From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #303 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, October 15 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 303 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Today's Library Links: October 15 [ljirvin@jmdl.com] Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #425 - comment on the interview, new label, etc. [] Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #425 - BSN in Life as a House [BRYAN8847@aol.com] She's at it again - And a new label ["Kate Bennett" ] One more thing Joni needs..... [BRYAN8847@aol.com] Joni, Tom Petty and the Music Business [Merk54@aol.com] Joni ashamed to be in the music biz ["Laurent Olszer" ] Joni on the music biz [Emily Gray Tedrowe ] Re: Seasonal Joni ["Lori Fye" ] Re: Seasonal Joni [Mags N Brei ] Reuters message boards reactions [Penny ] RE: Reuters message boards reactions ["Victor Johnson" ] Re: One more thing Joni needs..... ["Brenda" ] Re: Joni on the music biz [AzeemAK@aol.com] hold the phone! ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: hold the phone! ["Brenda" ] was hold the phone...Rolling Stone vs. Reuters stories ["Brenda" ] Re: joni is crotchety! [colin ] Re: Miles of Aisles Question ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: joni mention in usa today [] RE: joni is crotchety! ["Heather" ] Re: Seasonal Joni [] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 03:06:39 -0400 From: ljirvin@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Library Links: October 15 On October 15 the following items were published: 1992: "Joni Mitchell subject of music tribute" - Saskatoon StarPhoenix (News Item) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/921015ssp.cfm 1997: "Rocking Gracefully into the Golden Years" - Newhouse News Service (Biography) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/971015nns.cfm - -------- Can you type? http://www.jmdl.com/typing/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 03:23:58 EDT From: BRYAN8847@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #425 - comment on the interview, new label, etc. "I hope it all goes down the crapper." This is a good example of an article making the subject seem a bit more negative than she really was. The interviewer asked JM how she felt about some people's recent comments that "the industry is going down the crapper," or something like that. Joni then answered using the same unsavory language. Anyway, it is overall a very scathing little interview. See the entire interview on rollingstone.com (click on the Women in Rock feature and then Joni's link). Interesting that a new deal with the new label was signed, apparently, at the last minute, just before the new CD release. I guess the artist decided this will not be the swan song and wanted to sign on for multiple releases (my hunch is a total of three on the new contract) and that the powers-that-be at Warner/AOL nudged (or forced) her over to the more boutiquish, less commercial Nonesuch label (which has an impressive lineup of artists but is decidedly less mainstream than Reprise). I suppose the facts around all this will come to light soon enough (if it matters; I am curious at least). Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 03:26:17 EDT From: BRYAN8847@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #425 - BSN in Life as a House In a message dated 10/15/02 12:04:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time, les@jmdl.com writes: > I watched a movie last night with Kevin Kline called Life Is A House and > REALLY enjoyed it for a lot of reasons. In the movie (don't know if this > was > posted before) there was a dance sequence to Joni's Bothe Sides Now. What > is > really strange is that it was a orchestra version but did not sound exactly > like the BSN album release. Has anyone else seen this and noticed the > difference?? I want a copy of this version as it was really cool and very > sparse in it's production. > I don't think it was a different recording. Just an edited one...skipping a verse or two and making it sound like a different version. Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 00:41:53 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: She's at it again - And a new label "I hope it all goes down the crapper. I would never take another deal in the record business, which means I may not record again, or I have to figure out a way to sell over the Net or do something else. But I'll be damned if I'll line their pockets." lol...you go girl...the website is waiting for you! make your own cds! ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 00:42:01 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: vocal range >One more thing, Judy Collins once stated that dairy products were bad for singers!?!?< it causes mucus which gunks everything up... ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 03:31:05 EDT From: BRYAN8847@aol.com Subject: One more thing Joni needs..... .....is Faith Hill's goddamned fucking hype machine. Holy crap, I expect to open my medicine cabinet one morning and be greeted by FAITH HILL THIS AND FAITH HILL THAT. It is relentless. Bryan A Little Cranky, Too ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 04:43:24 -0400 From: Merk54@aol.com Subject: Joni, Tom Petty and the Music Business I haven't had a chance to listen to the new Tom Petty album yet, but based upon what I've read, it is Tom bashing the music business. A couple of the articles I've read praised Tom for fearlessly taking on the music industry. I find it interesting that when others try this, they come across as some sort of heros (Pearl Jam vs. Ticketmaster also comes to mind), but when Joni does it, they portray her as some cranky old bitch, biting the hand that feeds her. But I guess that's the way they've always treated her. She dappled in jazz, and they thought she was crazy. Later on, Sting tried the same thing, and he's a 'genius'. She used African drummers on the Jungle Line, and people think she's gone wacky. Paul Simon used African musicians years later, and he's made the album of the year. Etc. Etc. I guess I'd be a little cranky, too. Jack ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 13:49:07 +0100 From: "Laurent Olszer" Subject: Joni ashamed to be in the music biz As Zappa sang (Roxy 78?): "I have seen hell. I was under contract at Warner Bros for 10 years". Laurent ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 08:07:55 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluor.com Subject: Re: Miles of Aisles Question <> Court & Spark was April '74. MOA was November '74 <> Good point...keep in mind that MOA is not a complete concert. She did play some of the other C&S songs on the tour, for whatever reasons (unfamiliarity, etc) they were not included on the record. Also, Joni & the LA Express had done lots of shows in '74 prior to the C&S release, so they probably had an established setlist that they were comfortable with. This was Joni's first time out with a band, and some of those C&S compositions were pretty complex. I don't know if this is all of the story, I'm just kinda thinking out loud, and of course would be interested in what others have to say. <> Me too...it is very tough to listen with fresh ears to a song that is deeply engrained in your head as sounding a certain way. There's that 'resistance to change' factor, which is especially heightened when we're talking about something as "sacred" as Joni's music. Bob NP: David Cassidy, "Cherish" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 08:25:01 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluor.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #424 - She's at it again - And a new label <> Thanks for sharing this article, Bryan...I take it as a VERY GOOD sign, and have said that it's something that Joni should have done a long time ago. Here's hoping that her marketing strategies change for the better! Also encouraged that it sounds like there's much more to come from her...dare I say it? New songs! There - I said it! ;~) <> Can't blame MTV for this...put the blame on incompetent parenting. MTV was off limits to my son until he was 13 or so. It IS possible to give kids limits and tell them no. And more than possible, it's necessary. But it does require effort! The toughest thing is to talk to your kid's friend's parents to find out what their (and potentially your) child is exposed to. The most amazing thing I found out was how many parents had no problem allowing their kids to watch R-rated videos at 7 or 8 years of age. A 3-year-old watching MTV? Inexcusable. Bob NP: Art Garfunkel, "Scissors Cut" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 13:41:46 +0100 From: LXROSS@ctrl.co.uk Subject: RE: Miles of Aisles Question <> MOA was the first Joni album i listened to...way back when....and as best as memory can serve, i played it all the time, but all the time. i just wouldn't suffer to listen to anything else. i think too that i was doing some serious over-writing of black sabbath and yes who, up til receiving a copy of MOA, were hard coded into the Les psyche at that time. Consequently, the records Joni produced up to this time were among the last i ended up buying and i think to this day, i don't know the Blue version of Blue that well!! What kinda heresy is that???? The MOA versions of all the songs on this compilation have become favourites of mine. Except Woodstock which is complete pants compared to the original which is just spectacular - of course I didn't realise just how pants-like it was until i bought LOTC. However, Joni's version of ACOY on Both Sides Now is wonderful to me and i expect to be similarly 'taken' with some of what Joni does on Travelogue. I don't expect to like them all though. I'm going to have the toughest job with Hejira which for me is an almost holy relic. I'll want to like it, but if it ain't right it ain't eva gonna get listened to again.. I think the most prevalant fear regarding Travelogue is the chance that the versions therein will be ponderous and maudlin. I certainly feel that the only way this project is going to work is if, as happened on BSN, the songs are taken apart and rearranged. As with all such surgery, it isn't going to suit everyone. After all just take the example of other people's version of the JM canon, some people just make a complete arse of their versions. I mean some people just wont be helped. And isn't always down to their ability to sing - god forbid that should be called into question. But some arrangers really need to be......ok enough. Les (london, very much in trepidation over Travelogue and sensitive to the impression created, to wit "who rattled his cage?!" :-)) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 08:48:14 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluor.com Subject: RE: Miles of Aisles Question <> LOL, Les...and God love 'em for it! I enjoy the whole 'arse' collection, which I suppose makes me an "arse-whole". Just putting that out there before Smurf beats me to it! :~) Bob NP: Lucinda Williams, "Essence" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 06:26:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Re: Miles of Aisles Question Bob.Muller@fluor.com wrote: Good point...keep in mind that MOA is not a complete concert. She did play some of the other C&S songs on the tour, for whatever reasons (unfamiliarity, etc) they were not included on the record. Also, Joni & the LA Express had done lots of shows in '74 prior to the C&S release, so they probably had an established setlist that they were comfortable with. This was Joni's first time out with a band, and some of those C&S compositions were pretty complex. I don't know if this is all of the story, I'm just kinda thinking out loud, and of course would be interested in what others have to say. Me too...it is very tough to listen with fresh ears to a song that is deeply engrained in your head as sounding a certain way. There's that 'resistance to change' factor, which is especially heightened when we're talking about something as "sacred" as Joni's music. and now me: First of all , I would like to thank Bob, Jack and Les for helping me decide what Joni to listen to next...lol....ah , the power of suggestion. Here's how I listen to Miles of Aisles ... much of the time I start it at Cactus Tree ... I love the mood /emotions that song evokes in me and it rolls across me in waves from there. I dont know why Joni decided not to do more of Court and Spark on that tour, however, as you say Bob, they had a line up all ready and polished so it makes sense to go with that. As for Travelogue...as I said to someone off list, I feel like a Joni groupie when I talk about the demos we heard last October at the Hommage (wow, a whole year ago!) Anyway....if the CD is ANYTHING like her demos....let me tell you again dear ones...you are in for a treat. (I sound like a broken record). I like that Joni has the chutzpah to re record earlier work. She's playing with familiar territory and yet she creates new moods, new ideas , new interpretations, new ways of saying the same thing... I loved it more than my words can say. I feel okay about it and look so forward. I feel that if this is what she wants to do, that's fine with me. She was so excited while giving us a taste! She is playing with her own notes/music/ and tailoring her present voice around that. I do know what you mean Bob, about having a certain version burned in your head. and yet, Ive never been one to need a cover to sound exactly the same as that one in my head. I look forward to hearing the project with open ears and an open heart. (Not suggesting that you are not.) ..I know that I am still reeling from the experience in Toronto last year . Because Joni's music is so sacred to me (nice way to put it Bob), I think that's why in part, it was so exciting to hear new interpretations. I encourage others who were there to chime in and express their view/opinion too. Mags...listening to Miles of Ailes with headphones on.... a whole new world..the only way i get to really hear lyrics in a deep way anymore. np: Woman of Heart and Mind oh yea. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos, & more faith.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 10:17:00 -0400 From: Emily Gray Tedrowe Subject: Joni on the music biz hi everyone. i have to say, i find joni's ranting and raving about the "cesspool" music industry so tired. it makes me think she doesn't get out much anymore-- what the heck kind of music does she play for herself these days? only her own stuff, dylan's, and...??? that's pretty depressing. why has no one of her crowd found a way to introduce her to all the passionate, artistic, visionary musicians that are recording these days? duh, everyone knows that britney et al. are nothing more than pop guilty pleasures (at best)--it seems so beneath joni to take that on-- such a straw man for her (usually) insightful thinking. and, frankly, it really bugs me when she whines about money, not wanting to "line their pockets," complaining about no royalties, etc. that also makes me think she is losing touch with people who might actually want to buy her music. i realize that she is not insanely wealthy--but is that what she is about now? how confusing! in my opinion, she should remember what it was like to hang out with the waitresses all wearing black diamond earrings, talking about zombies and singapore slings. enough of this "david geffen has more money than i do" crap. i've always found joni's anger refreshing and vital--but this bitterness strikes me as misdirected and irrelevant. wow, sorry for the out-of-nowhere bad mood! - -- emily, in chilly chicago ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 09:48:54 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Seasonal Joni > Any other listers care to weigh in with their seasonal or > environmental associations? In the order in which I became acquainted with them, and the first place I "go" when I hear them: Hejira - summer in Biloxi, Mississippi (Winn-Dixie coldcuts) DJRD - winter in Westby, Montana MOA - autumn in Regina, Saskatchewan FTR - winter in Plentywood, Montana C&S - autumn in Fortuna, North Dakota HOSL - summer, somewhere on an eastern Wyoming highway in a thunderstorm Mingus - summer in North Canton, Ohio (21st birthday gift) STAS - autumn in Phoenix, Arizona Clouds - autumn in Phoenix LOTC - winter in Goodyear, Arizona Blue - summer in Phoenix S&L - winter in Colorado Springs, Colorado WTRF - autumn in Voorhees, New Jersey DED - spring in Bremerhaven and Basdahl, (West) Germany CMIAR - spring in San Antonio, Texas NRH - autumn in Galveston, Texas TI - winter in San Antonio TTT - autumn in San Antonio BSN - winter in Mount Vernon, Virginia Lori, noticing her list is something of a travelogue, in Maryland ~ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 10:47:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Re: Seasonal Joni Lori Fye wrote: > Any other listers care to weigh in with their seasonal or > environmental associations? In the order in which I became acquainted with them, and the first place I "go" when I hear them: Hejira - summer in Biloxi, Mississippi (Winn-Dixie coldcuts) DJRD - winter in Westby, Montana MOA - autumn in Regina, Saskatchewan FTR - winter in Plentywood, Montana C&S - autumn in Fortuna, North Dakota HOSL - summer, somewhere on an eastern Wyoming highway in a thunderstorm Mingus - summer in North Canton, Ohio (21st birthday gift) STAS - autumn in Phoenix, Arizona Clouds - autumn in Phoenix LOTC - winter in Goodyear, Arizona Blue - summer in Phoenix S&L - winter in Colorado Springs, Colorado WTRF - autumn in Voorhees, New Jersey DED - spring in Bremerhaven and Basdahl, (West) Germany CMIAR - spring in San Antonio, Texas NRH - autumn in Galveston, Texas TI - winter in San Antonio TTT - autumn in San Antonio BSN - winter in Mount Vernon, Virginia Lori, noticing her list is something of a travelogue, in Maryland wow Loir. .. what a memory you have! And that IS a travelogue!! The two Joni albums (and they were albums at the time) that stick out for me are more about my "place" in time , than place i was living. fine line between them. No surprise here at all because Ive talked about them openly on the list many times. Blue and Court and Spark were my sanity saving as anything during the time I lived in an attic apartment awaiting the birth of my first born child. (my own little green). I didnt know that Joni had lost a child to adoption at that time, I just remember feeling so much comfort in her words, oh how i felt joy as well as sorrow in anticipation. All that mixed in, mixed up. The sheer and sparkling joy of being pregnant, the butterflies in my tumm excitement over having that *first* child..sorrow for all of the ritual things that could have/would have/should have been in place for me however, they were not. It's all history now, all behind me..okay if that's true, then why does little green keep shining through my window when i least expect him to? *big smiles* . Anyway, I especially loved River as well, for obvious reasons, and my heart would break especially when she sings of wanting that river to sail away on. oh the agony in her soul. I think of spring when i think of Court and Spark, and happier times, times when i felt on the brink of life because that's when I heard it first, then it became the twin sister to Blue later on in that year and into the next spring when little green flew away. Mags ~ You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos, & more faith.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 13:42:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Penny Subject: Reuters message boards reactions Hi y'all! Thanks Les, for posting the current RS article on the website and Brian(?, I've got a bad memory and just resubbed to the list so it's harder for me to look-up who sent it in :), for posting the Reuters release he sent in last night. Anyway, if you have a disire to read more Joni content and some of the reactions to last night's Reuters article, the message boards there are jumping. Here's the link and one example. The pro/con have been pretty evenly split from what I've read there so far. Peace, Penny http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=768&e=3&cid=769&u=/nm/20021014/music_nm/leisure_mitchell_dc Re: I always thought she was overrated by: PapiBear (35/M/United States of America) 10/15/02 04:18 am Msg: 38 of 237 2 recommendations >>it takes a quite a bit of time (and work) to figure her work out. most people don't have the patience or brain capacity... << You left out "the desire". Most people would prefer to enjoy music, even complex, thoughtful music, rather than take a long time and work to "figure it out". Most folks don't consider music to be a math problem or a philosophical dissertation. They just want to hear a good tune and tap their toes, or be moved by the emotions of a song. Not sent into therapy about it. Now don't get me wrong; I can enjoy deep, rich, thoughtful music that lasts for generations, but I think to arbitrarily dismiss every songwriter besides herself and Bob Dylan is, well, myopic and selfish. And frankly, I'm not really interested in either hearing the music of or providing financial support to an artist so enamored with herself that she sees fit to be dismissive of people who admire her work. I won't deny her musical talent; that's a given. But as a person, I don't think I'd want to sit next to her on a bus or share a lunch with her. If she can't be grateful for the attention and adulation and respect she DOES have from millions, well, then she's more blind than Stevie Wonder. By the way, she didn't seem to throw a tizzy when Janet Jackson sampled her music in a dance song a couple years ago. If I'm not mistaken, Janet Jackson is one of those people who've assisted MTV and the rest of the music industry become a "pornographic cesspool". I believe Janet's brother is well known for his crotch-grabbing, in fact. Gee, funny how money tends to turn people into incredible hypocrites, huh? Posted as a reply to: Msg 18 by wsidechris Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:32:34 -0700 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: RE: Reuters message boards reactions Anyway, if you have a disire to read more Joni content and > some of the reactions to last night's Reuters article, the message boards > there are jumping. Here's the link and one example. The pro/con have > been pretty evenly split from what I've read there so far. I read a few of them. One person who apparently doesn't care for her says her voice sounds like a French police siren. I thought that was somewhat of a weird analogy...a bit extreme in my opinion (even if they don't like her voice.) Victor - --- Victor Johnson - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com "Roses wait for the springtime, They sleep beneath the ground. They hear March winds a callin' For the sun to come around."vlj Visit http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 14:40:22 -0700 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: Joni on the music biz and it going in the crapper On 15 Oct 2002 at 10:17, Emily Gray Tedrowe wrote: > hi everyone. > > i have to say, i find joni's ranting and raving about the "cesspool" > music industry so tired. it makes me think she doesn't get out much > anymore-- what the heck kind of music does she play for herself these > days? only her own stuff, dylan's, and...??? that's pretty > depressing. why has no one of her crowd found a way to introduce her > to all the passionate, artistic, visionary musicians that are > recording these days? duh, everyone knows that britney et al. are > nothing more than pop guilty pleasures (at best)--it seems so beneath > joni to take that on-- such a straw man for her (usually) insightful > thinking. > > and, frankly, it really bugs me when she whines about money, not > wanting to "line their pockets," complaining about no royalties, etc. > that also makes me think she is losing touch with people who might > actually want to buy her music. i realize that she is not insanely > wealthy--but is that what she is about now? how confusing! in my > opinion, she should remember what it was like to hang out with the > waitresses all wearing black diamond earrings, talking about zombies > and singapore slings. enough of this "david geffen has more money > than i do" crap. > > i've always found joni's anger refreshing and vital--but this > bitterness strikes me as misdirected and irrelevant. > > wow, sorry for the out-of-nowhere bad mood! > Emily, I'm not in a bad mood and I couldn't agree with you more. Unfortunately (or, maybe fortunately) I've been under a tight deadline for the last week so I'll have to keep this brief. 1) Joni has made millions of dollars from the music industry. Far more than just about all of the recording artists she complains about and criticizes. 2) The music industry has been the same "cesspool" for years. If it's so bad, why make any deal at all? Why not ask Warners to let her buy "Travelogue" from them and put it out herself? Why does she continue to be such an armchair jockey instead of putting her money where her mouth is? 3) Any musician who wants to sell music in music retail stores (not just at shows or on the net) SHOULD NOT wish for the demise of the industry. If the major labels aren't there to deliver the bulk of the music that retailers sell, there will be NO music retail. OK...back to work. Brenda n.p.: Bjork - "Unravel" - ------------------------------ Coincidence is God's way of remaining anonymous. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:43:15 EDT From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: check out this article in Billboard about Richard X Heyman Joni content Check out this great article about my friend Richard in the most recent Billboard! Joni content alert!! Billboard October 19, 2002, page 52 Words & Music by Jim Bessman Heyman's Heyday: Acclaimed New York singer/songwriter Richard X. Heyman, whose previous album, Cornerstone (1998), was on now-defunct label Permanent Press, suddenly has a new album out (Basic Glee, on his own Turn-Up Records); a companion disc on the way, thanks to novel self-marketing; and an autobiography, Boom Harangue - Life in Mid-Century Through The Eyes of a Rock'n'Roll Survivor (Writers Club Press). The book, baby boomer Heyman notes, comprises "short stories dealing with my brushes with fame and the funny things that happened growing up as a musician in the '60s." A guitarist who started playing drums when he was 7, Heyman has plenty of memories on which to draw. "I look pretty young but I'm just backdated," the still-boyish artist says, stealing a lyric from the Who's "Substitute." While he does not divulge his exact age, he's decidedly proud of having made it through the '60s and offers many entertaining stories from that period. One concerns an opening stint for the Beach Boys by his band the Doughboys (shortly after a name change from the Ascots, which had recorded a pair of singles for Bell Records): After breaking a borrowed floor tom, the group withstood an angry assault by its irate owner, Beach Boys drummer Dennis Wilson. Heyman also declares his "worship" of Joni Mitchell. "I learned to play piano from [Mitchell's 1970 album] Ladies of the Canyon - that and the Band's second album really hit home in terms of song composition," he says. "I used to listen to what she was doing with her left hand, learned how her chords flowed, and adapted it: The way you play piano affects the way you write, because you write within your ability. Listening to Joni expanded my ability." Heyman eventually switched to guitar and began writing "what I call 'melodic pop music,'" he says. His new album was recorded at his East Village Tabby Road home studio; he and wife Nancy Leigh (also his bass player/engineer) are big cat lovers. But they cut 34 tracks for the 14-song disc, and 14 of the remainder will soon end up on Rightovers ("as opposed to Leftovers," Heyman says). "I did a presale on Basic Glee involving two different [fan] clubs," Heyman explains. "For $25, the 'Basic Glee booster' received an autographed copy . For $50, the 'Basic Glee choir member' got the autographed copy, their name in the liner notes, and the exclusive Rightovers." But Heyman notes that Rightovers may appear in general release as well. "Ironically, people who have heard it already say it may be the best thing I've ever done," he says, "since the songs are more adventurous and daring - - and not what I would normally include on my albums." Meanwhile, the Arrex Aitch Music (BMI) writer has been promoting Basic Glee on his richardxheyman.com website and at "house concerts" in fans' living rooms. "They invite all their friends, and it's so intimate that sometimes we don't even use a PA," says Heyman, whose recent house concert in Louisville, Ky., was lensed for a segment on an upcoming episode of the PBS series Right on the Money - about artists who promote their work in atypical ways. ~rose ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:45:23 -0400 From: vince Subject: WB Penny! Penny! About time you came back! Good to see your name again in my inbox! Vince ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 15:15:09 -0700 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: One more thing Joni needs..... On 15 Oct 2002 at 3:31, BRYAN8847@aol.com wrote: > .....is Faith Hill's goddamned fucking hype machine. Holy crap, I > expect to open my medicine cabinet one morning and be greeted by FAITH > HILL THIS AND FAITH HILL THAT. It is relentless. > The problem is Joni doesn't seem even remotely interested in feeding the machine like Faith does. I mean, can you just see Joni doing an easy, breezy beautiful Cover Girl commercial with Queen Latifah? ; ) B n.p.: Bjork - "Pluto" - -------------------------------------------- "Radio has no future" - Lord Kelvin, 1897 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 18:30:35 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni on the music biz In a message dated 15/10/2002 15:17:45 GMT Daylight Time, ekg200@nyu.edu writes: << i have to say, i find joni's ranting and raving about the "cesspool" music industry so tired. it makes me think she doesn't get out much anymore-- what the heck kind of music does she play for herself these days? only her own stuff, dylan's, and...??? I was beginning to wonder whether I was exaggerating the extent to which she has carped about the music business and complained there's nothing worth listening to around - some hope! I do wish she'd stop moaning about it as well, it is so unclassy. The old cliche about "she should get out more" does seem apt. There is PLENTY of good music out there, in and out of record shops. There are PLENTY of people making music far more interesting than you've been making recently. Go and give them a try, you have nothing to fear! Azeem in London NP: Eyes Wide Shut ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 15:46:21 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: hold the phone! RS "Mitchell also lambasted MTV, complaining that her three-year-old granddaughter is already grabbing her crotch and dancing, imitating the video clips played on the music cable network." this doesn't mean the child's parents are letting the child watch these videos!...she might be hanging out with kids whose older siblings watch MTV & do the crotch grab...correct me if i am wrong but this statement led someone here to assume that the child's mother was lame for letting her watch mtv? whoa...big leaps of assumptions going on here! RS "In holding up Bob Dylan and herself as the standard for songwriting, she has written off devotees like Sting, Alanis Morissette and Sheryl Crow." the above is the writers opinion, a writer for rolling stone btw...i'd be more inclined to be upset at joni if i read what she ACTUALLY said in the context of an interview (& i do know she disses people which i aggree is totally uneccessary)...however...writers choose words according to their own agenda...for instance in the very first quote above, the writer could have said 'mitchell chided or was saddened...rather than lambasted...so the writers choice of words puts the subject (joni) in the light he chooses to put her...i read what writers say joni said with a very critical eye...no wonder she gets upset at being misunderstood... RS "Mitchell has also previously savaged her former label boss David Geffen for not paying her any royalties, although he has countered that her albums never sold enough copies to cover the advance payments that she received from him." i know people get tired of hearing her complain about this but again this writer has chosen a very deliberately negative word- savaged...i think this writer has an attitude & an agenda... major labels are notorious for withholding royalties & altering the math in their favor...i'd be willing to guess that it isn't the money joni is upset about as much as the the sleezy assed business practices of a so called former friend.... ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 15:55:41 -0700 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: hold the phone! On 15 Oct 2002 at 15:46, Kate Bennett wrote: > > RS "Mitchell has also previously savaged her former label boss David > Geffen for not paying her any royalties, although he has countered > that her albums never sold enough copies to cover the advance payments > that she received from him." > > i know people get tired of hearing her complain about this but again > this writer has chosen a very deliberately negative word- savaged...i > think this writer has an attitude & an agenda... major labels are > notorious for withholding royalties & altering the math in their > favor...i'd be willing to guess that it isn't the money joni is upset > about as much as the the sleezy assed business practices of a so > called former friend.... > I agree with you on the selectiveness of the quotes. It's hard to know who said what. Whether she brought it up or the writer just decided to include it, this Geffen thing is such ancient history, it's ridiculous to see it even talked about in the context of what's going on with Joni today. B - -------------------------------------------- "Radio has no future" - Lord Kelvin, 1897 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 16:28:43 -0700 From: "Brenda" Subject: was hold the phone...Rolling Stone vs. Reuters stories On 15 Oct 2002 at 15:46, Kate Bennett wrote: > > RS "In holding up Bob Dylan and herself as the standard for > songwriting, she has written off devotees like Sting, Alanis > Morissette and Sheryl Crow." > > the above is the writers opinion, a writer for rolling stone btw... Just thought I'd point out that there are two different stories. The Rolling Stone one, which you'll find here: http://www.rollingstone.com/features/coverstory/featuregen.asp?pid=1250 And the Reuters one which is here: http://news.yahoo.com/?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20021014/en_nm/leisure_mitchell_dc_2 David Wild wrote the Rolling Stone one but the Reuters piece is an unattributed wire story (which does not read like Wild at all and may not be from a RS writer). It hacks up the RS interview and makes it look much worse than what it was (except that last paragraph in the RS story). (Wonder is Bravo picked up Musicians...would be nice if Wild had Joni on there.) OK....my flurry is over....back to work. B n.p.: Talvin Singh featuring Leone - "Distant God" - ------------------------------ Coincidence is God's way of remaining anonymous. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 20:51:06 -0400 From: "patrick leader" Subject: RE: travelogue, was Miles of Aisles Question first, i usually don't chime in on the birthday parade, but roberto, les r and maggie? that's a sweet trio of libras! warm thoughts to all of you... >I'm going to have the toughest job >with Hejira which for me is an almost holy relic. I'll want to >like it, but >if it ain't right it ain't eva gonna get listened to again.. > those of us who saw the orchestra tour and/or scored tapes of shows from it are not worried about hejira. that song is sacred joni for me as well, but the orchestra version i love-loved live. it's based on that late eighties jam session she had with shorter, hancock and mcferrin on the song, in a latin dance rhythm. it works perfectly, as far as i'm concerned. you can assuage your fears about 'be cool' and 'for the roses' as well. the folks who are fond of 'judgement' seemed happy with its orchestral incarnation, too. i'm really excited about travelogue. it seems just brilliant to me that she's doing 'slouching toward bethlehem'. some other choices really excite me, as well. i'm also just really thrilled that she's putting another vocal version down of some of these songs. the only thing i'm dreading is songs i don't like much, particularly 'sex kills'. i like bsn very much, but i think she was singing the standards so much better a year later. i wish she had taken the orchestral versions of a lot of travelogue on tour before recording. i don't know if that would have been financially feasable, but i wish... that's why i'm glad she's sung the songs so much in other settings. at least there's a comfort level. patrick, rambling a bit... np - glass - dance #5 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 21:03:44 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: hold the phone! **she might be hanging out with kids whose older siblings watch MTV & do the crotch grab...correct me if i am wrong but this statement led someone here to assume that the child's mother was lame for letting her watch mtv? whoa...big leaps of assumptions going on here!** Kate, the girl is THREE! What if she were hanging out with "older siblings" who were watching a porno movie? I'm not singling out Kilauren, I'm saying that a 3-year-old has no business watching MTV, and if she is, then the parents are not doing their job, whether Daisy's sitting on her lap watching it or whether Kilauren has turned her over to whoever to babysit. It's bad parenting in my book (but don't get me wrong, it's very common parenting). Where's Julie Z. Webb when you need her? ;~) > **i know people get tired of hearing her complain about this but again this > writer has chosen a very deliberately negative word- savaged...i think this > writer has an attitude & an agenda...** The same writer intros the interview with "Let's face the facts: Joni Mitchell is one of the greatest songwriters ever - no gender required." I found the piece to be very positive. Like Brenda said, the "Reuters" edit puts a bit of a different spin on it. The issue also names Blue as the #2 Essential Album (Aretha's "I Never Loved A Man..." is #1), and there are more Joni mentions throughout than Patels in the New Delhi phone book. They mention her recording STAS as a defining moment in history, and there are a couple of good pics too, including the one which accompanies the interview which is beautiful and in which Joni makes no attempt to cover her age (unlike Stevie Nicks who has so much makeup caked on you have to just take their word for it that's it her! LOL Nikki!) Bob NP: Bruce, "Empty Sky" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 21:03:15 -0400 From: Yael Harlap Subject: joni is crotchety! ><granddaughter is already grabbing her crotch and dancing, imitating the >video clips played on the music cable network.>> i love joni but i have to say... she doesn't sound like anyone i would want to know personally, based on her crotchety attitude! who'd have thought joni would think that 'grabbing her crotch and dancing' is that horrible? i'm surprised joni would rather complain about explicit sexuality than explicit violence. i mean, i'm not surprised by that it LOTS of people, but in joni... it surprises me. the grouchy lady. ;-) - -yael ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 02:11:53 +0100 From: colin Subject: Re: joni is crotchety! > who'd have thought joni would think that 'grabbing her crotch and dancing' is > that horrible? > I'd be more surprised if she didn't think that a 3 year old grabbing her crotch whilst dancing was horrible..... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 18:45:15 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Miles of Aisles Question > Good point...keep in mind that MOA is not a complete concert. She did play > some of the other C&S songs on the tour, for whatever reasons > (unfamiliarity, etc) they were not included on the record. Also, Joni & the > LA Express had done lots of shows in '74 prior to the C&S release, so they > probably had an established setlist that they were comfortable with. This > was Joni's first time out with a band, and some of those C&S compositions > were pretty complex. I used to think it was odd that there wasn't more than one C&S song on MoA. I also thought that maybe the complexities of the arrangements made them more difficult to perform live. C&S is fitted together like a Bach piece or like clockwork to my ears. It would be very difficult to reproduce that precision I suppose. But not impossible. As some of the live performances from that tour attest, Joni did perform other numbers from C&S and judging from some of the tape trees and the video from the BBC, they worked just fine in concert. I've come to the conclusion that either Joni or Asylum decided that it was pointless and maybe not wise from a marketing standpoint to put a lot of songs on a live album from a record that had just been released. As it is, MoA serves as a pretty good retrospective of her music up to C&S. If somebody had bought C&S as their first Joni album (as I did), fell completely in love with it (as I did) and then got MoA, wouldn't it follow that they would want to hear the earlier albums that those live versions came from (as I did)? Mark E in Seattle still waiting for Lama's *real* review of the Cowboy Junkies' concert ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:16:25 +0800 (PHT) From: Subject: Re: joni mention in usa today Joseph, > if you're in tight with the Dawn Upshaw community, see what you can do! > :~) > I'll do what I can for your Covers Project, Bob. By the way, one member said that she heard Upshaw in one recital do "a Joni song about skating away forever". I don't know if classical recitalists' performance get recorded for posterity or if there are existing copies of the recital's transcripts, but I would really want to hear how Upshaw's ultra-sleek voice covered "River". Joseph np: Jean-Yves Thibaudet "Conversations with Bill Evans" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 23:00:54 -0400 From: "Heather" Subject: RE: joni is crotchety! a 3 year old what? - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of colin Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 9:12 PM To: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: joni is crotchety! > who'd have thought joni would think that 'grabbing her crotch and dancing' is > that horrible? > I'd be more surprised if she didn't think that a 3 year old grabbing her crotch whilst dancing was horrible..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 11:07:25 +0800 (PHT) From: Subject: Re: Seasonal Joni As a geographer by profession I am drawn to the unique interface of place and music ion JOni's writing. What I want to know are the places Joni went to when she was ariting songs for specific albums. Or were songs more like stream-of-consciousness transcriptions? I know of a lot of artists who were able to compose songs while waiting in the airports (i.e. Julia Fordham, Jim Chappell, Peter Kater, etc.). But the places where Joni was shen she wrote songs for specific albums are intriguing. And Lori, what a great memory you have! Let me see, what did I have for dinner..? :) Joseph obviously not a songwriter > Lori Fye wrote: >> Any other listers care to weigh in with their seasonal or >> environmental associations? > > In the order in which I became acquainted with them, and the first > place I "go" when I hear them: > > Hejira - summer in Biloxi, Mississippi (Winn-Dixie coldcuts) > DJRD - winter in Westby, Montana > MOA - autumn in Regina, Saskatchewan > FTR - winter in Plentywood, Montana > C&S - autumn in Fortuna, North Dakota > HOSL - summer, somewhere on an eastern Wyoming highway in a thunderstorm > Mingus - summer in North Canton, Ohio (21st birthday gift) > STAS - autumn in Phoenix, Arizona > Clouds - autumn in Phoenix > LOTC - winter in Goodyear, Arizona > Blue - summer in Phoenix > S&L - winter in Colorado Springs, Colorado > WTRF - autumn in Voorhees, New Jersey > DED - spring in Bremerhaven and Basdahl, (West) Germany > CMIAR - spring in San Antonio, Texas > NRH - autumn in Galveston, Texas > TI - winter in San Antonio > TTT - autumn in San Antonio > BSN - winter in Mount Vernon, Virginia ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #303 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? 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