From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2003 #167 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, May 20 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 167 Sign up now for JoniFest 2003! http://www.jonifest.com ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: for the roses ["Garret" ] Joni's songwiting methods [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] RE: [NortheastJonifest] may 17!!!! and some other quick hellos n jc [Rec] Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2003 #166 [Bobsart48@aol.com] Re: for the roses [Catherine McKay ] Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2003 #166 [Catherine McKay ] FW: [NortheastJonifest] may 17!!!! and some other quick hellos n jc [Rec] Perma-Vine [Mary Casey ] JT bio w/Joni content [anne@sandstrom.com] Re: JT bio w/Joni content [AzeemAK@aol.com] Today in History: May 20 [ljirvin@jmdl.com] Today's Library Links: May 20 [ljirvin@jmdl.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 12:10:26 +0100 From: "Garret" Subject: Re: for the roses What a nice discussion to with which to get re-introduced to the list:) I think ye are both on the right track, FTR could be about James or Joni. Afterall, isn't she "our lady of duality" and all that. The lyrics don't necessarily have to be about just one person, or indeed, different parts can refer to different people. I sincerely believe that Joni likes the idea of some sort of ambiguity in her work *particularly* on FTR and Blue; confessional as her lyrics may have been, she was poet-enough to dress them up a little and leave herself some space for self-protection. She would probably like to know that theories abound as to what she is saying, but she's not going to make interpreting her songs an easy task! And then, the songs really are what they mean to each of us (Constructive Alternativism and all that, lol) It's good to be back. GARRET np- Ocean Colour Scene, Day We Caught The Train ("ooh oh la la, ooh oh la la...") ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 08:36:59 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Joni's songwiting methods Welcome Matty! Like Ken says, the "Library" on the JMDL site is unsurpassed as a clearinghouse of articles and Joni writings. Happy hunting! Additionally, there are some audio interviews available (some transcribed as articles in the library) where Joni discusses her songwriting. For the most part, she composes song structure and writes music and chord changes, then lets the words follow to fit the structure. There are several cases where she performed "songs" before she had lyrics...Passion Play, Two Grey Rooms, Not To Blame were all conceived musically before they were filled in verbally, which is amazing to me because her words are SO DAMN good, you'd think it would be the other way 'round. Just another sign of the woman's genius, I s'pose... Again - welcome, thanks for your post and don't be a stranger. Bob NP: Pearl Jam, "crazy mary" 11/6/00 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 13:43:42 +0100 From: ReckersL@ebrd.com Subject: RE: [NortheastJonifest] may 17!!!! and some other quick hellos n jc Dearest Smurphbob, happy happy happy birthday!!! You are undoubtedly the wittiest of all the smurphs, and I can say this with some certainty, as I come from the land where the Smurphs are MADE! (Sigh, we all have our crosses to bear, but fortunately we also have Jacques Brel...) Thank you for trying to immortalise me in your beautiful and strangely moving camp song. Yes, you tried, but actually dear Bob you "mortalised" me... Although of course I am an excellent swimmer, I have this little caveat that I need to keep my eyes strictly ABOVE the water level, so by making me dive INTO the pool, you made sure I never came out! Ah well, if anyone wants to write about me (you see I do the diva bit quite well!), I would kindly request they send me out hiking instead. And while I'm here: gosh how I wish I had more time to post! I've just about caught up with all the digests I was behind on, and realise I also wanted to wish COLIN all the best with his health - and congratulate him on all those lost pounds - and wish STEPHEN a very happy birthday, and make some comments on why I think it's getting so hard for our dear Ashara to get enough deposits together for the Jonifest - yes that's how far behind I was with all the posts, it's hopeless... Anyway I still have this little idea about the exchange of books at Jonifest that was mentioned by Mags, I hope to send a separate post about that soon with a practical suggestion that I think would be fun. Till soon and lots of love, Lieve. [The birthday fairy announced:] MORTALS AND SUPERNATURAL BEINGS ALIKE CELEBRATE THE HAPPIEST DAY ON EARTH TODAY THE TIME HAS COME TO GREET OUR ONE AND ONLY S M U R P H" HaPpYBiRtHdAy BOB MURPHY THE BF'S PET AND APPLE OF ITS (splendidly made up) EYE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (the BF retires to a corner of the universe to contemplate the beauty of the mighty smurph.) ______________________________________________________________ This message may contain privileged information. If you have received this message by mistake, please keep it confidential and return it to the sender. Although we have taken steps to minimise the risk of transmitting software viruses, the EBRD accepts no liability for any loss or damage caused by computer viruses and would advise you to carry out your own virus checks. The contents of this e-mail do not necessarily represent the views of the EBRD. ______________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 08:47:32 EDT From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2003 #166 ). Walt wrote (my comments/replies inserted) about FTR being an open letter to JT (to which I agree) i may be wrong, but james had huge sucesses with "sweet baby" and "mudslide" by then. joni had yet to have her "court and spark" success. i believe she was critically successfull by then but had not reached james mass success." Well, I may be wrong, but Joni released LOTC and Blue at the same time James release SBJ and MSS. And before that, she had won a grammy. I do not think that he was a much bigger name than she was at that time, and certainly not at the time they were seeing each other (which pre-dated the release of FTR by some time - by then, they had crashed and burned, as memorialized a bit in "Electricity" and "See you sometime") . During the famous BBC concert (12/70, I believe) currently being circulated via PermaVine, I think that Joni was clearly the top bill (although I have long suspected that it was originally intended to be her concert, and she sort of let him - or asked him to - crash it). Also, she has said in interviews that she felt she probably helped his career more than he helped hers by their association. "I'm not after a piece of your fortune or your fame, cause I've tasted mine". Her fame came first, although it is possible that because of his two "hits" he was more widely known than Joni by the time FTR was released. "they toss around your latest golden egg..." I think that the open letter contains some reminiscences common to both of them that she was sharing with him - this is one. So was "and he was seen on a lot more "giant screens" but she was seen on them too also the image of an artist pouring simple sorrows to " the soundhole and your knee" seem to me a much more masculine/james image rather than a joni one. not to mention at the time his songs were steeped in sorrow a lot more than hers. Another reminiscence common to both of them, IMO. As far as whose songs were more steeped in sorrow, I think even our lady of sorrows would disagree with you there. "I sing my sorrow and I paint my joy", etc. Also, JT had quite a few upbeat songs in his early collection - more so proportionately than Joni, IMO. And I am confident that Joni also felt the simplicity of her own pouring of her simple sorrows to the sound hole and her knee., and was sharing it with JT in theis letter. also the line "did you get a round resounding for you way up here" seems to be tinged with more than a touch of sarcasm. I do not feel any sarcasm here. She goes on "It seems like many dims years ago sicne I heard that face to face" - a long time she she had felt such round resounding - another reminiscence. Finally, the whoe second verse is general in nature - relating to the business in general (to both of them, as well), and to anyone in the business. And the 4th verse is about her - note the "I" throughout. Yes, it is an open letter to JT. But the messages are those of sharing and recalling these commonalities. Such as Up the charts, Off to the airport Your name's in the new Everthing's first class The lights go down- And it's just you up there Getting them to feel like that. As far as time of year goes - "chilly now, end of summer" in Canada says it all to me. (I know this relates to someone else's post). Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 10:02:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: for the roses --- Garret wrote: > What a nice discussion to with which to get > re-introduced to the list:) .... > It's good to be back. > GARRET Hey, good to have you back, too! Catherine, who enjoys every post Mark in/near Seattle ever sends. ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 10:17:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2003 #166 --- Bobsart48@aol.com wrote: > ). > Walt wrote (my comments/replies inserted) about > FTR being an open letter to JT (to which I agree) > > i may be wrong, but james had huge sucesses with > "sweet baby" and "mudslide" by then. > joni had yet to have her "court and spark" success. > i believe she was critically successfull by then > but had not reached james mass success." I always figure, even when Joni is writing to, or about, another person, she is also writing to, or about, herself. In particular, when she sings, "Remember the days when you used to sit and make up your tunes for love, and pour your simple sorrow to the soundhole and your knee", that's where "you" and "I" are totally fused. ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 16:37:27 +0100 From: ReckersL@ebrd.com Subject: FW: [NortheastJonifest] may 17!!!! and some other quick hellos n jc Sort of copy, late, anyway... - -----Original Message----- From: Reckers, Lieve Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 4:34 PM To: 'NortheastJonifest@yahoogroups.com' Subject: RE: [NortheastJonifest] may 17!!!! and some other quick hellos n jc Catherine, you've made me so happy! You unfuzzed my brain, I think! I was just thinking how to explain that "les schtroumpfs" was only what the French speaking Belgians called the little blue men, but that "de smurfen" were made by a Dutch speaking Belgian (i.e. a Flemish person) when suddenly through the mist of time my memory lit up and told me: THE GUY WAS DUTCH! Yes, proper Dutch from the other side of the border! (I got confused because I think he's from the Dutch province of Limburg which is very close to Belgium, I'm actually from the Belgian side of Limburg) but hey Limburg Schlimburg, HE'S DUTCH! Uncle John can take over the guilt, I'm FREE! Ah, thank you Catherine dear! I am copying this correction to the Jonilist because my mistake was also sent there, and those messages are archived and I would not want this slur on Belgium to go into the eternal records! Lieve in London. -----Original Message----- From: Catherine McKay [SMTP:anima_rising@yahoo.ca] Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 3:05 PM To: NortheastJonifest@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [NortheastJonifest] may 17!!!! and some other quick hellos n jc --- reckersl@ebrd.com wrote: --------------------------------- Dearest Smurphbob, happy happy happy birthday!!! You are undoubtedly the wittiest of all the smurphs, and I can say this with some certainty, as I come from the land where the Smurphs are MADE! (Sigh, we all have our crosses to bear, but fortunately we also have Jacques Brel...) Aren't they called "les schtroumpfs" over there (not sure about the spelling, but it's close, n'est-ce pas? ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor - ---------------------~--> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/uetFAA/9rHolB/TM - ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: NortheastJonifest-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ EBRD SECURITY NOTICE This email has been virus scanned ______________________________________________________________ This message may contain privileged information. If you have received this message by mistake, please keep it confidential and return it to the sender. Although we have taken steps to minimise the risk of transmitting software viruses, the EBRD accepts no liability for any loss or damage caused by computer viruses and would advise you to carry out your own virus checks. The contents of this e-mail do not necessarily represent the views of the EBRD. ______________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 14:31:20 -0700 From: Mary Casey Subject: Perma-Vine I have sent the original disc to Emily in Wisconsin and am providing a copy to Terry as soon as I get the address. Thanks for making this all possible. Keep the love alive. Mary ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 16:05:53 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: JT bio w/Joni content I'm just reading the James Taylor bio, Fire and Rain. It has a chapter about Joni. (pardon me if I missed any previous thread about this...) My overall impression of the book isn't great. The author quotes people who are part of the JT online community. That's like quoting me in a book about Joni. The writing's choppy and sometimes repetitious. The chapter about Joni says she was into some heavy drugs at the time of her relationship with James, the implication being heroine. I'm not sure I buy this. It also says "You Turn Me On, I'm a Radio" was written abuot JT. I've never thought that was true. There are some other things that doen't jibe. Plus his timeline is kind of warped. Has anyone else read this? What do you think? And again sorry if this is a thread I missed... lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 19:38:55 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: JT bio w/Joni content In a message dated 20/05/2003 00:06:54 GMT Daylight Time, anne@sandstrom.com writes: > The chapter about Joni says she was into some heavy > drugs at the time of her relationship with James, the > implication being heroine. I'm not sure I buy this. I haven't read the book Anne, but I remember clearly a quote from Joni in quite a long interview, I think in Q. She was talking about drugs, and how naive she had been when she first got in with the Laurel Canyon set. But, she said, in response to prompting from the interview, "Oh yeah, I tried everything! Well, except mainlining heroin, as I figured the best thing that could happen would be that I didn't like it [or words to that effect]" So, I suppose that could mean that she tried heroin, by snorting or smoking it, but I'd be pretty sure she never injected it or became hooked. She did, of course, disclose that some of Hejira was written under the influence of Charlie (and I don't mean Mingus or Parker...) - that's a bit of a challenge to those of us who now associate coke excess with monstrosities like the third Oasis album... Azeem in London ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 02:07:46 -0400 From: ljirvin@jmdl.com Subject: Today in History: May 20 1988: Joni had a solo art exhibit at the Parco Gallery in Toyko that coincided with the release there of Chalk Mark. This show was her first "for sale" art exhibition. 1994: A three day concert billed as "The Great Music Experience" and held in Nara, Japan at an 8th century Buddhist Todaiji temple, featured musicians from around the world playing on each others songs. Bob Dylan, the Chieftains, INXS, and many other performers played three nights of music with the final night being a live worldwide broadcast that was also taped for later syndicated release in still other countries. More info: http://www.jonimitchell.com/Nara94.html - ---- For a comprehensive reference to Joni's appearances, consult Joni Mitchell ~ A Chronology of Appearances: http://www.jonimitchell.com/appearances.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 02:07:46 -0400 From: ljirvin@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Library Links: May 20 On May 20 the following items were published: 1998: "Dylan + Morrison + Mitchell = 1 riveting show" - Contra Costa Times (Review - Concert, with photographs) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=336 1998: "Dylan takes audience on a tour through rock 'n' roll history" - San Jose Mercury News (Review - Concert, with photographs) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=335 1998: "For this fan, 75-minute set is pure ecstasy" - San Jose Mercury News (Review - Concert, with photographs) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=334 1998: "Happy Van, Jazzy Joni, Rockin' Bob" - Seattle Weekly (Review - Concert) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=373 1999: "Jazz LP, Concert Tour in Joni Mitchell's future" - Daily News of Los Angeles (News Item) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=905 ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2003 #167 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? 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