From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #179 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Friday, June 21 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 179 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Borderline talk [Nuriel Tobias ] Bad read [Pearlz2swine@aol.com] rainy night house ["J.David Sapp" ] Fwd: [antonioni] Bergman on Antonioni and others [Relayer211@aol.com] Re:joni not particularly attractive physically? [WARREN901@aol.com] Re: joni not particularly attractive physically? [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] RE: Joni not particularly attractive physically? ["Aldridge, Phil" ] Re: joni not particularly attractive physically? ["Victor Johnson" ] Re: rainy night house ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Bad read ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Re:joni not particularly attractive physically? ["Mark or Travis" Subject: Borderline talk hello friends, could you help me understand something? It's about Borderline the song. What is that "borderline" that Joni's sees running down the table? This whole song is a riddle to me. it's combining personal and philosophical ideas that i can not put together. Love to know your ideas and opinions on the song, now that we know it'll appear on Joni's new album. yours as always, nuri _____________________________________________________________ Free email, web pages, news, entertainment, weather and MORE! Check out -------------------------------> http://wowmail.com _____________________________________________________________ Promote your group and strengthen ties to your members with email@yourgroup.org by Everyone.net http://www.everyone.net/?btn=tag ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 11:13:09 EDT From: Pearlz2swine@aol.com Subject: Bad read I am reading shadows and light and find it really disappointing even though I am savoring every word and don't want it to end. Seems that reading and talking about her just isn't as satisfying as listening. I am a rabid fan..love Hissing...started with Blue when I was eleven. I was just in Los Angeles and I felt so close to Joni I almost kissed a sunset pig! Ive been listening to Bruce Cockburn "lovers in a dangerous time" Is there any connection between these 2 Canadians? The acoustic version of that song seems so joniesque to me.(i am addicted to it) I am new here..please visit my paintings and poetry at www.seegod.net .Thanks to those who wrote to me and apologies to those I didn't write back. Is this considered Joni content? Pearl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 11:15:37 -0500 From: "J.David Sapp" Subject: rainy night house thanks to michael o'malley's beautiful compilation, Joni's piano, i have been rediscovering rainy night house. hearing it as the first cut gives it a new freshness. that is one of the beauties of Joni's work. for me a tune can lie dormant for many, many years and then something prompts a rediscovery. anyway rainy night house is my current choice as the best example of how Joni paints with words and music. the piano at times sounds like rain falling - particularly after the line "To see who in the world I might be". the vocal harmony at the close sounds like a bizarrely beautiful gothic church choir. but the words that set the mood for me are "and left you with your father's gun alone" they don't seem directly related to any other lyric, but the words evoke a sinister darkness - is someone suicidal? is someone homicidal? is it irrelevant? also listen to the way she phrases Florida and Arizona - very unusual and provocative. its a masterpiece. thanks Joni. peace, david ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 12:06:21 EDT From: Relayer211@aol.com Subject: Fwd: [antonioni] Bergman on Antonioni and others In a message dated 6/20/2002 7:51:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, YoDasling@aol.com writes: > Vitti was a terrible actress." Return-Path: Received: from rly-xf02.mx.aol.com (rly-xf02.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.226]) by air-xf04.mail.aol.com (v86_r1.13) with ESMTP id MAILINXF41-0620075129; Thu, 20 Jun 2002 07:51:29 2000 Received: from n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com (n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com [66.218.66.73]) by rly-xf02.mx.aol.com (v86_r1.13) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINXF22-0620075111; Thu, 20 Jun 2002 07:51:11 -0400 X-eGroups-Return: sentto-412522-267-1024573835-relayer211=aol.com@return s.groups.yahoo.com Received: from [66.218.67.199] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jun 2002 11:50:35 -0000 X-Sender: YoDasling@aol.com X-Apparently-To: antonioni@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_3_2); 20 Jun 2002 11:50:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 24289 invoked from network); 20 Jun 2002 11:50:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jun 2002 11:50:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jun 2002 11:50:32 -0000 Received: from YoDasling@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.21.) id r.4f.1f34ae33 (4322) for ; Thu, 20 Jun 2002 07:50:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4f.1f34ae33.2a431b85@aol.com> To: antonioni@yahoogroups.com X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows sub 114 From: YoDasling@aol.com X-Yahoo-Profile: yodasling MIME-Version: 1.0 Mailing-List: list antonioni@yahoogroups.com; contact antonioni-owner@yahoogroups.com Delivered-To: mailing list antonioni@yahoogroups.com Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 07:50:29 EDT Subject: [antonioni] Bergman on Antonioni and others Reply-To: antonioni@yahoogroups.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Bergman gave an interview on Sunday. His opinons about film makers, especially Antonioni should cause some discussion. I have to say I really agree with his opinion of Citizen Kane, which I've always regarded as theatre and not film. (Has anyone see Szabo's Colonel Redl which is very similar to Citizen Kane and makes Citizen Kane look like a kiddies film?) Excerpts from an interview with Ingmar Bergman with Jan Aghed in Swedish morning paper Sydsvenska Dagbladet, Sunday June 17, 2002. Background: For many years, Ingmar Bergman has been residing on the remote Swedish island of Farv. The small island only has a few people living there all-year, and Bergman is one of them. On the island, he also has his own movie theatre, where he often has private screenings, since he's so far off from any major city and wants to keep up with the new interesting releases. As a token of appreciation for all he's done for Swedish cinema during the years, all the distributors and theatre chains in the country occassionally send him reels to watch. Bergman might be old, but he's still very interested in new films, and apprently he watches a lot. About Orson Welles: "Bergman: For me he's just a hoax. It's empty. It's not interesting. It's dead. Citizen Kane, which I have a copy of - is all the critics' darling, always at the top of every poll taken, but I think it's a total bore. Above all, the performances are worthless. The amount of respect that movie's got is absolutely unbelievable. Aghed: How about The Magnificent Ambersons? Bergman: Nah. Also terribly boring. And I've never liked Welles as an actor, because he's not really an actor. In Hollywood you have two categories, you talk about actors and personalities. Welles was an enormous personality, but when he plays Othello, everything goes down the drain, you see, that's when he's croaks. In my eyes he's an infinitely overrated filmmaker." About Michelangelo Antonioni: "Bergman: He's done two masterpieces, you don't have to bother with the rest. One is Blow-Up, which I've seen many times, and the other is La Notte, also a wonderful film, although that's mostly because of the young Jeanne Moreau. In my collection I have a copy of Il Grido, and damn what a boring movie it is. So devilishly sad, I mean. You know, Antonioni never really learned the trade. He concentrated on single images, never realising that film is a rhythmic flow of images, a movement. Sure, there are brilliant moments in his films. But I don't feel anything for L'Avventura, for example. Only indifference. I never understood why Antonioni was so incredibly applauded. And I thought his muse Monica Vitti was a terrible actress." About Federico Fellini: "Bergman: We were supposed to collaborate once, and along with Kurosawa make one love story each for a movie produced by Dino de Laurentiis. I flew down to Rome with my script and spent a lot of time with Fellini while we waited for Kurosawa, who finally couldn't leave Japan because of his health, so the project went belly-up. Fellini was about to finish Satyricon. I spent a lot of time in the studio and saw him work. I loved him both as a director and as a person, and I still watch his movies, like La Strada and that childhood rememberance - what's that called again? The interviewer has also seen the movie several times, but just now the title slips his mind. Bergman laughs delightedly. Bergman: Great that you're also a bit senile! That pleases me. (Later the same day, several hours after the interview, the phone rings. It's Bergman. 'AMARCORD!' he shouts.)" About Francois Truffaut: "Bergman: I liked Truffaut a lot, I've felt a lot of admiration for his way to address the audience, and his storytelling. La nuit amiricaine [Day for Night] is adorable, and another film I like to see is L'Enfant sauvage, with its fine humanism." About Jean-Luc Godard: "Bergman: I've never gotten anything out of his movies. They have felt constructed, faux intellectual and completely dead. Cinematographically uninteresting and infinitely boring. Godard is a fucking bore. He's made his films for the critics. One of the movies, Masculin/Fiminin, was shot here in Sweden. It was mindnumbingly boring." About Andrei Tarkovsky: "Late one evening in 1971, Bergman and his friend and director Kjell Grede by pure coincidence stumbled upon a copy of Andrei Rublev in a screening room at Svensk Filmindustri. They saw it without any subtitles. He ranks it to be one of his most startling and unforgettable movie experiences ever." About modern American cinema: "Bergman: Among today's directors I'm of course impressed by Steven Spielberg and Scorsese, and Coppola, even if he seems to have ceased making films, and Steven Soderbergh - they all have something to say, they're passionate, they have an idealistic attitude to the filmmaking process. Soderbergh's Traffic is amazing. Another great couple of examples of the strength of American cinema is American Beauty and Magnolia." - ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Free $5 Love Reading Risk Free! Click Here! - ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Community email addresses: Post message: antonioni@onelist.com Subscribe: antonioni-subscribe@onelist.com Unsubscribe: antonioni-unsubscribe@onelist.com List owner: antonioni-owner@onelist.com Shortcut URL to this page: http://www.onelist.com/community/antonioni Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 16:36:19 EDT From: WARREN901@aol.com Subject: Re:joni not particularly attractive physically? mack, how could you...joni not attractive...such blashphemy !!! i have always thought joni to be beautiful both inside and out. when i first started listening to joni in 1970, at the ripe old age of 15, i thought she was the epitome of the beautiful blonde hippie chick. i remember looking at photos of her and thinking no other woman could be this gorgeous. when we got tickets to see her in concert, at duke university in 1974, i couldn't wait to see the beauty in the flesh! we made a banner from an old sheet on which we painted, we could drink a case of you, and i bought a dozen roses to present to joni at the concert. when the day arrived we packed up our car with a picnic and made the 45 minute trip to durham hours ahead of time. my friends thought i was crazy to think that i would be able to meet joni and present her with the roses but i knew i was going to do just that ! we ate our picnic and proceeded to the back of the venue about an hour before the concert was scheduled to begin and i nervously await the arrival of my idol. as concert time neared my impatient friends kept saying we had missed her and we needed to go inside. naturally i refused and told them i would meet them inside even though by that time i was starting to have my doubts too. a few minutes later they started to go in when i spotted a black limo pulling into the drive and shouted at them to wait, it came to a stop and a large man got out and joni followed. i approached joni and the man began to step in front of her and between she and i, joni motioned him that it was o.k. and she stopped right in front of me. being the star struck 19 year old that i was all that came out of my mouth as i handed her the roses was," your'e beautiful." she took the roses and leaned in and said " no, you're beautiful", and proceeded to kiss me on the cheek. needless to say she " loved me so naughty made me weak in the knees." i literally was weak in the knees, my best friend had a hold of my arm and if she hadn't i think i might have hit the floor. as joni moved on all my friends were looking at me in disbelief and it took me a few moments to realize what had just taken place. in a daze we all proceeded in to the gymnasium to find our seats and i was truly high from the experience. ( feeling better than any drug had ever made me feel! ) i couldn't sit still so my best friend and i decide to walk around before the concert started to try and calm down. we ended up at the restrooms and we parted to met again after we finished our business. when i got into the restroom i was so overwhelmed with joy that i started crying and was unable to regain my composure, to my surprise when bettyann and i met in the hallway she was crying too and we both lapsed into that wonderfully state of laughing and crying simultaneously! ( " ...laughing and crying you know it's the same release " ) the concert was wonderful and at the end i was in ' 7th heaven'. we sat in our seats until most of the crowd had dispersed and then saunterred out in a daze. i jokingly commented on how 'neat' it would be if we ran into joni leaving. sure enough and as we came down the stairs to the back exit we spotted a small crowd of whose center held a bemused joni! ( i truly couldn't believe we were seeing her again.) i stood there, like a deer caught in headlights, babbling about our good fortune not even realizing that joni was making her way towards me for a second 'close encounter.' she handed me one of the roses i had given her earlier, thanked me and my life hasn't been the same since. one of the few lucid thoughts i had all evening was that her photos didn't do her justice, she wasn't merely beautiful she was absolutely stunning and she had kissed me , joni mitchell had kissed me !!! it was an evening that i will never forget, i guess it goes a little ways to explaining why i am so obsessed with the woman... still reeling, warren keith p.s. well bob, i finally told the story. i was actually trying to compose something, per les' request, that could be posted on the site but i just couldn't seem to find the time to do it. mack's comment made me think of it and i got carried away... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 16:45:25 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: joni not particularly attractive physically? > well bob, i finally told the story. And a HELLUVA story it was!! Thanks for the detail, made me felt like I was there. And I agree, Joni in person looks MUCH better than in person, which is unusual because typically it's the other way 'round! She seems to have some kind of aura that just doesn't get captured much in photos, although Diltz and Norman Seeaf (sp) come as close as I've seen. Thanks again for sharing the once-in-a-lifetime experience. Bob NP: REM, "Airportman" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 21:42:50 +0100 From: "Aldridge, Phil" Subject: RE: Joni not particularly attractive physically? Warren, You lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky, lucky bastard. Knocks my "Joni ate my chips" story (IoW 1970) into a cocked hat. Phil ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:23:12 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: joni not particularly attractive physically? > And I agree, Joni in person looks MUCH better than in > person, Boy, I made it sound like Joni doesn't look good in photos, which certainly ain't the case (unless she's wearing Miyake!). She's pretty in pictures, and cosmically beautiful in person. Bob NP: REM, "Walk Unafraid" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 16:28:48 -0500 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Joni mention in Rosie mag In this month's issue of "Rosie" magazine, there's a brief verse of Night Ride Home on her letter page - "Hula girls and caterpillar tractors in the sand..." Not worth picking the magazine up, IMO. :) Mark ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:46:6 -0700 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: joni not particularly attractive physically? > > And I agree, Joni in person looks MUCH better than in > > person, > > Boy, I made it sound like Joni doesn't look good in photos, which certainly ain't the case (unless she's wearing Miyake!). > She's pretty in pictures, and cosmically beautiful in person. > > Yes, Joni has a rare natural beauty that exudes in everything she does and is. Can't help but fall in love with her over and over again. Victor NP: Wayne Shorter High Life ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:07:57 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: Re:joni not particularly attractive physically? Hey Warren, great tale. I am glad my comment was the catalyst for it. Thanks for sharing. Mack ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:09:50 -0500 From: "Cynthia Vickery" Subject: Re:joni not particularly attractive physically? ohhhhh, yeah! she *is* gorgeous. i've never been lucky/blessed enough to see her live except from the nosebleed seats, but my favorite "god-she-is-just-gorgeous" moments are those big delicious smiles during the tnt tribute when she forgets everything but the music and on the NRH video, with the fireworks lighting up her beautiful features. oh - and the when her face is just lit up with joy in the video for the much-maligned "dancing clown," when she's dancing with her cat in the kitchen. and you know there may be more! :o) c _______________________________________ Cindy Vickery Daniel Corporation 205-443-4718 direct 205-443-4615 facsimile http://www.danielcorp.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 16:29:45 -0700 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: joni not particularly attractive physically? > > well bob, i finally told the story. Warren - that is a fantastic Joni experience and relived like it just happened to you yesterday! And Bob wrote: > And I agree, Joni in person looks MUCH better than in person, which is unusual because typically >it's the other way 'round! She seems to have some kind of aura that just doesn't get captured much in >photos, although Diltz and Norman Seeaf (sp) come as close as I've seen. You took every word right out of my mouth! Also Herb Ritts didn't do such a bad job ('97 Vanity Fair and Lyrics and Poems book cover). Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:37:04 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Borderline talk > hello friends, > > could you help me understand something? It's about Borderline the song. > What is that "borderline" that Joni's sees running down the table? This whole song is a riddle to me. it's combining personal and philosophical ideas that i can not put together. Love to know your ideas and opinions on the song, now that we know it'll appear on Joni's new album. To me it's about differences. Differences in political opinions. Differences in religious beliefs. Differences in races & cultures. Anything that can potentially be divisive & cause people to be 'so distrustful, so displeased' with one another. Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:41:10 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: rainy night house > but the words that set the mood for me are "and left you with your father's > gun alone" they don't seem directly related to any other lyric, but the words > evoke a sinister darkness - is someone suicidal? is someone homicidal? is it > irrelevant? I believe that line has something to do with Leonard Cohen. I don't know the particulars, though. Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:38:43 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Bad read > I am reading shadows and light and find it really disappointing even though I > am savoring every word and don't want it to end. Seems that reading and > talking about her just isn't as satisfying as listening. I am a rabid > fan..love Hissing...started with Blue when I was eleven. I was just in Los > Angeles and I felt so close to Joni I almost kissed a sunset pig! > Ive been listening to Bruce Cockburn "lovers in a dangerous time" Is there > any connection between these 2 Canadians? The acoustic version of that song > seems so joniesque to me.(i am addicted to it) I am new here..please visit my > paintings and poetry at www.seegod.net .Thanks to those who wrote to me and > apologies to those I didn't write back. Is this considered Joni content? Pearl > Very much Joni content! And I very much enjoyed your paintings & poetry! Mark E. in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:52:10 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Re:joni not particularly attractive physically? i approached joni and the man began to step in front of her and > between she and i, joni motioned him that it was o.k. and she stopped right > in front of me. being the star struck 19 year old that i was all that came > out of my mouth as i handed her the roses was," your'e beautiful." she took > the roses and leaned in and said " no, you're beautiful", and proceeded to > kiss me on the cheek. needless to say she " loved me so naughty made me weak > in the knees." > i stood there, like a deer caught in headlights, babbling about > our good fortune not even realizing that joni was making her way towards me > for a second 'close encounter.' she handed me one of the roses i had given > her earlier, thanked me and my life hasn't been the same since. This is an amazing, wonderful story! For me this would have been a fantasy back in 1974. I love love love this story! Thank you for sharing it Warren, you lucky dog, you! Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 18:57:56 -0700 From: "gene mock" Subject: Re: Re:joni not particularly attractive physically? thanks warren, sure beats i think joni look my way at a concert once. later gene > had kissed me , joni mitchell had kissed me !!! it was an evening that i will > never forget, i guess it goes a little ways to explaining why i am so > obsessed with the woman... > > still reeling, > warren keith ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #179 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?