the web would churn out, sniggering to himself like Butthead. And this would still be forgivable if it were funny, which to my eyes it ain't. Rob Rabiee should consider himself lucky that his pathetic scribblings are being archived anywhere. Azeem in London NP: the Fourth Test Match - England holding their own! - -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.15/81 - Release Date: 24/08/2005 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:54:58 -0400 From: Patti Witten Subject: Re: Joni and Younger Musicians (SJC?) Sherelle > The main thing I try to impart is that no one is going to "give" > you anything. It is not required. You must create your own buzz and forge > your own destiny. To give the artist a sense of self-sufficiency is the best > thing I could ever do for someone. More than fiscal success, I prefer to see > "emotional success" where someone stands and says with pride, "I am a > musician" or "I am a singer/songwriter".< Kate > I agree. I think when someone asks us for help the best thing we can do > is share our experience. We can't do any more. I don't think Joni ever > enjoyed the biz part of music (as an artist, who does?). Yes, experience is key. When I was just starting out as a solo singer-songwriter, I went to a small concert given by Suzy Roche. She and I are not that far apart in age, but she's a veteran in the folkworld; if you know the Roche's history, you know what I mean. She almost winced when I told her I wanted to "be like her," saying, "I wouldn't wish this business on my worst enemy." I now realize what a huge favor she did me when after actually listening to the CD that I gave her, she wrote me a letter (not email) telling me she love my voice and wishing me well. That validation made a huge impression on me. (I've been a slut for validation ever since! LOL.) But the caution was just as strong. A good role model for encouragement: realistic yet warm. Still waiting to hear from Joni, who was handed my CD by a friend, at a gallery opening in CA the same year. Patti - -- Patti Witten on I-Town Records www.itownrecords.com MySpace http://myspace.com/pattiwitten http://pattiwitten.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 08:10:56 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni and Younger Musicians (SJC?) The Roches' Christmas album is without peer. They are extraordinary talents. Jerry > Yes, experience is key. When I was just starting out as a solo > singer-songwriter, I went to a small concert given by Suzy Roche. She and I > are not that far apart in age, but she's a veteran in the folkworld; if you > know the Roche's history, you know what I mean. She almost winced when I > told her I wanted to "be like her," saying, "I wouldn't wish this business > on my worst enemy." I now realize what a huge favor she did me when after > actually listening to the CD that I gave her, she wrote me a letter (not > email) telling me she love my voice and wishing me well. That validation > made a huge impression on me. (I've been a slut for validation ever since! > LOL.) But the caution was just as strong. A good role model for > encouragement: realistic yet warm. Still waiting to hear from Joni, who was > handed my CD by a friend, at a gallery opening in CA the same year. > > Patti ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 08:50:50 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... I agree. I don't think he is being serious, but trying to get attention. Much like when Muller makes those fart noises under his arm. Jerry :) > He's a joker. Little bit of adolescent silliness to try and be funny and > look smart. > > Mark E. in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 06:22:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... OMG I want to kick his butt! I guess he doesn't know much about Joni's guitar accomplishments - alternate tunings, etc. That boy needs to LEARN!!!!!!! lol..... Em < wrote: > Regarding the just-added article to the Library, I have just two > comments: > > "Huh??" > > and > > "What the...?" > > I hope you all 'enjoy' it as much as I did. > > http://www.jmdl.com/library/view.cfm?id=1332 > > Puzzled, > Les ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:50:09 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... TIE HIS BUTT DOWN AND MAKE HIS LISTEN TO HEJIRA! >--- Les Irvin wrote: > > > Regarding the just-added article to the Library, I > > have just two comments: > > > > "Huh??" > > > > and > > > > "What the...?" > > > > I hope you all 'enjoy' it as much as I did. > > > > http://www.jmdl.com/library/view.cfm?id=1332 > > > > Puzzled, > > Les > > > >I'm equally puzzled. I'm not sure the guy necessarily >understands what the word "gross" means. > >He got paid to write that? > >Scratching my head... > > >Catherine >Toronto >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >__________________________________________________________ >Find your next car at http://autos.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:55:17 -0400 From: "Yoda, Jedi Master, Esq." Subject: Neil Young as Joni's archivist Good news / bad news here. Good news: Mr. Young, in addition to being a fine songwriter and musician, also "hears" well. When CD was new, he said something like, "it sounds like thousands of tiny ice pellets hitting your face." In my opinion, he'd be a good caretaker of the existing sound quality. Bad news: 1 Mr. Young is still writing. 2 Mr. Young is still recording. 3 Mr. Young tours occasionally. 4 Mr. Young was sidelined last year. 5 So, in his SPARE TIME, he can work on his own rarities. 6 As mentioned, Joni's project is in queue behind Neil's. So, I guess I'm gonna enjoy the "1/2 full glass" I have in front of me: the audience records, the JMDL video trees, and (maybe) Neil Young's new album. np: Harry's House / Centerpiece on our Beloved singer-songwriter station, WNKU. How often do you hear Joni's jazz on the radio where you live? On the all-request show, he has 3 requests for Joni, none of them from me. >At one point Joni came up in the conversation, and he said that he was the archivist for all her audio works, and that he was going to be working with Joni and Larry AFTER he had finished the Neil project.< Jim Covington, KY - ---------------------------------- "The only things we own are the moments. Everything else is like a book borrowed from the library: it will all be returned." Karin Berquist of 'Over The Rhine' - ---------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:12:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... hi Bree, I agree that Hejira would be good to let him know Joni does have other than cornball content to offer. Hejira is way "dry", right? But as far as guitar work.... I'm thinking father back..(maybe even LOTC) has neat guitar stuff. Even picking strings! me likey.... :) happy Friday, Em - --- Bree Mcdonough wrote: > TIE HIS BUTT DOWN AND MAKE HIS LISTEN TO HEJIRA! > > > > >--- Les Irvin wrote: > > > > > Regarding the just-added article to the Library, I > > > have just two comments: > > > > > > "Huh??" > > > > > > and > > > > > > "What the...?" > > > > > > I hope you all 'enjoy' it as much as I did. > > > > > > http://www.jmdl.com/library/view.cfm?id=1332 > > > > > > Puzzled, > > > Les > > > > > > >I'm equally puzzled. I'm not sure the guy necessarily > >understands what the word "gross" means. > > > >He got paid to write that? > > > >Scratching my head... > > > > > >Catherine > >Toronto > >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >__________________________________________________________ > >Find your next car at http://autos.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 08:30:56 -0700 (PDT) From: mags h Subject: joni fest in winnipeg the dust is finally settling down, hey it's not my turn to dust LOL oh yea .. the winnipeg fest... well Ive been tossing this idea around and not sure how to do it. I know I dont have the whateverittakes to pull it off ... um, so Im thinking of asking if anyone is interested in attending the Winnipeg Folk Festival and then we can do some jammin' in an informal way from there. THis is THE best folk festival in the country, so it is said, has been going strong for many, many years. check out the site; as i think i've posted this before but perhaps it was missed.... www.winnipegfolkfestival.ca mind you, it's not as extensive as it once was but keep watching for changes...the 2006 line ups will be posted before you know it, speaking of which, any of you who are interested CAN apply to perform. There's info on that on the site, I think. It starts on the Thursday evening and then continues on until Sunday night. This year's festival included Daniel Lanois and Emmylou Harris, both of which were spectacular, even if the oncoming crazystorm did scare many of us away. The location is gorgeous and there is a camp ground...and if that doesnt turn your crank, there's lots of alternatives. this is a long way off, but you know how time flies when you are having fun....how I would dearly love to see this come to life. You never know...seems that anything is possible... Winnipeg is a great city, only 700,000 people however, music and art are fully supported in big ways here...lots of things to do and see too... ask Richard Flynn, he was here in June and he can tell you all about the Golden Boy ;-)) love, Mags - --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:59:50 -0700 From: "Lindsay Moon" Subject: Fountain of Sorrow (SJC) The lyrics: Looking through some photographs I found inside a drawer I was taken by a photograph of you There were one or two I know that you would have liked a little more But they didnt show your spirit quite as true You were turning round to see who was behind you And I took your childish laughter by surprise And at the moment that my camera happened to find you There was just a trace of sorrow in your eyes Now the things that I remember seem so distant and so small Though it hasnt really been that long a time What I was seeing wasnt what was happening at all Although for a while, our path did seem to climb But when you see through loves illusions, there lies the danger And your perfect lover just looks like a perfect fool So you go running off in search of a perfect stranger While the loneliness seems to spring from your life Like a fountain from a pool Fountain of sorrow, fountain of light Youve known that hollow sound of your own steps in flight Youve had to hide sometimes, but now youre all right And its good to see your smiling face tonight Now for you and me it may not be that hard to reach our dreams But that magic feeling never seems to last And while the futures there for anyone to change, still you know its seems It would be easier sometimes to change the past Im just one or two years and a couple of changes behind you In my lessons at loves pain and heartache school Where if you feel too free and you need something to remind you Theres this loneliness springing up from your life Like a fountain from a pool Fountain of sorrow, fountain of light Youve known that hollow sound of your own steps in flight Youve had to hide sometimes but now youre all right And its good to see your smiling face tonight Fountain of sorrow, fountain of light Youve known that hollow sound of your own steps in flight Youve had to struggle, youve had to fight To keep understanding and compassion in sight You could be laughing at me, youve got the right But you go on smiling so clear and so bright "Late for the Sky" by Jackson Browne to me was one of those flawless albums. I haven't listened to it in years but just reading those lyrics gave me goosebumps. The title track without fail caught in my throat at the same place every time and would probably do so if I heard it again. Several of the lyrics in Fountain have always made me think (completely guess) it's about Joni: I'm just one or two years and a couple of changes behind you (as I recall, Jackson was the young punk among the So Cal bunch of musicians he hung out with, Joni, the Eagles, etc., and Joni had been through quite a lot by the time she was on tour with JB) ... love's pain and heartache school (Blue album. Pain and Heartache University ... hmm, title for an album? 'university' very hard to rhyme with though) You've had to hide sometimes You've had to struggle, you've had to fight (the pre-FTR self-imposed seclusion and the several times she left stages mid concert) ... to keep understanding and compassion in sight (I always thought it was compassionate sight but then I thought the Steely Dan lyric of 'The Cuervo Gold, the fine Columbian" was "the Cuervo Gold, the pine cone ambiance." (Guess I'm off that discussion list ...) (How she writes every one of her songs) It was just my own musings but it's my story and I'm sticking with it. And it's sad to think that *if* the song was written with her in mind the falling out the two have since come to. Lindsay ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:06:34 -0700 (PDT) From: kate@katebennett.com Subject: Re: "Fountain of Sorrow"? smurf>>I can easily see why anyone would think it's about Joni, though, with lyrics like "running of in search of a perfect stranger" and even the single word "sorrow!" < hmmm... interesting thought, reading the lyrics it certainly could be about joni... and there is also "But when you see through loves illusions, there lies the danger" and there is this (is joni older than jackson? i think so...): "Im just one or two years and a couple of changes behind you: ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 17:37:49 EDT From: Warrenkeith91354@aol.com Subject: Re:Re: "Fountain of Sorrow"? This is totally Joni, I can't imagine it being anyone else! He captures her essence in those lyrics! Being aware of their history together I have got to say Joni, Joni, Joni!!! Jonily Yours, Warren Keith Smurf writes: "Fountain" isn't listed in JoniMitchell.com's list of songs about Joni: << http://www.jonimitchell.com/ListsInspiredByInspiredByJMYear.htm >> I can easily see why anyone would think it's about Joni, though, with lyrics like "running of in search of a perfect stranger" and even the single word "sorrow!" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 20:20:19 EDT From: Monafitz@aol.com Subject: Re: Things that make you go hmmmmm.... In a message dated 8/26/2005 1:23:32 AM Eastern Daylight Time, LesIrvin@jmdl.com writes: Regarding the just-added article to the Library, I have just two comments: "Huh??" and "What the...?" Puzzled, Les Don't be puzzled Les, Darwin was wrong, that's all. No doubt Mr. Rabiee is brachiating across the room now, working on his next article. Cheers, Mona Mona A. Fitzgerald, JD Windsor, CT 06095 USA ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 17:41:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Muller Subject: Re: New Library addition: 'Five Grossest Song Lyrics of All Time' I suppose you have to include this in your database just as I have to include some of my covers, but boy it sure is a terrible article. When he says: "Hey Joni, Joni: put away the Mel Bay Guitar Method -- Vol 1 chord chart and go head an overpriced co-op or something." He REALLY shows his ignorance - Joni's entire CAREER (which will be remembered long after the worms have made a meal out of him) is driven by an 'anti-Mel Bay' attitude. And like Catherine says, Joni's lyric is not even that gross. Why not pick a more obvious one like "snot is running down his nose, greasy fingers smearing shabby clothes"? (And don't think I'm dissing that J.Tull lyric; I'm not - it's a classic and sets the tone for the song. But it's a WHOLE lot grosser than DDT on apples, isn't it? Bob NP: Kevin Johansen, "So Lazy" - --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:03:25 -0400 From: "Richard Flynn" Subject: Joni And Jackson: the plot thickens After reading the thread on Fountain of Sorrow, I decided to write to Russ Paris who maintains the most excellent Jackson Browne fansite, which is well worth a visit: http://www.jrp-graphics.com/jackson_browne.html Here is our correspondence: > - - - - - ORIGINAL MESSAGE - - - - - > On Aug 26, 2005, at 1:52 PM, Richard Flynn wrote: > >> Dear Russ, >> >> What fabulous Jackson Browne fansite you maintain-I've used it many >> times. My question is: I'm a member of the Joni Mitchell discussion >> list and one of the people who works on its website >> http://www.jmdl.com . Currently members are speculating whether or >> not "Fountain of Sorrow" was written about Joni Mitchell. It seems >> biographically plausible, but I wondered if you could shed any light >> on the discussion, since you are obviously a real expert on JB. I've >> been a fan of him and his music since the first lp (my copy has the >> "simulated burlap cover"). >> >> Thanks for any help you can offer. >> >> Richard Flynn > -----Original Message----- > From: Russell Paris [mailto:russ@jrp-graphics.com] > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 7:01 PM > To: Richard Flynn > Subject: Re: A Jackson Browne Question > > Hi Richard, > > Jackson Browne always says he likes people to find their own meaning > in the lyrics to his songs. > > There is a general consensus among Jackson's fans that "Fountain of > Sorrow" was written primarily for Joni Mitchell. (The timing of their > relationship and the writing of the song is about right.) > > However, I can tell you that I heard from an extremely reliable source > that at least part of the song does not refer to Joni. I was very > surprised when I found out who it was about just a couple of years > ago, and it changed my whole framework for this song. (Sorry, the > person who told me didn't give me permission to repeat the story... > though it's very possibly that maybe the song wasn't really written > about > Joni.) > > In any case, I've seen Jackson perform the song in concert a number of > times where he's implied fairly strongly that it was written for Joni > Mitchell... and as I said, that's the generally accepted view among > his fans. UNofficial biographies of Jackson agree... though no > official Jackson Browne biography has been released. > > My own personal opinion is that I think it's likely that in writing > the song, Jackson drew on an amalgamation of various relationships... > but since his relationship with Joni was the freshest in his mind at > the time, he relates it to her. Maybe one of these days Jackson will > write an autobiography and we'll find out more. > > I hope that helps. > > Russ > http://www.jrp-graphics.com/jackson_browne.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 19:33:34 -0600 From: "Les Irvin" Subject: RE: New Library addition: 'Five Grossest Song Lyrics of All Time' > I suppose you have to include this in your database just as I > have to include some of my covers, but boy it sure is a > terrible article. I agree it's terrible. My philosophy with the Library has always been to include everything I find that's relevant to or focused upon Joni - good or bad. Besides, the inclusion of this 'article' will someday come to haunt the author for the rest of his life. :-) Speaking of less-than-flattering portrayals, everybody remember Liz Braun? http://www.jmdl.com/library/view.cfm?id=79 Les NP - Metheny/Mays "September 15th" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 00:35:34 -0400 From: LesIrvin@jmdl.com Subject: New Library addition: 'From show biz to big biz to no bizand loving it' The following has been recently added to the JMDL Library: Title: From show biz to big biz to no bizand loving it Publication: Toronto Star Date: 2005-1-9 Type: Mention Find it here under "Most recent additions...": http://jmdl.com/library ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2005 #244 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? 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