From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #336 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Monday, November 11 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 336 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: so sad [ewwt@juno.com] Re: so sad ["kakki" ] Re: NY Post Gossip Column on Joni's birthday!! [ewwt@juno.com] Miss Bland [Gordon Mackie ] Trvelogue Magazine Ad - UK ["Raffaele Malanga" ] Channel 13 ? ["Paul Castle" ] Re: Evian takes us down the memory trail ["Lori Fye" ] Tire Skids and Teeth Marks ["William" ] Re: Travelogue [Murphycopy@aol.com] [none] [Dave Cuneo ] Recall: [Dave Cuneo ] Travelogue's "Hejira" ["Lori Fye" ] Re: Recall: [colin ] time [Dave Cuneo ] Re: NY Post Gossip Column on Joni's birthday!! ["Bree Mcdonough" ] Speaking about bizarre links... [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Speaking about bizarre links... ["Lori Fye" ] Re: Tire Skids and Teeth Marks ["blonde in the bleachers" ] Re: Speaking about bizarre links... [dsk ] Re: Miss Bland [FredNow@aol.com] Re: Miss Bland [KJHSF@aol.com] Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #481 [paul mccloud ] "all the guilty people..." [Relayer211@aol.com] Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #481 - Joni, Jane & Jesus [BRYAN8847@aol.com] Joni, Jane & Jesus [hell ] Joni segment on PBS [KJHSF@aol.com] Re: WalterPhil's post "So Sad" ["PAUL PETERSON" ] Re: Joni, "an original" [Jenny Goodspeed ] Re: Joni, "an original" [Jenny Goodspeed ] Re: NY Post Gossip Column on Joni's birthday!! [ewwt@juno.com] Re: Tire Skids and Teeth Marks ["Humble tiger" ] Re: Joni segment on PBS ["Humble tiger" ] Re: Joni segment on PBS [Deb Messling ] Re: Celebrating Joni's birthday [Michael Paz wrote: << listened to the "travelog" links today and i find them so sad why would joni release so many of her old songs when to me every comparison to the way her voice used to sound just makes me wince. and just as i thought--- i hate the lame orchestrations i wish she'd just give up cigarettes laura nyro did and her voice improved. judy collins and joan baez' voices are still beautiful and neither smokes. >> Wow, I had the exact opposite reaction listening to the Travelogue links! I am enthralled with the way Joni's voice has matured and find the symphonic interpretations gorgeous. Her timbre and phrasing on the 12 songs I've heard blow me away with their powerful subtlety. Wouldn't it be nice if singers didn't get older and sounded the way they did when they were 20 at the age of 60? I don't think so! To me Joni sounds better with each successive album, vocally and musically. I rarely listen to her early albums for this reason. Thank God/dess she doesn't sound more like Judy Collins or Joan Baez because they both bore me to tears! Perhaps Madonna should start chain smoking. Maybe then she'd finally stop sounding like a teenager who snorted too much coke.... I find the most impressive rendition on Travelogue You Dream Flat Tires http://feature.atlrec.com/buzztone/joni_mitchell/youdream.swf What is really so sad is a music industry which promotes sex instead of talent! ET NP: Incubus "Science" (awesome!) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 20:15:43 -0800 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: so sad Hey Eric - welcome back! You wrote: > I find the most impressive rendition on Travelogue You Dream Flat > Tires http://feature.atlrec.com/buzztone/joni_mitchell/youdream.swf A number here have raved particularly about Flat Tires and Dawntreader - those were the two standouts for me, too, in early listens! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 03:43:43 -0500 From: ewwt@juno.com Subject: Re: NY Post Gossip Column on Joni's birthday!! Bree Mcdonough wrote: << I did not like the breaking out Madonna or the overtly sexual period..but the mature Madonna I can take. In this same interview she told the interviewer that she does not let her children watch TV. She reads to them bedtime stories and the Old Testament. This sad interviewer did not follow up with any questions. >> I finally began to like Madonna after seeing Evita and hearing Ray Of Light. But when I saw that Larry King interview with Madonna a few weeks ago I wanted to vomit! The boy-toy-turned-guru had the NERVE to lecture Jews and Christians that they have it all wrong and that SHE has found "the truth" which predates Judaism. Sorry Madonna but the Kabballa doesn't predate Moses or even Jesus. Larry King just smiled unbelievably and I don't blame him for not pursuing the topic further. Joni is 100% correct in her assessment of Madonna, the music industry and David Letterman, and I'm just glad that someone of Joni's calibre has the guts to say it like it is! ET NP: http://feature.atlrec.com/buzztone/joni_mitchell/slouchingtowards.swf ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 11:27:03 +0000 From: Gordon Mackie Subject: Miss Bland The title of todays email .....she was my music teacher...honest! Hand on heart. Anyhoo, been reflecting on the range of of responses to my 'corned beef' email. Rather than individual replies , Ill try and 'sum up' some thoughts... I thnk it was Fred who said that Joni might hear things that I don't in Mendoza's orchestrations.Sure, no doubt... and he asked why Joni would work with him again...I dunno...people end up working with people for all sorts of reasons...even more than once. The Premature ejaculation thread (excellent title) is fair....I have now listened to Flat Tyres and Love...interesting! Still open but not convinced..open minded but not wide open IMHO is simply that..no great shakes...just an opinion...but it has some validity surely ( or am I deluded...yes Gordon you're deluded all right..lol) Q: Is is negative to be critical? Is it positive to be uncritical? Joni doenst hold back, why should we? (not that we need her permsission). Or am I being too Western in my thought? Someone else commented that because people were giving of their best why should we be so unkind. I 'spose there's a lot in that. It presumes many things. People were at work ...and may have given of their best, however this is a well known orchestra. They have to work with lots of people (some they wish they hadn't). If you think I'm negative go speak / listen to session musicians/ band members after having completed some recording work! Darlings! They make me sound like a teddy bear...whatever that means..lol To those who privated the personal insults, sobeit. I'll live. If you have something to say, make it meaningful..not bland. Im reminded of the Scarecrow in the Wizard of Oz (see I can do homespun philosphy..lol) When asked by Dorothy how he could speak if he didnt have a brain, he replied he didn't know, but lots of people without brains do an awful lot of talking. Did I just shoot myself in the foot ! ( no need to answer that) Have a nice day ....as Willy the Shake reminded us...paint a starry night again man Gordon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 12:05:58 +0000 From: "Raffaele Malanga" Subject: Trvelogue Magazine Ad - UK Sirry for not responding earlier. I saw an ad for Travelogue on the UK magazine Uncut - or Q, not really sure. In the back pages among CD reviews. Raffaele (London) _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 14:17:01 -0000 From: "Paul Castle" Subject: Channel 13 ? Just had this question from Gene Shay [I can't keep up at the moment so sorry if this has just been discussed] >Do you know what happened to the Canadian production on Joni? Now, I >understand it will be produced by Channel 13 in New York (Public TV). > A woman called me from 13 and asked if I had any photos of Joni, I sent >her the few that I do have---shots taken backstage with me and Tom Rush at >the Tower Theater, Phila following a concert I produced in the 70s as a >benefit for The Main Point Coffee House. I also had one with Joni, Ed Sciaky >and me, on the steps of the Capitol Building in Washington, DC. That was >during a peace march on Washington---early 80s, I think. Anyone have the latest best to all Paul ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 06:57:05 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Evian takes us down the memory trail I'm probably late on chiming in on this thread, but anyway ... > 10.) Who remembers... lol, now I can't think of her name -- she was a > big Ferron fan... jog my memory. That would be Susan L.A. Chaloner from up Vancouver way. Lori ~ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 07:28:03 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Travelogue Kakki wrote: > It's hard for me to even describe the way it affects me. For a long > time Joni fan it will be like experiencing an exquisite and magical > reincarnation of all those first listens long ago. The orchestration > IMO is a huge part of its magic. Brilliant and original. Yes, Kakki! All of the above. I don't have the CDs yet but I've listened to a few cuts so far (and thank you again, Moni!!) and I'm IN LOVE with it already. The only way *I* can describe this album is to say that it affects me the same way "Man From Mars" does: it causes some sort of not- unpleasant heaviness in my heart, and it makes me want to cry. Maybe it's partly because I have a feeling this album IS Joni's "swan song," at least in terms of commercial releases. Which is sad and fine at the same time. As for Joni's voice, I love the smokiness. So jazzy. As for how it's gotten that way, yeah there are the ciggies to bemoan, but you know ... whatever makes Joni happy makes me happy for her. She deserves happiness. (Don't we all?) Lori NP: "Circle Game" -- OMG! How delicious!! ~ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:37:17 -0000 From: "William" Subject: Tire Skids and Teeth Marks I'm not sure if this should have a no Joni tag or not - I've never had reason to post a NoJoCo one before so forgive me if I should have tagged it. Just in case, this email I received from a friend reminded me of Chinese Cafe, bits of No Apologies and who knows what else. <<>> Forgive me if it's outta place here. WtS ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 10:33:12 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Travelogue Lori writes: << it causes some sort of not-unpleasant heaviness in my heart >> Golly, Lori, that just about sums up 90% of her music for me! Nicely put. XO, --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 10:45:39 -0500 From: Dave Cuneo Subject: [none] Ciao joniphiles, " ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 10:45:55 -0500 From: Dave Cuneo Subject: Recall: Dave Cuneo would like to recall the message, "". ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 07:45:17 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Travelogue's "Hejira" Sorry for the brevity, but all I can really say about this cut is ... WOW. Lori ~ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:52:27 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Recall: yes I am sure we all wish we could recall messages sent in haste. too late tho! Dave Cuneo wrote: > Dave Cuneo would like to recall the message, "". - -- bw colin TANTRA LHASA APSO (reg 1982) colin@tantra-apso.com http://www.tantra-apso.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 10:56:32 -0500 From: Dave Cuneo Subject: time Ciao joniphiles, A joniphile wrote: "I remember the first time I heard For the Roses. I didn't like it. It was a friend's copy and I didn't even buy my own copy until many years later. Now it's my second favorite CD by Joni. (Hejira being first.)" I bought "The Hissing of Summer Lawns around Xmas time 1975 and was turned off by it, like many Joni fans who could not handle Joni's "growth". It was not until around 1988 or so that I came back to it and began to appreciate it. In fact, I sought of gave up on any new Joni past FTR until fall of 1980, when one night I heard "Refuge of the Roads" on the radio in Hawaii and got pulled back in again. But even that album, Hejira, did not "come together" for me until around 1990 or so, although I thought "Refuge" was brilliant from the start. And it is only within the past 6 months that I have begun to listen to "STAS" seriously for the first time - prodded on by all the Joni chatter on the digest. I still refuse to go out and buy CDs of "DJRD" or "Mingus" though - God I hated those albums (except for "Jericho" from DJRD). And since Shadows and Light is mostly stuff from that era, I don't own that either. I came late also to WTRF and DED, but like them both now, and CMIARS, which has flashes of brilliance equal to anything Joni has done (Beat of Black Wings, Number One). Of course, I came late in life to lobster, crab, clams and mussels too! Ciao, dave. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 11:34:54 -0500 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Re: NY Post Gossip Column on Joni's birthday!! >The boy-toy-turned-guru had the NERVE to lecture Jews and >Christians that they have it all wrong and that SHE has found "the truth" >which predates Judaism. Sorry Madonna but the Kabballa doesn't predate >Moses or even Jesus. Larry King just smiled unbelievably and I don't blame >him for not >pursuing the topic further. Larry King never follows up with pertinent questions...at least to my satisfaction. Well...at least she is trying to feed her soul instead of her..NEVER MIND. > Joni is 100% correct in her assessment of Madonna, the music >industry and David Letterman, and I'm just glad that someone of Joni's >calibre has the guts to say it like it is. I love Joni for her guts! But why name names? She can't rant and rail without making it personal? Bree > ET > NP: >http://feature.atlrec.com/buzztone/joni_mitchell/slouchingtowards.swf _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 08:50:34 -0800 From: "gene mock" Subject: Re: Tire Skids and Teeth Marks thanks, like joni said, "we can't return, we can only look from behind from where we came......." boy! if we could only turn back the clock and make things right. take care gene - ----- Original Message ----- From: "William" To: "JMDL" Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 7:37 AM Subject: Tire Skids and Teeth Marks > I'm not sure if this should have a no Joni tag or not - I've > never had reason to post a NoJoCo one before so forgive me if I > should have tagged it. Just in case, this email I received from > a friend reminded me of Chinese Cafe, bits of No Apologies and > who knows what else. > > << > You lived as a child in the 50s or the 60s or earlier. > Looking back, it's hard to believe that we have lived as long as > we have... > As children, we would ride in cars with no seat belts or air > bags. Riding in the back of a pickup truck on a warm day was > always a special treat. > Our baby cribs were covered with bright colored lead-based paint. > We had no childproof lids on medicine bottles, doors, or > cabinets, and when we rode our bikes, we had no helmets. (Not to > mention hitchhiking to town as a young kid!) > We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle. > Horrors. > We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and then > rode down the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes. After > running into the bushes a few times we learned to solve the > problem. > We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as long as > we were back when the streetlights came on. No one was able to > reach us all day. > No cell phones. Unthinkable. We played dodgeball and sometimes > the ball would really hurt. We got cut and broke bones and broke > teeth and there were no law suits from these accidents. They > were accidents. No one was to blame but us. Remember accidents? > We had fights and punched each other and got black and blue and > learned to get over it. We ate cupcakes, bread and butter, and > drank sugar soda but we were never overweight.....we were always > outside playing. We shared one grape soda with four friends, > from one bottle and no one died from this? > We did not have Playstations, Nintendo 64, X Boxes, video games > at all,99 channels on cable, video tape movies, surround sound, > personal cellular phones, Personal Computers, internet chat rooms > ... we had friends. We went outside and found them. We rode > bikes or walked to a friend's home and knocked on the door, or > rung the bell or just walked in and talked to them. > Imagine such a thing. Without asking a parent! By ourselves! Out > there in the cold cruel world! Without a guardian. How did we do > it? > We made up games with sticks and tennis balls and ate worms and > although we were told it would happen, we did not put out very > many eyes, nor did the worms live inside us forever. > Little League had tryouts and not everyone made the team. Those > who didn't had to learn to deal with disappointment..... Some > students weren't as smart as others so they failed a grade and > were held back to repeat the same grade.....Horrors. Tests were > not adjusted for any reason. > Our actions were our own. Consequences were expected. No one to > hide behind. The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke a > law was unheard of. They actually sided with the law, imagine > that! > This generation has produced some of the best risk-takers and > problem solvers and inventors, ever. The past 50 years has been > an explosion of innovation and new ideas. We had freedom, > failure, success and responsibility, and we learned how to deal > with it all. > > Before lawyers and government began to regulate our lives, > for our own good.(?)>>> > > Forgive me if it's outta place here. > WtS ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 12:33:33 -0500 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Speaking about bizarre links... Just stumbled upon this one, titled: Joni Mitchell: A STORMY LOVE AFFAIR WITH CHRIST A bit of a stretch of a review of BSN, believe it or not. (Good old Christians, they can even see Christ in a plate of spaghetti if they try hard enough...) Read the whole piece (if you dare) at: http://users.motion.net/debbie58/joni02.htm Bob NP: The Beatles, "Strawberry Fields Forever" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 09:46:14 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Speaking about bizarre links... > Just stumbled upon this one, titled: > > Joni Mitchell: A STORMY LOVE AFFAIR WITH CHRIST > > A bit of a stretch of a review of BSN, believe it or not. Holy smokes. In fact I think I'LL take up smoking right now. I need SOMEthing to calm me down after reading THAT! Lori ~ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 18:47:49 +0100 From: "Moni Kellermann" Subject: Re: Speaking about bizarre links... > http://users.motion.net/debbie58/joni02.htm Quote: "The great turning point of the CD is A CASE OF YOU. With Christian symbolism dripping all over the lyric, Mitchell becomes a kind of latter-day Mary Magdalene, from whom she receives wise advice: "Go to Him! Be with Him! But be prepared to bleed!" " ROTFL! moni ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 13:3:0 -0500 From: "Christopher Treacy" Subject: Re: Speaking about bizarre links... I repeat, Oy Vasmir. > [Original Message] > From: Moni Kellermann > To: > Date: 11/11/2002 12:47:49 PM > Subject: Re: Speaking about bizarre links... > > > http://users.motion.net/debbie58/joni02.htm > > Quote: > > "The great turning point of the CD is A CASE OF YOU. With Christian > symbolism dripping all over the lyric, Mitchell becomes a kind of latter-day > Mary Magdalene, from whom she receives wise advice: "Go to Him! Be with Him! > But be prepared to bleed!" " > > ROTFL! > > moni - --- Christopher Treacy - --- ctreacy1889@earthlink.net - --- EarthLink: The #1 provider of the Real Internet. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 10:20:08 -0800 (PST) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Re: Speaking about bizarre links... VictorJimfunnyboiBob wrote: Just stumbled upon this one, titled: Joni Mitchell: A STORMY LOVE AFFAIR WITH CHRIST A bit of a stretch of a review of BSN, believe it or not. (Good old Christians, they can even see Christ in a plate of spaghetti if they try hard enough...) Read the whole piece (if you dare) at: http://users.motion.net/debbie58/joni02.htm and after reading "that" all I can say is.............. OY is right!!!!!! yikes!!!!!!!! You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive medley & videos from Greatest Hits CD ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 13:39:13 -0500 From: "blonde in the bleachers" Subject: Re: Tire Skids and Teeth Marks I was not born in the 50s or 60s and am definately a Gen-Xer if you must label me, but growing up I had much of the experiences described below and had parents who held me accountable for my actions....don't count us out yet! There are plenty of risk takers, innovators, and problem solvers out there but you no longer hear about them because news is about what is wrong with this society we live in, not what is right, and and don't pretend that the government and lawyers didn't regulate your life back then, maybe now you are just more aware of it..... >From: "William" >Reply-To: "William" >To: "JMDL" >Subject: Tire Skids and Teeth Marks >Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:37:17 -0000 > >I'm not sure if this should have a no Joni tag or not - I've >never had reason to post a NoJoCo one before so forgive me if I >should have tagged it. Just in case, this email I received from >a friend reminded me of Chinese Cafe, bits of No Apologies and >who knows what else. > ><<> >You lived as a child in the 50s or the 60s or earlier. >Looking back, it's hard to believe that we have lived as long as >we have... >As children, we would ride in cars with no seat belts or air >bags. Riding in the back of a pickup truck on a warm day was >always a special treat. >Our baby cribs were covered with bright colored lead-based paint. >We had no childproof lids on medicine bottles, doors, or >cabinets, and when we rode our bikes, we had no helmets. (Not to >mention hitchhiking to town as a young kid!) >We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle. >Horrors. >We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and then >rode down the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes. After >running into the bushes a few times we learned to solve the >problem. >We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as long as >we were back when the streetlights came on. No one was able to >reach us all day. >No cell phones. Unthinkable. We played dodgeball and sometimes >the ball would really hurt. We got cut and broke bones and broke >teeth and there were no law suits from these accidents. They >were accidents. No one was to blame but us. Remember accidents? >We had fights and punched each other and got black and blue and >learned to get over it. We ate cupcakes, bread and butter, and >drank sugar soda but we were never overweight.....we were always >outside playing. We shared one grape soda with four friends, >from one bottle and no one died from this? >We did not have Playstations, Nintendo 64, X Boxes, video games >at all,99 channels on cable, video tape movies, surround sound, >personal cellular phones, Personal Computers, internet chat rooms >... we had friends. We went outside and found them. We rode >bikes or walked to a friend's home and knocked on the door, or >rung the bell or just walked in and talked to them. >Imagine such a thing. Without asking a parent! By ourselves! Out >there in the cold cruel world! Without a guardian. How did we do >it? >We made up games with sticks and tennis balls and ate worms and >although we were told it would happen, we did not put out very >many eyes, nor did the worms live inside us forever. >Little League had tryouts and not everyone made the team. Those >who didn't had to learn to deal with disappointment..... Some >students weren't as smart as others so they failed a grade and >were held back to repeat the same grade.....Horrors. Tests were >not adjusted for any reason. >Our actions were our own. Consequences were expected. No one to >hide behind. The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke a >law was unheard of. They actually sided with the law, imagine >that! >This generation has produced some of the best risk-takers and >problem solvers and inventors, ever. The past 50 years has been >an explosion of innovation and new ideas. We had freedom, >failure, success and responsibility, and we learned how to deal >with it all. > >Before lawyers and government began to regulate our lives, >for our own good.(?)>>> > >Forgive me if it's outta place here. >WtS - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 13:52:57 -0500 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Speaking about bizarre links... In a message dated 11/11/2002 1:20:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, magsnbrei@yahoo.com writes: > OY is right!!!!!! yikes!!!!!!!! Well, don't be TOO rash, Mags...word on the street has it that Joni's already back in the studio doing her next project, orchestrating the following songs with added lyrical twists: 1. I Had a King of Kings 2. Tin Angel of the Lord 3. My Old Man - Jesus! 4. You Turn Me On, I'm a Radio that only plays bland Christian music 5. Free Man in Jerusalem 6. In France They Pass the Offering Plate 7. Otis & Mary Magdalena 8. Sex Kills, Jesus Saves 9. Urge For Going to Church 10. The Last Time I Saw Jesus I for one can't wait - I'm already tired of listening to this Travelogue thing! ;~) Bob NP: The Beatles, "Three Cool Cats" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 11:04:24 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Miss Bland gordon >Is is negative to be critical? Is it positive to be uncritical? Joni doenst hold back, why should we? (not that we need her permsission). Or am I being too Western in my thought?< actually, i think you are being quite zen in your thought...;~} ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:27:24 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: Speaking about bizarre links... SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > > A bit of a stretch of a review of BSN, believe it or not. (Good old Christians, they can even see Christ in a plate of spaghetti if they try hard enough...) And the right-wing Christians always see Marxists, too, and always as something very very scary. That's strange to me since, on today's political spectrum, Christ is more of a Marxist than a right-wing, individual-above-all capitalist, but right-wing Christians can't seem to grasp that. The more right-wing the writer, the sooner Marxists are mentioned, and a Marxist in a right-winger's view is anyone with even slightly liberal opinions so there are LOTS OF THEM... ooooh those big bad scary Marxists are gonna overrun us all! Save me Jesus from the Marxist hordes worshipping the Dylan! LOL! As though there's not enough real stuff in the world to worry about! "She seems a reluctant Holy Ghost combating the rigors of the Trinity." High praise indeed since the Holy Ghost is one form of God according to Christians. His statement doesn't make much sense, but it does show that the "reviewer" likes Joni so much he considers her a Goddess. Is this guy on the joni list? And this cracked me up: "It's clear that the only male left who could interest Mitchell is Jesus of Nazareth." Well, obviously a Goddess needs a God in order to be satisfied. Mere-man Don from Canada never had a chance. I wonder if this article is in Myrtle's collection. Debra Shea NP: Bruce Cockburn's "Someone I Used to Love" from Dart to the Heart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:28:43 EST From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Re: Miss Bland Gordon Mackie writes: >I thnk it was Fred who said that Joni might hear things that I don't >in Mendoza's orchestrations.Sure, no doubt... and he asked why Joni >would work with him again...I dunno...people end up working with >people for all sorts of reasons...even more than once. All other reasons aside, given Joni's consistently passionate involvement in music, do you think she would hire Mendoza (twice) to shepherd such a vital, monumental task if she wasn't completely thrilled and delighted with his work? Of course not. So doesn't this make you stop and think and reconsider what it is about Mendoza's work that she admires? At worst, your opinion won't change; at best, it will ... and you'll be thrilled and delighted, too. - -Fred ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 16:00:13 EST From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Re: Miss Bland In a message dated 11/11/2002 6:27:01 AM Eastern Standard Time, gordon.mackie@strath.ac.uk writes: > To those who privated the personal insults, sobeit. I'll live. It bothers me that listers would insult you or any other lister for simply offering your opinions or your critique. It seems to me that many of our threads could be construed as criticisms of Joni. When the set-list for Travelogue was announced, didn't we gladly start a discussion about which songs we felt she should have included? Is that not a criticism of her work? If I feel that the arrangement on Amelia is plodding and doesn't serve the song, or have the idea that it would have been really inspired to arrange the song differently, maybe with some vocalizing from the Bulgarian Women's Choir, isn't this the place where I come to share these ideas? Isn't that the fun of the discussion? Or are we only allowed to share our glowing reviews? I don't recall that any of the negative criticism included someone saying they hated Travelogue so much that they'd never listen to Joni again. So what's the big deal? I've been underwhelmed by some of the Travelogue stuff and alternately thrilled by some of it, too! And my personal favorite threads have been when listers share great ideas about how things could be done differently, especially the discussions about who we'd like to hear cover different Joni tunes! So, I'm gonna encourage everyone to post their opinions, positive or negative. I love checking my mail each day and reading all the differing opinions about Travelogue and all things Joni! ken ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 13:08:02 -0800 (PST) From: paul mccloud Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #481 "Joni is 100% correct in her assessment of Madonna, the music industry and David Letterman, and I'm just glad that someone of Joni's calibre has the guts to say it like it " madonna has always made me sick,,. i like laura nyro U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 16:22:37 -0500 From: Relayer211@aol.com Subject: "all the guilty people..." "All the guily people,he said,they've all seen the stain on their daily bread,on their christian name I've cleared my self I sacraficed my blues And you can complete me And I complete you" -Court and Spark I've been thinking about these lyrics.any ideas about what they mean? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 16:37:49 -0500 From: BRYAN8847@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #481 - Joni, Jane & Jesus This is the best part.... God blesses Jane Fonda. Her father's Americanism held sway. Henry Fonda's ghost, with the help of Christ, brought Jane home. Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 14:01:38 -0800 (PST) From: hell Subject: Joni, Jane & Jesus Bryan wrote: > This is the best part.... > > God blesses Jane Fonda. Her father's Americanism held sway. Henry > Fonda's ghost, with the help of Christ, brought Jane home. I don't know, I kind of like: "The CD begins with the bliss of her original success in the Sixties. Apparently, whatever entity ran the universe blessed her with talent, brilliance, beauty and a ruthless business sense. However, since Marxist "Revolutionaries" such as Joan Baez, Bob Dylan and John Lennon dominated that period, Mitchell was swept into a vortex that was entirely godless, thankless, self-pitying, self-entitled and in fact, almost psychotic." Thank god she managed to crawl away from that vortex of psychosis! This is almost funnier that the mental image of Bob Murphy in gold lame! (Almost.....)! Hell ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 17:12:11 EST From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Joni segment on PBS Did anyone else catch the amazing Henry Diltz program on PBS last Friday? He showed brilliant super 8 footage of Joni dancing at a so-cal rocker's party at someone's home in the early 70's with friends and fellow rockers. He had amazing things to say about how beautiful Joni was to photograph--the certain spark about her that is magical when caught on film. It also struck me that there was, in the vintage footage, an element of weariness about Joni-like she was dancing and enjoying herself but then would look around and see that everyone was drunk and high in a way that would bore her. It occurred to me that she really must have felt frustrated as she outgrew her peers, choosing to focus on her art and passion and leave the drunken revelry behind. I think this may be where she really took off artistically and left everyone else in the dust. That footage made it clear that she was the incredibly exceptional genius amongst a group of talented people. You can just see it--it's almost like she appears in color while the crowd remains in black and white. Diltz also talked about the Laurel Canyon photos, and how the Steppenwolf album cover of the time was shot in a burned down house next to Joni's. He also remembered having to take a cab out of Las Vegas with Joni to take pictures of her in the desert, and that she had to pay the cab fare of almost seventy bucks cuz he had no money on him! I hope we can get this segment on one of the tape trees because it was amazing! Ken ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 18:05:12 -0500 From: "PAUL PETERSON" Subject: Re: WalterPhil's post "So Sad" thanks for telling some hard to accept truths about 'our' Joni. I felt the way you write when the Both Sides Now CD first came out, esp after Taming the Tiger which seemed so not up to her usual standard. But I really got into Both Sides Now eventually and the concerts were transcendant, esp Hejira, and Judgement, and Case of You and Both Sides. I'm feeling the way you write about the links to the new CD. I wonder if I will convert to loving them after a few more listenings. Right now tho, it sure sounds like, as someone wrote, Joni-lite. As to her cranky pronouncements, I have always accepted them as another expression of Joni's melancholy world view. I think we all love her music as much for its sadness and the comfort of the words of a kindred spirit always doomed to imperfection. Someone who could write "I guess I never really loved" is going to find a lot to hate about the world we live in. But then I do too. Maybe it's not Madonna, but I could certainly come up with a list. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:20:56 -0800 (PST) From: Jenny Goodspeed Subject: Re: Joni, "an original" You mean I don't have to be at the kid's table for Thanksgiving?! ; ) I want to hear what you all think, mainly because I literally have been thinking about this on and off for weeks and can't seem to come to any kind of conclusion. To me, Hejira sounds like the ground-breaker. But, because I was born 11 months after STAS was released, I'll never know what it was like to hear her for the first time (thanks Kate for saying what it was like). I'm still wondering who laid the ground for her musical work. Dylan opened up the door on lyrics, perhaps Baez and Nyro influenced her vocally - but those chord progressions, where did they come from? The Beatles? Chopin? Or was it as she has said a product of her tunings. Anyone else fascinated with how music evolves? Okay, Jim, tag you're it! Jenny "Jim L'Hommedieu (Lama)" wrote:Goodspeed, let's leave it at what? You didn't SAY anything! What do YOU think? Why did you raise all of these questions for ME to answer? :) C'mon. You've got a fine head on your shoulders! Give it up, girl! You're old enough to sit with the grownups. Speak! Speak! Lama Jenny said, >> So - this all has me thinking - when is an artist ground breaking - when an artist truly comes up with something new or combines influences in a way that has never been done before? Specifically - when do you think Joni broke some ground? And what was her contribution - lyrical...musical. For pop/rock music history buffs - or heck for people who were actually cognizant at the time - how do you see Joni in the context of popular music? How about in music in general? Did she truly become an original right of the bat with STAS - or was that more a logical, albeit creative outflow of what was happening around and before her? I have a zillion other thoughts/questions, but let's leave it at that....>>>> U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive medley & videos from Greatest Hits CD ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:24:46 -0800 (PST) From: Jenny Goodspeed Subject: Re: Joni, "an original" Kate Bennett wrote:i was listening to joni from the moment of her first release...& from the first note of her first song on her first album she was unique...her intelligence & her very visual lyrics, her use of alternative chords (tuned to the sound of the day!) & not going with any method of formulaic songwriting...she painted pictures with her words like no other...> Ah Kate, I'm jealous! Thanks for the info on Sting...I had only ever heard her quote on how Sting is her and JT's child, and I can hear James in some of his work, but I could not hear Joni. But, from the horse's mouth, as it were! Congrats on the great success of the Joni birthday show! You're an inspiration. Jenny U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive medley & videos from Greatest Hits CD ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 18:55:43 -0500 From: ewwt@juno.com Subject: Re: NY Post Gossip Column on Joni's birthday!! << I love Joni for her guts! But why name names? She can't rant and rail without making it personal? >> Hi Bree, Perhaps Joni thinks Madonna epitomizes what's wrong with the music industry today. Or perhaps Joni is following Madonna's example, promoting her new CD with negative controversy. ;~D Eric ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 19:54:38 -0500 From: "Humble tiger" Subject: Re: Tire Skids and Teeth Marks I was a '70's child and I can relate to alot of these memories......I don't think we had an answering machine until the '90's :) Erica <<>> Forgive me if it's outta place here. WtS _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 20:16:17 -0500 From: "Humble tiger" Subject: Re: Joni segment on PBS Ken, I saw this wonderful special a couple of months ago and LOVED it!! I just happened to turn it on and was surprised to see the Joni part of the show. I especially loved the story of Joni footing the cab fare on their trip to the desert outside of Vegas! Erica Did anyone else catch the amazing Henry Diltz program on PBS last Friday? He showed brilliant super 8 footage of Joni dancing at a so-cal rocker's party at someone's home in the early 70's with friends and fellow rockers. He had amazing things to say about how beautiful Joni was to photograph--the certain spark about her that is magical when caught on film. It also struck me that there was, in the vintage footage, an element of weariness about Joni-like she was dancing and enjoying herself but then would look around and see that everyone was drunk and high in a way that would bore her. It occurred to me that she really must have felt frustrated as she outgrew her peers, choosing to focus on her art and passion and leave the drunken revelry behind. I think this may be where she really took off artistically and left everyone else in the dust. That footage made it clear that she was the incredibly exceptional genius amongst a group of talented people. You can just see it--it's almost like she appears in color while the crowd remains in black and white. Diltz also talked about the Laurel Canyon photos, and how the Steppenwolf album cover of the time was shot in a burned down house next to Joni's. He also remembered having to take a cab out of Las Vegas with Joni to take pictures of her in the desert, and that she had to pay the cab fare of almost seventy bucks cuz he had no money on him! I hope we can get this segment on one of the tape trees because it was amazing! Ken _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 20:19:09 -0500 From: Deb Messling Subject: Re: Joni segment on PBS What was the name of this program? At 05:12 PM 11/11/02 -0500, you wrote: >Did anyone else catch the amazing Henry Diltz program on PBS last Friday? - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Deb Messling -^..^- messling@enter.net - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 20:49:57 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Celebrating Joni's birthday Kakki Thanks for the report it sounds like it was just fab. Spoke briefly with Yael today who had a great time there. Wish I could have been there. And Kate thanks for posting the setlist just to rub it in (an old tactic of mine). I am also a big sucker for kids charities. Love Paz on 11/8/02 2:26 AM, kakki at kakkib@vzavenue.net wrote: > Just got home a bit ago from Kate Bennett's 2nd annual tribute to Joni at > Soho in Santa Barbara and fundraiser for music programs in the local > schools. It was really fantastic and Kate and Jeff did a superb job. We > had our first hard pouring rain here in it seems like years and so it was a > challenge getting there and I missed the first hour (which included Yael and > Jim Messina!! argh). Probably before tonight Kate was the almost the only > one who knew Messina produced Joni's first demo. (Not Crosby!). I met up > with Coyote Rick and Yael and Messina had just left their table. He did not > perform but told the story of producing the demo and working with her. Many > of the top Santa Barbara singer-songwriters performed and, of course, Kate > even got Jeff Pevar there, too! The place was absolutely jam-packed but it > was good to see such a turn-out on a stormy night. > > The songs spanned all of Joni's periods and each were introduced with a > reading by Kate. Some standouts for me were Anita Bayley singing > "Electricity" and "For the Roses" absolutely beautifully and perfectly note > for note like the original, Karen Thurber, who reminded me so much of Marian > in her brilliant precision and perfection on "Good Bye Pork Pie Hat," and > then OMG Marcella and George Quirin with friends doing a "Centerpiece" that > was part Tuck & Patti, part Manhattan Transfer and part early Annie Ross. > OMG. I'd noticed George earlier sitting in on dulcimer on "All I Want" and > I thought to myself "he's (our) Victor!" When he later played acoustic > guitar (try to imagine this for that song) on "Centerpiece" better than > Tuck, I again thought "Victor." When I raved to him after the show, he was > so humble and said he'd just learned it today, I knew it he was truly our > local "Victor"! ;-) He and his wife Marcella have a CD called "Clarity" on > sale at Borders. Highly recommend checking them out. > > The performances tonight were taped and I hope there will be a forthcoming > CD. Next year I hope more of the jmdlers can make it. Major kudos to Kate > for an outstanding night! > > Kakki ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #336 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)