From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2004 #15 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Sunday, January 18 2004 Volume 2004 : Number 015 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: JMDL Digest V2004 #28 [Catherine McKay ] What do we all do for a living (VLJC) [Jennymac48@aol.com] Re: JMDL Digest V2004 #28 ["Victor Johnson" ] Joni cover by Darol Anger ["Paul Castle" ] Re: What do we all do for a living (VLJC) ["mackoliver" ] Re: The Arrangement [Bobsart48@aol.com] RE: "The Arrangement" now with joni content!! ["Kate Bennett" ] Joni Compilation Project Update [Emiliano ] Joni Compilation Project Update (songs in chronolog. order) [Emiliano Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2004 #28 Russell, correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like maybe you're on the Joni-digest, rather than the joni-only one, and that maybe you want to be on the joni-only one. If you were, you wouldn't get most of the non-joni stuff. You should check the place on www.jmdl.com where you sign up and make sure you signed up for the one that's right for you. I'm copying this to the list at large, because there may be a few other people who could use this info as well. --- russell brooker wrote: > Hello Loves, > > If we're going to talk about Joni... > > Wellt then let's talk about Joni... > > Not your daily lives, I've got so much on the ball > about that... > > But let's talk about Joni. Please. I beseech you. As > a > planet, now. "Both Planets, Now". > > OK! We Did It! ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 09:45:29 EST From: Jennymac48@aol.com Subject: What do we all do for a living (VLJC) Hi all. I don't know if this has been done but wouldn't it be fun to see what we all do for a living and what our main hobby activity is and how do we attribute either to Joni's influence (if we do). I'll go first: I'm a mosaic artist for a living and dogs are my hobby. The art I attribute to Joni because the pull to create got too strong not to and I listened to her songs long enough to get the stregnth to make it happen. (God Bless her.) The dogs are I attribute to Joni's influence that creatures like dogs are pure in love and can't hurt you (like some/most people). ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 09:47:08 -0800 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2004 #28 Please forgive me, oh most devoted follower of she who is called Joan Anderson. Please join me as I say this prayer. Our Joni, who art in Bel Air, Hallowed be thy Name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, On earth as it is in Paprika Plains. Give us this day our daily joni And forgive us our trespasses, As we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into Brittany Spears, But deliver us from evil. For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, and nothing lasts for long, nothing lasts for long, nothings lasts for long, Amen. Victor Johnson New cd "Parsonage Lane" available now Produced by Chris Rosser at Hollow Reed Studios, Asheville http://www.waytobluemusic.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 16:05:04 -0000 From: "Paul Castle" Subject: Joni cover by Darol Anger Knowing Bob, he's probably already got it covered, but this sounds like an interesting addition to the collection - >February 24th marks the release of Republic of Strings >by Darol Anger and the American Fiddle Ensemble >(fiddler Brittany Haas, cellist Rushad Eggleston and >guitarist Scott Nygaard) on Compass Records, which includes a cover of Joni's "Help Me" sung by guest vocalist Laurie Lewis. (I saw Laurie at a festival I played at in Northern Ireland last year - great voice - and a fine fiddler, herself). The album also includes a cover of Stevie Wonder's "Higher Ground" with guest vocalist Sarah Watkins of Nickel Creek. Somewhere I've got a tape of Darol playing in Montreux (the band), which I really like. Fiddler Darol Anger (it says here) >has pioneered a unique fusion of classical, jazz, and bluegrass styles both as a solo artist and in a series of pioneering groups, including the David Grisman Quintet, the Montreux Band, the Turtle Island String Quartet, Psychograss, and the Grammy-nominated Fiddlers 4 (with Michael Doucet, Bruce Molsky, and Rushad Eggleston).> best to all PaulC ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 10:04:18 -0600 From: "mackoliver" Subject: Re: What do we all do for a living (VLJC) Okay Jenny. Diversion is good at this point. I am a nurse. Like to write, play sports, watch sports, garden, work with plants, bird watch, listen to mind bending music (joan for instance), spend time with family and friends, etc. Main activity at this point is trying to extricate myself from the foul, crud-filled, pus ridden existence I am currently sharing with this mentally ill drunk I made the mistake of knowing. Too much to share? If I can't with you here, then who else? For as Joan has sang, if you feel contempt, then tell it. There it is. The trial and the work continue. mack np: joan, ttt. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 12:51:52 EST From: Musicloverrick@aol.com Subject: Re: ttt I've never heard Taming the Tiger but when I first bought Hejira I popped it into the CD player in my car and thought, "Wow wait a minute this is a LOT different than the other one's I've heard..... (At the time I had only heard Blue, LOTC, FTR, C&S, and Clouds and Joni Mitchell.) But then I was like, "Man I can really get into this....." So I understand what you mean about Hejira....Rick ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:02:07 EST From: Musicloverrick@aol.com Subject: Re: on inventing chords In a message dated 1/16/2004 5:11:08 PM Central Standard Time, hvnphun16@hotmail.com writes: > > Rick wrote: "Don't you find it interesting that there so many successful > artists who were > self-taught on the guitar? Joni, Loretta Lynn, Dolly Parton, Wynonna Judd" > > I didn't know about those others (besides Joni). Thanks for sharing that > bit of info! > > I wonder how many other successful artists were self-taught? > > Well mia, i would venture a guess to say it's MANY MANY more than the ones I listed, and I'm sure I even know about more, but those were the only ones who came to mind at the time.....Rick ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 12:22:30 -0600 From: "mia ortlieb" Subject: re: Play the Political Joni's lyrics game Deb wrote: <> Yes, it could be interpreted like that! And Joni expanded on this same topic with WINDFALL: "In the land of litigation The courts are like game shows Take what's behind the curtain The jury cries" I think Joni likes to side with common sense more than siding with any political party. Also, during the Vietnam War, didn't some liberals attack her for performing for the soldiers? As if the soldiers themselves, especially the draftees, were responsible for the decisions made by the federal government. Mia _________________________________________________________________ Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:59:46 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: LOTC and harmonic complexity Les asked of David: "I'd be interested in your opinion David. Take the Ladies of the Canyon album. Do you hear the same harmonic complexities on the piano songs as you do on the guitar songs? To me, piano songs like Willy and Rainy Night House are pretty standard harmonically; majors, minors, passing tones. The harmonic complexities in those songs come from her voice, not from the piano. Compare that with guitar songs like Conversation or The Priest. More complex harmonically? Because of the open tunings? " LOTC holds a near and dear place in my heart, as my intro to Joni and the record through which I fell in love with her work (and her, I suppose). I too am looking forward to reading David's reply (I am days behind, catching up, in chronological order). But I would say this: 1. Joni was just getting into piano compositions with LOTC - her first two albums were basically guitar-only (though she did play piano on Night in the City, it seems). One would expect a certain amount of simplicity in her earlier efforts, and for growth to occur over time. 2. I agree that Willy and Rainy Night House (as well as Blue Boy) are relatively straightforward by her standards. For Free, too (witness some of her later arrangements of that song, which were a bit more colorful). However, to be fair, within LOTC we see early indications of complexity in The Arrangement and Woodstock (that nearly "all black keys" composition concept). 3. It would not be long before her piano arrangements became more interesting and colorful - My Old Man, Blue, The Last Time I Saw Richard being good illustrations - one release later. 4. I agree completely that The Priest is a special song - and that the guitar composition is one of her best. However, Conversation is a very simple song by Joni's standards - including her earlier standards, as David pointed out. I would have picked the title song to LOTC as a second illustration of more complex guitar arrangement.. 5. I was very much taken by her piano arrangements on the next several records, too - FTR and C&S contain some beautiful piano compositions as song accompaniment - especially The Banquet, Judgment of the Moon and Stars, Lesson in Survival/Let the Wind Carry Me, Down to You. I believe that it is easier to compose the sounds that one hears on the piano than on the guitar (or than on any other instrument, for that matter). I hypothesize this: that it may be easier to play (while singing) some of the more complex chordal progressions on the guitar (with its simple fingerings) than on the piano - which means that for performance purposes, Joni may have been more inclined to composing on the guitar. (Also, it's tough to lug the piano around the house with you.) Finally, one could argue that the "sounds" can be varied/altered more on guitar (a string instrument) than piano (a percussion instrument) - which may have kept Joni more interested over the years from a creative perspective ("what new sounds can I come up with?" - not merely "what new notes ?"). I imagine there are many aspects to her art with which I am totally unfamiliar, because of my limitations. I'd love to hear her answers on this subject, but I'll settle for David's. Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 14:03:46 EST From: PassScribe@aol.com Subject: Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2004 #14 << From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: STAS or JM I like to refer to it as STAS because Joni named it that, even if the goofs in the graphics department didn't realize it. I can so clearly remember sitting on the floor of my bedroom in Phoenix, studying the cover of the record that I had recently bought at a used store near the university, and realizing that those seagulls spelled something. (And wondering, "Why was the 'L' cut off?") I was 21 and had been listening to Joni for just two years. I wish I could relive the majic of discovering each of Joni's recordings, in random order, again. What sheer joy! Lori :~) >> Yeah, Lori, I've had such great memories of "discovering" things, be they songs, albums or old comic books. It has something to do with the "unexpected" aspect of it all... such a surprise yet profound impression. I get a similar, perhaps less extreme, feeling when turning on the car radio and hearing a favorite song and getting all excited even though I could have easilly popped in a tape or CD and chose to play it at any time because I already love it/own it. Kenny B ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 14:26:24 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: Cactus Tree v Taming the Tiger Les closed: "Cactus Tree vs Taming the Tiger? No comparison! :-)" But I do not really understand. In terms of playing the guitar to accompany yourself (whether or not while singing the song), TTT is much more complex rhythmically and more difficult to master than the relatively simple Travis picking on Cactus Tree, IMO. (Listen hard to Tiger Bones, and try to play it, to see what I mean). As far as "songs" go, my vote goes to Cactus Tree over TTT, but I like 'em both !! Best Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 15:40:40 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni cover by Darol Anger **Knowing Bob, he's probably already got it covered, but this sounds like an interesting addition to the collection -** Au contraire, mon frer! This is a new one on me, and I appreciate you bringing it to my attention. I did turn up some interesting new ones this week, and one of them was in fact a Help Me, but this is exciting news. And all the more so because as you say Darol and this string band are amazing musicians. I too was awed by the Montreaux CD's and have one that I enjoy very much. Barbara Higbie, who also played with Montreaux, recorded "Rainy Night House" a while back and that's a very pretty version. So...I'll add this to the database and anxiously await its birth. Looks like 2004 is shaping up to be yet another banner year in the never-a-dull-moment world of Joni covers! Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 16:04:37 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: Political bent and appreciation of Joni - SJC, but mostly about the list Mary replied to Buck: "What I would suggest is that some would find it difficult to see how conservatives could appreciate Joni Mitchell not because they think conservatives are intrinsically evil or misguided, but because that first group of folks sees Joni's own politics and worldview, from her actions and interviews and music and art, as tilting more liberal than conservative. And I think there's some real support for that view. " Well, Mary, you may be right, but I am hard pressed to understand why you would want to imply tolerance of - or even apologize for - such a narrow-minded view. I think that most of the liberal leaning people politically on this list do not feel that way. (For those that do, feel free to add me to your count of those "conservative-leaning" listers who have no problem whatsoever appreciating Joni's art or the views expressed therein - not that I necessarily share them in all cases). On this list - as in the world at large - there are "knee-jerk" liberals and conservatives. But there are also the more thoughtful types who lean one way or the other, without dismissing the other conclusions as necessarily 'wrong' - and certainly not worthless, much less 'evil'. I think that the support you suggest, if real, is extremely misguided. Mary further wrote: "But Joni has always been relentlessly uncategorizable: remember her somewhat controversial comment way back when that she was "not a feminist," even though I'd be hard-pressed to think of an artist, male or female, who more strongly exemplified "feminist" principles in her control of her art and her career? " By "somewhat controversial", I believe you are euphemizing. As I recall, her quote was pretty close to - "Most of the feminists are basically man-haters - at least all the ones that I know". Well, here was Joni slipping - while also unwittingly showing the danger of labelling (are 'feminists' only the hard core, politically antagonistic, "tail of the bell curve" types, or also the middle of the road, pro-fairness types of people like myself ? ;-) ). Anyway, Joni's political statements rarely achieve anger levels in her art. Most of the time, there is pathos mixed with urgency, sadness mixed with hope. In the rare cases where she does step out, the art tends to be diminished IMO (even if I share her revulsion of the stereotypical evangelist in Tax Free, for instance - which I do). A good example of her work in this regard is Borderline - do you imagine her "opinionated friend" to be a conservative demagogue type, or could the song's lyrics also be applicable to a liberal demagogue type ? I see Joni as being among the "open-minded" types, who seems to come down on the liberal side of most political issues, but whose art reflects what she sees as honestly as she can present it, and who usually leaves her "borderline" political opinions out of her art. Once in a while, when she sees an issue as truly not borderline, she steps out. I can relate to that. Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 16:23:09 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame Excellent choice - well deserved. I assume Blue is already in ? Hejira and S&L should get in, too, IMO. That would make 4, on the merits. But are these other two accessible enough to get the votes ? I hope so. That would be something. Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 16:36:01 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: California Lori asked: "All the news of home you read More about the war And the bloody changes from "California" Is Joni complaining or merely observing?" Well, she's got the blues. She's lonely in Spain; the streets are full of strangers. And there is additional melancholy - reading that the home she is away from is embroiled in a deadly war, with divisive dissent that itself is producing mounting casualties as the times they are a changin'. A perfect example of her political art at its best - capturing the mood of the times without anger or bias, serving as a conduit for the sadness, pain and frustration so widely felt at the time, and putting into a single verse. And a nice complement (and contrast) to Dylan's anger, eh ? Sadly observing, IMO. She was really something. Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:54:46 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Fw: Play the "Joni's Political Lyrics" game! = longish Ron> what there is seems to be more personal, becoming less personal as time passes...it seems to me that she actually lost a lot in the growing up....it doesnt draw me in, it doesnt involve, theres just nothing personal about it...its really just an impression which i am for the first time trying to put into some coherent (hopefully) words - so perhaps im wrong... any and all thoughts on the topic would be gratefully welcomed :-)< Ain't no right or wrong to this but I agree with you ron, I think there is more art in subtly including a politial view within a story (making it personal whether or not it is actually autiobiographical) than just talking 'at' someone which like you mentioned, does not draw me in either...being drawn in here is the key to excellent writing, imo... I have to feel emotionally it as well as appreciate it intellectually for it to be a great song... Kate www.katebennett.com "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" The All Music Guide ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:59:55 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: on inventing chords >I wonder how many other successful artists were self-taught?< This is a hard question to answer because I don't know what self taught really means... I think Bonnie Raitt learned a lot from playing with blues guys but it wasn't in a formal setting... Many talk about learning songs by listening to records so in a sense that is self taught but in a sense it is not... Self taught could be totally making up stuff by ear but I think most musicians can site many influences from which they draw their ideas whether it is conciously or subconciously... If self taught means not studying music theory perhaps that is one definition but in learning music by alternative means, it is possible to learn quite a bit of music theory which really boils down to relatively simple math... Kate www.katebennett.com "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" The All Music Guide ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 17:23:05 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: The Arrangement Lori wrote: "That song (one of my favorites on LOTC) has always seemed to me to be -- at least in some ways -- Joni's indictment upon selling one's soul to Capitalism and the almighty dollar. Well, I personally find that song haunting - and so did my dad before me. But not an indictment - rather, a personal whisper in the listener's ear. Not really that you "should have been more", but the more affirmative -even understanding - "you could have been more". Sort of like "I understand your inner beauty - you made some choices, they worked out to some extent, but was it worth giving up the dream for ?" A whisper, considering the potential downside of the road she herself did not take, and perhaps affirming her own decision (which she in turn questioned many times in song) to not pursue the potential upside satisfaction of giving of herself to another and a family and thereby possibly earn and know the love that only can come from that. I think this is not even really social commentary, much less political commentary - it is an angle on the haunting aspect of big choices/decision that we all face, and the "what if's" left behind. . Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 16:00:18 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: "The Arrangement" now with joni content!! >I think fear can be the biggest obstacle to overcome. Victor< Me too...& it really IS the only thing to fear! I love the philosophy of 'face your fear & do it anyway'... It really works... Fear loves inaction, it feeds on it, it grows bigger on it... Also fear is a bully that likes you to believe it is a bigger obstacle than it really is... Its just a puny punk... :~} Or to bring it back to joni: 'fear is like a wilderland, stepping stones or sinking sands' Kate www.katebennett.com "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" The All Music Guide ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 17:04:16 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Joni cover by Darol Anger SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > **Knowing Bob, he's probably already got it covered, > but this sounds like an interesting addition to the > collection -** > > Au contraire, mon frer! This is a new one on me, and I appreciate you > bringing it to my attention. I did turn up some interesting new ones this week, and > one of them was in fact a Help Me, but this is exciting news. And all the more > so because as you say Darol and this string band are amazing musicians. I've seen Darol a couple of times, and he is one fine gut scraper. I'm sure it will be a classy rendition. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:32:57 +0100 From: Emiliano Subject: Joni Compilation Project Update Hi, it's saturday night, the girls are sleeping, and here comes the exclamation marks' prince again! Gerry wrote ( some 2 days ago, in acousticharmonies@yahoogroups.com): > > Who do you think should be the next singer/songwriter to get the > Acoustic Harmonies "treatment"? > > My first thought was Van Morrison, but it may be time for a woman to > get the spotlight. How about Sandy Denny or Laura Nyro? > > Just trying to stir things up a bit. I have no idea what shows are > available and obviously that's a big factor. > and Ray: > > I know there are some huge Joni fans out there. Anyone would like to > put something together? > Well, you know I enthusiastically talked about this with Mr Paz, and then on list... Humm, I'm so overwhelmed (who isn't?) Isn't even a year, by now, when I discovered this Queendom, this wonderful & beloved list (though sometimes it's a pain in the ass, Feliciano!). I only knew the "Urge for going" bootleg (here known as "Circle game") last february ! I'd love to have an [acousticharmonies] Joni Mitchell compilation, but only if it's made by the JMDLers! I fear our SIQUOMB will get angry if we weed it openly here! Even if we put list name on artwork? ??? I'm never in hurry (well, some running to girls' school exit)... it's hard working january... anyway, I post in separate the list (ordered by show date... except the studio outtakes)... you know, maybe we can start thinking, plus about the songs that aren't by now, about the order: I figure out as a show, beginning with band, alternating some solo renditions... Even if the techny aspect of this (the editing and burning) need to be made by just one of us , I thought it would be funny to make little suggestions on list, even receiving some flaming joke ;-) For the artwork... it will be of trouble putting the photographer's name? I somewhat repeat my question about your point of view about copyright 'n legal things possibly involved. Well... Have a Wonderful time! Emiliano NP: Chinese Cafe', from Wembley '83, Thanks Randy! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:44:12 +0100 From: Emiliano Subject: Joni Compilation Project Update (songs in chronolog. order) Song to a Seagull '68 2nd Fret sets Come to the sunshine ? (some intro) '68 2nd Fret sets Woodstock '69 Big Sur Woodstock (& intro) '69 Dick Cavett S Rainy NHouse /B. Boy '69 PBS California '70 w JT For Free '70 w JT Hunter '71 Blue outtake BSN '71? Folk. Tv, w Pete Seeger Blue (instr) w/ Paul Horn '74 Visions Dreamland '75 HOSL demoes Boho Dance '75 HOSL demoes In France. '75 HOSL demoes S&L '76 Philadelphia For free '76 Philadelphia Coyote/Don Juan's RD '76 Philadelphia T Wolf that lives Lindsay '78 Bread & Roses A Case of You '83 Refuge Wild Things. '83 Refuge Sweet Bird '83 Refuge talk intro asking for more light, before Edith... '83 Refuge God Must Be A Boogie Man '83 Refuge For Free '83 Refuge Chinese Cafi/ '83 Refuge Woodstock '83 Refuge Amelia '83 Refuge 3 Great Stimulants '86 Amnesty Int. #1 '86 Amnesty Int. #1 '87? Video Impossible Dreamer '88 Rock M. C. Dog Eat Dog '88 Rock M. C. 3 Great Stimulants '88 Rock M. C. Passion Play speechless '88 San Remo Lakota '88 San Remo *non* Sex Kills '94 Toronto Borderline '94 Troubadours Sweet Bird '95 Gene Autry Shades of Scarlett. '95 Gene Autry Moon at the Window '95 Gene Autry Sex Kills '95 JazzFest, NO Comes Love '98 PWW&M Trouble Man '98 Woodstock Sue's "You're a GENIUS!! '98 Woodstock Woodstock (& intro) '98 Woodstock Man from Mars '99 Grace. BSO BSN finale 00 All Stribute Judgement. 00 Camden For The Roses 00 Greek Moon at the Window MuchMusic? Love's cries MuchMusic? ah, remember, there are some mistakes, viva! Emiliano ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 20:53:02 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame **I assume Blue is already in ?** Assume no longer - Blue was inducted in 1999. "Both Sides Now" by Judy Collins was inducted last year. Joni's other Grammy recognitions: (if this doesn't through legibly you can go to www.Grammy.com and do a search on JM... (A sidenote...I REALLY think it's cool that Joni & Tom Scott won the Grammy for best arrangement for "Down To You". Grammy's made lots of royal screw-ups (Milli Vanilli anyone?) but sometimes they nail it) GRAMMY Winner Joni Mitchell,artist. Allen Sides & Geoff Foster,engineers/mixers. Joni Mitchell & Larry Klein,producers. Genre Trad Pop GRAMMY Category Best Traditional Pop Vocal Album Year 2000 - 43rd Annual GRAMMY Awards Title of the Work Both Sides Now Artist Performing Work Joni Mitchell GRAMMY Winner Joni Mitchell,artist. Joni Mitchell & Larry Klein,producers. Genre Pop GRAMMY Category Best Pop Album Year 1995 - 38th Annual GRAMMY Awards Title of the Work Turbulent Indigo Artist Performing Work Joni Mitchell GRAMMY Winner Joni Mitchell & Robbie Cavolina,art directors. Genre Packaging GRAMMY Category Best Recording Package Year 1995 - 38th Annual GRAMMY Awards Title of the Work Turbulent Indigo Artist Performing Work Joni Mitchell GRAMMY Winner Joni Mitchell & Tom Scott,arrangers. Genre Arranging GRAMMY Category Best Arrangement Accompanying Vocalists Year 1974 - 17th Annual GRAMMY Awards Title of the Work Down To You Artist Performing Work Joni Mitchell GRAMMY Winner Joni Mitchell,artist. Genre Folk GRAMMY Category Best Folk Performance Year 1969 - 12th Annual GRAMMY Awards Title of the Work Clouds Artist Performing Work Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:02:03 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: "The Arrangement" now back to jc --- Kate Bennett wrote: > > to do what they really wanted to do all along, > except now they're kind > of old and maybe it's too late.< > > I've been thinking about this idea lately as I talk > to people who fall > into one of two camps...one being 'its never too > late' & the other being > 'its too late'... I am in the first camp I guess > because to me, life is > a process, not a product (for the most part)...to > me, the people in the > first camp seem much happier...the others seem more > resigned... > > Any comments? I also believe it's never too late to change or try new things. You're going to get old and die anyway, so you might as well do something you've always wanted to do and then get old and die ;-) I think often people just give up trying because maybe they're so caught up in a lifestyle that they *feel* they can't change. I'm wondering if The Arrangement guy is actually dying, or just feels like he's dying. What does Joni mean when she says, "Lying in some room trying to die?" I always thought she meant he was feeling depressed enough or stuck-in-a-rut enough to want to die, but passively, like maybe of boredom. Now I'm wondering if he's not literally dying, either because now he's sick and dying in some (hospital) room, or maybe he has attempted suicide or something. On the other hand, maybe I'm trying to read too much into it. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:02:03 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: "The Arrangement" now back to jc --- Kate Bennett wrote: > > to do what they really wanted to do all along, > except now they're kind > of old and maybe it's too late.< > > I've been thinking about this idea lately as I talk > to people who fall > into one of two camps...one being 'its never too > late' & the other being > 'its too late'... I am in the first camp I guess > because to me, life is > a process, not a product (for the most part)...to > me, the people in the > first camp seem much happier...the others seem more > resigned... > > Any comments? I also believe it's never too late to change or try new things. You're going to get old and die anyway, so you might as well do something you've always wanted to do and then get old and die ;-) I think often people just give up trying because maybe they're so caught up in a lifestyle that they *feel* they can't change. I'm wondering if The Arrangement guy is actually dying, or just feels like he's dying. What does Joni mean when she says, "Lying in some room trying to die?" I always thought she meant he was feeling depressed enough or stuck-in-a-rut enough to want to die, but passively, like maybe of boredom. Now I'm wondering if he's not literally dying, either because now he's sick and dying in some (hospital) room, or maybe he has attempted suicide or something. On the other hand, maybe I'm trying to read too much into it. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:11:06 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: "The Arrangement" now back to jc **I'm wondering if The Arrangement guy is actually dying, or just feels like he's dying. ** Well, given that Joni wrote this not independently but rather specifically for the film, let's look at the synopsis of the film's plot and see. I would say that at least originally it would be the former. I haven't seen this film so perhaps someone who has can offer up some insights. From The All-Movie Guide: Kirk Douglas has an extreme case of mid-life crisis in Elia Kazan's turgid melodrama (adapted from his best-selling novel). Douglas plays successful advertising executive Eddie Anderson, who cracks under the strain of the morning rush hour in Los Angeles and plows his sports car into a truck. Landing in a convalescent home, Eddie remains mute to everyone except his boss Finnegan (Charles Drake). In his recovery room, Eddie dreams about co-worker Gwen (Faye Dunaway), a sexy research assistant at his agency. Meanwhile, the psychiatrist Dr. Liebman (Harold Gould) talks to Eddie's wife, Florence (Deborah Kerr), who reveals that at one time Eddie and Gwen had an affair, but they broke it off. Unfortunately, after that escapade, Eddie's interest in sex vanished completely. Then after the interview with Dr. Liebman, following a terrible nightmare, Eddie breaks out of his self-imposed silence and declares to Florence that he is tired of his unfulfilling life of "arrangements." Eddie returns to work, but the return is marked by Eddie insulting a major client, alienating his co-workers, and then taking off in a private plane in which he flies madly over the skies of L.A. His lawyer Arthur (Hume Cronyn) keeps Eddie from being thrown in jail and also talks Eddie into giving Florence the power of attorney. Eddie proceeds to travel to New York, where he runs into Gwen, who now has a child. Eddie is in New York to visit his senile father, Sam (Richard Boone), but when his family attempts to put Sam in a nursing home, Eddie takes him away with him to their old family estate on Long Island. Eddie calls up Gwen, and she travels to Long Island to resume their affair. Meanwhile, Eddie's loved ones search for Sam, and they are closing in on Eddie's Long Island sanctuary. Bob NP: Joe Henry live on KCRW...man he's great. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 22:51:15 -0500 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Re: "The Arrangement" now back to jc >I'm wondering if The Arrangemenjcguy is actually >dying, or just feels like he's dying. What does Joni >mean when she says, "Lying in some room trying to >die?" I always thought she meant he was feeling >depressed enough or stuck-in-a-rut enough to want to >die, but passively, like maybe of boredom. Now I'm >wondering if he's not literally dying, either because >now he's sick and dying in some (hospital) room, or >maybe he has attempted suicide or something. On the >other hand, maybe I'm trying to read too much into it. I think the guy is just depressed. If one were literally dying they would not have to try. The few times in my life when I was depressed (always able to pull myself out of it) I would lie in bed and there would be two imaginary buttons. Button one...my life would continue...no miracles promised.. just that I would continue to breath. Button two...life would cease... I would stare at these buttons..which to choose..which to choose. ...which one do I push.... Anyway....this came to mind reading these posts on "The Arrangement" Bree np: Stay in touch....OH!! stay in touch... ' >===== >Catherine >Toronto >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction > > > > >______________________________________________________________________ >Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca _________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE online virus check for your PC here, from McAfee. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 01:09:38 EST From: BRYAN8847@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2004 #30 - Grammy H of F In a message dated 1/17/2004 5:54:27 PM Pacific Standard Time, les@jmdl.com writes: > From: Bobsart48@aol.com > Subject: Re: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame > > Excellent choice - well deserved. > > I assume Blue is already in ? > > Hejira and S&L should get in, too, IMO. > I think in order to be "inducted" into the Grammy Hall of Fame, the work has to have been a previous Grammy winner....but I'll have to check into that to be sure. Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:23:51 -0500 From: ljirvin@jmdl.com Subject: Today in History: January 18 1974: Joni performed at the Kiel Opera House in St. Louis on the first date of her tour with the LA Express. More info: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=297 http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=817 - ---- For a comprehensive reference to Joni's appearances, consult Joni Mitchell ~ A Chronology of Appearances: http://www.jonimitchell.com/appearances.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:23:51 -0500 From: ljirvin@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Library Links: January 18 On January 18 the following articles were published: 1988: "California Weather" - CBS Evening News (News Item) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=910 1998: "Rock's Fab Fiftysomethings" - New York Daily News (Biography) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=219 ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2004 #15 ******************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)